Question to American members

[BruceVC]

Something interesting occurred a while ago  and it made me think about something I wanted to ask

 

Ros was having a debate with Monte about the UK  system of government and as usual Ros was making a very interesting and compelling point and Monte got annoyed and basically said " I don't need advice about my country from someone who lives in Sweden " , it was a complete overreaction but it made me realize how most of us don't like foreigners giving us advice about our country or highlighting issues 

 

Yet it seems on a daily basis most of us give advice or criticize or scrutinize the USA and its policies and culture...and yet you guys never seem to get annoyed?

 

Why is that? Are you use to it...do you ignore it..I'm interested in how our American members feel about non-Americas often discussing the USA 

 

 

[Gfted1]

Were used to it. Everyone always wants to knock off the king of the hill.

[BruceVC]

Were used to it. Everyone always wants to knock off the king of the hill.

But people dont always criticize ...sometimes its just "advice '"  about the USA generally

 

Its an interesting social phenomena   

[Tale]

Blind national pride is a joke.

 

If you've got good criticism, I like it. If you've got RT conspiracy theory nonsense, well, I probably already ignore your posts.

[BruceVC]

Blind national pride is a joke.

 

If you've got good criticism, I like it. If you've got RT conspiracy theory nonsense, well, I probably already ignore your posts.

Its strange but I get very annoyed and amused  with some of the spurious and patently absurd views people have about the USA when I have debates on these South African radio stations....you guys wont believe what some people think about the USA

[Gfted1]

But people dont always criticize ...sometimes its just "advice '" about the USA generally

"Advice" is generally just nicely worded criticism.

[ShadySands]

We're used to it.

This

 

 

Blind national pride is a joke.

 

If you've got good criticism, I like it. If you've got RT conspiracy theory nonsense, well, I probably already ignore your posts.

Its strange but I get very annoyed and amused  with some of the spurious and patently absurd views people have about the USA when I have debates on these South African radio stations....you guys wont believe what some people think about the USA

 

Sure I would believe it

 

I just don't care

Edited October 15, 2015 by ShadySands

[Orogun01]

Relevant to this thread
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BxroiTRg7Tg

[Guard Dog]

Speaking only for myself I don't give a s--t what anyone one else areound the world thinks. They don't live here and don't get a vote so criticize away. We're still gonna do what we're gonna do.

[BruceVC]

Speaking only for myself I don't give a s--t what anyone one else areound the world thinks. They don't live here and don't get a vote so criticize away. We're still gonna do what we're gonna do.

Sure, but you guys musn't assume I am talking about criticism only. On this forum we normally discuss American developments, like the elections and things like the gay marriage bill

 

 I would say there  is more constructive debate about  the USA than negative?

[the_dog_days]

Simply put, there is no other place in the world like America (Canada comes as close as anyone). It's almost not worth the time to explain how and why laws and systems of government that work elsewhere in the world don't and won't work here. Even the few, futile times I've tried ended with the other party giving me blank looks like I was speaking in gibberish. My time is too valuable to worry about it.

[Blarghagh]

They don't live here and don't get a vote so criticize away.

Eh, sometimes I feel like I do live there. Whatever dumb **** the US of A does, the EU is likely going to follow. Because they're idjits.

[BruceVC]

Simply put, there is no other place in the world like America (Canada comes as close as anyone). It's almost not worth the time to explain how and why laws and systems of government that work elsewhere in the world don't and won't work here. Even the few, futile times I've tried ended with the other party giving me blank looks like I was speaking in gibberish. My time is too valuable to worry about it.

You right, you guys have an amazing country. I love visiting the USA,...it just seems at times you Americans dont seem to appreciate what you have as sometimes you seem to complain about things that aren't that bad for an outsider

[Hurlshort]

I think it is weird that people don't criticise their own countries more. We have a few Russian posters thay come to mind.

[BruceVC]

 

They don't live here and don't get a vote so criticize away.

Eh, sometimes I feel like I do live there. Whatever dumb **** the US of A does, the EU is likely going to follow. Because they're idjits.

 

 

TN are you proud of the Netherlands...would you say you are a patriot ?

 

 

I think it is weird that people don't criticise their own countries more. We have a few Russian posters thay come to mind.

But Hurl lets be honest,,,you can't take criticism from Oby seriously, he isn't a real person. He is vaporware

Edited October 15, 2015 by TrueNeutral
The edit button exists for a reason.

