Journalism and sexism in the games industry

[Darkpriest]

 

If I can manage to refrain from wearing shirts with hot babes when I go to the cancer ward, you'd think he can also manage to do the same when presenting his findings to the media.

 

"Looking professional when you interact with people in a function related to your profession" is a big part of being a professional.

 

 

 

I am fairly sure that you are bound by the contract to wear a specific type of clothing when you are on the cancer ward and your desire to wear hot babes or not has no real comparison to the situation of that guy. I am alos quite sure that you are fairly easy to replace on your position (as it is the case for the vast majority of jobs/functions)

 

I am sure that if he would be making a pitch for the project in front of potential funding parties, he would also refrain from this type of shirt. It would probably was also the case if he would be on a staged press conference a day after. How is the shirt related to his work performance and interactions with other people (where proebably half of the people wear odd things as well and he communcates via radio/phones/computer most of the time). 

 

Not sure what you do for a living and where yo work exactly, but if it is a large institution, check how people dress in all other parts of this institution and how it affects their work...

Edited November 16, 2014 by Darkpriest

[aluminiumtrioxid]

 

I like that you have to ask who you should be judging based on their clothing.

 

 

I like how you expertly avoid giving anything resembling an answer to my question.

 

I mean, I'm trying to have a discussion here, but the sheer amount of bad faith arguments and condescending bull**** is making it really hard to engage with the problem in any way, shape, or form.

Edited November 16, 2014 by aluminiumtrioxid

[Meshugger]

 

 

I like that you have to ask who you should be judging based on their clothing.

 

 

I like how you expertly avoid giving anything resembling an answer to my question.

 

 

Because you answer a question with a question.

 

"Why is it morally good to judge the clothing on some people and not on others?"

[aluminiumtrioxid]

 

 

 

I like that you have to ask who you should be judging based on their clothing.

 

 

I like how you expertly avoid giving anything resembling an answer to my question.

 

 

Because you answer a question with a question.

 

"Why is it morally good to judge the clothing on some people and not on others?"

 

 

Well, if you mean, say, rape victims by "others", my answer would be very different from the one I'd give when "others" means "guys dressing up as SS officers as a 'joke'" (a politician in my country pulled that off a few years ago, if I remember correctly).

 

Therefore I asked you to clarify.

[BruceVC]

 

 

 

I like that you have to ask who you should be judging based on their clothing.

 

 

I like how you expertly avoid giving anything resembling an answer to my question.

 

 

Because you answer a question with a question.

 

"Why is it morally good to judge the clothing on some people and not on others?"

 

No, you aren't making sense. I agree with Alum

 

You make a statement like that without explaining the context or giving an example. And then you get surprised when no one answers

[Longknife]

Just for some clarity.

 

 

How many of you actually know a good amount of engineers and physicists? I actually do, and I can tell you I've yet to meet one that didn't dress casually unless he himself was regularly expected to speak with people rather than work as much as the others. It's a common perk of the job, to the point where yes, they can go in to work looking like **** and no one cares because what they care about is results. Realize that this same field of study on a university level is also not unfamiliar with eccentric individuals with strange habits, so the area of work is abnormal from the get go, even before it's a workplace.

 

  I would assume the "why is it morally good to question the clothing of some and not others" comment is a jab at those SJWs who were interviewed by Pakman and some other journalists who did not even bother to comb their ****ing hair. Let me be clear: I would be the FIRST person to join the "I don't give a flying **** what you wear" club because I find judging people by their clothing to be largely ridiculous. But showing up for something professional like an interview that'll go on TV or a court case wearing anything but something that at least shows an ATTEMPT to dress up (like again if you just show up to court in a cheap button up shirt rather than a suit, more power to you, as long as you make the effort), then I legitimately question your intelligence and your grasp of reality, because attending a broadcasted interview (obviously one scheduled in advance and not on the spot) or a court case without dressing up must be akin to jumping in a pool of water when you know you can't swim.

 

 

 

 

 

Having said all of this, I find the entire story ****ing ridiculous. I legit don't care what he's wearing and when I first heard it was "misogynistic" I actually had to go find a higher quality photo of the shirt cause I couldn't tell from the videos I'd seen.

 

 

My take on this?

 

If you don't like his shirt and thus you would make the bold assumption that this guy is some massive misogynistic, woman-hating **** because he wore such a shirt rather than using Occam's Razor and assuming "he likes boobs and isn't afraid to say so," then that's your right. But you know what's in his rights? Wearing a shirt you don't like. Make your little presumptious judgement of him in silence or amongst your friends, then keep it to yourself.

