Chris Avellone hates Obsidian!

[Infinitron]

The fun continues! http://sugarbombed.com/forums/threads/sugarbombed-presents-the-chris-avellone-interview-part-ii.21180/

 

SB: Now onto New Vegas. Since you designed New Reno in Fallout 2, how did you and the other developers go about differentiating New Vegas from it? And what influence did you take from it (New Reno)?

CA: I don't know if there were any conversations on differentiating New Vegas from New Reno, the level designers for the city might know (I don't know if they played Fallout 2). BTW, New Reno wasn't solely mine, I inherited the design from the Troika guys before they left Black Isle, so I had that template to build on (the crime families, the Enclave, jet production, etc.) The worst parts of New Reno you can blame me for, don't blame the Troika guys. 

Looking back the only thing I regret in New Reno is that I should have cut out one of the crime families (four was too many with everything else that was going on) and made Myron more systemically valuable to the party (his combat build and crafting abilities weren't helpful). Cassidy ended up being a better companion for systemic considerations, even with his heart condition. I did a post about companion design based on this learning experience a while back on the Obsidian forums, but I don't know if it's still up there (Obsidian locked me out of my profile after my departure, and they've refused to delete my account). The companion system design principles are not being used in recent Obsidian titles, so it may have been removed.

 

 

SB: Something that most people can agree on is that Bethesda and Godfather Pete Hines are experts at marketing. By using the hype of Fallout 4 and announcing it 6 months before release, they were able to make it one of the most profitable games in history. What were your personal experiences with Bethesda's PR/marketing department like, and how does this compare to other companies you’ve worked with in the past?

 

CA: Ah, a Bethesda question, I was waiting for it (Part 1 was filled with them, Monte, almost as if they were LEADING QUESTIONS HMMMM Editor's Note: Lol). I've been wrapped up with Prey for a while now, and I didn't have much interaction with marketing, but I doubt it's changed much - overall, I think Bethesda is one of the few companies that do marketing right. I've said this before, and I'll say it again - I have a lot of respect for Pete Hines - if you see him on the trenches at E3, he takes his job seriously and isn't ****ing away on his mobile phone while journalists ask the developers ****ty questions that PR should be listening to and monitoring (sorry for the tirade, am channeling past experiences).

 

In addition (and I've said this before, too), but he knows how to demo games he's working on, and he was always willing to take over showcasing the game and gameplay for one of the other demo folks if a developer or demo-er needed to be pulled away for an interview, and he did it without a hitch, something a lot of other PR folks I've worked with in the past wouldn't dare do or want to (and most may not even like the games, and feel that demoing is what "the developers are for"). 

 

Another thing which may be hard for non-developers to understand the full importance of, but Bethesda plans their marketing. This is rare in my experience. Bethesda is clear about messaging, they time and focus information releases, schedule demo dates properly (ask any developer, but demo deliveries should never be sprung as a surprise to any development team because demos can derail development by months), and more. Also, if there's any doubts as to how well marketing does their jobs, I'll just say this - you can buy Fallout T-shirts in Target. Target. I still can't believe it. That never would have happened at Black Isle, but Bethesda made Fallout visible to the public, which is no small feat. Even my parents recognize the Fallout logo (and the Vault Boy) when they see it - hell, I wasn't able to do that and I'm their son, and this is my livelihood.

 

So, yeah, I think they do a good job with marketing. Other folks I've worked with in the past have the exact opposite opinion, however, but that's up to them to outline their grievances. I don't agree with their opinion, and their opinions were so vague/hyperbolic it was hard to argue them - and I hate hyperbole in any event, it's the equivalent of lying to make your ill-founded point.

 

(Oh, and to say it, LucasArts was pretty good to work with, too, they also had their **** together.)

 

 

Edited November 21, 2016 by Infinitron

[Oner]

It's like he's treating the internet as his facebook.

[Oerwinde]

Obsidian locked him out of his forum account? You would think just removing any mod/dev access would be enough, must have been a really bad break.

[Majek]

We should make a game about all this.

[HoonDing]

"Saw a little of that community yesterday during Sawyer's stream of New Vegas. "why there so many words in this game i just wanna shoot stuff"  :huh:"

 

except the shooting was also terrible

[Lexx]

I checked his blog on the forum. Couldn't find his stuff about companions right now, but there are so many posts- why would Obsidian delete exactly that one?

[Zoraptor]

It's still there. At least I presume that's the one.

