C2B

The UI redesign wasn't a waste of time. BioWare's UI sucked donkey balls, Obsidian's did not. It was a waste of time compared to what they could have been doing during that.

Breath of Fire 6 got announced As a online rpg

Winning an award.

Is Julian HassatHunter by the way?

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-07-31-fear-is-the-path-to-the-dark-side

I don't remember if that was covered, but Tools Programmer Brendan Booth left back in June and is now working at Blizzard. Edit: And someone else has joined, though I can't seem to find his profile.

Argh, the distinction into *series* makes this hard. NWN2 has some of the worst companions, but then there is Mask of the Betrayer.

I suspect - but could be wrong - that this is what Alan is getting at. I know its what I'm getting at. The solution to the problem isn't in changing the internet; its addressing the stem problems which are all in real life. Where to start, how to proceed....all important questions, but we have to tackle the problem, not its symptoms that show up on the internet and increasingly in real life. Absolutly On an another note though and to explain my earlier posts in this thread better. The reason why I'm not sold on the article in the OP is because of a piece the author wrote a week ago http://www.penny-arcade.com/report/article/why-you-want-****-to-make-your-video-games "Why you want **** to make your video games" This reflects actually another problem that is in the same vein, but much older. The belief that artists are exempt from decent behaviour because they are *artists* Cue to the edge article about the whole thing This is actually my main problem with the whole discussion surrounding the incident. There's reasonable and good voices (people shouldn't behave that way), but there are people that are upset because a *artist* was attacked and how dare you insult someone *special*.

We are not really talking about the same thing. Because being confronted with physical violence doesn't even factor in on my side yet. (Which is about the immediate emotional reaction that also factors in things like what we hear, see or smell. And context in general actually. For a more extreme example, someone insulting you in front of your house with your friends watching while spitting in your face. Actually had a similiar experience a few weeks ago where two *cat-ladies for lack of a better term* verbally attacking my mom after seeing a sickly kitten. There are lots of emotions involved (like someone invading your personal space) you're not going to get over a simple internet post.) Anyway, we probably won't see eye to eye on that anyway, so let's discuss about what we DO agree. The internet is taken too lightly and there is too much vitrol. With what solutions wou you improve that situation though? The internet as a social platform with easy access and (some) anonymity basically guarantees that you will never run out of hateful people. I'm sure some can be brainstormed, but IMO we need to tackle the issue on both sides. Socially in real-life as well as on the internet.

It isn't (yet. As this may very well come int future) For one reason. Your senses. It's just not the same emotionally compared to being in the actual situation. Sure its the same. That the "slighted person" is impotent to act rashly towards the "insulter" doesn't change the nature of what you're doing. It just means you can get away with it without repercussions for the most part. Back when I was a mod for Black Isle, one of the other mods created a page with a lot of BIS mods & posters pictures (self-submitted). One gadfly decided to start saying in the IRC chat that I looked like "a child molester". I can assure you that this kind of defamation of character could not have bothered me more, upset me more or made me more angry had it been said to my face instead of over an IRC chat. The problem is that there are far too many people who think "oh its just the internet" and dismiss the idea that what people put here for others to read is completely harmless. It is why we have anonymous tweeters tweeting rape threats to a journalist who successfully petitioned for Jane Austin to be put on a £10 note. Because not enough people think that the internet and social media "matter" and that those offended just need to "get over it". And if they don't they get attacked for being "thin skinned". Oh, it's certainly a problem that the internet is taken too lightly. (Facebook bullying and other stuff becoming a bigger issue for example. I actually had/have to counsel on some of that stuff myself.) And I may have miscommunicated things here. It's the same for the one who makes the insult, it's not the exact same for the one who recieves it. For example in the video: You take the whole moment in, not just the post as you do on the internet. A important factor in the video is that there is an audience that looks at the situation. Maybe your friends are even in there. Hello, shame. There's other stuff as well. Smell can too factor in the equation. Though of course, with technolgic advances that may very well be the case in the future here as well. And then there is no real difference. @JFSOCC You suck isn't an insult or at least rude? And Phil Fish insulting another developer is ok? Also again, the argument itself is questionable as it relates to western games as well. Apart from the fact that the argument itself isn't accurate, due to the existence of games like Demon's/Dark Souls even if they are exceptions. Another thing about Fish, but I personally don't think that's his worst. He's gone on record saying consoles are for gaming and pc's for spreadsheats. Which is why it's a bit funny seeing him defended in a forum relating to a pc only game.

