Devil of Caroc: Missing attribute points, no racial trait

[Tomice]

1) Devil of Caroc has 2 attribute points less than all other companions (probably from not having a racial bonus)

 

2) Her racial trait "Living Machine" is more disadvantage than advantage, while all others are purely beneficial.

 

3) Can't switch armor, is stuck with a variant of breast plate (without any unique trait or advantage,) is therefore stuck with unenchanted armor when most of your other companions already wear uniques at that point. Not talking about the lack of flexibility.

 

I know #3 is by design, but all summed up her disadvantages far outweigh her advantages. Her special race is not all balanced towards the others.

The missing attribute points indicate that this is not by design, but at least partially a bug.

 

 

 

Suggestion:

Make her armor 0% recovery in the next patch. It fits with her "living machine" trait and would compensate for her armor-related drawbacks. It would be a very quick fix (changing a value for a single item, maybe change the the text for her unique trait). There's no unexpected consequences or balance issues (she would only be a bit quicker in her actions, nothing out of the ordinary)

 

If you think 0% is too much, remember that other armors have "second chance" and other useful, unique traits. Also remember that her current racial trait cancels itself out (having at least as much negative as positive effects) - meaning that she actually has no racial advantage right now !!! The resulting extra attack speed would have to compensate for both the lacking unique racial trait as well as the lacking unique armor trait.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Tomice

[Heijoushin]

Why did you start a second thread to bitch about her? You already have one here ->

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/82061-devil-of-caroc-far-worse-than-other-rogues-gameplay-discussion-only-avoid-story-spoilers-pls/

 

Meh, basically I agree with you. But I still love her for her personality and voice.

Edited September 13, 2015 by Heijoushin

[hilfazer]

Zahua misses 3 points.

[Tomice]

Why did you start a second thread to bitch about her? You already have one here ->

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/82061-devil-of-caroc-far-worse-than-other-rogues-gameplay-discussion-only-avoid-story-spoilers-pls/

 

Meh, basically I agree with you. But I still love her for her personality and voice.

 

The above thread was made before I was sure this can be considered a bug. I didn't know about the missing attribute points yet. Plus I wanted to check that I haven't missed something about her skills.

 

 

Zahua misses 3 points.

 

Thanks for pointing this out. I don't like to have self-mutilating party members, so I didn't take him.

 

Oh, and while we're at it: Pallegina's paladin order doesn't have an unique ability (like "Fires of Darcozzi Palace")

[Guest]

Dear Obsidian,

 

Is there any plan on the horizon to address the concerns above? Not sure how the timing of this post played out with the release of 2.03, but Zahua and DoC are both still missing attribute points.

 

Thanks!

[Heijoushin]

Guys... you know that the stuff above aren't actually bugs, right? I'm pretty sure they're design decisions. 

[SamHam]

Well, the Devil of Caroc does have quite many immunities, as a trait, I'd assume, and the armour you can enchant like any other. Only thing I don't "like" about her is the low Dexterity, but it's not exactly a major problem.

[Guest]

And Zahua? Why was his character purposely given fewer attribute points than every other companion?

[Heijoushin]

And Zahua? Why was his character purposely given fewer attribute points than every other companion?

 

I can't speak for the designers obviously, maybe they really did make a calculation error.

 

But since all people/characters are different, I just don't think it's a bug if some are weaker or stronger than others. At worst, it's a balance issue.

[Guest]

Guys... you know that the stuff above aren't actually bugs, right? I'm pretty sure they're design decisions. 

 

 

I can't speak for the designers obviously, maybe they really did make a calculation error.

[Aarik D]

Hello everyone, 

 

I just did some calculations, and Devil has 75 base attribute points. But because she is a construct, she does not get any racial bonuses to attributes. I did check with Zahua, and he is indeed missing 3 base attribute points. I have written a bug for that. 

 

If a majority of people feel that Devil of Caroc is in any way inferior to her fellow companions, you are all welcomed to give us your feedback, we are more than happy to hear your input and take your opinions into consideration. 

 

Thank you for your support. 

[Guest]

I'm perfectly ok with trading off a couple of attribute points for her list of immunities. Thanks for checking into Zahua and submitting that for the next patch.

[AndreaColombo]

Aarik,

 

I believe Devil of Caroc is rather subpar compared to the other companions:

 

• She doesn't get racial bonuses to her attributes, which means she's effectively 2 points short vs. everyone else.
• She cannot use Food or Potions.
• Her stat distribution is rather abysmal (any custom Rogue you may make is going to be better even without min/maxing.)
• She is forced to wear a breastplate-equivalent armor with 40% recovery penalty and no special abilities. Basically a generic breastplate you can enchant, which is worse than most unique armors you could have a custom Rogue wear.

And what she gets in exchange for all that is immunity to Poison and Disease, two things that aren't particularly common, nor particularly threatening in the game.

 

She's got great writing, dialog, and personality but from a mechanical perspective she's rather bad

[Aarik D]

Hey guys,

 

We have added a few more immunities to Devil of Caroc which might help make her more awesome in your eyes. 

 

On top the poison and diseases immunities she is also immune to:

• Blind
• Charm
• Confused
• Domination
• Sickened
• Unconsciousness

Unfortunately these changes are not retroactive but if you retrain Devil, she will gain these immunites. Please feel free to add your feedback. 

 

Edit: Added Sickened to the list

[Elric Galad]

Oh that's the reason why I pointed these immunities and I was answered that did not exist !

[Heijoushin]

 

Guys... you know that the stuff above aren't actually bugs, right? I'm pretty sure they're design decisions. 

 

 

I can't speak for the designers obviously, maybe they really did make a calculation error.

 

You got me bro. I tried to use my diplomatic skill to cover all possible outcomes, and you got me. 

[Guest]

Diplomatic sounds something like, "Hey guys, are you sure this is actually a bug? Maybe it's a design decision.".

 

Do you see how your first post may have come across as condescending?

[Heijoushin]

Diplomatic sounds something like, "Hey guys, are you sure this is actually a bug? Maybe it's a design decision.".

 

Do you see how your first post may have come across as condescending?

 

To be honest, I was a little frustrated with the thread. As a recently released game, there are/were genuine bugs/issues that would cause the game to crash or become unplayable. Posting in the technical support forum that one companion is slightly weaker than the others seemed nitpicking (especially since the OP posted another thread about the same thing elsewhere)

 

But since the devs have agreed, I suppose I am in the wrong. I apologize. 

[Guest]

Totally agree that some bugs are more important than others, but what's the harm in reporting the ones we find?

 

Frustration is understandable though. No apologies necessary. Take care!