Beta...just finalized my pledge today...

[WilliamDecker]

I have been staying away from my PE emails mostly because I want everything to be fresh and surprising.  I really don't need to be updated, but caught that I hadn't finalized my pledge.

 

Anyway...through the process I noticed that I could get access to the beta...for additional funds ($25).

 

"Can't wait to play Pillars of Eternity? No problem - add on the early access beta key and you can play it before everyone else! The beta key is digital only."

 

Now...I like the idea behind Kickstarter and getting companies setup while taking out the middle man, but really.  Besides Horse Armor has there been a more obvious attempt at sucking as many dollars out of the customers before?  4 million dollars from the Kickstarter alone, and god knows how much more from other sources and future sales, and Obsidian is looking to hit us up for additional dollars?

 

I was slightly disgusted by this.  The business decision is almost EA like.  If people are willing to pay that's one thing, but does everything need a price tag?  The sale of beta keys is an evil practice.  The purpose of public beta testing is that people are willing to give you their time, something more valuable than $25, in order to help you finalize your product.  I remember beta testing previous games and companies sending me a final copy of the game, for free, along with other cool things...like t-shirts and whatnot.  How has this role been reversed into a developer, not a publisher, hitting me up for additional funds to aid in fixing their mistakes?

 

Give it away for free to the people willing to give you their time.  It's extremely unflattering Obsidian to immediately become the beast developers have been blaming for many years (the evil publishers).  The community has fixed your problems before (KOTOR2) for free, maybe rethink this one.

 

For those willing to justify a price tag on bandwidth and whatnot?  It's nowhere near $25.

[Leferd]

You do realize that they are not specifically selling you a game, right?

 

The Kickstarter was a fundraiser.

 

Specifically, they are asking for donations to raise capital to create the game and based on how much was donated, they are offering you rewards based on what dollar tier you pledged for.

 

Beta access is a reward tier within the kickstarter. Beta access is still offered outside of the kickstarter as another reward tier.

 

I don't see what the problem is...unless you actually thought that Kickstarter is a retail outlet selling the game?

[Metabot]

I do understand where you're coming from to an extent, I know of no other sources of funding that Obsidian has received for this game other than the kickstarter and add-on's through paypal and late backers through paypal. This isn't Star Citizen. Now, if they actually were able to secure more funding from other sources I would be ok with that. If you don't want to pay for the beta then don't.

[nikolokolus]

To the OP: You do realize that 4 million pazoors for a game like this, from a studio like this, is a paltry sum right?

 

As to paying for "beta access" I know it is/was a common practice for "Mmorperger" developers to give beta access to games because they needed to stress test systems and balance their games with live players, but single player games like this are slightly different beast. It might be more appropriate to call it "early access." in this case and if you don't think it's worth the money then you don't pay for it.

 

Personally, I backed at the level I did because I want a game like this to be made and it wasn't going to happen under the traditional publisher model. Early access doesn't matter that much to me, but I don't see at as a voracious money grab, since any extra funds are going to the game's development, whereas a game published by a company like EA was going to get made with the features it has no matter if I pre-order or not ... except that frequently, they cull content from a game and hold it out as something to be purchased as day-one DLC unless you play the pre-order game.

 

Maybe these are subtle distinctions, but they're real enough for me to change my purchasing/backing habits.

[Aeschylus]

here's a solution.... Don't click on the beta test button... just get your game for 25 dollars and get off the soap box sir...

[Zulithe]

I couldn't justify the Beta price. I have way too many games to play as it is, no extra time to devote to the Beta. I'll let those intersted pay the $25. I'm happy to wait for the final (and less buggy) game.

 

I did however add the $20 expansion option. Apparently this is at a discount. So I'm assuming the full price is 24.99 or 29.99.

