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Thread for those of us who want to roll a single or multi rogue....lets talk

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biting whip is 30% additive damage to the base roll (it got nerfed from 40%)

 

 

Sneak attacks is extra 30% on top of all the damage eg two handed style, lashes ect

 

so sneak is far more powerful

 

Where are you getting this? I was under the impression that Sneak Attack has always been an additive bonus. IIRC only Might and lashes are multiplicative bonuses in Deadfire.

Either way, Mindstalker is the multiclass to take if you wanna stack sneak attack damage. 

 

i think you would be better of dueling with a wizard because of the wizards self buffs. The cipher has hardly any self buffs that are good apart from time parasite and a multi cant get that (level until level eight )

 

If you want to play a stealthy, backstabbing assassin your going to be very close to the action. The wizard has the abilities to really keep the rogue alive and with the latest patch all wizard buffs and weapons summons are nearly instant cast (0.4 seconds)

 

I think a cipher will be to flimsy 

Edited by master guardian

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Another interesting thing to note: If you want to have sneak attack damage but you DON'T want to run rogue, you could run a beguiler cipher single/multiclass instead and the effect is almost as good, except it takes one ability to get it up to the 30% of rogues sneak attack and it turns off when you hit max focus, but you're probably gonna be casting cipher spells at max focus anyway. 

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i cant wait to sneak around behind a high level wizard and blow his head off with my arquebus doing : ;assasinate, backstab, deathblow, sneak, critical hit!!!!!!!

 

wooowwww

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hang on i just checked on the beta and sneak attack and backstab went of from stealth and the target didnt have an affliction on them 

 

is this a bug?

 

I though sneak needed an affliction on the target to work

 

 

 

edit

 

its ok just checked in deadfire sneak attack works from stealth now!!!! cool 

 

it says it works within 2 sec combat

Edited by master guardian

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I'm not sure that I'm convinced 2H is absolutely the way to go for an assassin. You get more damage from assassinate/backstab, but you aren't going to be making 100% of your attacks out of stealth. During those times you get a lot more out of dual wielding thanks to full attacks. Some multiclasses are going to benefit from quicker attacks too. Faster swings and double hits on full attacks = higher number of crits, which helps out a lot of combinations. Assassin/monk procs weakness on crits. Assassin/barbarian interrupts on crits. Assassin/skald gains phrases on crits. There are probably other synergies out there as well.

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biting whip is 30% additive damage to the base roll (it got nerfed from 40%)

 

 

Sneak attacks is extra 30% on top of all the damage eg two handed style, lashes ect

 

so sneak is far more powerful

 

Where are you getting this? I was under the impression that Sneak Attack has always been an additive bonus. IIRC only Might and lashes are multiplicative bonuses in Deadfire.

Either way, Mindstalker is the multiclass to take if you wanna stack sneak attack damage. 

 

i think you would be better of dueling with a wizard because of the wizards self buffs. The cipher has hardly any self buffs that are good apart from time parasite and a multi cant get that (level until level eight )

 

If you want to play a stealthy, backstabbing assassin your going to be very close to the action. The wizard has the abilities to really keep the rogue alive and with the latest patch all wizard buffs and weapons summons are nearly instant cast (0.4 seconds)

 

I think a cipher will be to flimsy 

 

Oh missed this when I made my above post. I'm not gonna be focusing on backstabbing. I'm gonna be a ranged dps with rods and scepters, and a club to reduce their will if they get in close so I can dominate them with cipher spells. 

 

That's the plan, anyway.   

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biting whip is 30% additive damage to the base roll (it got nerfed from 40%)

 

 

Sneak attacks is extra 30% on top of all the damage eg two handed style, lashes ect

 

so sneak is far more powerful

Where are you getting this? I was under the impression that Sneak Attack has always been an additive bonus. IIRC only Might and lashes are multiplicative bonuses in Deadfire.

Either way, Mindstalker is the multiclass to take if you wanna stack sneak attack damage.

i think you would be better of dueling with a wizard because of the wizards self buffs. The cipher has hardly any self buffs that are good apart from time parasite and a multi cant get that (level until level eight )

 

If you want to play a stealthy, backstabbing assassin your going to be very close to the action. The wizard has the abilities to really keep the rogue alive and with the latest patch all wizard buffs and weapons summons are nearly instant cast (0.4 seconds)

 

I think a cipher will be to flimsy

Oh missed this when I made my above post. I'm not gonna be focusing on backstabbing. I'm gonna be a ranged dps with rods and scepters, and a club to reduce their will if they get in close so I can dominate them with cipher spells.

 

That's the plan, anyway.

When they don’t respect the watcher, they get the club. Best strat. 10/10. 5 stars. 9/10. A+

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I'm not sure that I'm convinced 2H is absolutely the way to go for an assassin. You get more damage from assassinate/backstab, but you aren't going to be making 100% of your attacks out of stealth. During those times you get a lot more out of dual wielding thanks to full attacks. Some multiclasses are going to benefit from quicker attacks too. Faster swings and double hits on full attacks = higher number of crits, which helps out a lot of combinations. Assassin/monk procs weakness on crits. Assassin/barbarian interrupts on crits. Assassin/skald gains phrases on crits. There are probably other synergies out there as well.

 

Maybe go swashbuckler as black jacket / assassin to quickly switch between dual wielding and two handing to get the best of both worlds? 

