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master guardian

Thread for those of us who want to roll a single or multi rogue....lets talk

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Now I can't decide between Assassin and Beckoner. Would it be too bad to multiclass both?

 

In the last version of the beta, non-offensive spells and abilities were breaking invisibility. Not sure if that applies to chants but it probably does. So that would be bad. But hopefully that was just a bug and it will have been fixed by launch.

 

You can cast summons and nonoffensive spells without breaking stealth though.

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What a relief to learn that sneak attack scales with power level. I think I will keep the build I had planned after all.

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im stuck between a

 

Assassin/ Devoted

Assassin/ Blackjacet

Assassin / Wizard

 

I'm interested in: Beckoner, Assassin and Wizard.

 

I'll probably try one MC combination of these classes and restart the game if I'm not satisfied or if I get more information from the forums.


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Sneak attack scaling is definitely good news. Maybe other passives are now scaling too ? 

Like Riposte, putting it back over the playthrough to its post-buff POE1 state.

 

I have a question for the beta players. Blunderbuss backstab on the first pellet only got me wondering:

When using full attack or primary attack abilities with a blunderbuss, do every pellet have a chance to apply additional effects if they hit ? Or just the first one ?

On paper, when you're not looking for the damage but to apply the effect, blunderbuss sounds OP if all pellets have a chance to hit or crit.

 

I must decide between getting a single blunderbuss or pistol in my second slot just to apply Sap with more accuracy as an opening volley. My plan is to find a weapon with as much accuracy as possible, and as little damage (I want the confused target to survive longer and cause mayhem).

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im stuck between a

 

Assassin/ Devoted

Assassin/ Blackjacet

Assassin / Wizard

I say go Assassin/Black jacket, have dual weapons for your full attacks, and a 2h weapon for backstab, maybe have a powerful ranged weapon or a blunderbuss for your first backstab, or run dual pistols/scepters for a ranged option for your full attacks or just an alternative opening move before you swap into melee.

 

I'm biased though cause I have a softspot for black jackets that aren't just cycling firearms.    

Edited by Riftis
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im stuck between a

 

Assassin/ Devoted

Assassin/ Blackjacet

Assassin / Wizard

I say go Assassin/Black jacket, have dual weapons for your full attacks, and a 2h weapon for backstab, maybe have a powerful ranged weapon for your first backstab, or run dual pistols/scepters for a ranged option for your full attacks or just an alternative opening move.

 

I'm biased though cause I have a softspot for black jackets that aren't just cycling firearms.    

 

 

Black Jacket loses constant recovery, and damage against Assassin is increased... OTOH iirc Black Jacket can quick-switch to shield immediately after attacking without recovery penalty. 

 

Devoted accuracy and penetration bonus combined with assassinate is probably overkill... and even if you choose a dual damage type weapon as your only proficiency, you may miss out on good unique weapons, which may even have a special bonus for backstab or crit etc. You can always respec that though....

 

Wizard/Assassin was fun back before it was nerfed and DoT could be used while invisible, hopefully they'll at least have changed it so that DoT like Deep Wounds don't end invisibility... guess we'll find out soon. Even in the beta multiclass only got a few uses of assassinate (Smoke Veil invisibility), early levels will probably be hard, but Wizard buffs and good companions should get you through. 

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to be honest the more i look at multi-classing the more i come back to just wanting to run a single class,

 

OBS have balanced multi classing to much . Im struggling to find mulitclass builds that justify the negatives from multi classing.

 

And how they have tinkered alot of the abilities and spells to balance mulitclassing is beggining to be quite frustrating 

 

For example:

 

     -the 3rd level wizard spell haste is pretty much no longer haste, it increase dex by 5

 

     - all the rangers modals are gone, twin arrows costs points to use and is level 8? really just to fire twin arrows once??? this is crap, no joke i had to read this about ten times just to be sure: you have to use bond to fire twin arrows once! and you have to waste a level 8 slot on it hahahah this is balancing gone out of control

 

 

heaps and heaps of little changes like this just to balance multiclassing. 

Edited by master guardian

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Dot+invisibility: Yes, correct - the ticks break invisibility. Seems to be an oversight/bug.

Edited by Boeroer

Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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maybe they fixed it in the release was it reported?

 

sht thats to pretty big bugs for release if they didnt fix them

 

1. Backtab doesnt work for dual weilding and blunderbuss

 

2. Deep wounds breaks invis

Edited by master guardian

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actually i take that back about priests

 

priests of wael have incredible mage spells for protection

 

hope they didnt get nerfed,

 

piest of wale/ assasin is now a contender as well

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Priest of Wael/Ascendant drowns in focus once he's summoned his spiritual rod (and uses it with Blast).

