Undead Raedric fight seems impossible? (possible spoilers)

[Lones555]

The second fight vs Raedric seems impossible to do (when he returns as undead). I have done the bounty side quests without issues but this undead Raedric battle is silly, the famyprs just kill everyone in my party instantly. I'm level 10 and have not had this issue in combat before, it just seems impossible.

 

I've had a look about for tips and videos and EVERY SINGLE video is of them cheesing it by using the ranger pet to only aggro Raedric himself. This is clearly not how the fight is meant to go down so has anybody actually done this fight properly cos the Fampyrs just one shot or charm everybody. 

 

Anyone got any tips that doesn't involve bugging the encounter with ranger pet so only Raedric himself aggros?

[sparklecat]

I used a lot of priest buffs and fireballs, I think?

 

What I mainly remember about the fight was that it was such a laggy, choppy mess thanks to the spell effects that I couldn't tell what was going on half the time, unfortunately.  It came down to just Raedric vs Eder in the end, though.

[Anthile]

To me it was the hardest fight in the game. You pretty much have to start out using a Cipher's Amplified Wave or a Wizard's Call To Slumber to knock everyone prone and then cast friendly fire-proof AoE spells like Chain Lightning, Firebug and Cleansing Fire. Fampyrs are nasty but they are not very durable.

Re-dric is not particularly powerful by himself. He has the poor habit of throwing fireballs at point blank range that can hurt a lot but he will also take full damage from it. In fact, I managed to trick him into killing himself. Nothing could have been more satisfying.

[PsychoBlonde]

The second fight vs Raedric seems impossible to do (when he returns as undead). I have done the bounty side quests without issues but this undead Raedric battle is silly, the famyprs just kill everyone in my party instantly. I'm level 10 and have not had this issue in combat before, it just seems impossible.

 

I've had a look about for tips and videos and EVERY SINGLE video is of them cheesing it by using the ranger pet to only aggro Raedric himself. This is clearly not how the fight is meant to go down so has anybody actually done this fight properly cos the Fampyrs just one shot or charm everybody. 

 

Anyone got any tips that doesn't involve bugging the encounter with ranger pet so only Raedric himself aggros?

 

I had (some) trouble with this fight, but managed it.

 

The main issue with the Fampyrs is that they charm your party members.  I succeeded when I used that one prayer spell (prayer against bewilderment or something, it's high-level) to  boost my characters' resistance to charming.  Then I just spammed them with fire spells.

[Greensleeve]

I confess I used a single Paralyse scroll to win. Which is maybe a bit cheesy, but it worked. I also didn't find the charm to be the largest problem, but instead the fampyr's insane accuracy, high damage, high interrupt, and crazy speed. They kept basically any of my characters interrupt-locked until he or she was dead. Then I went for a paralyse scroll and won the fight pretty easy. 

[Psychevore]

I just ran back with the entire squad when the battle started, forcing the fight on the stairs. Then summoned a tonne of stuff with figurines to keep everyone, especially the monks, stuck on the stairs.

[Anatolici]

I was utterly slaughtered at level 9 in the fight, then returned and won at level 11. I used that Cipher spell that causes Domination and Mass-Charm to buy time (had to move my Cipher way back, or the vamps would charge her first and kill her first before she got it off). I also immediately cast the high level Priest spell, Prayer against Bewilderment, to keep the charms off. Even then the fight was very close, as Raedric regenerates fairly quickly, so I wasted a lot of damage on him.

I advise using lots of AoE spells during the Charm/confusion phase (which didn't last long), and lots of 'enemy-jumping' spells like Chain Lightning.

I didn't try the Mass Petrify spell, though I won the final battle by using it.

[omgFIREBALLS]

As is standard for my five-ranged party, I left those five way back and had my tank step up and do the talking. While they were grazing and missing him, I buffed those guys up and sent them in to slaughter. It still wasn't an easy victory as some slipped past the tank and caused a lot of trouble for my glass cannons. PotD, level 10.

