Death & Dying

[constantine]

Sorry to be a bother, but I'm a lil' confused.

 

 

 

 

So, what is the deal when you run out of (Stamina?) a.k.a HPs in combat ?

 

What goes different when you play in Expert Mode and does the game handle unconsciousness for enemies the same as for party members ?

 

Lastly, there will be NO resurrection magic in the game, correct ..?

[Gfted1]

I believe that when you run out of Stamina you become unconscious for the remainder of the battle but pop tall after (assuming your party wins). However you are now "maimed" (some lessening of character ability) and must return the all powerful "rest spot" to get ungimped. Or maybe that's what happens when you lose all Health.

 

Expert mode will offer toggles for things like permanent death.

 

There is no resurrection or healing in PE.

[IndiraLightfoot]

Is that "maimed" more or less the same assorted collection as in Dragon Age: Origins?

[constantine]

 

 

Expert mode will offer toggles for things like permanent death.

 

There is no resurrection or healing in PE.

 

 

... or healing -/-/- NO healing ? are you sure, cause I remember I've read some Paladin and/or Cleric talents that can replenish Stamina over time or give a big temp bonus to Stamina

                           But are there talents or magic (pots) that can replenish Health or you get it back only with resting ?

 

 

Permanent Death -- so, in Expert Mode, losing all your Stamina is just as punishing as losing all your Health ? Wouldn't that render useless the Paladin talent to revive you with a peak of Temp Stamina (which gradually wears off). Does anyone know how the game handles perma-death ?

[MReed]

If my understanding is correct, and it may not be...

 

• Stamina and health are separate and independent from one another.
• Most (but not all) combat damage comes out of stamina, which can be replenished via spells and other, similar, effects.
• Health damage occurs due to unusual combat effects (or damage in excess of your stamina?) and can't be healed via spells or similar effects.

[PrimeJunta]

@Gfted1, close, but no cigar. Running out of stamina does indeed cause you to drop in combat, but you won't be maimed when you wake up. However, if you run out of health in combat, then you will be maimed, or, in Expert mode, dead.

[Gfted1]

Is that "maimed" more or less the same assorted collection as in Dragon Age: Origins?

 

I haven't played the DA franchise and I don't think Obs has released a "maimed" list. I expect it to be similar to FONV but Im just speculating.

 

 

 

 

 

Expert mode will offer toggles for things like permanent death.

 

There is no resurrection or healing in PE.

 

 

... or healing -/-/- NO healing ? are you sure, cause I remember I've read some Paladin and/or Cleric talents that can replenish Stamina over time or give a big temp bonus to Stamina

                           But are there talents or magic (pots) that can replenish Health or you get it back only with resting ?

 

 

Permanent Death -- so, in Expert Mode, losing all your Stamina is just as punishing as losing all your Health ? Wouldn't that render useless the Paladin talent to revive you with a peak of Temp Stamina (which gradually wears off). Does anyone know how the game handles perma-death ?

 

 

I was using "healing" wrt replenishing your Health pool. There are abilities that will regain your Stamina.

 

Death must kick in when you lose all Health so maybe that's when the maiming comes into play?

 

 

 

If my understanding is correct, and it may not be...

 

• Stamina and health are separate and independent from one another.
• Most (but not all) combat damage comes out of stamina, which can be replenished via spells and other, similar, effects.
• Health damage occurs due to unusual combat effects (or damage in excess of your stamina?) and can't be healed via spells or similar effects.

 

 

Damage occurs to Stamina and Health every time you take damage. I think its somewhere around a 4:1 ratio so for example, an attack that delivery 20 damage to your stamina also delivered 5 damage to your Health. Stamina will regen while Health can only be replenished at a "rest spot"

[constantine]

Thank you guys, that helped a lot.

 

 

-Another question:

 

So.. so far it has not been announced that there are other ways to replenish your Health apart from Resting, right ?

 

So as an effect the party (or maybe your front-liners that are likely to get the most abuse) will *need* to return to a safe spot to recollect their strength right ?

[ReyVagabond]

@Gfted1, close, but no cigar. Running out of stamina does indeed cause you to drop in combat, but you won't be maimed when you wake up. However, if you run out of health in combat, then you will be maimed, or, in Expert mode, dead.

