Baldur's Gate: Siege of Dragonspear RELEASED

[Tigranes]

Man, this is why I don't go on Twitter.

 

Is the game any good? I had little hopes before release, but I'd always love to be pleasantly surprised.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

Man, this is why I don't go on Twitter.

 

Is the game any good? I had little hopes before release, but I'd always love to be pleasantly surprised.

From what I've been able to glean is that it's essentially a megamod with more polish and a new class. I haven't played it yet and this is what I'm getting from others, so perhaps posters who have played the game will have a different opinion.

[Volourn]

"Edit: Anyhow the character may be hamfisted, but I've seen people basing their entire negative review off that character's inclusion. That's assholish. Don't do that.
        Also don't start off your review with "I have nothing against LGBT folks but" and then write a long screed about exactly that. That is also assholish. Don't do it."

 

Don't tell people what to do like theya re your slave. that is assholish. Don't do that.

 

 

"Seems the people that have played it, like it, and others pissing and moaning about what they dont know. Sounds about right."
 

I don't need to play it to know it sucks.  I avoid plenty of games knowing they suck because I was smart. I was also dumb enought o play games that ended upsucking wasting time and money. I prefer to avoid that whenever the suckiness is obvious.

 

And, their attitude and their poor writing about this hamfisted nonsense is more.  But, evil SJW Nazis will be evil SJW nAZIS.

 

 

Also, btw, MANY people who have played it hate it. But, they were dumb enough to buy it so I don't feel sorry for them.

Edited April 5, 2016 by Volourn

[Hiro Protagonist II]

Well I am playing it and the technical glitches especially with the reloading a save and the game going into story mode is annoying. Even on the most difficult setting, it's very easy and it's probably due to the unbalancing of new items/spells. TBH, I don't know why the game is easy on Legacy of Bhaal difficulty.

 

The world map is weird. Some of the areas are out of their original positions and some areas I'm a little baffled at first on how to get there because the areas don't line up. Durlag's Tower is way over to the side of the map. Also, clicking on an area and then having to hit the travel button is an extra step that's not needed.

 

Another thing I don't like is the zooming in and out of the town map. I prefer hitting the map key, clicking somewhere on the map and then going back to the play screen. It's pretty much instant in the old games. This zooming out, clicking somewhere on the town map, and then watching the screen zoom in on your new location feels weird to me. I much prefer the old way.

 

There is more magical items and spells which weren't in the original game, it has BG2 type lock picking, traps and spell learning xp, and it feels like someone just installed a mod on the original game for all this new cool phat loot. If there wasn't enough xp in the game, they've added more xp which wasn't needed. Same with unbalancing the game with items and spells.

 

While some people might not like the pixel hunting and prefer the TAB key that highlights everything, I prefer if it wasn't in BG1. There's hidden things on different maps that shows up now. It's hard not to miss anything.

 

Imoen has Detect Traps on all the time which makes the game easier. I assume it disappears when she's fighting but automatically goes back on when she's not. No idea if it's an A.I. script that you can turn on/off.

 

If you roll a fighter character and the STR comes up 18/00, it doesn't show this in the character portrait. It shows 18/100. Probably so people won't assume 00 means 0 instead of 100. This to me feels a little dumbed down. But then the target audience most likely will be people who don't know what 18/00 is. 

 

Overall, it feels like a heavily modded unbalanced game. And that's not getting to the expansion. All in my opinion of course.

 

edit: I'd prefer to play BG1 without all these mods but despite this, it's more fun than Pillars of Eternity.

Edited April 5, 2016 by Hiro Protagonist II

[kirottu]

A Tale Of Dragons And Memes: Why Dragonspear’s Writing Is Horrid. A opinion piece from Nichegamer.

[Excalibur_2102]

I've enjoyed what I've played of it so far. Have to say, though, and I know it won't be popular considering all the IE evangelists on these boards, that I find myself constantly missing some of the changes to the UI and mechanics made by Pillars of Eternity.

 

Are you doing a review on it?  Its kinda difficult to find unbiased opinions on this one... There's only two reviews from critics that I can find, and then there's virtually no point in reading user reviews at this moment in time.