 

Still better than the first time I beat him. Only the tank was alive then and basically just survived while Raedric killed his minions, then himself, with fireballs.

[Althernai]

I don't think there is a way to win this "fairly" (i.e. walking the whole party into talking range instead of sending the tank forward on his own) with most parties on Hard. It would probably be possible if there was something that countered Charm/Domination, but even that 6th level Priest spell is not fully proof against it and there's no way you'll cast it before they get you if you start within range of them. I managed to give them a taste of their own medicine and hit them with a Confusion, but it doesn't last very long. In the end, it came down to Eder vs. Raedric and a couple of badly wounded Fampyrs and since they basically couldn't hurt him, he beat them down with the aid of a summoned Adra Beetle.

[Kenji]

Confess! And repent! That most of you have used scroll of paralysis! (At least I did)

 

There's no shame in that, I treated the fight just as if it were my Vailian Warband fighting against the Adra Dragon.

[Evange]

Non-Cheese method: 

 

You need the Priest's spell Protection Against Treachery. First of all, send in your tank to begin the conversation. Let him take all the first wave of spells.

 

During this period, quickly use your figurines for summons and also cast all the buffing spells. Your tank should still be engaging Raedric and move your summons and remaining party to engage the fampyrs. Remember to give your tank plenty of potions as he will be eating a fireball every now and then.

[LadyCrimson]

Why is using something that's in the game (paralyze scroll or prone or similar spells) considered cheese, now? It's a legit tool the game gives you, not an exploit of some wonky game mechanic. I get not everyone wants to use those advantages, but that personal type of preference doesn't necessarily make something "cheese" if others do use them.

 

Just curious.

[cirdanx]

Why is using something that's in the game (paralyze scroll or prone or similar spells) considered cheese, now? It's a legit tool the game gives you, not an exploit of some wonky game mechanic. I get not everyone wants to use those advantages, but that personal type of preference doesn't necessarily make something "cheese" if others do use them.

 

Just curious.

 

Because people are stupid. If something like gaze of adragan wouldn´t be there, they would be complaining on the sleep spell or seals or something else.

 

It isn´t cheese in any way at all, you could also trap a room and then lure anyone in it..is that cheese? More like a strategy. I can see why gaze of adragan is considered "easy mode" but that is just a balance problem nothing else. (the duration is way to high) And as much as i love this game..balance is totally out of the window sadly.

 

Edit: also that fight isnt hard all. :>

Edited April 16, 2015 by cirdanx

[Anthile]

I don't understand the talk about cheese either. Cheese is something like climbing on a balcony to shoot a boss from a position where it can't reach you. Scrolls are meant to be used. People do not use them in unintended ways. Clearly, this how developers intended them to be used.

[sparklecat]

Why is using something that's in the game (paralyze scroll or prone or similar spells) considered cheese, now? It's a legit tool the game gives you, not an exploit of some wonky game mechanic. I get not everyone wants to use those advantages, but that personal type of preference doesn't necessarily make something "cheese" if others do use them.

 

Just curious.

In general, if an item or spell trivializes an otherwise challenging fight, I'd consider it cheese.  Sure, the game gave it to you, and you can use it if you want, but if there's a giant gap in difficulty between groups that bring this one special item and those that don't, I view it that the intent was for the encounter to be challenging and use a wider array of the tools at your disposal.

 

The Shield of Balduran was a legit tool that BG2 gave you to take on beholders, and I definitely used it when I didn't feel like dealing with them, but it was still cheesy as hell.

[LadyCrimson]

Yeah, I could see the balance aspect of it a bit, if it's totally out of whack. I thought those scrolls/spells had a high chance of not actually paralyzing or something, however, which can mitigate the imbalance a bit. Maybe I'm thinking of something else, tho. So many spells. >.>

 

Most of the time when I think of serious cheese I think of stuff like Anthile mentioned - using tactics that = taking advantage of known AI limitations or environment quirks in a way that negates pretty much any danger to self. Like those weird certain spots in Borderlands 2 where you could squish yourself into them and were completely safe from any dmg....

