BruceVC

It is fun, I don't take it personally I can't speak for other promancers but I know for a fact you guys have offended people before. Do you know I had 2 people contacting me and saying that weren't coming back to this forum because of the anti-romance propaganda, aggression and dismissiveness of there Romance ideas Well I think that...deserves a round of applause, good work chaps. Little by little we can scourge the debased promancers from our ranks, and send them back to the perverted den of sickness that is the BSN, so long as we remain firm of constitution and purpose. Remember only you can halt the spread of this sickness! Oh you are funny

It is fun, I don't take it personally I can't speak for other promancers but I know for a fact you guys have offended people before. Do you know I had 2 people contacting me and saying that weren't coming back to this forum because of the anti-romance propaganda, aggression and dismissiveness of there Romance ideas

LOL Yep. When developers troll, it's a marvel to behold. Well, what are you guys waiting for? Take this info to the Romance thread and show it to Bruce already! Hold on, I haven't watched the video but how do we know its a fake because its seems like the beginning of an exciting Romance arc ....

I avoided watching this video, it was hard as I started it and heard the initial 1 minute of conversation. But I avoided it, has anyone else made a conscious decision to try to not watch any gameplay videos so your first play through is a complete surprise on every level ? hey bruce, they already summoning you in giantbomb thread . Anyaway Its not spoilery too much if you dont want so feel free to look at it Okay good, I think I'll do that

I've never played FC2, but I really hope your not enjoying those awful fake aussie accents that are often used in games and television. I am enjoying the accents but I'm not sure how accurate the Australian accents are? Have you played Dead Island? If they sound anything like that, they are bad, very bad. Truth be told accents can be hard to recognize in cases, for example on different occasions I've been told my accent is, Dutch, South African and English. Yeah same as me, Americans generally always get me wrong. They think I sound Irish or Australian

I avoided watching this video, it was hard as I started it and heard the initial 1 minute of conversation. But I avoided it, has anyone else made a conscious decision to try to not watch any gameplay videos so your first play through is a complete surprise on every level ?

Nah, what should disturb you much more is people that say that don't care about Romance but feel the need to tell everyone on the thread about Romance that they don't care about Romance. I find that much more disturbing

I've never played FC2, but I really hope your not enjoying those awful fake aussie accents that are often used in games and television. I am enjoying the accents but I'm not sure how accurate the Australian accents are? I think South African accents are not bad and there is some Afrikaans if I'm not mistaken?

Yes actually we are and we are enjoying it because its relevant to the discussion of what type of Romance implementations we want and why we want them

Hiro I'm going to clear this up for you so there is doubt. I am going to be methodical in my post and try not to skip any details. You can thank me later for learning something new I am a feminist, so the first thing to agree is "what is a feminist". A feminist is someone who believes in feminism. So what is feminism? http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/feminism?q=feminism Feminism is where a person believes that the sexes, male and female, are equal and should be treated equally in society. This includes considerations like If a male can vote, a female should be able to vote. if male gets a certain salary doing a job then a female should get the same salary doing the same job If a male can go to certain bar or establishment then a female can also go to that same bar I can give more examples but I think you get my point A feminist does not mean You cannot think a women is attractive in chainmail bikini armour That because I try to pickup a girl in a bar I am not a feminist Because I am attracted to a certain look, like Isabela, then I am betraying the principles of feminism Because I like Romance in RPG as part of a more immersive RP experience I can't say I'm a feminist The sexualisation of characters does not mean that a feminist cannot like how these characters look and say they are attractive In a RPG you could argue, but I wouldn't, that if all the female NPC's are represented a certain way then is not a fair representation compared to how the males are represented. But this would be a strange criticism as many people think the male characters are also clichéd and stereotypical Now if I supported and approved of the objectification of women in RPG I would be betraying my feminist principles, but as I've explained many times that's not what I do or think Isabella is a hottie, but that's not the only reason I Romanced her. I enjoyed her story and she played an invaluable part in combat. I hope this explains my motives where I say " I am a feminist but I enjoy Romance and I can appreciate the beauty of a women"

Now you are making your argument sound a little desperate, gaming is just another medium for entertainment. The exact same principles should apply around the definition of sexualisation and objectification of people? So you should answer the Catwomen question as it is relevant?

So are you a feminist? Also can you show me a link where a feminist is okay with the sexualisation of females in video games? We don't need a link, I am a feminist and mentioned by others there are different types of feminists and different interpretations of feminism So I am letting you know as a feminist that in the context of a RPG the sexualisation of characters is fine as long as you don't objectify them.