[narg]

why so angry, EA still sell beta of their BF4 (and with china rising add they go back to alfa stadium) for full price and offer vip beta for double the price and ppl buy it for milions of copy, stupid ppl, I cant understand this

 

dayz sell 400 000 of ALFA pre-acces, and beta will be at end of year and ppl buy it again, but here is difference, EA have hundreds programers and dayz make 10-20 ppl, so I dont have problems with dayz, but with bf4 beta yes

 

selling alfa/beta  pre acces is two way things, one is, that developer dont believ himself and want make fast money = game may not be finished, or will be crap, second, developer is small studio and really need every dolars they can get, decision is up to you... true is, when game is crap even in beta, it does not mean full game will be flawles briliant (X rebirth)

Edited January 15, 2014 by narg

[Walsingham]

I think I speak for many of us when I say that you could inform us BF4 players were being fed live to crocodiles and I wouldn't give a ****.

 

EDIT: I mean, I'd look for a youtube video. But you know...

Edited January 15, 2014 by Walsingham

[Hassat Hunter]

It has a price tag since it was originally just a boon for higher tiers on Kickstarter... and this way lower tiers can still get it, albeit expensive.

 

Personally, I didn't go for it...

[narg]

I dont know, if i understand you correctly, but i have this vids about crocodile feeding with bf4 players, sadly, this footage cover only what happen before feeding starts, not feeding itself (but you can see one happy bf4 player)

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IsAxc6peZdU

 

 

[speedknob]

In the same boat - just did my 'order' today.  Looking forward to seeing further progress.

[BruceVC]

I'm one of those people who never plays a beta of any game. Why ruin the excitement of the story and the events in the game by playing a version of the game that will inevitably have bugs....no thanks, not for me. I'll stick to playing PoE once the first official patch is released. I find this way I generally have no real complaints around overall stability of the games I play  

[Infinitron]

Psst guys, OP is a troll

[Walsingham]

Psst guys, OP is a troll

 

Expensive route to trolling.

[neo6874]

I'm one of those people who never plays a beta of any game. Why ruin the excitement of the story and the events in the game by playing a version of the game that will inevitably have bugs....no thanks, not for me. I'll stick to playing PoE once the first official patch is released. I find this way I generally have no real complaints around overall stability of the games I play  

Thing is, teh PE beta isn't actually "here, play the first chapter" (or whatever), but sounds more like it's gonna be "here, play this totally unrelated to the campaign module and break whatever you can".

[BruceVC]

 

I'm one of those people who never plays a beta of any game. Why ruin the excitement of the story and the events in the game by playing a version of the game that will inevitably have bugs....no thanks, not for me. I'll stick to playing PoE once the first official patch is released. I find this way I generally have no real complaints around overall stability of the games I play  

Thing is, teh PE beta isn't actually "here, play the first chapter" (or whatever), but sounds more like it's gonna be "here, play this totally unrelated to the campaign module and break whatever you can".

 

 

Okay that's interesting, if that's the case it makes more sense to play the Beta. But I'll still wait for the finished product

[terryrayc]

I'm seeing a lot more people making posts like this with companies that decide to extend the buy in to the betas.  We really see it a lot with Steam Early Access.  For some reason people are okay with getting beta through kickstarter...but lord help you if you decide to allow people to buy into the beta later....even if you keep the price the same(Well more so if you do) people still make comments like

 

'Why should I pay you to help test your product'

 

Here's a secret....you DO NOT HAVE TO BUY INTO THE BETA!!!!!!

 

If you don't think it's worth the $25.00 then don't spend it.

[Halsy]

I'm in the process of starting a new biz for myself and wasting even a mere $25 for something like a beta just isn't in the cards for me right now. Even if it was this concept of paying to beta really bothers the hell out of me. Every time I see it happens the game comes out an absolute mess. Release it to all the backers if you're serious about getting real feedback and bugs killed. Larian is doing it the right way. And given Obsidians bug filled track record they need everyone and their dog beta'ing this.

[Jobby]

Ach if people will pay it and the money goes towards the games development I have no problem, personally I wouldn't pay $5 to get a shot of an unfinished game I have already purchased, but again each to their own.

[Walsingham]

 Release it to all the backers if you're serious about getting real feedback and bugs killed. Larian is doing it the right way. And given Obsidians bug filled track record they need everyone and their dog beta'ing this.

 

You're assuming - and I think you are very VERY wrong - that all beta testers are the same.

