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Update #50: So... Project Eternity!

project eternity update josh sawyer faq

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#81
GreatEmerald

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NO one suspects the humanoid platypi!!! ^_^


Just like nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition? :devil:


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#82
Amentep

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NO one suspects the humanoid platypi!!! ^_^

Just like nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition? :devil:


Only with more duckbills and poison spurs.

#83
Hormalakh

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Thanks for the info on the ethnicities. Josh you live in California and you have no East Asian or Middle Eastern/Persians or Southeast Asians in your ethnicities for the humans?! For shame...

 

Edit: I understand the difference between the cultures/physical attributes distinction. I'm just interested in knowing which humans have specific physical attributes like epicanthal folds, rosy red cheeks, e.g. human's (and other races) physiological adaptation to geographical limits.

 

http://en.wikipedia....gent_properties


Edited by Hormalakh, 17 April 2013 - 02:09 PM.

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#84
Gumbercules

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Thanks for the info on the ethnicities. Josh you live in California and you have no East Asian or Middle Eastern/Persians or Southeast Asians in your ethnicities for the humans?! For shame...

 

Edit: I understand the difference between the cultures/physical attributes distinction. I'm just interested in knowing which humans have specific physical attributes like epicanthal folds, rosy red cheeks, e.g. human's (and other races) physiological adaptation to geographical limits.

 

http://en.wikipedia....gent_properties

 

Maybe Asian-influenced cultures will appear in a sequel, once the PC boards a ship and goes off to explore new lands. Dyrwood is supposed to be a very small part of the world, so they have to save something for future games. That said, I think some Middle Eastern and Indian influences could be worked into the Aedyran designs, given that they're supposed to come from warm climates.



#85
Zeckul

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Looks like you finally mastered the fine art of making video games look sharp on Youtube. I like to think my little guide I posted here a while ago helped you, in any case congratulations, this series has gone from excellent commentary + so-so image quality to excellent commentary + excellent image quality. This might be the first time in eons I watch someone else's Let's Play.


Edited by Zeckul, 17 April 2013 - 04:36 PM.


#86
Hormalakh

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Maybe Asian-influenced cultures will appear in a sequel, once the PC boards a ship and goes off to explore new lands. Dyrwood is supposed to be a very small part of the world, so they have to save something for future games. That said, I think some Middle Eastern and Indian influences could be worked into the Aedyran designs, given that they're supposed to come from warm climates.

 

I can dig that. Most middle-easterners are considered "white" afterall. It's just, I don't know, I feel that the ethnicities as described currently are a little difficult to swallow. It seems like we got the whites (which we can't ever forget about) and the "token" black ethnicities "check." then we got mesoamerican because you know, that's "cool." 

 

but then it's really difficult to categorize people in this way. "Black" means different things. You've got jamaican black, haitian black, african black, middle-eastern black (yeah really. check out persian gulf people. Some of them are quite darkly toned.)

 

So I understand the whole "let's move away from white,black,latino" and describe where people are from. coastal places, mountainous regions, desert people, etc etc. It makes sense from a evolutionary biology/physiology perspective and basically "cleanses" it of any racial stigmata. 

 

At the same time, i'm sure some people want to play "yellow" mountainous people and "black" mountainous people or "scots" mountainous people, etc etc. Is this possible? Do these specific ethnicities limit the physiological makeup of the players you can choose? For example, if you pick the "coastal" does your PC automatically look darker skinned? Do all Player Characters have specific physiological characteristics picked for them? etc etc

 

It's a dangerous road to walk on in my opinion and perhaps some further thought should be put into it. I'm OK with people being described as from certain geographically descript locations and at the same time certain aspects of their physiology should be customizable.

 

anyway, i'm ranting. this deserves some further explanation and thought in my opinion. or maybe i'm completely misunderstanding this.


Edited by Hormalakh, 17 April 2013 - 05:06 PM.

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#87
Adam Brennecke

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Looks like you finally mastered the fine art of making video games look sharp on Youtube. I like to think my little guide I posted here a while ago helped you, in any case congratulations, this series has gone from excellent commentary + so-so image quality to excellent commentary + excellent image quality. This might be the first time in eons I watch someone else's Let's Play.

Yep. We followed your guide! Thank you :)



#88
J.E. Sawyer

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Ethnicity and culture are separate characteristics in the game.  Individual meadow folk can be from the Vailian Republics just as coastal aumaua can be from Aedyr.  The common-name descriptions of ethnicities don't restrict where they can be from.  Literally every ethnicity in our race document has a bit-by-bit description of what physical characteristics they have, including facial features, skin tones, hair colors (and textures), eye colors (and shapes), etc.  E.g., only savannah folk, pale elves, and boreal dwarves have epicanthic folds.  Of those, only boreal dwarves have them consistently.


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#89
Hormalakh

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Ethnicity and culture are separate characteristics in the game.  Individual meadow folk can be from the Vailian Republics just as coastal aumaua can be from Aedyr.  The common-name descriptions of ethnicities don't restrict where they can be from.  Literally every ethnicity in our race document has a bit-by-bit description of what physical characteristics they have, including facial features, skin tones, hair colors (and textures), eye colors (and shapes), etc.  E.g., only savannah folk, pale elves, and boreal dwarves have epicanthic folds.  Of those, only boreal dwarves have them consistently.