It isn't (yet. As this may very well come in the future) For one reason. Your senses. It's just not the same emotionally compared to being in the actual situation. Being an **** on the internet is still bad (which is why I critizized Fish on that as well). But in real life a real hurtful situation can become ten times worse. I'm saying this as a person who got riducled several times during his youth in front of family and friends (And not in the sense of typical bullying. Long story) THAT hurts (emotionally at least. There are still tons of worse things out there). Being told I'm a moron on the internet doesn't faze me nearly as much.

So he seems to be a tactless jerk. Doesn't mean you have to be a tactless jerk in return. There's definitely a "give as good as you get" philosophy in play on the internet. I disagree with this. This is why people think they can post rape threats, death threats and other things to social media because they don't get that this communication is part of real-life.And what people don't realize is that it spills over into communication.If BIGJGAMINGDUDE (who just happens to be a Japanese indie game developer) had asked a question on a message board about the influence of Japanese games on western indie gaming and FEZFAN3000 had replied (just happening to be a indie developer) that Japanese Video game sucked......well that kind of response is expected these days. I'm not saying its right - I bemoan this state of affairs. But I also acknowledge that a lot of people don't being a jerk on the internet and being a jerk in real life aren't mutually exclusive.Which is kind of what I'm getting at, being tactless in real life or online is the same and doesn't warrant being It also shouldn't be a free pass either; point out the tactless behavior but don't allow "well he's a jerk" to be a cause to dismiss someone else's actions.I disagree, but for that last part I didn't? In the same post I even mentioned I'm not defending Beer. that's not even remotely my point. My point is, if you're acting like a **** don't expect to not get the same in return.

What I forgot to mention was that Fish is bipolar. Which is why I also hope he uses the occasion to get himself some help.

Nope. What it does though, is if you insult people you also have to be prepared to take it yourself. Actions have consequences. Fish doesn't and in return acts like the victim. It's also not the only example of Fish using insults. He even does so casually, having no problem calling people cheap. Two things regarding that - I'm not defending Beer either (I don't like the guy any more than I do Fish. Probably even less.) - Discussions on an internet portal are never the same as in real-life. Having someone say *You suck* to your face is a completly different situation. How would you like it, if I insulted your work, or anything that's important to you. Not in a discussion, but by throwing insults around directly in your face with maybe your friends around to listen. In many social situations this even ends physically. I do think Fish will come back to games. Hopefully more grown up. Because in a work enviroment that attitude can hurt you badly.

That someone is a fellow video game indie developer and japanese. *They suck* to his face isn't exactly not dickish. Just look at the other guy. There's a difference between a online forum and real-life. Aside from these complaints applying to western games as well. (Which is funny that you mention the codex, because a comment there mentions that things like forced tutorial sections are common in modern western games too)

That is victim blaming. Phil Fish acting outside of social mores doesn't give people the right to send abuse his way. Nor do we know if it's cause or consequence. I've seen it happen before recently that someone blew up after suffering abuse for hours on end, and then got seen as the ****. It's important to know the context. I think people here do not realize all the things Phil Fish did over the years Here's some context in video form http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMPIcV6zsPw Yeah, Fish insulting a video developer in the face in front of tons of other people is just not a problem compared to being insulted in a twitter discussion. Totally. Or how about his former co-worker that stated that he was impossible to work with. That guy sure has no context. Or Or Or Or Or Or Or Or a thousand other things. Phil Fish is acting like this CONSTANTLY. They aren't isolated incidents at ALL. If they were, I would have nothing against that guy. What I'm saying here is. I agree with the topic's intent. There's too much vitrol about game developers. What I DON'T agree on is the article. Being a creative guy is NO JUSTIFICATION to being a ****. And it sure as hell isn't if you can't take it yourself. How about if Chris Avellone suddenly started acting like an ass and insulting people left and right? Edit: Another well overlooked fact. FEZ wasn't Fish's idea. He got in the project after the original creator searched for a artist. Then the orginal creator left the project after.