 

  The entire problem with the SJW movement is that it is constantly perceiving "bullying" from others. In this case, they think he "bullied" the entire female gender by wearing a shirt with boobs on it...made by a woman. So what do they do to right this wrong? They bully him.

 

Maybe your parents skipped this lesson, but mine didn't: revenge is wrong. You don't go acting exactly like your opposition, because "an eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind." This case and some of the cases we've seen over the past couple months have been particularly bad because the need for any revenge or any teachings of lessons has been kind of a stretch, not to mention the time did not match the crime. It feels like SJWs are constantly trying to charge people guilty of -AT BEST- drunk and disorderly conduct with first degree murder. No, it doesn't work that way.

 

  So if you don't like someone, do it on your own time. But going out of your way to harass, bully them and coerce them via media pressure because you don't like them? If you think that's acceptable, then you're a ****ing psychopath.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Longknife

[Meshugger]

William Usher is fighting the good fight. The guy who wrote that the shirt is misogynic (Chris Plante) has gotten into some trouble it seems with disclosing too much about his former employer, Polygon. 

 

 

Circumstancial evidence:

 

 

Archived:

 

 

LoL is approaching a 1 billion in revenue this year, so they definately have the cash for this.

[Meshugger]

 

 

 

 

I like that you have to ask who you should be judging based on their clothing.

 

 

I like how you expertly avoid giving anything resembling an answer to my question.

 

 

Because you answer a question with a question.

 

"Why is it morally good to judge the clothing on some people and not on others?"

 

 

Well, if you mean, say, rape victims by "others", my answer would be very different from the one I'd give when "others" means "guys dressing up as SS officers as a 'joke'" (a politician in my country pulled that off a few years ago, if I remember correctly).

 

Therefore I asked you to clarify.

 

 

You're almost there....just elaborate a bit more.

[Nonek]

As far as i'm concerned dictating what people can and can't wear as clothing is morally reprehensible, I may not approve of young ladies dressed like whores and strippers spillling out of their skimpy clothing on a friday night in any major city centre, however I have no right to tell them what to wear. This seems very simple, as far as the colourful shirt our scientist friend wore, it's inoffensive.

 

I would even go so far as to not condemn prominent Anti GG Neo Nazi's, like Ian Miles Cheong and Geordie Tait, if they choose to dress in their idolised factions regalia. I will judge them every which way from Sunday, but I will not try to remove that right. As doing so would be the first step on the road to becoming like them.

 

Edit: To focus on a shirt in the midst of what the Rosetta Project has achieved is ridiculous and small minded anyway, and I truly pity anyone so petty as to be worried about such things while mankind steps into the stars.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Nonek

[TrashMan]

 

 

It's ****ing obvious that he WAS MADE to make the statement by the oganization he works for... It's a PR action driven by the institute he works for. He probbly went throughout a painful discussion with the HR people and his superiors. 

 

 

And I'm sorry, but it probably has pretty little to do with "SJW pressure". I'm pretty sure if he was wearing a tacky T-shirt with pink unicorns instead of one with half-naked women, his superiors also would have had a serious discussion with him about what is appropriate to wear on occasions like this.

 

 

IF a company has a casual dress code, then it is appropriate. Enough of this faux crap about "you must dress this way" stick-in-the-butt assholery.

Appropriate? By who's judgemnent? Yours?

Well, I consider your tastes in clothing abysmal.

 

 

 

 

This thread is full of bizarre and unsubstantiated assumptions, no wonder GG lacks meaningful cohesion and results

 

When did I ever say that harassment can't cause people to be bullied or pressured? When did I say that harassment can't be hurtful?

 

My point again is that you cannot assume he apologized because he was pressured from nameless  feminists and SJW, he apologized because he felt he had offended people. That's his words, not mine. And these people are not the nameless people on twitter who  expressed the initial  outrage but rather his work colleagues who he obviously respects

 

Its not hard to understand

 

Wrong, he wasn't apologizing to his colleagues. No colleague ever had a problem with him.

 

 

 

 

"Looking professional when you interact with people in a function related to your profession" is a big part of being a professional.

 

Basing your worldview on superficial appearances is stupid.

"looking professional" is nothing more than "looking like my imagined stereotype".

Choice of clothing has NO BEARING WHATSOEVER on ones capacity to do jobs like this.