 

Thats good. ill be able to play ironman mode without woring about perma death.

 

The only thing i hope is that every one that plays in expert mode plays also with ironman mode.  So they dont do any reloding after every death shananigans.

[Gfted1]

So as an effect the party (or maybe your front-liners that are likely to get the most abuse) will *need* to return to a safe spot to recollect their strength right ?

That is correct. The rest spot is the lynchpin for everything; resting, unmaiming, inventory, per rest abilities, per rest spells, etc...

[constantine]

 

That is correct. The rest spot is the lynchpin for everything; resting, unmaiming, inventory, per rest abilities, per rest spells, etc...

 

 

 

May I pose a worry there ?

 

Do we have any idea how commonly will such places appear in, like, a dungeon ? I mean it can be a bother if your party is not allowed to set camp inside the ruins they explore and has to leave to find some safer outdoor area ..

 

*edit*: typo

Edited April 22, 2014 by constantine

[constantine]

Also, I'm definitely going for expert mode ! I wanna have the frightful feeling of perma-death slightly crawling on my neck   

[Gfted1]

May I pose a worry there ?

 

Do we have any idea how common will such places appear in, like, a dungeon ? I mean it can be a bother if your party is not allowed to set camp inside the ruins they explore and has to leave to find some safer outdoor area ..

You're preaching to the choir. Im really hoping a mod will be released quickly.

 

And the rest spot is not portable. You will have to walk your party back to wherever you saw the last one at. You can see a representation of the rest spot in some of the outdoor pictures, it looks like three sticks stacked like a teepee.

[constantine]

Jeez ..

 

This may be the first very thing I read about the game and can't find myself to agree with ..

 

 

It would sure be nice to eliminate rest exploit from previous IE games, but wouldn't only be natural that rest spots exist even in dungeons ? I mean, every pen-and-paper player party has rested in the occasional ruins every now and then, so even if you see it from that perspective it still makes sense.

 

 

 

How are we supposed to explore THE ENDLESS PATHS OF NUAAAAAA ?????!!! AHHHH !!!

 

 

(replying to my worried -and kind of creepy- self: bit by bit .. or maybe the devs DO add rest spots in dungeons !)

[Gfted1]

I cant imagine there wouldn't be rest spots inside dungeons. That would be...terrible.

[constantine]

 

@Gfted1, close, but no cigar. Running out of stamina does indeed cause you to drop in combat, but you won't be maimed when you wake up. However, if you run out of health in combat, then you will be maimed, or, in Expert mode, dead.

 

Thats good. ill be able to play ironman mode without woring about perma death.

 

The only thing i hope is that every one that plays in expert mode plays also with ironman mode.  So they dont do any reloding after every death shananigans.

 

 

 

I am not THAT hardcore myself, but reading all expert mode has to offer, like withholding skill checks-dialogue options' effects from the player, this is the way i'll go for my play experience.

[constantine]

I cant imagine there wouldn't be rest spots inside dungeons. That would be...terrible.

 

 

Just the thought of it makes me wanna     or maybe 

[Karkarov]

Pretty sure they said the maimed thing was only like the easy settings and normal+ would be permanent death.

[ReyVagabond]

Thank you guys, that helped a lot.

 

 

-Another question:

 

So.. so far it has not been announced that there are other ways to replenish your Health apart from Resting, right ?

 

So as an effect the party (or maybe your front-liners that are likely to get the most abuse) will *need* to return to a safe spot to recollect their strength right ?

 

As far as i know, health is like a long team resourse, how far can you go without going back to camp.

 

So you can go into a dungeon and reach level 5 but your team has 5 hp points each, then you know there is no way to finish it, so you turn back to camp, rest and then you come back.

 

there is no rest where ever you like in this game. AS FAR AS I KNOW.

 

So adding anything that changes how you replenish HP, changes the idea of the resourse, so i dont think they will add nothing to heal it at least in lower levels.

[PrimeJunta]

Pretty sure they said the maimed thing was only like the easy settings and normal+ would be permanent death.