? There's been 2 people that were most likely hired for a MMO project Obsidian just assists on. With one of them being Ex-Black Isle and the other a Network engineer who worked on some of the most profilic MMO's. As a network engineer that is FAR from a bad thing. How's that too mmo-ish?

They have a release date? I thought they will make a new one during/after the beta.

they aren't on the forums as much because they're working on the vertical slice. it's ok to be critical of their decisions because that is what they wanted. some people are obnoxious but there are still enough good people out there that realize that obsidian is awesome at what they do for people like Sawyer and co to realize we appreciate their efforts. these guys are professionals. the amount of bile they have to deal with when dealing with scum that are publishers is NOTHING compared to a few dummy comments from puerile children about a specific game mechanic. someone saying "wahh I hate crafting skill" isn't going to take food away from the mouths of the dev's family; bonuses based on obnoxious metacritic scores does. I suspected as much. it's a rare case for a person to have enough hate against him from a group and for him to have done no wrong. doesn't excuse the treatment. although the COD comments were particularly crazy: that's a special kind of moron. also what is this about the codex? a lot of the most interesting discussions about RPGs and P:E specifically occur on RPGCodex. It seems some of you guys are projecting your own feelings about the Codex onto the devs from Obsidian. Phil Fish said "suck my ****. Choke on it" upon winning a award. It nearly does. The guy's terrible himself. And I didn't say anything about the codex discussions. In context I was referring to the codex rough nature/environment.

While it's true that some hate always gets thrown around you have to learn how to deal with it since you can prevent it. I do think many Obsidian devs are capable of that, as they have been dealing with the codex for years. You just can't let it get too close emotionally. Granted, it would be swell if the population grew up. The case of Phil Fish reflected in the article, though.... is a special one. Because he invented it 100% for himself. He constantly acts arrogant, insults people (openly at a indie panel he (and others) went down on another dev) and acts all scared when someone actually goes after him. He can dish it out, but can't take it. As such I don't actually have much sympathy with the guy. Grow up.

Twain Martin - Network Engineer Quite the impressive resumee. My guess is for Skyforge.

The level has a bug so if you don't recruit paco before going to the crime scene, you will get the same quest CONSTANTLY anew. You don't have to bring paco to the quest to finish it though ( it ends with you paying the detective for info)

Stephen Zorn - Design Intern

He also became known a while ago.

Ja, ist klar. Einleitung war klasse gemacht wo wir schon hier sind. Das is natürlich auch meine persönliche Meinung und hier ist es auch gar nicht ein schlimmes Beispiel. Aber aus der Perspektive des Lesers habe ich es schon einige Male erlebt wo das Bias übertrieben wurde (was ich schlimm finde). Oder besser gesagt wenns ins Eigenlob und ähnliches übergeht. Um zwei Beispiele zu nennen - Das South Park: Stick of Truth Preview von Pure Sophistry - Das Shadowrun: Returns Review von Blistered Thumbs Beide stellen während ihres Reviews die eigene Meinung in den Vordergrund (z.b Ich bin DER South Park Fan/Ich bin DER Rollenspiel Experte) um die Validität ihrer Meinung zu verdeutlichen und argumentieren über spezifisches, das wahrscheinlich die wenigsten interessiert. (Das Stick of Truth Preview ist hier hervorzuheben, da der Autor soweit geht uns mitzuteilen wie viele Male exakt "**** you, bitch" gesagt wurde) Das kann dir natürlich egal sein. Wollte nur aufzeigen woher meine Befürchtungen kommen.