 

[BruceVC]

As far as i'm concerned dictating what people can and can't wear as clothing is morally reprehensible, I may not approve of young ladies dressed like whores and strippers spillling out of their skimpy clothing on a friday night in any major city centre, however I have no right to tell them what to wear. This seems very simple, as far as the colourful shirt our scientist friend wore, it's inoffensive.

 

I would even go so far as to not condemn prominent Anti GG Neo Nazi's, like Ian Miles Cheong and Geordie Tait, if they choose to dress in their idolised factions regalia. I will judge them every which way from Sunday, but I will not try to remove that right. As doing so would be the first step on the road to becoming like them.

 

Edit: To focus on a shirt in the midst of what the Rosetta Project has achieved is ridiculous and small minded anyway, and I truly pity anyone so petty as to be worried about such things while mankind steps into the stars.

   Nonek you are very skilled at theatrics

 

"  morally reprehensible"

 

Guess this is another point to add to your list of  " why I despise and loath SJW and Feminists " .....  

 

[Meshugger]

Nonek gets my point. Imaginary cup of tea to you, my good sir!

 

Btw, Gamergate has started a fund to buy a gift for the shirt guy: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/matt-taylor-rosetta-project-scientist#home

 

4426 dollars so far, exceeding the estimated target by 146% within a day.

[pmp10]

Nonek gets my point. Imaginary cup of tea to you, my good sir!

 

Btw, Gamergate has started a fund to buy a gift for the shirt guy: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/matt-taylor-rosetta-project-scientist#home

 

4426 dollars so far, exceeding the estimated target by 146% within a day.

Are you sure he would actually want it?

Seems to me he would prefer to get away from witch-hunts rather than invite more.

[Keyrock]

 

 

 

 

 

 

There is no point in trying to reason with SJW logic. BruceVC proves this. I'm sorry, but you are off the charts biased.

 

So lets be clear on this, you think its impossible that he felt he had offended women he works with and he wanted to set the record straight? You say this cannot be the case?

 

Lets be clear indeed. He's not sexist for any reason you list. He was likely asked to issue an apology so men like you wouldn't get your panties in a twist.

 

 

When did I ever say he was sexist? I believe I have said several times that I don't believe he meant to offend anyone. But that doesn't change the fact he did offend people

 

You guys really need to stop putting words in peoples mouths and stop making assumptions around what people say

 

Irony Level: Plaid

 

 

Sure, where did I make assumptions about what people are saying?

 

I have said I disagree that pressure from feminists and SJW made Dr Taylor apologize, this is exactly what you guys are saying is the reason he apologized

I have said Dr Taylor made the apology because he felt he offended people, that's exactly what he said in the interview.

 

Where am I making assumptions?

 

 

 

 

So.. feminists (mostly white males) bullied, intimidated, and threatened a space scientist into an emotional breakdown over a friggin' shirt that was a nice gift by a female friend. That's EVIL. More evdience that feminists and SJWs are just nazis .

 

I don't know about that Volo, lets be honest the shirt was an eye-sore and I have to say probably inappropriate for him to wear in an interview. Your are defined in society rightly or wrongly by your appearance. But its just a shirt and this man is a highly intelligent  and respected person, I would have just said " I'm sorry for wearing that shirt " and then moved the conversation onto the real topical event ....the comet

 

But resorting to crying in an interview, isn't that a bit dramatic?

 

I'm not going to pour over all 200 or so pages of this to find all instances, but here's a fun one that not only makes and assumption but also contradicts your own assertion of the sincerity of his apology.  Here you make the assumption that he's resorting to theatrics in his apology.

 

 

Dude, one of the Mojos attacked him SIMPLY FOR TRYING TO SET UP AN INTERVIEW. 5 tweet messages were harassement to her.

 

 

 

In other news, SJW's abusing the Twitter WAM system:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B2fQw_LCIAAtLSI.jpg

 

 

 

B.t.w. - Bruce, should anyone wearing this also be shamed and attacked?

 

 

This looks like a shirt that a gay man would wear and yes it also sends a certain message. Whether men would feel it objectifies them I can't say ?

 

Here you make an assumption about what kind of person would wear that clothing.

 

In fairness, those examples are fairly petty, and, like I wrote, I'm too lazy to pour over 200 or so pages of this discussion to look for better, more meaningful examples and reading back through what came before it for proper context.  More importantly, my comment was more aimed at SJWs in general and less at you specifically.  I certainly didn't make that clear, which is my mistake, apologies for that.  