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I think I'm gonna play as assassin/fighter (no sub). Assassin seems like the the best option to alleviate sneak attack nerf and fighter class alleviates assassin's squishiness. Also that Charge ability looks like a fun option to get out of trouble and fly around the battlefield:

https://youtu.be/9Fdjvx1fMa8?t=87

Edited by Aramintai

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I'm not sure that I'm convinced 2H is absolutely the way to go for an assassin. You get more damage from assassinate/backstab, but you aren't going to be making 100% of your attacks out of stealth. During those times you get a lot more out of dual wielding thanks to full attacks. Some multiclasses are going to benefit from quicker attacks too. Faster swings and double hits on full attacks = higher number of crits, which helps out a lot of combinations. Assassin/monk procs weakness on crits. Assassin/barbarian interrupts on crits. Assassin/skald gains phrases on crits. There are probably other synergies out there as well.

 

Maybe go swashbuckler as black jacket / assassin to quickly switch between dual wielding and two handing to get the best of both worlds? 

 

It was mentioned several times around here somewhere that black jacket is best with four guns. Something about shooting swiftly as a Gatling gun 8)  

Edited by Aramintai

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I'm not sure that I'm convinced 2H is absolutely the way to go for an assassin. You get more damage from assassinate/backstab, but you aren't going to be making 100% of your attacks out of stealth. During those times you get a lot more out of dual wielding thanks to full attacks. Some multiclasses are going to benefit from quicker attacks too. Faster swings and double hits on full attacks = higher number of crits, which helps out a lot of combinations. Assassin/monk procs weakness on crits. Assassin/barbarian interrupts on crits. Assassin/skald gains phrases on crits. There are probably other synergies out there as well.

 

Maybe go swashbuckler as black jacket / assassin to quickly switch between dual wielding and two handing to get the best of both worlds? 

 

It was mentioned several times around here somewhere that black jacket is best with four guns. Something about shooting swiftly as a Gatling gun 8)  

 

Blasphemy!  

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So it looks like my original idea of rolling a dual-saber Mindstalker and using Cipher's CC spells to set up sneak attacks is going out of the window. The 30% damage bonus just isn't worth the trouble. And since dual-wielding isn't really compatible with backstabbing, a non-casting Soul Blade/Assassin with a pair of sabers will be suboptimal, too... And there's no way in hell I'll ever play a rogue with a two-handed weapon, this just feels wrong on all levels :D I guess one last option is to try an Ascendant/plain Rogue (no subclass), and alternate between generating focus in melee and then dodging out of the fray (Escape, Smoke Veil etc.) and spamming Cipher spells for free while ascended. This might work, but it's pure theorycrafting on my part. Not sure how sustainable a dual-wielding Rogue will be in melee if the enemies aren't already debuffed...

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So it looks like my original idea of rolling a dual-saber Mindstalker and using Cipher's CC spells to set up sneak attacks is going out of the window. The 30% damage bonus just isn't worth the trouble. 

But! But! With Beguiler cipher and biting whip your sneak attack bonus is 60%

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So it looks like my original idea of rolling a dual-saber Mindstalker and using Cipher's CC spells to set up sneak attacks is going out of the window. The 30% damage bonus just isn't worth the trouble. And since dual-wielding isn't really compatible with backstabbing, a non-casting Soul Blade/Assassin with a pair of sabers will be suboptimal, too... And there's no way in hell I'll ever play a rogue with a two-handed weapon, this just feels wrong on all levels :D I guess one last option is to try an Ascendant/plain Rogue (no subclass), and alternate between generating focus in melee and then dodging out of the fray (Escape, Smoke Veil etc.) and spamming Cipher spells for free while ascended. This might work, but it's pure theorycrafting on my part. Not sure how sustainable a dual-wielding Rogue will be in melee if the enemies aren't already debuffed...

i dont see any reason to multi a rogue with a cipher apart from getting bitting whip

 

you need self buffs (wizard, fighter) or good self passives (paladin ) to make it really worth it

 

unbending is arguably the best defensive buff in the entire game and a fighter gets it pretty early (5) and now with the new changes on using powers you can use it mulitple times per encounter. nothing is going to be better for a rogue then that in terms or raw power , you will be able to sit there invincible and dish out huge damage the entire encounter if you have enough guile

 

im going to multi with a wizard though because i reckin it wil be more fun

Edited by master guardian
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Having played a Trickster single and multi(w/cipher, chanter, and wizard) through all beta content, I enjoyed the trickster a lot. He felt good in all the builds I tried and especially good multiclassed with chanter or cipher. I would even play Trickster single though. Sure if you're looking for your stereotypical backstabbing thief rougues aren't that by default anymore in general.. You need to spec them that way. Overall rouges are better in deadfire to me, they were not nearly as fun or versitile in PoE 1.

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Having played a Trickster single and multi(w/cipher, chanter, and wizard) through all beta content, I enjoyed the trickster a lot. He felt good in all the builds I tried and especially good multiclassed with chanter or cipher. I would even play Trickster single though. Sure if you're looking for your stereotypical backstabbing thief rougues aren't that by default anymore in general.. You need to spec them that way. Overall rouges are better in deadfire to me, they were not nearly as fun or versitile in PoE 1.

The boy only cares about damage, friend, not utility or usefulness in other situations. Let him be.

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BTW Josh just posted on SA that Sneak Attack scales with power level now.

 

Maybe that's where the confusion about whether it was 20% or 30% came from.

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BTW Josh just posted on SA that Sneak Attack scales with power level now.

Nice!

 

Hmm, hmm. That does sound nice  :shifty:

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BTW Josh just posted on SA that Sneak Attack scales with power level now.

Which also makes a case for a single-class rogue vs. multiclassed one. Interesting :)

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So does this also means Deathblow also scales with PL, so they change it from +100% damage to +50%, same as FoD?

 

What about Carnage? Imo 33% of weapon damage is a bit low

Edited by dunehunter

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BTW Josh just posted on SA that Sneak Attack scales with power level now.

 

Now we're cooking with gas. Wonder how and by how much it scales.

I kinda think that it goes up to the used to be default 50%. But it would be cool if it goes even higher on single class.

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