[Excalibur_2102]

Well I am playing it and the technical glitches especially with the reloading a save and the game going into story mode is annoying. Even on the most difficult setting, it's very easy and it's probably due to the unbalancing of new items/spells. TBH, I don't know why the game is easy on Legacy of Bhaal difficulty.

 

 

Ive heard there's a bug where it wont stay in legacy of bhaal mode for some reason... Could be that

[Hiro Protagonist II]

Yeah I just read another review and some players are advising to stay away until the bugs are patched. Full review is in the link.

 

https://archive.is/aRfwn

 

Edited for brevity to focus on game mechanics below.

 

 

 

There’s two sides to every controversy, and this Baldur’s Gate situation is no different. A portion of the gaming community has expressed concerns about the functionality of the game. Reports indicate mod incompatibility, in-game bugs being fairly common, and overall a loss of confidence that the game was properly tested before releasing. The other side of the issues surrounding the Baldur’s Gate expansion are politically charged and center around the writing of Siege of Dragonspear itself.

Looking at it from a gameplay perspective, there are signs that is a buggy experience. On the official subreddit, a thread about bug reporting is stickied to the top of the site, acknowledgement by the mods that it is a prominent issue.

Steam and GoG are the places where the public’s reviews of the game come from. Since the public is hyper focused on talking about the game’s flaws, reviews are heavily curated and hard to come by. One popular top review on the page manages to go into detail about gameplay issues.

“I’m a huge fan of the

Baldur’s Gate

franchise and, over the years, have played through the campaigns more times than I can count. That said, I would urge fans of the series to hold off on purchasing this DLC for the moment. Here are a few of the issues I experienced in SoD. Attempting to import my protagonist via save file or character import results in him being stripped of all equipment. This gear is permanently lost. (If you have an endgame save from the main campaign this doesn’t occur, but I don’t have that luxury.) Game difficulty settings are broken and can retroactively corrupt save files if you’re attempting to play on the highest difficulty. Multiplayer is in an unusable state. Although I have some minor grievances with the UI updating, there is one particular change I find rather immersion breaking. If you scroll towards the edge of the map, nearly half the screen will be blanketed in darkness. This was not present in previous versions.”

A second negative Steam review shares similar concerns.

The heavy moderation is confirmed by a comment from the Siege of Dragonspear Steam developer on site. “The accounts that have been banned were banned for perpetuating a false narrative and engaging in a campaign of harassment that is being coordinated externally. Personal attacks against individual developers are also potential reasons for forum bans. Don’t think we don’t see what’s happening. Are there worthwhile criticisms of the game to be had and discussed? Sure. But let’s have that discussion. If you’re only here to hop on the GamerGate/KotakuInAction bandwagon, or to spout abuses at the LGBTQ community or one of our writers, you’re not welcome here; don’t be surprised if your posting privileges get revoked.”

“Do not buy this game in its current state. The entire expansion is plagued with technical issues including (but not limited to) corruption of previous single-player save files, randomly changing game difficulty, inaccessible online multiplayer, and inescapable dialogue loops. While some of these problems might be the product of the v1.3 to v2.0 update, several game-breaking issues are already easily reproducible in the expansion’s content alone. Had I known on launch day just how poorly programmed this expansion was, I would have waited for Beamdog to iron out all of the kinks (a process which they seem rather lackadaisical about) and not purchased this product.”

The story of GoG’s reviews paints a different picture than the curation of the Steam page does:

“While the mechanics of the game are in line with the originals, the story falls short. It sacrifices the narrative and world building of the original

Baldur’s Gate

in order to break the 4th wall and beat players over the head with messages about social issues with the grace and subtlety of a Saturday morning cartoon from the 90’s.There is no problem with having messages about social issues in a game. The problem comes when one hijacks another franchise, gut out its soul and fill it with vapid maxims and fables in its place. That is one of the surest ways to kill off a franchise, and it is especially odious when it happens to a well-loved franchise. Want social justice? Sure, but stop hijacking the industry and make your own games. You’re not going to improve the industry, you’re just going to kill it from the inside out.”

According to the game developer, that GoG reviewer would have what they see as a “wrong opinion”. If you read this wanting to know actual problems with Siege of Dragonspear in terms of gameplay, then you’ve read as much as you need to. The rest of the problems are about personal opinions and gaming community discussions more focused on the medium in general.

