Why I think a fully voiced PoE:Deadfire is a mistake

[Lord_Mord]

 

 

I, too, spend most of today playing indies rather than AAA and have stumbled on some gems, games made by 3 to 10 people that sell for $14.99 with more depth and lore than an rpg game. What sorcery is this that Hollow Knight a game made by 3 people could possibly dethrone Castlevania

 

Man, that game looks beautiful. I have to try it.

[Gregorovitch]

 

 

It's a bit of a double-edged sword, I'd say, because on one hand you can aid in avoiding misinterpretations, but on the other you run into the issue of overlining or unilateralizing the meaning to dialogue that might have best been served by letting the player fill in the tone he felt it more natural or appropriate to the dynamic between both characters instead.

This isn't Dark Souls, I shouldn't be guessing about the intent of the Merchant from the Old Rebpublic who is trying to convince me to help them sink a Principi vessel.

 

Some vague and open ended dialog is fine, basing your entire game around it?  I hope your game isn't very dialog or story heavy, otherwise it will make little to no sense.  Case in point, no one made rave reviews of Hotline Miami because of the story.  It was the gameplay and the soundtrack that sold it.

 

You can't maintain a tight solid narrative, and have large amounts of open ended dialog with unclear meaning at the same time.  Deadfire is a story driven RPG, it needs a tight solid narrative.

I think you are taking my above remark to extremes - I never said that all lines should be vague or open to multiple interpretations, I said that *some* interactions could benefit from this approach and that full voice-over could potentially work against it due to setting an explicit delivery or tone. In all honesty you probably wouldn't run across the risk of misinterpretation in most encounters anyhow provided the game is competently written (which, in Obsidian's case, they usually are). Likewise I don't think tonal or implicit ambiguity necessarily works against the tightness of narrative, that would be more if the literal or explicit meaning in plot points and certain key situations are made unclear which is not the kind of "open interpretation" I was referring to.

 

 

I think an additional issue is that in a long RPG like Pillars one the the biggest degraders of the payer's experience can be when they miss an important or pivotal statement in the text that would, had they read it properly, significantly enhanced their appreciation of the story down the track. I know I have been guilty of this on occasion becasue I'm tired or I just want to go fight something already etc. It is much harder to miss this sort of thing if it's spoken.

 

I don't disgree with you that studied ambiguity can be a good and enriching thing in narrative, but I'm not sure it trumps that.

[JerekKruger]

I think an additional issue is that in a long RPG like Pillars one the the biggest degraders of the payer's experience can be when they miss an important or pivotal statement in the text that would, had they read it properly, significantly enhanced their appreciation of the story down the track. I know I have been guilty of this on occasion becasue I'm tired or I just want to go fight something already etc. It is much harder to miss this sort of thing if it's spoken.

Hence my preference for partial voice acting. Use voice acting to emphasise the important stuff and have the unimportant stuff unvoiced.

[morhilane]

 

No one had a problem with Skyrim being fully VO.

It's mainly because there was nothing wrong with it, but some people out there will probably complain about it lol It's the internet, sometimes it doesn't even have to be about what's preferable, some people just like to talk

 

Anyways, Skyrim's voice acting/voice overs and wtiting in general is pretty good actually, and so was Oblivion. Morrowind on the other hand....

 

Morrowind voice acting is better than Oblivion, but very few characters speak more than greetings and combat grunts (the 4 NPCs you talk while starting the game, Vivec, Dagoth Ur and the Daedra Princes are the only one with more than greetings and grunts).

 

Oblivion has major editing issues (character switching voice depending what you ask them and the sound level output is different in some cases) and most NPCs lack direction. I get the impression their initial plan was just to voice the main quest NPCs, Daedra and main guilds NPCs.

 

Skyrim is super fine though.

[SonicMage117]

This is seriously bad though:

 

^Morrowind Dark Elf voices

[Karkarov]

 

 

 

I, too, spend most of today playing indies rather than AAA and have stumbled on some gems, games made by 3 to 10 people that sell for $14.99 with more depth and lore than an rpg game. What sorcery is this that Hollow Knight a game made by 3 people could possibly dethrone Castlevania

 

Man, that game looks beautiful. I have to try it.

 

Lol Hollow Knight is overrated as hell.  Also it was an okay game until the final bit then it pretty much just sucks because it decides it doesn't want to be a slightly harder castlevania anymore, it wants to be super meat boy and dark souls.

 

Symphony of the Night is in no danger from that game.

 

Also best line of the day has to go to that dark elf with "I've fought guars more ferocious than you."

Edited April 21, 2018 by Karkarov

[OrKToS]

i haven't played first game, because it wasn't voiced. and VO is one of main reasons i will buy Deadfire. Don't know how annoying repeatable lines in this game, but in Original sin 1-2 it was just fine, some of them even a meme now. 

[injurai]

No one had a problem with Skyrim being fully VO. 

 

But people did have problems with repetition and lack of distinct voices despite having like 80 VOs.

 

Plus it was easy to listen to someone and go about you're own business.

[Night Stalker]

Don't know how annoying repeatable lines in this game, but in Original sin 1-2 it was just fine, some of them even a meme now. 

 

I don't know how you feel about this, but for me, when an oft-repated phrase becomes a meme, it is an indication that it was source of annoyence (arrow to the knee, wishing for a nuclear winter and so on).

[The Sharmat]

This is seriously bad though:

 

^Morrowind Dark Elf voices

Nothing wrong with guys that grew up next to a giant volcano that constantly spews fine ash not sounding like random passersby from LA shoved into a recording booth.

