BruceVC

Whats your point? I don't think Orog needs you to explain or justify his view Also no need to get defensive and try for some unfathomable reason to lessen the point I'm making. Cosby is a habitual predator who raped dozens of women throughout his career It would be nice if you acknowledged this instead of making some inane point about " what I said about what Orog said when he said...." Thats not the issue, this is about a celebrity who for years got away with committing sexual violence. Focus on the issue and stop trying to catch me out and question the semantics around my post My point is pretty self-evident: you misstated Orogun's stance for no real reason, made a generalization about posters earlier in the topic dismissing the accusations against Cosby (which only a very few did), and now are making an assertion about Cosby being "a habitual predator who raped dozens of women throughout his career" as if that counters anything I said (at no point did I comment about Cosby's innocence or lack thereof). If you could stop all that, that would be great. And once again stop focusing on the wrong point, this discussion is about Cosby Its not about what you think or assume I think about what people feel about Cosby, your entire post is a just a lame strawman which once again seems to be some sort of unnecessary defensive mechanism. Did you read Namutree's post ? That would be type of response most rationale people would make about this...but no you are more concerned because " I said some posters dismissed the allegations ". I got it, thanks. So can we now get your comment on the issue if that is at all possible?

Thank you for your honesty and yes I well remember your understandable hesitation around condemning him in the past. The good news is the vast majority of celebrities that we tend to love and respect would never do something like what Cosby did over decades

Whats your point? I don't think Orog needs you to explain or justify his view Also no need to get defensive and try for some unfathomable reason to lessen the point I'm making. Cosby is a habitual predator who raped dozens of women throughout his career It would be nice if you acknowledged this instead of making some inane point about " what I said about what Orog said when he said...." Thats not the issue, this is about a celebrity who for years got away with committing sexual violence. Focus on the issue and stop trying to catch me out and question the semantics around my post

One man hardly a culture makes, so please bring evidence of how the majority of contemporary Hollywood is currently engage in non consensual sex. As that is the only thing that can be called raped and that its the only magnitude that makes a culture. So don't call a glass an ocean. Fair enough, I'll drop the whole "culture of rape that exists in some circles" I don't feel like a debate around semantics when in fact all I'm trying to do is highlight the fact that rape is a problem in most societies and Cosby is looking more and more guilty Interesting that you are more concerned with trying to prove me wrong than the substance of the article? Interesting that every case becomes a soapbox to preach the feminist gospel. Now there is evidence that Cosby did commit those crimes, before he was just being accused and being tried by the public. At this point is probably safe to assume that he's guilty, yet I don't see how that a rape culture makes. Yes as I said I'll drop the whole " rape culture" comment The point I'm making is there is an issue around rape and people dismissing it in certain cases in civil society and more importantly the view " oh here we go again, another example of a celebrity being accused of rape yet he is more than likely innocent ...those annoying feminists always crying wolf " But it seems like you now concur that Cosby is guilty so we seem to be in agreement. The most important consideration is that this is a valid example so maybe we shouldn't be so quick to dismiss it next time there is an accusation when it happens to a celebrity or other person

Yes because destroying the economy and causing citizens to suffer because you accepted terms to impose austerity on an already depressed economy so you can get a loan you couldn't pay back is a very responsible thing to do. The former finance minister spoke of three ways Greece could pay off its debt in a sustainable manner in the video Messhugger linked, if you don't think he's right feel free to argue why he's wrong. But it's good to know you think democracy is bad when people don't vote how you want them to. Yes, Germany has really been ****ing things up the last few years. Anyways the referendum has plenty to do with self-rule which is a key component of freedom. Which given the posts the last few pages is what people are talking about ITT. Ah yes the famous and fallacious " its Germany's fault and the Troika for insisting on terms and austerity " Yet as usual this argument overlooks the obvious, why did the the Greek government need the initial loans? Because the government was about to go bankrupt...so once you again you cannot avoid the whole mismanagement of state institutions and finances by the previous Greek government Nice perspective KP, lets attack the Germans for having a strong and growing economy and believing that for the EU to succeed its member states have to adhere to certain rules and regulations. And lets also blame them for supporting austerity when needed You are right that Greek was broke, but they were allready broke before and should have never been accepted into the EU by their standarts, didn´t bother germany much back then. I think you are right, that blaming germany is silly, there are way more factors, but germany is one of them. Besides that, your last words...austerity doesn´t work. That is not a new revelation, infact they knew this 2 years ago as IMF documents showed back then: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/03/1176099/-Austerity-doesn-t-work-New-IMF-report-details-the-damage People keep saying "austerity doesn't work, its been proven " This is a fundamental and relevant point and one I disagree with. Lets take Spain, yes they still have a high unemployment and high government debt but there economy is on the rebound despite what people like 2133 will tell you. There banking sector is healthy and they have the one of the fastest growing economies in the EU http://www.brandonsun.com/business/breaking-news/moodys-raises-outlook-for-spains-banks-to-positive-ending-7-year-negative-rating-308123421.html http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2015/07/02/world/europe/ap-eu-spain-economy.html?_r=0 http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/jun/20/spains-improving-economy-is-not-reaching-everyone And then we have Ireland which left the bailout program end of the 2013 and is fastest growing economy in the EU http://blogs.wsj.com/moneybeat/2014/01/07/irelands-post-bailout-bonds-blowout/ http://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/ireland-to-be-fastest-growing-euro-area-economy-in-2015-1.2062814 Ireland also went through difficult austerity and came through stronger despite issues around social security cuts ....so to keep saying " austerity doesn't work" simply doesn't reflect the reality. I'm not saying its not hard ....but that is not the same thing as saying it doesn't work http://news.yahoo.com/ireland-preparing-lift-austerity-measures-043224486.html;_ylt=A0LEVy9aX5tVqIEABOFXNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTByMHZ0NG9yBGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwM3BHZ0aWQDBHNlYwNzcg--