 

Priest of Wael/Helwalker with Lightning Strikes and DualityoMP(INT) has an enormous Blast AoE and hits with +80% shocking lash * 50% MIG bonus in an AoE. Pretty decent. Too bad Turning Wheel doesn't work ranged. If you want that too you could go with Priest of Skaen/Eothas/Berath and go to town with +50%(varies)+30%(shock)+50%(burn). Also Shining Beacon, while nerfed in comparison to PoE, is still "the sh!t" with +10 MIG and +10 INT.

A priest of Skaen/Assassin can use his spells instead of Guile to become invisible 2/encounter (Skean gets Shadowing Beyond) and thus can at least do 2 more Assassinations+Backstabs during fight. Maybe you don't need his spiritual weapons but take a heavy hitter (I'm sure there will be some rad weapon for backstabbing). However - if you like the sneaky assassin type this would be fun I guess.

So all in all - if you want a more martial or damage-oriented priest then multiclassing can be fine. There are many more cool combos like Triumph of the Crusaders + Blood Thirst, Spark the Souls of the Righteous + 6 skeletons and whatnot.

 

But it's true that the high level spells of priest are very, very tempting. Also getting Devotions and such a lot earlier seems like to be very important. Devotions is still one of the best spells in the game (given the Power Level). I also think that a single class priest may be the "optimal" way to go if you want the best buffings asap.

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Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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So I see that everyone are stating that 2H is the only way to go if you want to Backstab.

 

But what about using a single 1H like a saber or a sword?

 

Sure you get less base dmg, but using a single weapon gives you +12 acc, faster recovery and +20% hits to crits from the One-Handed Style.

 

I feel like the higher accuracy with the faster recovery will allow you to more reliably apply afflictions and more crits can make up for the lower dmg.

 

Plus now you don't have to be a rogue carrying a giant sword.

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So I see that everyone are stating that 2H is the only way to go if you want to Backstab.

 

But what about using a single 1H like a saber or a sword?

 

Sure you get less base dmg, but using a single weapon gives you +12 acc, faster recovery and +20% hits to crits from the One-Handed Style.

 

I feel like the higher accuracy with the faster recovery will allow you to more reliably apply afflictions and more crits can make up for the lower dmg.

 

Plus now you don't have to be a rogue carrying a giant sword.

 

Good point. I definitely don't want to be a rogue sneaking around with a massive sword.

 

I'll try different builds without advancing much and check the forums before I go for real. Maybe I'll even end up as a Beckoner/Assassin, if the chant doesn't break stealth. I really like these classes.


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So I see that everyone are stating that 2H is the only way to go if you want to Backstab.

 

But what about using a single 1H like a saber or a sword?

 

Sure you get less base dmg, but using a single weapon gives you +12 acc, faster recovery and +20% hits to crits from the One-Handed Style.

 

I feel like the higher accuracy with the faster recovery will allow you to more reliably apply afflictions and more crits can make up for the lower dmg.

 

Plus now you don't have to be a rogue carrying a giant sword.

 

In theory a 2H should only be better if you are auto-attacking from stealth, utilizing a full attack should grant the bonus to both weapons when backstabbing right?


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So I see that everyone are stating that 2H is the only way to go if you want to Backstab.

 

But what about using a single 1H like a saber or a sword?

 

Sure you get less base dmg, but using a single weapon gives you +12 acc, faster recovery and +20% hits to crits from the One-Handed Style.

 

I feel like the higher accuracy with the faster recovery will allow you to more reliably apply afflictions and more crits can make up for the lower dmg.

 

Plus now you don't have to be a rogue carrying a giant sword.

 

In theory a 2H should only be better if you are auto-attacking from stealth, utilizing a full attack should grant the bonus to both weapons when backstabbing right?

 

 

No, only first attack get bonus.

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I'v done a quick test with console commands and playing with some level 20 builds vs dummies :

 

There is good, bad and ugly with the rogue right now.

Ugly, the dot bug is still here, that make any invisible ability useless if you use dot which is a big problem since a big part of rogue tree is about invisibility & Dot.

The pernicious cloug is bugged too, look like there is no DOT (with dummy I only see 1 tick of dot then nothing.)

 

Bad, the class have too much identical skills that do pretty much the same thing : DMG + affliction + DOT, 3 different smokes very similars and lot of teleports. As a solo class you can have lot of skills but they all feel very similar.

Lot of abilities could be merged and replaced by modals/self buff that the class completly lack. You want some corrode DOT? add a poison weapon self buff ability that make all your attacks deal a DOT instead of a new attack skill (that work with affliction, a modal that add a poison that weakness for exemple). A stance/modal that allow you to switch from an offensive fighting still (reckless assault) to a defensive highter deflection one (combo with ripost).