[SonicMage117]

 

This is seriously bad though:

https://youtu.be/rvkjmnRRcG4

 

^Morrowind Dark Elf voices

Nothing wrong with guys that grew up next to a giant volcano that constantly spews fine ash not sounding like random passersby from LA shoved into a recording booth.

Indeed lol

 

It's super terrible, among the worst actually.. unless people don't consider a constipated cookie monster to be bad?

 

Where's the effort?

[The Sharmat]

This is actually the first time I've ever seen someone complain about the Dark Elf male voice in Morrowind, much less while praising Oblivion's voice work. Guess there's always someone.

[OrKToS]

I don't know how you feel about this, but for me, when an oft-repated phrase becomes a meme, it is an indication that it was source of annoyence (arrow to the knee, wishing for a nuclear winter and so on).

i never was annoyed by repeated lines (maybe i was, but can't remember any of it). and i think best example of repeateble voice lines is ANY RTS, where units repeat same line over and over and over again with each click. It didn't annoy me at all, was you annoyed by it?. and i  doubt any RPG will have same level of repetition as RTS, so... was full voice over are mistake? I'd say no, it was best kind of decision.  Maybe it's just me, but when all characters are voiced, it immerse me better, then when voiced only main characters, and other characters sounds the same in my head. 

[SonicMage117]

Guess there's always someone.

Lol I think this same exact thing every time I get on this forum

[Wintermist]

I like that it's fully voiced myself, it was annoying in PoE that in dialogues suddenly you get something that wasn't voiced at all and it's just so random. Now you always have it, and if you don't like it you can turn it off, can't get more perfect.

 

I get why doing voices in a game like this is hard, because of the sheer amount of dialogue. It does a lot for the game though, I think. I also understand that adding new things will be more work too because now they got to add voices for it to match the text. In a pure text scenario they could add as much as the writers could come up with without the hassle of getting the voice lines there, and making sure the voice lines match up with the written text. Something that could be a bother if you have to edit the story and all.

[Artaios]

This is actually the first time I've ever seen someone complain about the Dark Elf male voice in Morrowind, much less while praising Oblivion's voice work. Guess there's always someone.

Yeah, the Dunmer voices are great and Oblivion's acting was so generic.

[Skazz]

 

This is actually the first time I've ever seen someone complain about the Dark Elf male voice in Morrowind, much less while praising Oblivion's voice work. Guess there's always someone.

Yeah, the Dunmer voices are great and Oblivion's acting was so generic.

 

Wealth beyond measure, Outlander.

[Artaios]

 

 

This is actually the first time I've ever seen someone complain about the Dark Elf male voice in Morrowind, much less while praising Oblivion's voice work. Guess there's always someone.

Yeah, the Dunmer voices are great and Oblivion's acting was so generic.

 

Wealth beyond measure, Outlander.

 

Under sun and sky, Outlander, we greet you warmly.

[SonicMage117]

Alotta nostalgia there...

[HAWmaro]

Haven't played morrowind in a while so can't comment on that but i can confirm that Oblivion had some of the worst voice acting and Voice direction i have seen(heard actually) in a AAA game.

[Tanjaxxx]

Muting voice aside....(Since you can do that in Poe and Poe2, right....?)

 

Felt like adding my bro from another ma' (lol) thought PoE's voice acting was awful, while I actually found it great......at least, in due time.

 

And even Skyrim's voice acting is horrible for the most part as well (Oblivion aside lmao). Not because it's actually 'that bad', 'goofy' or whatever but because it's so boring it makes me wanna poke my ear drums lol. Skyrim, I mean.....

 

To each their own I guess but I'll add this;

 

It's great that we have a fully voiced Poe2.  And if anyone doesn't like voice acting, they can simply mute it as stated above. Win win??

 

Update:

 

Personally, I think I'll enjoy this feature. ^^ As long as my own character isn't voiced, it's all good! :D 

Edited April 23, 2018 by Tanjaxxx

[SonicMage117]

Haven't played morrowind in a while so can't comment on that but i can confirm that Oblivion had some of the worst voice acting and Voice direction i have seen(heard actually) in a AAA game.

Not even close, though I'm wondering how many games with voice acting you've actually played.

 

Elder scrolls aren't particularly the best, Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim may each have their own faults in voice acting (I could name cheap small budget indie titles who blow these games out the water) but they aren't by any means the worst in the industry.

[George_Truman]

Stop! You violated the law! Pay the court a fine or serve your sentence! Your stolen goods are now forfeit...

 

Oblivion VA is hands down the best of all time you guys don't know what you're talking about.

[SonicMage117]

Stop! You violated the law! Pay the court a fine or serve your sentence! Your stolen goods are now forfeit...

 

By the nine divines, someone's stolen all've me sweetrolls! Alarm the Imperial Gaurds at once... GAURDS, GAURDS!!!

[HAWmaro]

I specifically said AAA game, of course if you'll look at smaller titles or older ones you'll find lots of hilariously bad examples of VA that are much worse than oblivion. BUT compare Oblivion to AAA games that came out around the same time(let's say GOW3, FFXII, MGS4, ME/DAO(a bit later than oblivion) just to give a few examples from different genres) or even to any other bethesda game that came after it including published ones and you'll find That Oblivion VA is just awfull in comparison, not just worse but MUCH MUCH worse.  

Of course in the end to each his own I guess, I just felt the VA was one of the weakest aspects of that game.