[MrBrown]

 

Well I am playing it and the technical glitches especially with the reloading a save and the game going into story mode is annoying. Even on the most difficult setting, it's very easy and it's probably due to the unbalancing of new items/spells. TBH, I don't know why the game is easy on Legacy of Bhaal difficulty.

 

 

Ive heard there's a bug where it wont stay in legacy of bhaal mode for some reason... Could be that

 

 

Yes, legacy of bhaal mode basically doesn't work, even if it seems to be on it the monsters the game loads can still be loaded as if on a lower difficulty.

 

There's a workaround (https://forums.beamdog.com/discussion/49808/legacy-of-bhaal-mode-workaround), but it's really bothersome.

[Lychnidos]

How was Jaheira a nagging wife  , she always struck me as the one that wore the pants in that relationship.

[213374U]

A Tale Of Dragons And Memes: Why Dragonspear’s Writing Is Horrid. A opinion piece from Nichegamer.

 

Yeah, I have to agree with that. You know you've failed when actual transsexuals show up to tell you that you done ****ed it up with lazy-ass writing whose only reason to be there seems to be using them as your personal soapbox.

 

Most worrying of all seems to be Oster & co.'s take on criticisms, and how weak their grasp on the issue is -- they seem to be content to lump it all together as "misoginy/transphobia" and chalk it up to a GG conspiracy.

 

Maybe it's a Bioware thing? The hubris, I mean...

 

 

Are you doing a review on it?  Its kinda difficult to find unbiased opinions on this one... There's only two reviews from critics that I can find, and then there's virtually no point in reading user reviews at this moment in time.

I've long settled for opinions which I know reflect my own biases, which works well enough when looking at games. Be sure to tell me if you ever find a truly unbiased opinion, though...

 

My opinion, which I know you didn't ask for: the writing is weak. Railroading, flimsy motivations, badly set up scenarios. These issues all existed in the original BGs to a certain extent, so take it as you will. The identity politics posturing will bother you the more you read about it outside of the game. It is grating and immersion breaking, and the rewriting of old characters to give them "way better personality upgrades" is unforgivable, but it doesn't warrant giving the game a 0 on Metacritic. Area and encounter design seems to be good so far as is the atmosphere, and the visual and VO bells & whistles are all pretty good. I'm playing on Insane (bonus dmg disabled) and while I had no trouble at all in the initial dungeon, I've had my ass handed to me a few times after that (though I can't be sure of the extent to which SCS is responsible for this). I haven't found any gameplay balance problems due to OP items or spells yet, and the inclusion of such feels to me exactly like it did in vanilla ToB.

 

I don't agree with calling this a mod, unless you also consider ToB a "mod". I'm not having problems with the difficulty resetting itself and haven't tried playing online, which seem to be the most severe issues affecting people.

 

It isn't a flawed gem... it's just flawed. That being said, no reason why you can't have $20 worth of fun with it. That's more than I can say for a lot of the shovelware being pushed out these days.

Edited April 7, 2016 by Tigranes
Remember, what we call certain groups says a lot about how we really think about them.

[Majek]

Lol, their forums died. :D

[GhostofAnakin]

The inclusion of the transgender character reminds me of BioWare's inclusion of almost all romanceable characters being bisexual.

[Volourn]

"Maybe it's a Bioware thing? The hubris, I mean..."

 

Eh./ that is the official PC line. Obsidian did the same thing with PE. *shrug* It's the age we live in. The SJW Nazi Age.

 

 

"Yeah, I have to agree with that. You know you've failed when trannies show up to tell you that you done ****ed it up with lazy-ass writing whose only reason to be there seems to be using them as your personal soapbox."

 

Just read that post. That person is 100% correct on their assessment.
 

Edited April 5, 2016 by Volourn

[Excalibur_2102]

 

 

 

Maybe it's a Bioware thing? The hubris, I mean...

 

 

Are you doing a review on it?  Its kinda difficult to find unbiased opinions on this one... There's only two reviews from critics that I can find, and then there's virtually no point in reading user reviews at this moment in time.

