theBalthazar

Hello, I understand the absense of grazes. It becoming an element of gameplay. OK, no problem, I know that. But, this doesn't explain why It fails as often. Exemple : I have the double of accuracy compared to my opponent : 85 VS 42 Miss. Yeah... !^^ I test that in reaction on a man in another topic said that with the right investments we could make the wizard something correct. I was trying to boost the accuracy in this exercise and prove his claims. False for me. Even with grazes, I only do a "graze" with this attack. Worst than Tyranny in fact. Yes it is flame of devotion, but it is worst with spells : (flame of devotion = +20 of accuracy + 12 One handed +9 perception, so pretty solid... look at the pictures) And it is Relaxed gameplay here. No PoTD...^^

No it is not the point of view of Josh sawyer. He said Gap between "Viable" and "Optimal" must be reduced !^^ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvyrEhAMUPo&feature=youtu.be&t=1m50s Since all are shared (passives and actives + Multiclass associations of two classes), yes you must to propose similar values. If not, I take an another abilitie. With multiclass of POE2 this effect increases. I do not speak of different functions abilities, but similar bonuses... Think to it : You'll never take this poor 5% bonus... Admit it ^^ For the value of ONE point of abilitie. Not worth it. Obsidian change the system mainly for this reason. Useless talents. To finally do that...

Hello, Once you are in multiclass system, equivalence is important. E. g. : [PALADIN] Exalted focus : +5 % of hits converted to crits. (Eventually x5 = 25 % but scattered for each member of party (less impressive) and with the problem of distance of the aura) [FIGHTER] Disciplined strike : Via Intuitive +50 % of hits converted to crits. I count what abilitie brings intrinsically.

Humm... Not necessarly. You can add new talents on general pool, and on abilities side.

Ideally, if they stay on the specific pool, they should rename the similar talents names. Like : Bull's Will Will of the Giants (I invent anything) Same effect but different name (and stack, obviously ! )

I'm happy with the new system for that too. Now, I use Cat flurry more easily. Before you had to think about whether you would not need it later. (or make a painful return to the city on the other hand) This is the principle reason for which I prefer the new system.

If still the spells were doing heavy damage. But there, not only they do less damage than the melees, but more they miss more often. (I do not know why)

Shattered Pillar have a big penalty. It is not 8 or 7, but 5 wounds max. Not a big problem now but as soon there is +x by wound (armor, damage...), shattered will be greatly less efficient.

So what is the final choice of Josh about this subject ? We know ? General pool or reinforced pool for each class ? Moreover, we agree that the estoc, sword and the rapier on the best modals ? : p It is perhaps the bigger problem, you quickly take the same weapons each time...

I'm not totally agree with ths choice, but why not. Modal is modal, there is negative and positive pendant. It is the principle.

So, in Q/A Sawyer said there is no proficiency of unarmed (monk)/claw (druid) because good enough effective ? Bad thing, Proficiency is not for efficiency, it is much more a deal. Advantage in many case but sometimes bad. I am surprised at this choice.

I have a doubt so... If it is not a balancing choice, Unarmed (Monk)/claw (druid) proficiency is missing ? It is intended ?

I have test Fury, Seems less strong than animals, or is it only me ? We must count rebound damage indeed, but I don't know, not the same feel of efficiency than the cat or others forms ?

It is strange because I have clear the beta x 20 with single class but now... I don't know. My config or options without doubt. Weird.

Indeed. I have tried to judge classes and subclasses according to their intrinsic value without multiclass, but some like helwaker and soul blade can create a good multiclass. More, Soul blade is the best subclass of cipher for now in my ranking... But globally this class and all its derivatives are mostly bad casters. (like all casters in fact : p)

In the beta you have a tooltip on stack rules. They define all abilities passives and actives = stack. Wildstrike is a special case indeed, because you must have 2pts to create this exploit when you take the wildstrike (twice =multiclass). But after all is not particulary cheat. (It is not intended obviously, because, following levels don't allow that). But, for me it is not a big problem : you spend 2 pts... it deprives you of other options. Recall that in this idea : any abilitie must be equal to others after all ... If not : balancing all abilities.

Hello, Each time I test this combo, I have a random crash in or outside the battle. No idea of the nature of the problem. https://uploadfiles.io/zggga EDIT : There is also the problem with Berserker + Fighter... Humm... Already repair the installation with GOG. So... I don't know : p

Don't forget the main rule of stack : All abilities stacks. So, two panels with twice the same abilitie = double effect. Already possible on the same panel with multiclass = wildstrike x 2 for druids etc. Witch weapon focus ? POE2 = General mastery for all proficiency. RP Similar to Fighter. (= general mastery with all weapons POE1 = Panel of few weapons (I always found that was illogical) In short I prefer special approach of proficiency, but I dislike the "package" of POE1. Best system is (for me) : Proficiency = One special weapon focus with accuracy. (few in number not like now) Weapon focus (like it is in POE2) = special and specific deal with one or two class max (general mastery of weapons... Like Fighter for exemple (Why specifically barbarian ? Mystery...)