One man hardly a culture makes, so please bring evidence of how the majority of contemporary Hollywood is currently engage in non consensual sex. As that is the only thing that can be called raped and that its the only magnitude that makes a culture. So don't call a glass an ocean. Fair enough, I'll drop the whole "culture of rape that exists in some circles" I don't feel like a debate around semantics when in fact all I'm trying to do is highlight the fact that rape is a problem in most societies and Cosby is looking more and more guilty Interesting that you are more concerned with trying to prove me wrong than the substance of the article?

http://kdvr.com/2015/07/06/court-documents-show-bill-cosby-got-drugs-to-give-to-women-for-sex/ So are people still going to deny that Cosby is guilty of habitual rape through the decades? I remember getting attacked at the time for suggesting this....well anyway its a good thing as any attention brought to end the culture of rape that exists in some circles in society is a good thing

<joke> Nah, they're not going to make a single clone of Shepard. They're going to make *2* clones of Shepard, one for you to play and one for you to romance. </joke> Seriously though, I liked the series (admittedly decreasingly during each installment) so I'm curious - if they can recapture the best parts of the series for a full game, then the game will be worth playing. I'm very excited about ME4,...... lets be honest Amentep whats better than killing alien scum and Romance in space

Says the guy sitting nicely in his safe, prosperous and comfortable first world country

Referendum also has lot of to do with that Greeks (as society) don't like cuts in their standard of living and their government asked of them do they want make those cuts or do they trust them in their claim that other euro countries will give them more money if they say no for the cuts. Which as seen by many (even by quite lot of euro area's political leaders) that Greece try to vote that other countries should pay their bills, which has seen as anti-freedom and anti-self-rule thing to do. No Elerond...haven't you heard? A Democracy is where you get to vote if you don't want to pay off your loans and then if you do vote this then the people who lent you the money must just adsorb your debt... That's a Democracy because " people voted for this " and if you don't agree with this you are opposed to freedom and self-rule

Yes because destroying the economy and causing citizens to suffer because you accepted terms to impose austerity on an already depressed economy so you can get a loan you couldn't pay back is a very responsible thing to do. The former finance minister spoke of three ways Greece could pay off its debt in a sustainable manner in the video Messhugger linked, if you don't think he's right feel free to argue why he's wrong. But it's good to know you think democracy is bad when people don't vote how you want them to. Yes, Germany has really been ****ing things up the last few years. Anyways the referendum has plenty to do with self-rule which is a key component of freedom. Which given the posts the last few pages is what people are talking about ITT. Ah yes the famous and fallacious " its Germany's fault and the Troika for insisting on terms and austerity " Yet as usual this argument overlooks the obvious, why did the the Greek government need the initial loans? Because the government was about to go bankrupt...so once you again you cannot avoid the whole mismanagement of state institutions and finances by the previous Greek government Nice perspective KP, lets attack the Germans for having a strong and growing economy and believing that for the EU to succeed its member states have to adhere to certain rules and regulations. And lets also blame them for supporting austerity when needed