I've long settled for opinions which I know reflect my own biases, which works well enough when looking at games. Be sure to tell me if you ever find a truly unbiased opinion, though...

 

 

 

I tend to agree with a lot of reviews that gamebanshee does, so that is why I asked...  So I suppose I should say "Gamebanshee reflects my own biases for the most part," if you want precise terminology.  I didn't ask your opinion, no, but of course youre more than entitled to give it...

 

I for one wont be playing SoD for quite a while, at least until this whole "agenda" thing has blown over... if it ever does

[Zoraptor]

The inclusion of the transgender character reminds me of BioWare's inclusion of almost all romanceable characters being bisexual.

 

That was time saving for DA2's abbreviated development cycle, iirc. Unrealistic, but understandable given time restraints and that romances of all types are kind of expected from Bioware.

 

As for blaming of GG for negative reviews they do seem to be following Bioware's play book there where they'd blame 4chan or whoever for review bombing at metacritic. To be fair, there's at least some truth in it too, it's just far too simplistic and absolute. And Bioware would defend their decisions collectively too, whether or not they personally agreed with them. I can distinctly remember Bioware peeps saying that they had enough time to do DA2 properly when it was patently obvious it was rushed, and I've seen David Gaidar defend decisions which were later found to have been opposed by him. A house divided against itself and all that.

 

At the end of the day though, and with all other cliches being equal it is pretty much a direct equivalent of how many posters wished Obsidian had dealt with the 'transphobic' backer content; ie close ranks and say that they support [backer/ staffmember], nothing is wrong and nothing will be changed since it's just a vocal minority complaining.

[cirdanx]

The inclusion of the transgender character reminds me of BioWare's inclusion of almost all romanceable characters being bisexual.

 

Kinda, it´s pandering. However that is not really the issue here, it never was. If you care to read, i will add my comment and break down that i posted on Boogie2988´s video.

 

I will break down eveything that happened now, because the comments also show, that there are a bunch of people who do´t get it, and i have spend most of my time following and discussing this mess since the addon came out.

 

In contrast to what Beamdog wants you to believe (or people like Jim Sterling who can´t do his research..what the hell is wrong with you?), this has NOTHING to do with a trans NPC. The only reason this false narrative doesn´t die, is because it´s get reinforced by Beamdog and all the not so smart users who are either just repeating what Beamdog says (sheep) or intentionally are coming to Steam to accuse the playerbase that THIS is their problem.

 

If you take a look at the forums and the reviews, you will see that 99% don´t care about this specific NPC, if anything, they are angry that it´s a petty representation that could be handled better. Point being, it´s just a symptome of the real issue, horrible writing for the sake of ideology. I may have found 2 people who are really against it, and one another who does´t support it because it´s against the lore of a world, where a thing like transgender wouldn´t even exist, a world in which all it takes to change your look, gender, even your race is all but a little bit of magic.

 

The issue, is that said writer, a self-proclaimed Social justice warrior, whatever that means to you, is not only a really bad writer (the ending sucks). But also decided to forcefully emphasize her world view into an established setting and world. And worse, what really pissed people off, she had the nerve, to take beloved and established characters from a classic game, change them and use them as her mouth piece. Not only is that horrific writing, retconing and character breaking...it also shows the sheer arrogance and disrespect about the original material. Which ironicly, is what brings in money for Beamdog.

 

And why? Because she thinks that a character was sexist or wrongly portrait. That further shows how much of a dummy writer she is, because she doesn´t understand the original characters and their tropes at all. This is sh*tting all over the legacy of one the best made RPG´s of all time. This issue is all over the expansion, here is a well written summary of her forcing her views into the world:

http://nichegamer.com/2016/04/04/tale-dragons-memes-dragonspears-writing-horrid/

 

But even if we ignore this, here is the next problem. The patch 2.0 that accompanied the DLC, broke not only BG1 in several ways, but also BG2. Because Beamdog decided to not care about the quality of it at all. I can´t list all bugs because there are too many. From glitchers, a poorly designed UI (i´m not talking about taste, i´m talking about poor design, more clicks to do what you want and actual textures overlaying things like prices in BG2), MP broken, selfcasting AI, which is NOT ok in such a combast system, a respawn system that does nothing but makes things a chore and adds too much xp, and so on. They did this DESPITE people already saying it´s horrible during the beta. They didn´t care.