[Gromnir]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/13/sunday-review/why-russians-hate-america-again.html?_r=0

 

"Intellectuals pointed me to books on Berlin in the 1920s and the concept of “ressentiment,’’ a philosophical term that describes a simmering resentment and sense of victimization arising out of envy of a perceived enemy. It often has its roots in a culture’s feeling of impotence. "

 

most o' the world recognizes the unique position the US has as the sole remaining superpower.  though such a label has far less meaning than it did in decades past, there still exists the pervasive envy and the widespread belief that the role is undeserved.  

 

we spent time teaching abroad.  we would sit 'mongst a group o' euros as they mocked American culture and American intellect.  initially when such stuff would occur, we would point out that Gromnir were American.  our euro companions would shrug off and observe that they weren't talking 'bout Gromnir but 'bout Americans and America in general. were kinda surreal. how often is you gonna have a group o' Americans discussing the failings o' swedish or austrian culture and education?  the typical American don't care enough 'bout sweden or austria, and that includes educated Americans.  is not as if those folks on campuses at ivy schools, stanford and mit is unaware o' europe and south america and asia neither.  it won't make some o' you feel better to know that educated Americans is aware but wholly unconcerned with your foibles and failings.

 

furthermore, there is a huge misconception 'bout US patriotism/nationalism.  other than perhaps germany, is few nations that is so self-deprecating 'bout their history. a large portion o' the history hurlshot teaches kids in school is how rotten and evil the US has been for the past couple centuries.  bad to indians.  bad to revolutionary war vets. US were bad to laborers and blacks and just about everybody.  gets even more pronounced at universities where professors is not shy 'bout exploring faults in US politics and culture and history. there is a world-wide myth o' "america, f*%$@ yeah" that has been perpetuated but that doesn't exist. watch tv shows and fbi agents is more often portrayed as buffoons than highly educated and competent.  the military?  the US military in tv and movies is as often portrayed as trigger happy maniacs as they is shown heroic.  

 

oh, and again as this gets missed so often, Gromnir has much reason to loathe US.  

 

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2012/08/pine-ridge/huey-photography

 

some well-intentioned euro tells us 'bout gaza and the suffering there and we cannot help but note that conditions at pine ridge is worse than gaza but that euro sympathies not seem to extend to folks who ain't lobbing rockets at farmers or hurling molotov ****tails at police. soa gain, if you got some weird notion that Gromnir is just another ignorant and blind American, you got your facts wrong.

 

we do run into frequent misapprehensions 'bout US when speaking with folks from other corners o' the globe... and the fixation 'pon the US folks got is sadly understandable.  

 

we blame on the internet... can blame all on internet.

 

...

 

that last bit were sarcasm in case it weren't obvious.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Malcador]

I think it is weird that people don't criticise their own countries more. We have a few Russian posters thay come to mind.

Doesn't seem like there are many topics made just for that, most of the time it's on some world event - of late if it's political it involves the West ****ing with some people. Fighter and Sakai are Russian, I think, and have seen them criticize their state as much as any of you Americans.

 

As for oby, well, he just trolls people - less so since Walshingham's not around to constantly bite his bait it seems, heh.

 

Around the world, some people can come up with reasons other than envy for having a dim view of the American state - some are justified, others are not.

Edited October 15, 2015 by Malcador

[BruceVC]

 

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/13/sunday-review/why-russians-hate-america-again.html?_r=0

"Intellectuals pointed me to books on Berlin in the 1920s and the concept of “ressentiment,’’ a philosophical term that describes a simmering resentment and sense of victimization arising out of envy of a perceived enemy. It often has its roots in a culture’s feeling of impotence. "

most o' the world recognizes the unique position the US has as the sole remaining superpower. though such a label has far less meaning than it did in decades past, there still exists the pervasive envy and the widespread belief that the role is undeserved.

we spent time teaching abroad. we would sit 'mongst a group o' euros as they mocked American culture and American intellect. initially when such stuff would occur, we would point out that Gromnir were American. our euro companions would shrug off and observe that they weren't talking 'bout Gromnir but 'bout Americans and America in general. were kinda surreal. how often is you gonna have a group o' Americans discussing the failings o' swedish or austrian culture and education? the typical American don't care enough 'bout sweden or austria, and that includes educated Americans. is not as if those folks on campuses at ivy schools, stanford and mit is unaware o' europe and south america and asia neither. it won't make some o' you feel better to know that educated Americans is aware but wholly unconcerned with your foibles and failings.

furthermore, there is a huge misconception 'bout US patriotism/nationalism. other than perhaps germany, is few nations that is so self-deprecating 'bout their history. a large portion o' the history hurlshot teaches kids in school is how rotten and evil the US has been for the past couple centuries. bad to indians. bad to revolutionary war vets. US were bad to laborers and blacks and just about everybody. gets even more pronounced at universities where professors is not shy 'bout exploring faults in US politics and culture and history. there is a world-wide myth o' "america, f*%$@ yeah" that has been perpetuated but that doesn't exist. watch tv shows and fbi agents is more often portrayed as buffoons than highly educated and competent. the military? the US military in tv and movies is as often portrayed as trigger happy maniacs as they is shown heroic.

oh, and again as this gets missed so often, Gromnir has much reason to loathe US.

