Dragon Age III / The Witcher 3 trailers. Impressions?

[Keyrock]

 

 

I wonder what's wrong with the people behind DA's graphics. They looked a generation behind everything else. CDP's modified Aurora engine looked equivalent or better than DA (without even going into its superior design). Comparisons between TW2 and DA2 aren't even worth going into.

 

You have the ME team on one hand doing a great job with graphical design, and the DA team making an game that's arguably uglier than almost any RPG released in the last half of the decade. Even MMO's like Age of Conan make DA look like a fan project. 

 

And why the obsession with the washed out reds and browns in the color palette?

While ME was far from cutting edge, I will agree that the difference in design quality between the two franchises (ME and DA) is quite noticeable.  Did they use the same engine for both series? (Unreal Engine?)

 

 

Notice I said "design", meaning artistic design, not commenting on the tech itself (which looked better than DA regardless).

 

Yup.  My question about engines used was separate from my comment on design, though I did a poor job of making that clear.

[Amentep]

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSKBh1eg-tA

 

I think he means that ?

 

Yeah that looks right

 

 

Ah...never chose that option there.

 

 

 

I think the idea - at least as I get it - is that this is a "doorway opened to the Fade in the Sky" as opposed to "magicians calling demons forth from the fade" or "mages being possessed by demons from the fade" which was the whole reason mages were feared and such.

What i don't like about this is that can become a cop out. " oh, a gate to the fade is open and we need the mages help to close it and templars to fight the demons. Let's unite and fight the archdemon Flemeth the BIGBAD.

The templar-mage war was the only element in any Bioware game in the last decade with no clear black and white solution, and i was curious how Bioware would deal with it.

 

 

Does seem like its an easy way to get out of that conflict; hopefully it won't be used as such.

[Hurlshort]

Whatever happened to the guy who posted a 90 minute video about how bad DA2 was?  I think he would have a lot to say about this stuff.  

[Zoraptor]

The Fade was one of the potentially better pieces of backstory in DAO, but it didn't really give much of a feeling of danger. Though that's a consequence of having so much combat and it being a long game as much as anything.

 

Day 1 Purchase^TM

 

For both titles, probably.

[NOK222]

Mal, we all know the Maker is actually behind everything and the final boss of the series.

 

On a serious note, I think the mage-templar part of the game (I'm assuming in order to rebuild the Inquisition, you'll need and or either) it's gonna be much like the Quarian-Geth part in ME3 (one of the only good written parts of the game). You CAN get them both, but it won't be easy.

Edited June 19, 2013 by NKKKK

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

Whatever happened to the guy who posted a 90 minute video about how bad DA2 was?  I think he would have a lot to say about this stuff.  

I think he is crusading against linear level design in PE mechanics. Someone should really nudge him to this thread...

[Nepenthe]

Whatever happened to the guy who posted a 90 minute video about how bad DA2 was?  I think he would have a lot to say about this stuff.  

 

Yeah, especially since I, a self-professed fan of Bioware and its games, depend on all these people with "no interest in Bioware", who are "never ever going to buy one of their games again" on receiving all my Bioware news in a timely fashion.

 

I do agree with Drowsy re: the art direction of DA2, it was a cluster****. I can't remember there being anything particularly wrong on that front in DAO, at least not anything that couldn't have been attributed to development hell. I'm cautiously optimistic that they'll manage to find (yet) another direction with DA3.

[HoonDing]

Whatever happened to the guy who posted a 90 minute video about how bad DA2 was?  I think he would have a lot to say about this stuff.  

He got hired by BioWare.

[BruceVC]

 

Whatever happened to the guy who posted a 90 minute video about how bad DA2 was?  I think he would have a lot to say about this stuff.  

 

Yeah, especially since I, a self-professed fan of Bioware and its games, depend on all these people with "no interest in Bioware", who are "never ever going to buy one of their games again" on receiving all my Bioware news in a timely fashion.

 

 

 

 

Very insightful comments my friend, very insightful.

 

And we both know all these "Bioware bashers" will be playing DA3 when it gets released

[Malekith]

 

 

Whatever happened to the guy who posted a 90 minute video about how bad DA2 was?  I think he would have a lot to say about this stuff.  

 

Yeah, especially since I, a self-professed fan of Bioware and its games, depend on all these people with "no interest in Bioware", who are "never ever going to buy one of their games again" on receiving all my Bioware news in a timely fashion.

 

 

 

 

And we both know all these "Bioware bashers" will be playing DA3 when it gets released

 

Fat chance. PE will be released few months before it

Chances are i will play DA:I (if i don't hear terrible things about it) , but it will be in a Steam sale. After all i played DA:O 2 years after it was released as well. I don't like modern games so much to purchase them in Day 1

[TrashMan]

 

 

What i don't like about this is that can become a cop out. " oh, a gate to the fade is open and we need the mages help to close it and templars to fight the demons. Let's unite and fight the archdemon Flemeth the BIGBAD.