LOL... Best nerf ever. Now +15 % of speed (+5) VS 50 %, and there always the malus. Poor Wizard, sniff...

Tiers list – Beta 1.0820 - Until level ~10 GOD TIERS Devoted (Fighter) Berserker (Barbarian) Shifter (Druid) Beckoner (Chanter) TOP TIERS Nalpazca (Monk) Lifegiver (Druid) Unbroken (Fighter) Base Fighter Base barbarian Base Druid Base Monk Shattered pillar (Monk) Penalty too strong if not... It could be highter MID TIERS Assassin (Rogue) Base Rogue Shieldbearer of St Elcga (Paladin) Bleak walker (Paladin) Base Chanter Kind wayfarers (Paladin) Darcozzi Paladini (Paladin) Goldpact knights (Paladin) Broken effect ? + Shared flame don’t work ? Mage slayer (Barbarian) Troubadour (Chanter) Sharpshooter (Ranger) LOW TIERS Street fighter (Rogue) Trickster (Rogue) Fury (Druid) Corpse eater (Barbarian) Helwalker (Monk) Good when multiclass but very bad deal (With 5 wounds : +15% damage AND +25 % more received damage WTF far too much…) Skald (Chanter) Ghost heart (Ranger) Stalker (Ranger) Soul blade (Cipher) All priest (Wait the full list of spells but for now…) Base Cipher TRASH TIERS Black jacket (Fighter) Base Wizard All spe wizard Beguiler (Cipher) Ascendant (Cipher) -------------------------- 1) All classes are fun to play, except these who always fail (hello casters) or with a strong penalty (Ascendant, beguiler) 2) 50 % of hit converted to crits for Fighter / barbarian is Very very strong... 3) See low / trash tiers : Globally casters, and WTF ratio Bonus/penlaties (Black jacket) or WTF concept (Stalker) 4) Wizard often miss 6-9 seconds spells (ffuuu ^^). It is ridiculous. Chanter also have problem of the duration. sometimes 9 seconds for invocations !! (even if they are strongs) seems to be "irrationnal" in the course of the fight. 5) Black jacket, Stalker, Fury, Shifter, street fighter, ghost heart, nalpazca have great "background"/idea, good "essence".

I specified at the OP : 3) What penalties discourage you to take the class / are too strong compared to bonus ?

Hello, According to you, 1) What classes/subclasses are fun to play ? 2) What classes/subclasses are enough Powerful, too much powerful ? 3) What penalties discourage you to take the class / are too strong compared to bonus ? 4) What classes/subclasses are not enough powerful ? 5) What are concepts that you like / Dislike ? (Not to mention the raw power of the class) If you want, make a tiers list (rank better at worst) I will post mine in few days, when I will try/test all the classes at 100 %.

In this case, if I C.C. all the ennemies = useless (for me obviously). ---- All the question turn arround : With spells level... hum... 8-16 for POE2, multiclass will it have similar situation than POE1 ? If yes, single class dead. If no, wait and see. There is also an argument : The number of spells. Tendancy to have less spells by line at advanced levels. 1st level of spells for priest POE1 : 10 spells. 8th level of spells for priest : 3 spells. So... in POE2...9th-10th : 2 spells ?... I don't know obviously but you understand the concept. I will watch it closely, I'm interested ... ^^

I tried obviously. But there is better spells to inferior level. It is all. So, after that, there is not -superior- valors at these level to use them. Simple. I don't say all was bull****. I say : Spells at level 16-20 MUST be Very very effective to compensate their late arrival. More effective than level 12-16 spells of POE1 in the first game. Because these spells was equivalents or less than certain spells at lower levels. The difference is: spells at level 12-16 has an efficiency in POE1 (I don't say there was totally useless when used). But no ... They must be MORE effective this time !^^ If not Single class keep nothing.

Single class in POE2... ...LOL. +7 talents against +Double core abilities +Double choice in panel +More Power Source (Yes... count again) VS +Hypothetical OP Spells/abilities At the very end of the game (16-20) +A big advance over time on better spells/abilities. ----------- So, the only advantage of single class right now, is the last point. You are "ahead" with "new things". If you have enough options in multiclass to be efficient : it is not sufficient to compensate in single class. Few ideas : * Better empower. WHEN I see Nature godlike with +2 power level, you cannot tell me single class can't have a +2 power level with empower (against 1 now ?). It is logical. One class = more perf in this class at the critical moment. * Special passive/active abilities at the creation for each single classes. A reward to compensate +7 points AP of difference and other core of multiclass. * More empower per encounter OR/AND more empower per rest. ETC ETC.