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2012/08/pine-ridge/huey-photography

some well-intentioned euro tells us 'bout gaza and the suffering there and we cannot help but note that conditions at pine ridge is worse than gaza but that euro sympathies not seem to extend to folks who ain't lobbing rockets at farmers or hurling molotov ****tails at police. soa gain, if you got some weird notion that Gromnir is just another ignorant and blind American, you got your facts wrong.

we do run into frequent misapprehensions 'bout US when speaking with folks from other corners o' the globe... and the fixation 'pon the US folks got is sadly understandable.

we blame on the internet... can blame all on internet.

...

that last bit were sarcasm in case it weren't obvious.

HA! Good Fun!

Gromnir I know you probably don't like these compliments but I find these types of posts you make really interesting

You always have so much pertinent information to share and I generally learn something new from you, nice one

 

I think it is weird that people don't criticise their own countries more. We have a few Russian posters thay come to mind.

Doesn't seem like there are many topics made just for that, most of the time it's on some world event - of late if it's political it involves the West ****ing with some people. Fighter and Sakai are Russian, I think, and have seen them criticize their state as much as any of you Americans.

As for oby, well, he just trolls people - less so since Walshingham's not around to constantly bite his bait it seems, heh.

Around the world, some people can come up with reasons other than envy for having a dim view of the American state - some are justified, others are not.

Malc are you proud to be Canadian, would you say you are a patriot? Edited October 15, 2015 by TrueNeutral
Please stop double-posting within minutes of each other. There is no reason for that.

[Malcador]

No, not a patriot. Canada's a nice place and all but when I see Canadian patriotism (rather amusingly the same thing these people turn up their noses at when Americans do it) it seems like watching some idiot sports fans. Speaking of which, Remembrance Day is next month - national circle jerk on Vimy Ridge and how we get to vote due to WWI, heh.

 

Canada does a lot right though, namely health care and general sense of wanting to care for everyone. But is rife with a lot of problems people apparently can't see, heh - again, the same thing they turn their noses up at the Americans for.

[BruceVC]

No, not a patriot. Canada's a nice place and all but when I see Canadian patriotism (rather amusingly the same thing these people turn up their noses at when Americans do it) it seems like watching some idiot sports fans. Speaking of which, Remembrance Day is next month - national circle jerk on Vimy Ridge and how we get to vote due to WWI, heh.

 

Canada does a lot right though, namely health care and general sense of wanting to care for everyone. But is rife with a lot of problems people apparently can't see, heh - again, the same thing they turn their noses up at the Americans for.

I appreciate your honesty, I have never been to Canada. I must say you guys seem to have a great place. I know South Africans who have immigrated there, they love it

 

Its a bit  cold for me

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

I don't care, I've got thick skin and don't hold any love for the US. But trolling them is pretty funny.

[Gfted1]

Huh, I didn't know Federal law trumps Tribal law. I thought it was the other way around. For some reason I also had it in my head that while on a reservation you are technically not protected by the Constitution, but that seems wrong too if Fed trumps Tribal. Things that also surprised me were housing shortages, no Federal checks and 80%(!!!) alcoholism. Damn.

[BruceVC]

 

I don't care, I've got thick skin and don't hold any love for the US. But trolling them is pretty funny.

Can I ask you a question, I have to be honest I don't understand how you can live in the USA but not like your country? I am probably misunderstanding you ?

 

 

Huh, I didn't know Federal law trumps Tribal law. I thought it was the other way around. For some reason I also had it in my head that while on a reservation you are technically not protected by the Constitution, but that seems wrong too if Fed trumps Tribal. Things that also surprised me were housing shortages, no Federal checks and 80%(!!!) alcoholism. Damn.

You mustn't feel too guilty Gfted1 ...I can only imagine what you already live with what with all the " white guilt " that probably keeps you awake at night..its okay to want redemption but I don't think Gromnir expects that

Edited October 15, 2015 by TrueNeutral

[Gfted1]

Its as if my thoughts are laid open to you like a book.

[BruceVC]

Its as if my thoughts are laid open to you like a book.