Look at you, jumping into the conversation and reminding us we aren't spelling her name properly But you right you do spell her name Isabela, my bad

I agree with this sentiment, I don't think 1 million sales is impossible but its unlikely. I am hoping for 600-800 k in sales figures

I'm enjoying Far Cry 2, I have got use to the driving as it is a little awkward in the beginning. I also find it very entertaining to see most of the mercenaries you fight are basically South Africans or Australians, I like hearing the accents

But guys lets be realistic, when do you ever think the US Marines will ever have to attack a well defended beach again? The USA generally always has control of the air. So they would bomb any well defended beach position back to the stone-age before they take the chance that hundreds of Marines may die in some sort of beach assault. This is not Normandy or the Pacific campaign against the Japanese. I think this vehicle is just a way to transport Marines onto the beach, its not really suppose to survive a seriously aggressive frontal attack?

So the first thing you see in the real world is women in bikinis walking around the city? Where is that city because I want to get on the next plane and fly there. When you first see Isabella she is not wearing a Bikini. She is wearing a totally normal but sexy revealing outfit. Nothing else. Yes she shows her cleavage but again there is nothing wrong with that. She is a rogue like character and she knows how she can use her body to her advantage. She is using this outfit to get mans attention and then steals from them. Basically she is using men as objects to get money out of them. Also since this is an RPG you know exactly what kind of character or class Isabella is as well. I agree, for me there was also much more to Isabella than just her looks. She had an interesting history and personality

There is a difference between female NPCs in video games and sexualised female NPCs in video games. You would know this. And you can have female NPCs with attractive qualities without them being sexualised. Why wouldn't you want to have female NPCs without them being sexualised? As a feminist, I would think that's what you'd be campaigning for just like the many websites I've seen with young girls, women and feminists do want. You're the polar opposite to all those girls, women and feminists and actually want sexualised female NPCs in games. And as you've stated many times, you go on looks to romance before anything else. And if the character can do other stuff, then that's a bonus for you. But your primary is always looks first. When you're going by looks first, then everything else is secondary. You are absolutely correct, you can have attractive qualities without them being sexualised in a game. But I am not a developer, I don't create the Romance options. I merely base my interaction with my party members on what is available from a NPC perspective. And as others have mentioned the consideration of sexualisation is a fact in marketing of most products and a reality of life. We can't and won't be able to change this. Let me give you an example, I go to bars regularly with friends probably every second week. At these bars they have shooters girls who come you table and sell you shooters. These girls are all attractive ladies, there are no overweight or unattractive ladies who do this. Now you can see this as a negative and say " this is wrong, this is clearly selling shooters by demonstrating the sexualisation of the shooter girls and manipulating men to buy shooter because the girls are hot". But the companies that own these services will tell you that the reality is customers generally only buy shooters from girls that appear to be attractive. But that's not all the girls do, they are witty and enjoy a conversation with someone who doesn't just objectify them. I often end up chatting to shooter girls but also supporting them by buying whatever they are selling. Is this wrong? Who are we to judge the fact that just because these shooter girls are attractive they able to sell more shooters. This is something that absolutely benefits them and they have no issue with So once again the fact that certain NPC are attractive or sexualised is not the only reason I Romance them, so I wouldn't have chosen Isabella to be in my party if she wasn't as effective in combat. I hope this clears this up

However, you have said you need the 'looks' and sexualisation of female NPCs to even start a romance. You could choose any other NPC to fill your party but you choose Isabela because of her looks as well. Even if there was another NPC that could fill the role combat wise and/or have an interesting personality, it was the looks that you chose first and seems anything else was secondary and a bonus in your eyes. The main thing for you was her looks, then personality, then combat prowess. It was the sexualisation of the female NPC that you choose and then you worked your party around her? eg. Well I don't need this NPC because Isabela can do this already and she's in my party. So you've already objectified her in this case as well. And there's more to objectification than just 'looks'. As a feminist you would know this, so it's disingenuous to say objectification is only about one thing. I find it very hard to understand why you're taking this stance as a feminist with your justification of sexualisation of female NPCs because you want to romance the 'hottie' in a video game when it seems to go against everything about what I've read on feminists views on this topic. Perhaps some links would help because I have many links where it seems to back me up on this. You seem to be missing something important, part of a Romance option is obviously the aesthetics . Whats wrong with that? But its not the only thing. Its like going to a Pizza take-away and saying to people "you guys are only eating Pizza because you like the taste"....Duh ?? Obviously, that's why they are eating the Pizza. So in the Isabella example I chose Isabella not just because of her looks but also I enjoyed her personality and her contribution in combat, its the same reason I chose Viconia and Romanced Viconia. So the appearance of the person is not the only reason. I could identify with all the Romance choices I made and I respected them as party members for a number of reasons. This is not the same as objectifying someone, I am surprised you can't seem to grasp this?