 

right, i understood that. i don't assume that ethnicities are equivalent to cultures. i think this is a step in the right direction (more anthropological in its description) and so that is why my question is "are these three human (i'm sticking to human for now) ethnicities limited only because of outside resource management, or are these three ethnicities the only ones that exist in the PE world?" You don't need/have to have everything described/flesh out in the first game but has this consideration been made? 

 

not to belabor the point (sorry!) but here are a few good wiki articles on the topic. this is obviously an anthropological subject of study and has been heavily studied for many years. from what i've gathered (and I am by no means an expert), anthropologists have always gotten it wrong (and probably continue to do so). but the main idea is that many of the main differences in physiological traits we see between humans (black skin, epicanthal folds, deep rosy cheeks, etc) are due to evolutionary adaptations over thousands of years. however, we continue to categorize people based on very varying physical traits and sometimes these things are not as clear cut (nature rarely has absolutes) as we sometimes make them out to be. 

 

Ultimately, does the ethnicity choice that I, as a player make, limit the, for example, skin tones I can choose for my PC? Can i toggle epicanthal folds, other physiological traits and still  be a certain ethnicity?

 

an example: can my oceanic dude have white skin tone with nappy hair or can my savannah dude be black (i've also seen this)? it's rare, but it happens! Bless America with its crazy mixture of people...

 

 

http://en.wikipedia...._and_biometrics

http://en.wikipedia....oloid#Criticism


Edited by Hormalakh, 17 April 2013 - 05:37 PM.


#90
J.E. Sawyer

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They are the only ethnicities known of in this part of the world.

 

I'm still really not sure what you're looking for here.



#91
Hormalakh

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They are the only ethnicities known of in this part of the world.

 

I'm still really not sure what you're looking for here.

 

 

Ultimately, does the ethnicity choice that I, as a player make, limit the, for example, skin tones I can choose for my PC? Can i toggle epicanthal folds, other physiological traits and still  be a certain ethnicity?

 

an example: can my oceanic dude have white skin tone with nappy hair or can my savannah dude be black (i've also seen this)? it's rare, but it happens! Bless America with its crazy mixture of people...



#92
Greensleeve

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I must say that you are making an excellent job at making me want to play the damn game! I've been trying to keep myself sated with Icewind Dale & Icewind Dale II recently, but more than anything, I was reminded of why I didn't like Icewind Dale I (very few character advancement options other than a few for casters). Though IWD II I'm still having fun with. 

 

Anyway, it'll be very interesting once we start getting more information about the classes, races, etc, to see what would be interesting and fun characters to build and play. 



#93
J.E. Sawyer

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We have not even started to figure out the total number of permutations of skin/eye/hair tones, hair styles, etc.  We are not going to offer "eye shape" customization because you're never going to see the character in enough detail for that to matter.  Those systems are extremely expensive to implement.


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#94
Hormalakh

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Thanks for the answer. I didn't think you'd have figured this all out by now, but I thought i'd be the squeaky wheel that brings a little discussion on the topic for when you guys do start "permutating and iterating."

 

and now, an interesting perspective on humanity.

 

http://boingboing.ne...half-black.html



#95
Gumbercules

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I can't remember, will there be support for custom portraits? Because if so, that should greatly expand people's options for character customization as far as epicanthic folds and other such features are concerned. For the zoomed-out 3D models we'll be looking at most of the time, all the game really needs to ask us is, "Do you want your character to be white, black, or brown?" and then, "How white/how black/how brown? Move this color slider," and "What type of hair?" and that should be close enough to approximate all real-world ethnicities from a distance.



#96
J.E. Sawyer

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Well, one way or another, we will not have literally infinite combinations.  There's always going to be a practical limit to what we can implement.  Portraits will be more limiting in that regard than character models, though you can always override the portrait.



#97
Gumbercules

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Right, I merely meant that if there's support for custom portraits, one can find a portrait they like on the internet and import it, or even draw/paint their own.



#98
Hormalakh

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Yeah I imagine so. At any rate, I think this ethnicity idea is great. I've never seen it being implemented even remotely correctly in any game and I salute you guys for definitely trying to make real sense out of the world that you're creating. Things like this really make the world stand out from the cardboard cut-out fantasy worlds we usually see. real thought going into game mechanics and the game world. i already feel that this world is bigger than the game and i haven't even played it yet.

 

keep up the great work. all the best to you guys.



#99
Sugarjaye

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Awesome information overload... lol.

 

Also, ZOOM :)



#100
SunBroSolaire

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Do we know how ethnicity will be treated in this game? Will it only determine NPC attitudes toward the player, or will it also define starting skills? 

 

I think Sawyer, Cain, Avellone, Bernicke, Ziets, and everyone else on the team deserve a ton of credit for attempting to deal with issues of race and ethnicity in a realistic way, anyway. It's got to be a really intimidating subject (especially for a bunch of white guys  :p ), but I have a lot of faith that you will do it right, especially because of New Vegas.







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