The rogue can't use inspiration (or need a level 8 ability). A rogue that can't buff his dex/perception? feel really strange.

 

Good, look like gambit can be devastating and with high critic rate, you can just spam hit. Take not that with a blunderbuss, only the first hit count for the extra guile I think.

The tier 9 ability have a special invisibility that don't break when you attack (or with the dot). So for the duration you can continue to attack and benefit from backstab.

 

 

EDIT:

The teleport that do dmg (knife throw) at t8, feel bad in my opinion for a t8, 3 guile ability. Visualy it's poor and it only hit people at melee range (was expecting a better aoe). The charge (t5 fighter) and flagellant (t6 monk) are just far better for only 2 resources since they do full attack on every one in their path.

 

the sap skill : the upgrade could be interesting, but since I tested the trickster, the AOE confuse spell (t5) feel just far better. For other rogue I don't know if it's worth to be a lvl 7-8 ability.

Edited by Takkik

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I'v done a quick test with console commands and playing with some level 20 builds vs dummies :

 

There is good, bad and ugly with the rogue right now.

Ugly, the dot bug is still here, that make any invisible ability useless if you use dot which is a big problem since a big part of rogue tree is about invisibility & Dot.

The pernicious cloug is bugged too, look like there is no DOT (with dummy I only see 1 tick of dot then nothing.)

 

Bad, the class have too much identical skills that do pretty much the same thing : DMG + affliction + DOT, 3 different smokes very similars and lot of teleports. As a solo class you can have lot of skills but they all feel very similar.

Lot of abilities could be merged and replaced by modals/self buff that the class completly lack. You want some corrode DOT? add a poison weapon self buff ability that make all your attacks deal a DOT instead of a new attack skill (that work with affliction, a modal that add a poison that weakness for exemple). A stance/modal that allow you to switch from an offensive fighting still (reckless assault) to a defensive highter deflection one (combo with ripost).

The rogue can't use inspiration (or need a level 8 ability). A rogue that can't buff his dex/perception? feel really strange.

 

Good, look like gambit can be devastating and with high critic rate, you can just spam hit. Take not that with a blunderbuss, only the first hit count for the extra guile I think.

The tier 9 ability have a special invisibility that don't break when you attack (or with the dot). So for the duration you can continue to attack and benefit from backstab.

 

 

EDIT:

The teleport that do dmg (knife throw) at t8, feel bad in my opinion for a t8, 3 guile ability. Visualy it's poor and it only hit people at melee range (was expecting a better aoe). The charge (t5 fighter) and flagellant (t6 monk) are just far better for only 2 resources since they do full attack on every one in their path.

 

the sap skill : the upgrade could be interesting, but since I tested the trickster, the AOE confuse spell (t5) feel just far better. For other rogue I don't know if it's worth to be a lvl 7-8 ability.

 

I think everybody overestimate backstabbing, with Might went back to additive bonus, backstabbing add 1.5 x base weapon damage to your hit. So if you wield a sabre, you get extra 20 damage and that's all. It seems to me some people still think backstabbing can increase your total damage by 1.5 times?

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I'm testing a Priest of Skaen/Beckoner and I found out some interesting things:

 

- I almost immediately gain 2 phrases at the beginning of combat and so can summon my skeletons really fast

- Chanting doesn't break stealth until the attack hits:

 

 

Chant.jpg

 

 

- Summoning skeletons doesn't break stealth:

 

 

Summon.jpg

 

 

Edited by InsaneCommander

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I'm testing a Priest of Skaen/Beckoner and I found out some interesting things:

 

- I almost immediately gain 2 phrases at the beginning of combat and so can summon my skeletons really fast

- Chanting doesn't break stealth (as you can see in the picture below the enemy is within range):

 

 

Chant.jpg

 

 

- Neither does summoning my skeletons:

 

 

Summon.jpg

 

 

 

Do you mean you can hit with Soft Winds of Death without leaving stealth? The attack roll doesn't bring you out of stealth?

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I'm testing a Priest of Skaen/Beckoner and I found out some interesting things:

 

- I almost immediately gain 2 phrases at the beginning of combat and so can summon my skeletons really fast

- Chanting doesn't break stealth (as you can see in the picture below the enemy is within range):

 

 

Chant.jpg

 

 

- Neither does summoning my skeletons:

 

 

Summon.jpg

 

 

 

Do you mean you can hit with Soft Winds of Death without leaving stealth? The attack roll doesn't bring you out of stealth?

 

 

Apparently not. I moved near the enemy to test. And later I summoned the skeletons. Some time passed, I think it was enough for the Soft Winds of Death.

 

Let me test in another battle and I'll let you know for sure.

 

Edit: It breaks stealth when the attack hits. But you can "sing" in stealth until that happens.

Edited by InsaneCommander

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