I've found that it's harder to take sides if you stop treating countries as individuals and applying the same logic. "Greece" cannot renege on or pay its debts because it's an abstract entity, not a person, and it cannot act or make decisions. And once you begin digging into what is owed, to whom, why, and under what circumstances were those debts contracted, the issue becomes very muddled. Hell, even considering "Greeks" as a whole is silly, because you are lumping together an unskilled burger flipper that puts in 60 hours a week in two jobs for a pittance, an old lady that has to make do with a 400€ pension, and Papandreou. Should the debt be repaid in full? Does it matter? It's all make-believe anyway... that's the real issue IMO. Bottom line - Greece, the country, made up of voters and politicians, happily accepted truckloads of EU cash from Northern Europe. They squandered it. They don't want to pay it back. As there is no shared European demos, not unnaturally the creditors are pissed off. Why are so many people on this thread battling to grasp or accept such simple and irrefutable truths about this Greek crisis...it truly stupefies me

Well if freedom and self-rule means you destroy your economy and cause your citizens to suffer, due to malfeasance and corruption, for years if not decades under economic hardship then I am opposed it ...you right KP But we both know its more complicated than that since the root causes of this Greek crisis have nothing to do with freedom but more to do with mismanagement, intransigence and demagoguery

There seems to be a lot of tension in this thread and I can guarantee you I know the reason. Very few of you have accepted and embraced Bioware Romance like us Promancers have If you did that I'm sure you will find yourselves more content with life and just a lot less grumpy

we watched the women's world cup and were incredible disappointed. based on our limited viewing o' japanese anime, we expected the USA team to be a bunch o' racist amazons with enormous b00bs who would insult the plucky japanese players by calling 'em "monkeys" and then cheat horribly. the japanese team, by comparison, would do their best and through the power o' friendship they would create a world where nobody would have to cry. the event did not unfold at all the way we expected. even worse, the japanese girls were not particular attractive, and none o' them had bunny or cat ears. no maid outfits neither... and we didn't see one freaking robot on the japanese team. am so disillusioned. HA! Good Fun!

Okay I'm impressed....I assume you mean "steak tartar " ....most people won't touch it because its " raw meat...waaaaaaaaaaaaaah " Its incredible ....truly delectable. And you can have so many things that you can add to it like capers or a tot of cognac. I always have the raw egg and parsley among my base ingredients

Well, I suppose one's perspective on the likelihood of that occurrence hinges on to the extent to which one believes the EU decision making process to be subservient to financial interests. We'll have to wait and see. Also, pretty funny to see Bruce defend "democracy" right up to the point where it is put into practice (cf. Crimea, Greece). Then it's all propaganda, manipulation, etc. Or, should I say, it would be funny if people recognized him for the poe that he is. No 2133, you are mistaking my criticism of Crimea and this Greek crisis with me someone contradicting the values of a Democracy Crimea was/is a legitimate part of Ukraine so even though the citizens of Crimea wanted to join Russia thats just not the way the world works. There are legal and political realities where citizens of a region just can't have there own state or just breakaway and join another. Its not just the fact the Crimean referendum was a farce, its the fact the Ukraine government (you know the people who actually govern Ukraine ) have no desire to give Crimea to Russia. How do you feel about the Basque separatists getting there own nation in Northern Spain, I assume you are supportive of there objectives ? And Greece..no idea why you think I am criticizing there NO decision based on the principles of Democracy. I know this was a Democratic vote, that's obvious. But it was an egregious mistake because I fail to see how this decision is going to get more funding from the European Troika or somehow get the current Greek government to implement the necessary austerity measures needed that will start there economy moving forward

Why have you stopped training?

He did say that actions of Greece's debtors are terrorism, so I would guess that he would not get most warmest welcome in meetings with other eurozone's finance ministers. Meaning that if Greece hopes to have any change in any negotiations with their debtors he probably should not be part of those negotiations. Yeah I have heard that argument, hopefully that is exactly the reason and outcome But the issue is he represented a certain symbolism around the Greek defiance. Many Greeks really liked him and believed what he said Now the rhetoric is over and the NO vote has won he resigns...what does that say about the veracity and credibility of the NO argument ? Surly for the all the millions of Greeks who stood by his views he needs to continue to represent the NO perspective and ideological stance ? That is something that only Greeks themselves can give answer. I think the vast majority of Greeks have been mislead and manipulated by the current Greek government and they will now face dire consequences. And trust me for those that think " it can't get worse " ....it can get worse. I live in Africa and I can give you many examples of just how bad it can get dire how? its not like there's anything left to lose, the previous government has seen to that At the moment the Greeks need additional loans to keep the Greeks bank sustainable and viable and for government to pay its pubic sector debt So without those loans these institutions will collapse, its inevitable So right now the Greek banks are allowing 60 Euro/day withdrawal...but what if there was NO money in the Greek banking system and they can't pay the salaries of the bloated public sector? You do realize how bad that would be, it would be similar to certain African countries where the public sector is basically dysfunctional and is unable to meet its service delivery agreements to the public