 

The templar-mage war was the only element in any Bioware game in the last decade with no clear black and white solution, and i was curious how Bioware would deal with it.

 

If I were to make a guess, I'd say one faction will get the Cerberus treatment and go full incompetent evil.

 

Probably templars, because of name (negative conotations) and all this political correctness enforcement.

 

And if BioEAware does that s*** again then they are effectively dead to me.

 

 

***

 

On antoher note, the only problem I had with DA:O (graphics-wise at least), was the oversized hands. UGH. Ughly.

 

Edited June 19, 2013 by TrashMan

[TrashMan]

Can't see what exactly the danger is in an invasion from the Fade, demons and abominations in the last two games could be banished by the coughing of an asthmatic ninety year old. Unless they're aiming on blinding a vast majority of the populace through blurred textures.

 

Two words: Gameplay balance.

 

Becuase it doesnt' matter how powerfull someone is in the fluff, when you can't put it in-game like that or it will ruin everything.

 

In the DA book, a mage is *powerfull*.

Abominatiosn are terrifying.

 

But sinne this is a game, a group of 4 will be killing dragon and demons by the dozens, thus completley ruining their reputation for power and feel of danger.

 

Ya know...kinda like in the novels or some games, a Space Marine is a murder-death-machine that wipes out whole armies, but in the tabletop or some games are totally underwhelming.

[NOK222]

 

What i don't like about this is that can become a cop out. " oh, a gate to the fade is open and we need the mages help to close it and templars to fight the demons. Let's unite and fight the archdemon Flemeth the BIGBAD.

 

The templar-mage war was the only element in any Bioware game in the last decade with no clear black and white solution, and i was curious how Bioware would deal with it.

 

If I were to make a guess, I'd say one faction will get the Cerberus treatment and go full incompetent evil.

 

Probably templars, because of name (negative conotations) and all this political correctness enforcement.

 

And if BioEAware does that s*** again then they are effectively dead to me.

 

 

***

 

On antoher note, the only problem I had with DA:O (graphics-wise at least), was the oversized hands. UGH. Ughly.

 

I doubt that, for it's faults, DA 2 showed both sides pretty fairly.

[anubite]

http://www.vg247.com/2013/06/18/dragon-age-inquisitions-open-world-is-pretty-ambitious-says-bioware-gm/

 

BioWare will attempt to pull of a Skyrim - push out a buggy, shallow game with a huge open world and (hopefully) some mod tools. Modders will fix the mess for them and they'll get 8/10's and 9/10's like DA2 did, and the game will be labelled a success. If they're smart, they'll do better than Merril and introduce a new Tali to rope in some of the desperate types.

 

The best thing BioWare can do at this point is realize Dragon Age isn't an ARPG. There's a big difference from Path of Exile or Diablo and Baldur's Gate and I don't believe BioWare is capable of delivering something on the same level of quality as Torchlight or Path of Exile. You can't do Button=Awesome and you can't have "fast paced tactical combat" simeltaneously because that's a contradiction. It's either slow-paced tactical gameplay or it's button-mashing ARPG combat. You don't do both.

 

Will BioWare realize that? I honestly doubt it. 

Will BioWare realize a huge open world doesn't equate to a deep or engaging RPG experience?

Will BioWare design hallway-fest hyperlinear dungeons with spongey boss fights again? I assume so.

Will there be melodrama and gratuitious sex while underpining some vague notion of "pushing the medium foreward" (look guys, equal rights! Look at how progressive and modern our story is!!!)? Most assuredly.

Will we see ME4 or will the company dissolve after this game? It's too soon to tell, but a strong possibility considering EA's previous strategies. All it needs is a small financial crisis to justify it and poor sales from either title.

 

These are all my predictions. I'll eat my foot if any one of them is wrong.

Edited June 19, 2013 by anubite

[BruceVC]

http://www.vg247.com/2013/06/18/dragon-age-inquisitions-open-world-is-pretty-ambitious-says-bioware-gm/

 

BioWare will attempt to pull of a Skyrim - push out a buggy, shallow game with a huge open world and (hopefully) some mod tools. Modders will fix the mess for them and they'll get 8/10's and 9/10's like DA2 did, and the game will be labelled a success. If they're smart, they'll do better than Merril and introduce a new Tali to rope in some of the desperate types.

 

The best thing BioWare can do at this point is realize Dragon Age isn't an ARPG. There's a big difference from Path of Exile or Diablo and Baldur's Gate and I don't believe BioWare is capable of delivering something on the same level of quality as Torchlight or Path of Exile. You can't do Button=Awesome and you can't have "fast paced tactical combat" simeltaneously because that's a contradiction. It's either slow-paced tactical gameplay or it's button-mashing ARPG combat. You don't do both.