 

I'm surprised Infintron managed to resist adding Chris's "I worked on Tyranny but I bet they've not credited me!!!1!!!" tweet (he's credited on narrative design, first name even), guess it's because we don't have an easy tweet poster unlike the 'codex which would fall apart without the ability to gossip over 147 character messages about trivialities from trivialities. We only discuss the big and important issues, here, and if you want to talk about tweets you jolly well have to click a link to see them like a proper researcher!

 

At this point I'm willing to chip in a few bucks to buy Chris some Preparation H brand botty ointment to treat the obvious butthurt. Then again, perhaps he's researching that High School game he was talking about and wants to get a good idea of what the 'gossip' mechanics need to be.

[WorstUsernameEver]

I don't see any actual tweet saying that?

[Zoraptor]

It's there. I paraphrased- actual quote is "No, I worked on it but may not be in the credits (they tried to delete me from the credits at least once since my departure)"- but that should have been pretty obvious from the string of exclamation marks.

 

(To be fair to Infinitron, the first reply to the tweet makes it irrelevant except as evidence of potential butthurt so it's pointless except in that context. And while I might make no twitter integration into a point of pride if we've got youtube integration twitter integration would probably be a good idea so we can keep up on the goss' ourselves)

[WorstUsernameEver]

I'm not an idiot, it was clear to me that you were paraphrasing, but I couldn't find anything referencing Tyranny except for a tweet where he said the team deserved the credit. Thanks for the link, though.

[Lexx]

Why the hell would Obsidian remove his name from the credits. His name means free money.

[Rosbjerg]

I've lost some respect for him over the cause of this thread to be honest - throwing around accusation and insunations without backing them up seems like an unprofessional move.

[Gromnir]

I've lost some respect for him over the cause of this thread to be honest - throwing around accusation and insunations without backing them up seems like an unprofessional move.

been doing it in increasingly less subtle ways since he left obsidian.  

 

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/81337-novella-comming-any-word-on-progress/?hl=chrisa&do=findComment&comment=1774584

 

is not a shift in behavior for chrisA but rather a continuation.

 

too bad too.  we like his work, for the most part.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[HoonDing]

AVellone will make Elder Scrolls even greater great again.

[Rosbjerg]

Luckily one can easily seperate the person from the art - couldn't listen to Prince or see any Tom Cruise movies otherwise...

[Zoraptor]

I'm not an idiot, it was clear to me that you were paraphrasing, but I couldn't find anything referencing Tyranny except for a tweet where he said the team deserved the credit. Thanks for the link, though.

 

I didn't think you thought it was a verbatim quote, but I thought I'd better be safe due to the 'actual tweet saying that' line. I probably should have linked the tweet in the first place anyway.

[Volourn]

"I've lost some respect for him over the cause of this thread to be honest - throwing around accusation and insunations without backing them up seems like an unprofessional move."

 

I've gained some respect for him over the cause of this thread to be honest - throwing out opinions and viewpoints and backing them up with his observations and experiences seems like a professional move. And, if it makes Obsidian fnaboys butthurt the better. I'm sure Obsidian will survive. So will Chris. Win-win.

[Gfted1]

Luckily one can easily seperate the person from the art - couldn't listen to Prince or see any Tom Cruise movies otherwise...

 

I'm wracking my brain over here, whats the hubbub about Prince?

[algroth]

AVellone will make Elder Scrolls even greater great again.

Again?

[Rosbjerg]

I'm wracking my brain over here, whats the hubbub about Prince?

Believed in and outspoken on a lot weird stuff like chemtrails and vaccine autism.. Generally just very eccentric and arrogant according to people who dealt with him.

[Gorth]

Do I really want to know what a **** hydra is?...

[GhostofAnakin]

Obsidian locked him out of his forum account? You would think just removing any mod/dev access would be enough, must have been a really bad break.

 

You think?

 

Couldn't tell from the various links to his interviews in this thread. 

[HoonDing]

I like Avellone, he tells it like it is.

[Flouride]

I like Avellone, he tells it like it is.

 

Without actually telling anything and making sure he does not piss off anyone who might actually still want to hire him as a freelancer. What an upstanding and a generally great guy.

Either he comes out with all of it, or he should just shut the **** up about it. He is throwing girly high school hissy wits over the Internet on different interviews.

I don't think that makes him look good at all. And this comes from a person who has so far loved pretty much every game Avellone has worked on and thinks he is one of the best if not the best person to write companions. I'm not angry or anything that he disses Obsidian, I'm just sad that what was once a good relationship went really bad, and has turned Avellone into this.

[Oner]

No it doesn't? The problem people here have is with the way he expresses his beef with Obsidian (which btw, we have no way to prove as true or false), nobody said it's his fault.