No doubt, Russian prisons are hardcore How many Russian inmates have there PS3 requests taken seriously, recognized and a valid complaint ?Somehow I don't think many .... I doubt the majority of South African prisons even have PS3 facilities

I'm not engaging in this debate because I want to prove the " supremacy of Western ideology ". We need to take the emotion out this debate and look at the facts I am absolutely critical of the way the Tsipras government has consistently handled the negotiations and led the country to the NO vote So people like Varoufakis have for ages been making all these arguments about how the loans are unacceptable and he was been very skillful at grandstanding and anti- EU rhetoric And his views helped shape the NO vote. And now that they have won he quits So for me it demonstrates a simple truth, Tsipras didn't really believe all the anti-EU views. They just wanted to win the NO vote which they feel gives them some credibility around asking for changes to the agreed on austerity and loan agreements Yet how much support would he have received if it had become common knowledge that Varoufakis would have resigned if the NO vote had won? I don't remember seeing a single link that this was the strategy. So I see this whole thing as disingenuous because it now appears what Tsipras was really saying is " down with the Germans, IMF and ECB....but we don't really mean this because once we win the NO vote we are going to position a softer argument and use less vitriol " ......the inconsistency boggles my mind

He did say that actions of Greece's debtors are terrorism, so I would guess that he would not get most warmest welcome in meetings with other eurozone's finance ministers. Meaning that if Greece hopes to have any change in any negotiations with their debtors he probably should not be part of those negotiations. Yeah I have heard that argument, hopefully that is exactly the reason and outcome But the issue is he represented a certain symbolism around the Greek defiance. Many Greeks really liked him and believed what he said Now the rhetoric is over and the NO vote has won he resigns...what does that say about the veracity and credibility of the NO argument ? Surly for the all the millions of Greeks who stood by his views he needs to continue to represent the NO perspective and ideological stance ? That is something that only Greeks themselves can give answer. I think the vast majority of Greeks have been mislead and manipulated by the current Greek government and they will now face dire consequences. And trust me for those that think " it can't get worse " ....it can get worse. I live in Africa and I can give you many examples of just how bad it can get

He did say that actions of Greece's debtors are terrorism, so I would guess that he would not get most warmest welcome in meetings with other eurozone's finance ministers. Meaning that if Greece hopes to have any change in any negotiations with their debtors he probably should not be part of those negotiations. Yeah I have heard that argument, hopefully that is exactly the reason and outcome But the issue is he represented a certain symbolism around the Greek defiance. Many Greeks really liked him and believed what he said Now the rhetoric is over and the NO vote has won he resigns...what does that say about the veracity and credibility of the NO argument ? Surly for the all the millions of Greeks who stood by his views he needs to continue to represent the NO perspective and ideological stance ?

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2015-07-06/greek-finance-minister-yanis-varoufakis-resigns/ Unbelievable, so one of the main proponents and architects of the referendum, the Greek finance minister, has resigned He claims it will be easier to negotiate better terms on the loans if he isn't involved. This is UTTER BS....the issues with the loans are not to due to clashes of personality but structural around the actual terms of the payments I don't believe it will make any difference who Greek sends to renegotiate the terms... there will always be certain conditions that Greece has to adhere to. I just find it concerning Varoufakis seems to be jumping ship when we will now see the true impact of the NO vote

Yes of course this is accurate, the primary reasons the Greek economy is in the state its in is due to mismanagement Its not just the bloated and problematic public sector and ineffective tax collection. Its factors like the low retirement age and as you mentioned this puts massive pressure on GDP Zora highlights the fundamental misunderstanding around the Greek crisis where he says " Now, hopefully, there will be some good sense and good will shown by both sides" This view makes the spurious point that the solution to the Greek problem is around the terms of the loans...no. The Greeks needed to implement serious economic restructuring and under this new government they will be delayed from doing this, yes some loan relief will help but the loan payments are just a symptomatic problem. The core issue is how the Greeks have managed there economy ...and the NO vote will reduce attention from the important and required changes the Greeks still need to make Remember we mustn't forget the reason for the loans initially was because the Greek government was about to go bankrupt, so for all the people blaming the loans and bailouts as the root cause of the current financial crisis in Greece maybe they can explain that one? In other words the economic problems existed in Greece before the loans