 

Will BioWare realize that? I honestly doubt it. 

Will BioWare realize a huge open world doesn't equate to a deep or engaging RPG experience?

Will BioWare design hallway-fest hyperlinear dungeons with spongey boss fights again? I assume so.

Will there be melodrama and gratuitious sex while underpining some vague notion of "pushing the medium foreward" (look guys, equal rights! Look at how progressive and modern our story is!!!)? Most assuredly.

Will we see ME4 or will the company dissolve after this game? It's too soon to tell, but a strong possibility considering EA's previous strategies. All it needs is a small financial crisis to justify it and poor sales from either title.

 

These are all my predictions. I'll eat my foot if any one of them is wrong.

 

It doesn't seem like you are a fan of the DA series anubite? Or am I misunderstanding you

[Keyrock]

http://www.vg247.com/2013/06/18/dragon-age-inquisitions-open-world-is-pretty-ambitious-says-bioware-gm/

 

BioWare will attempt to pull of a Skyrim - push out a buggy, shallow game with a huge open world and (hopefully) some mod tools. Modders will fix the mess for them and they'll get 8/10's and 9/10's like DA2 did, and the game will be labelled a success. If they're smart, they'll do better than Merril and introduce a new Tali to rope in some of the desperate types.

 

The best thing BioWare can do at this point is realize Dragon Age isn't an ARPG. There's a big difference from Path of Exile or Diablo and Baldur's Gate and I don't believe BioWare is capable of delivering something on the same level of quality as Torchlight or Path of Exile. You can't do Button=Awesome and you can't have "fast paced tactical combat" simeltaneously because that's a contradiction. It's either slow-paced tactical gameplay or it's button-mashing ARPG combat. You don't do both.

 

Will BioWare realize that? I honestly doubt it. 

Will BioWare realize a huge open world doesn't equate to a deep or engaging RPG experience?

Will BioWare design hallway-fest hyperlinear dungeons with spongey boss fights again? I assume so.

Will there be melodrama and gratuitious sex while underpining some vague notion of "pushing the medium foreward" (look guys, equal rights! Look at how progressive and modern our story is!!!)? Most assuredly.

Will we see ME4 or will the company dissolve after this game? It's too soon to tell, but a strong possibility considering EA's previous strategies. All it needs is a small financial crisis to justify it and poor sales from either title.

 

These are all my predictions. I'll eat my foot if any one of them is wrong.

While I have lost much faith in BioWare, my outlook isn't nearly as bleak for the game or BioWare for that matter.  While I have come to terms with the fact that the BioWare that made the Baldur's Gate games is gone forever, I do think they can still make good games.  With that said, I'm firmly in "show me don't tell me" and "let others be the guinea pig" modes for DA3, or anything else BioWare puts out for that matter.  If after it has come out people are singing its praises (and not just paid off "reviewers" like IGN and such, but people I know and trust that have similar tastes as me) then I may well get it.  Until then, I'll remain cautious and weary.

[HoonDing]

It will be a fun game.

[NOK222]

While this will sabotage my efforts to get unbanned from BSN. I want to share this with you guys.
 

TL;DR David Gaider uses the Misogyny defense to shield criticism for Morrigan's look. 

[Gfted1]

Laf. What a jerky way to reply to people.

[HoonDing]

I thought David Gaider had left BSN?

[NOK222]

Hey I think I her jawline looks a bit weird and not consistent with her previous looks. 

 

Wait...I'm sorry, that was Da Patriarchy talking through sad misogynist me. 

[Tale]

I've seen the criticism against Morrigan's new look, and he's not wrong.

 

He's not entirely right either. It's not just misogyny, there's just a general pettiness out there towards anything Bioware. Misogyny is just a common tool in that particular box. There's not a lot of good signal to read in that feedback.

 

Full disclaimer: I actually like the look. So I may be biased.

[Malekith]

 there's just a general pettiness out there towards anything Bioware.

In BSN?  I can understand it here or in Witcher forums or RPGCodex, but Bioware's own forum isn't supposed to be Bioware fans?

[Tale]

 

there's just a general pettiness out there towards anything Bioware.

In BSN?  I can understand it here or in Witcher forums or RPGCodex, but Bioware's own forum isn't supposed to be Bioware fans?

 

Who do you think would be most disappointed with Bioware's recent titles if not their fans?

 

The ones with the greatest hope are often those hit the hardest by bitter disappointment.

[Amentep]

Hey I think I her jawline looks a bit weird and not consistent with her previous looks. 

 

Wait...I'm sorry, that was Da Patriarchy talking through sad misogynist me. 

 

I didn't think Morrigan or Varric looked like they looked in their previous games.

 

That said, I'm not really sure its an issue for me either.