 

Releasing to people who pony up extra means they have an investment in testing properly. Filing bugs etc.

 

Giving to everyone and their dog is just going to blow surprises and generate ill-informed negative comment from people who don't understand what a beta is and don't care.

[Hiro Protagonist II]

 

Releasing to people who pony up extra means they have an investment in testing properly. Filing bugs etc.

 

Giving to everyone and their dog is just going to blow surprises and generate ill-informed negative comment from people who don't understand what a beta is and don't care.

 

 

I think some people who have paid for the beta may not know what they're paying for. I can see a lot of ill-informed negative comments about the game having bugs, instead of giving feedback to Obsidian with what bugs they've found for them to squish? Oh joy, something to look forward to.

[Frenetic Pony]

Yeppers, complaining about a thing you don't have to buy is ridiculous, always has been and always will be. It's a freely available thing to purchase or not to purchase, and the seller is free to set whatever price they want because... they're selling you something.

 

May as well go around to random houses for sale and complain to the sellers that it costs too much, and they buy it anyway. If you don't know what you're getting... again that's your fault. You just paid $25 for a thing you don't understand because you don't do 2 minutes of googling and then complain about it... yeah definitely your fault then.

Edited January 15, 2014 by Frenetic Pony

[Walsingham]

Perhaps a more logical thing would be to charge $15 but you have to complete 5 mock bug test reports.

[Lephys]

I think some people who have paid for the beta may not know what they're paying for. I can see a lot of ill-informed negative comments about the game having bugs, instead of giving feedback to Obsidian with what bugs they've found for them to squish? Oh joy, something to look forward to.

While this is most certainly true (we've already seen comments here and there along the lines of "When do I get to play this early?! 8D!", I think Walsingham is still correct, in that you're going to see relatively more people legitimately willing to test the beta build out of people who had to pay $25, than if you had just given it to everyone in the universe.

 

Or, I shouldn't say "more," but... a greater percentage of the beta folk will probably be legitimate testers, with the price tag as opposed to "Hey, just download this and play it! YAY!"

[kebrus]

OP, i'm with you...

 

in fact i exclusively came here looking for some information about this, and unfortunately i can already tell this is not a good community to stay in, i would advise you to stay away from it like i'm going to do after this post.

 

There are two sides of the problem, the additional funds which you were trying to discuss about, and the reaction to your view on the subject. In my view they are both connected, the reason they can't understand what you trying to say is the same reason why none of them could give you any good reason why should Obsidian ask additional 25$ for the beta.

 

What they are all trying to do is justify their own spending and the associated risks and consequences. Value is relative, so keeping this in mind, it's actually reasonable to ask money for anything as long as there are people willing to pay for it, simply because they consider it valuable to them. These people can never give you a good justification because there are none, so instead they comments fall in false moralism and ethics. "You don't have to buy it" they say... or, "They need the money to finish it" ... none of this matters because it still doesn't say anything about why should Obsidian ask for money on something that almost all other companies either do it for free or actually give you money to do it. They are simply blinded by their own feelings towards the game and their pledge. They are already too invested. You'll get nothing out of this thread, and this is a warning for the mentality of the people in this community, it's the "either you like it or you leave" mentality.

 

anyway, this is a trend that will stay, and i don't see any way out of it, the reason it happens is because the backers already invested their money and some of their time into this project, none of us want it to fail so it doesn't matter if Obsidian puts a price on the moon, they already caught they audience, you, me and all the rest who already paid something... now it's a money game where they try to grab a lit bit more money out of us, if it seems valuable to you, you don't see a problem in paying for a beta, if it isn't you feel jaded because you thought they considered you a bit special because you backed their project, well, in the way they see you, you are proportionally more valuable to Obsidian as more money you give to them

 

This could all be easily avoided if instead of calling this beta access this was early access, the difference between the two is that you in early access openly admit you are paying to play the game sooner even if it's still buggy, while beta you are supposed to help them finding and fixing problems

 

and this is were i'm with you OP:

 

IF... Obsidian wanted any of our help, they could simply asked for it, if they asking for money is because they don't need it... so this should never be called beta access

 

cheers, have a happy life... all of you