 

I found that funny, hence the snark and the joke, since putting words into people's mouths is the modus operandi of SJWs.  To borrow one of anti-GGs terms (it's only fitting), SJWs have weaponized putting words into people's mouths and making assumptions about their intent.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Keyrock

[Hurlshort]

I am pretty sure the rest of the normal world is over this. The guy wore a questionable shirt, the guy apologized, end of the story.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

Nonek gets my point. Imaginary cup of tea to you, my good sir!

 

Btw, Gamergate has started a fund to buy a gift for the shirt guy: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/matt-taylor-rosetta-project-scientist#home

 

4426 dollars so far, exceeding the estimated target by 146% within a day.

$4426? Clearly that shows how evil we are, all that could've gone to Patreon!

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/space/11232986/Matt-Taylors-sexist-shirt-and-the-day-political-correctness-officially-went-mad.html

[Keyrock]

I am pretty sure the rest of the normal world is over this. The guy wore a questionable shirt, the guy apologized, end of the story.

Can I ask you this?  Which was worse, his tacky shirt or the scathing attacks launched at him for wearing said shirt?

 

The reason we're not just letting these things go and moving on, the reason we're taking a stand against the SJWs and holding them accountable for their actions is because it needs to be done.  The "just let it go, just some mad people rambling, it doesn't affect me, move on" attitude is what's allowed these evil people to get as much power and influence as they already have.  Meanwhile, any time anyone does something that doesn't fit into their rigid ideals and they spot a potential opening, they launch an organized scathing attack, most often containing mistruths, wild conjecture, or just outright lies, and bully their way to victory.  With a similar "just let it go" attitude people, particularly prominent individuals or professional organizations will make a concession to them because they have a lot to lose by having their name dragged through the mud by a media all to willing to run with sensationalized hit pieces without any research or fact checking, because those are what tend to draw the eyeballs of the masses, and who actually puts in real journalistic work these days?  So it's much easier for these individuals and companies to make a small concession and move on with their lives.  With shortsightedness and with a small scope, it's the logical move for said individuals or companies, as digging their heels in and fighting for what's right generally comes with many costs (money, reputation, etc.), plus people often tend to take the path of least resistance.  Meanwhile, each little concession adds up as these far left-wing control freaks chip away at freedom and move us ever so slightly closer to a totalitarian police state.  Well, some of us have decided to take a stand.  We're ready to pay the cost of digging our heels in and fighting, and we will expose these people for the zealots they are and we will fight them for as long as it takes.  Why?  Because in our views, it's the right thing to do.  Sure, a free society has its own evils.  Freedom allows for all types ugliness to rear its head.  In my view, those evils pale in comparison to the evils of totalitarianism.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Keyrock

[Hurlshort]

They were both equally sophomoric.

[Meshugger]

So would you be completely ok to wear a shirt that causes the media to write articles that you are putting humanity a step backwards and getting hounded on social media, bullied into submission that you're a bad person. And after offering a tearful apology you would still think that it was ok, since in your mind you caused it?

Edited November 16, 2014 by Meshugger

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

They were both equally sophomoric.

So wearing a tacky shirt is equivalent to harassment?

[Longknife]

 I may not approve of young ladies dressed like whores and strippers spillling out of their skimpy clothing on a friday night in any major city centre

 

What are you, gay?

 

I love those ladies... :C

[Longknife]

This looks like a shirt that a gay man would wear and yes it also sends a certain message. Whether men would feel it objectifies them I can't say ?

 

 

What are you, not a man?

[Hurlshort]

This thread is so ridiculously reactionary.

[Meshugger]

??

 

What do you mean by reactionary? 

[aluminiumtrioxid]

 

If you don't like his shirt and thus you would make the bold assumption that this guy is some massive misogynistic, woman-hating **** because he wore such a shirt rather than using Occam's Razor and assuming "he likes boobs and isn't afraid to say so," then that's your right. But you know what's in his rights? Wearing a shirt you don't like. Make your little presumptious judgement of him in silence or amongst your friends, then keep it to yourself.

 

 

So you're essentially saying "it's okay for him to offend someone's sensibilities (however idiotic those sensibilities are), but when said someone wants to express that their sensibilities were offended, THAT's a big no-no"?

 

This is a very prevalent and utterly ridiculous stance. If you're willing to cry "freedom of expression" for protecting people's rights to wear tacky T-shirts/draw giant boobs in their art projects/whatever, why don't their critics also get to exercise their freedom of expression by writing scathing articles about what they think of tacky T-shirts/art with giant boobs/whatever?

Edited November 16, 2014 by aluminiumtrioxid