 

Permadeath is an extra option you have to enable separately. You can play on hard without permadeath. or, if you want, on easy with it. It's also part of the Expert Mode option set.

 

Source: http://pillarsofeternity.gamepedia.com/Mode - follow the links for references. See also http://pillarsofeternity.gamepedia.com/Health#Health .

Edited April 22, 2014 by PrimeJunta

[constantine]

Thank you for the links PrimeJunta.

 

-From the wiki:

 

Some characters (e.g. barbarians) have a different formula for converting Stamina damage into Health damage.

 

 

now why would any sane person DO THAT ??!

 

 

*edit*: now that i think of it, barbarians are not known for their wisdom 

Edited April 22, 2014 by constantine

[ReyVagabond]

 

I cant imagine there wouldn't be rest spots inside dungeons. That would be...terrible.

 

 

Just the thought of it makes me wanna     or maybe 

 

Actually I’m against this! I hate the resting in the middle of a dungeon.

It must make sense and that depends on the Dungeon.

But lets say you are a cave. Inside the cave there are Bears. You kill some of them, and then you rest. So if you are careful the other bears may not want to attack you.

In that cave I would have no problem.

But let’s change the setting to, an Evil Mage Dungeon.

Lets say you kill half his minions to get there, for me its moronic to be able to sleep there, and still feel the world is real, alarms should sound, the mage should try ambush you, not 3 skeletons and what not, but a big ambush, with traps waking up in the middle of a fireball, or maybe some of your companions as hostages, or dead even. All depending of multiple skill checks and what not, but it should always should carry a consequence resting in dungeons you are invading, where people should roam and live there.

Resting in next to a room filled with bandits and with only the consequence that you where ambushed by 3 regular bandits its not enough.

That’s why I support going back to some sort of base camp, maybe that I set near the big dragon lair, but still not inside his lair.

[ReyVagabond]

Thank you for the links PrimeJunta.

 

-From the wiki:

 

Some characters (e.g. barbarians) have a different formula for converting Stamina damage into Health damage.

 

 

now why would any sane person DO THAT ??!

 

 

*edit*: now that i think of it, barbarians are not known for their wisdom 

Actualy this means that barbarian take more stamina damage and less health damage, their formula is 1/6 instead 1/4, so the can take a lot more pushment than other classes.

 

Fighters may have better armor, and defence. but barbarians have more helth, d10 vs d12,

[constantine]

Of course, I wouldn't like it if resting in the dungeon defies realistic outcome just as you described.

 

I guess I will have to trust the devs will also pull that one through and decide what is best for each case.

 

 

 

*Edit*: Also thanks for the explanation of the Barbarian's power ! I thought what was implied is that they converted Stamina DMG to Health DMG and I was like ... whaaah ??!

Edited April 22, 2014 by constantine

[Volourn]

"The only thing i hope is that every one that plays in expert mode plays also with ironman mode.  So they dont do any reloding after every death shananigans."

 

Nah. Ironman mode is too risky when it comes to the PC. Wouldn't trust one with a ten foot pole. if I could just the game to be 100% completely unbuggy and never crash, I'd be for it, but nope. Not gonna happen. Hardcore is cool. Ironman mode is cheating and liable to be abused by the game to screw you over in some lame way.

 

 

AS for resting in dungeons...  most dungeons no ala that mage dungeon described above or a crypt where a mummy keeps raising the dead. However, some dungeons it makes sense to be able tor est under certain conditions. ie. Undermountain - a huge place where you can find (relatively speaking) 'safe' corners to rest in.  Find a place, barricade yourself in, and you should be fine MOSTLY. But, yeah, should not be over done. Resting everywhere anytime with no consequences is lame. And, no being interrupted by 3 wimpy skeles is not punishment just annoying. A better way to do that. Say you rest in that mage's abode. He doesn't attack you, but he summons all his remaining minions  , sourrunds you (r blocks your one exist) and tells you to surrender or die. Instead of just killing you outright (can be boring) he can demand a service from you and  geas you to make sure you follow through. THAT would be punishment for resting in a dumb place at a dumb time without a lame game over and an interesting   side qeust resolution.