Volo that hurts my feelings, what is so bad about my Internet behaviour? Can you share your perspective

I'm not one that believes in tribunal system, if you don't know by now that you aren't suppose to make racist or homophobic comments online I doubt some kind of player based court is really going to change that behaviour. Banning is the right strategy, this type of punitive step will get the message across Where has gone "education is needed to change social injustice on the internet" attitude of yours? Did you grew tired of polishing your white armor already? You know me, I never get tired of polishing my white armour But the reality is I have very little patience with some types of Internet behaviour If you ever make a software to reach through screens and punch people on the face I want to be your customer. If people want to assign some negative label to my commitment to issues of SJ as a joke, to be dismissive or in an attempt to make me sound silly that's fine. I really don't mind. It makes absolutely no difference to me and will in no way change my view or comments I make. Sorry to disappoint

It's not false and it's not slander. You admitted you are all for sexualisation of female NPCs in video games. You can't get around that. And what act is this? Quoting you saying you are all for sexualisation of female NPCs in video games? I'm just quoting what you have written. Hiro I wanted to respond to this because you asked a good question earlier Firstly you are 100 % correct that I am a feminist and as you know I take issues of SJ very seriously, in fact I take them more seriously than Romance. But there is no contradiction here. The sexualisation of a person in game is not necessarily a bad thing. My definition of that means that there is sexual dimension to there character. This could be there appearance or how they conduct themselves. Isabella is a good example of this type of personality and she also happened to be my Romance choice, ahhhh....those Pirate boots But a person who is sexualised also needs to have other attributes that make them relevant or important. They need to be defined around something else apart from there sexuality. And that's important, so Isabella wasn't just a hottie. She was a important contributor in combat and had an interesting personality But the objectification of a person is where that person has no other purpose but to be an object and this is normally around there looks, so for example if Isabella only looked like she did and had no other valuable combat skills or had no interesting dialogue choices. This is a negative So you can see the difference, the sexualisation of something is not always a bad thing but the objectification of something is

I'm not one that believes in tribunal system, if you don't know by now that you aren't suppose to make racist or homophobic comments online I doubt some kind of player based court is really going to change that behaviour. Banning is the right strategy, this type of punitive step will get the message across Where has gone "education is needed to change social injustice on the internet" attitude of yours? Did you grew tired of polishing your white armor already? You know me, I never get tired of polishing my white armour But the reality is I have very little patience with some types of Internet behaviour

and that is one o' the problems... and why we asked which western powers. US only has one real ally in the middle east: israel. not only that, most amaericans, even with mounting casualties in gaza, support the idf actions. so, take US sanctions off the table for the nonce as they don't seem at all realistic. sure, if death toll gets too high, the US will threaten, by which time the idf will probable be moping up and preparing for the next major hamas conflict 2 years from now. HA! Good Fun! I share Gromnirs sentiment but also the situation is not as black and white as saying " Lets stop aid or enforce sanctions against Israel as this will improve the situation" The reality is Hamas is considered an Islamic extremist group, linked to other groups like Hezbollah, and almost all Western countries grapple with the problem of Islamic extremism. So no Western country wants to unintentionally empower any fundamentalist group by weakening Israel. And Hamas has been very provocative by firing the rockets So it justifies funding genocide? US has given support to terroris... freedom fighters before, they have no problem when it seems to suit their agenda; I guess they don't mind what their allies do as long as its not done to them. Personally I just dislike how media is treating this, by pulling out whomever dares report anything negative about Israel and how the West has taken a meek, consenting attitude towards the whole thing. It bothers me that these people could wipe out a nation and manipulate perception into making themselves the good guys. Do you really consider what the Israeli's are doing as genocide? Also how do you know the media is pulling out anything negative about Israel, do you have any links you can share about this or is this more your perception? Because in South Africa most people, outside the Jewish community, are very critical of Israel

Kids spend their parents money on this game too, and behave like brats too. Trust me played this game long enough to know. Shadowgate does look good but it also appears to be very hard