 

This brings up the next point, Beamdogs middle finger to the playerbase. No word on how and when they fix this, no support what so ever. When people started to critisize, they slienced them, baning, closing threads. Then they asked players for positive reviews to counter the negative once. When that didn´t work they tried to blame the gamergate movement (as if most BG players even are about this, being an older demographic). When that didn´t work they accussed the critics of being sexists and bigots, again not getting the point or deliberately derailing from them. Then the petty writer tried to rally her SJW friends to go against the critics.

 

Do you people see where the problem is? Do you understand that this has NOTHING to do with a trans NPC, one you can kill anyway for some neat loot? If anything you would expect, that the portrait minorities would actually agree with the critics for their horrible display in the game and talk about the real issues the game has.

 

I for one am happy that Wizards of the Coast told Beamdog to get lost and didn´t allow them to change anything in the original game. I am also happy i got my refund and this shaddy company will never ever get money from me again.

 

People can hang themselves on the false story of the trans character, but it doesn´t change the real issues.

 

That´s the real story here.

 

(on a side note, which also got negative feedback, if you ever want the classic versions from GoG, you better hurry, because Beamdog is going to bundle them with the "not so enhanced" editions and make them not avaible on their own anymore)

[Junai]

Beamdog think themselves liberals, but they haven't even addressed the recent epidemic of hamster shaving, and PETAs 2016 hamster agenda. I will alert TyT, and have them interview Boo to help raise awareness about the issue. There is no excuse. We've had queer Gromnirs, trannies desperate for acceptance, but not a single word about hamster abuse. Boo feels the Bern.

Edited April 5, 2016 by Junai

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

(on a side note, which also got negative feedback, if you ever want the classic versions from GoG, you better hurry, because Beamdog is going to bundle them with the "not so enhanced" editions and make them not avaible on their own anymore)

What?

[cirdanx]

 

(on a side note, which also got negative feedback, if you ever want the classic versions from GoG, you better hurry, because Beamdog is going to bundle them with the "not so enhanced" editions and make them not avaible on their own anymore)

What?

 

Here: https://www.gog.com/news/definitive_edition_bundle_baldurs_gate_i_ii_icewind_dale

 

You will not be able to buy the classic versions on their own anymore from GoG. You will only get them with Beamdogs EE´s. Or in other words "buy our product if you want the classics you sheep"

[Zoraptor]

The classic versions are already gone from Gamersgate, which I thought may have escaped notice. They were GOG versions there.

 

There is some precedent for this, there have been three Space Rangers 2 versions with the two earlier ones disappearing when (well, prior to actually) enhanced versions were released.

Edited April 5, 2016 by Zoraptor

[213374U]

Here: https://www.gog.com/news/definitive_edition_bundle_baldurs_gate_i_ii_icewind_dale

 

You will not be able to buy the classic versions on their own anymore from GoG. You will only get them with Beamdogs EE´s. Or in other words "buy our product if you want the classics you sheep"

Yeah. Not cool. I'm guessing the original versions were still outselling the EEs after all these years, and we can't have that.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

Well I guess it's good I already have the originals. But that's some real bull****.

[Hiro Protagonist II]

I already have the GoG versions too. I didn't want the EE version in my GoG library and thankfully with this free steam key I'm using, it's relegated to Steam (which I only have around 20 games on it) that I rarely use.

[Rosveen]

 

 

 

(on a side note, which also got negative feedback, if you ever want the classic versions from GoG, you better hurry, because Beamdog is going to bundle them with the "not so enhanced" editions and make them not avaible on their own anymore)

What?

Here: https://www.gog.com/news/definitive_edition_bundle_baldurs_gate_i_ii_icewind_dale

 

You will not be able to buy the classic versions on their own anymore from GoG. You will only get them with Beamdogs EE´s. Or in other words "buy our product if you want the classics you sheep"

This is a ****ing disgrace. I still have the copies I bought elsewhere, but I can't redownload them, so I'm going to rebuy them on GOG right away just in case. Wouldn't want to be left with only my old disks in the digital age.