[sparklecat]

Kana's paralyze invocation, at least, seems to nearly always succeed; it's the only one I've used thus far because it feels not so overpowered with the time it takes to build up enough chants.

 

The way I at least use 'cheese' would exclude taking advantage of limitations/quirks like that; they sound more like straight-up exploits to me than something legitimate but kind of cheap.

[Greensleeve]

Scrolls of Paralysis have +15 Accuracy, so they very often hit, or at least graze. And even on a graze I believe it has a duration of 10 sec. So you know, easy to hit, huge AoE (8m radius I believe) and huge range (20m), and long duration. Totally wins an encounter all on its own. 

[dukefx]

Yeah, I could see the balance aspect of it a bit, if it's totally out of whack. I thought those scrolls/spells had a high chance of not actually paralyzing or something, however, which can mitigate the imbalance a bit. Maybe I'm thinking of something else, tho. So many spells. >.>

 

Most of the time when I think of serious cheese I think of stuff like Anthile mentioned - using tactics that = taking advantage of known AI limitations or environment quirks in a way that negates pretty much any danger to self. Like those weird certain spots in Borderlands 2 where you could squish yourself into them and were completely safe from any dmg....

That's not cheesing, that's exploiting. Cheesing is using some 3rd party stuff that is limited (other means of paralyzing/petrifying may or may not be considered such since they come at a high cost like wasting a 6th level spell which may be needed for something else). You hoard all your traps, potions and scrolls for a difficult encounter. There is nothing wrong with that except that it totally obliterates the challenge. This is why it's cheesing.

[Rumpelstilskin]

Ok, just to verify, I can't get this quest if I killed Kolsc instead, can I? I read that a guy in Celestial Sapling was supposed to initiate it, but he doesn't seem to be there.

[billythegreat]

Ok, just to verify, I can't get this quest if I killed Kolsc instead, can I? I read that a guy in Celestial Sapling was supposed to initiate it, but he doesn't seem to be there.

You may want to waltz back and kill Raedric too, then try again .

[Rosbjerg]

Saw the fampyr reception and cast the protection from domination and charm as soon as the fight started - which saved me from the initial clusterf*** of loosing half your guys. Then I tried to pull back my caster/supports and let my melee guys engage as many as possible. 2 fampyrs broke through which my second line had to deal with (and did) and then it was just a slug from there. Trying to keep ahead with protections and trying to wear them down slowly with spells etc.

 

It worked on my second try.

[Lones555]

Why is using something that's in the game (paralyze scroll or prone or similar spells) considered cheese, now? It's a legit tool the game gives you, not an exploit of some wonky game mechanic. I get not everyone wants to use those advantages, but that personal type of preference doesn't necessarily make something "cheese" if others do use them.

 

Just curious.

I know you aren't specifically addressing me, but the "cheese" method of sending the ranger pet in solo so ONLY Raedric aggros (leaving the Fampyrs behind) is clearly not a strategy intended by the game designers and it feels wrong to do it. Using in games items like scrolls or intelligent team positioning I would not class as such.

[WebShaman]

I didn't have these problems - it was really easy. Eder goes forwards (he is my tank) accompanied by my bear (slightly behind him). A chat ensued.

 

Fight starts, auto-pause. Three figurines, Havarius does his root stuff slowing everything down and Aloth slips them up with grease.

 

Kana sings, and ranged weapons on Raedric. Fampyres concentrate on summons (who get entangled) and Aloth and Havarius rain down death and destruction spells) while the rest whack and shoot Raedric down. The Fampyres go down even faster afterwards.

 

No para or petrify used.

[Varana]

Yep, summons are a good way of dealing with the problem.

I positioned my party back at the stairs to have at least some front line (although the fampyrs certainly managed to get through to the casters, now and then). Figurine summons were basically distractions; what really saved the day were Kana's ogres once he had sung enough. As has already been said, the fampyrs aren't that tough, and ogres SMASH.