Baldur's Gate enhanced edition

[BruceVC]

Gamebanshee slams BGEE in every possible way:

 

http://gamebanshee.c...ion-review.html

 

Incredible how they broke a game that was almost bug free and stable.

 

I read the GB review and it doesn't slam the game in every way, they do recognize improvements in aspects like the Journal and he says the new characters and some quests are a welcome addition.

 

But I do agree its not a great endorsement. It looks like I won't be playing the game until the first patch gets released.

[bussinrounds]

Eh, I like the more tactical/chess like combat that turn based gives you. Seeing each characters/creatures actions play out as they happen, instead a chaotic mess with lights flashing across the screen, which leaves my thinking...wtf just happened ? Getting all the feedback as it takes place, instead of having to scroll back in the battle log to find out..wtf just happened? Having the control over my characters and knowing where they're going, instead of relying on pathetic pathfinding/having to pause constantly and babysit/redirect them. Don't get me wrong, there can be crappy TB combat also, but when done right, I'll take it over a RtwP system in a party based RPG any and every day.

 

As far as real time (without pause) action rpgs go, I'm not saying they shouldn't exist and have no place at all, but we have so many games with this type of gameplay anyway, do we really need all these supposed "RPGs" to adopt the the same style of relying on the players twitch skills and reactions over character skills & stats ? And besides, most all of these action RPGs have crap gameplay and aren't nearly as good as true action games anyway (except for the rare exception like Dark Souls, say) It almost feels like the weak RPG mechanics are sort of an excuse for the bad combat and vice versa. The standard of combat isn't very high in action RPGs, but on the other hand there are rarely deep RPG mechanics in action games either. Like VD said..."an action game for casual gamers sold as an RPG! Brilliant! Why brilliant? Well, any complaints about the action elements would be met with "It's an RPG! Duh!", while any complaints about the RPG elements would be met with "It's not your grandpa's RPG with die rolls and skill checks. It's an action game! For next generation! Duh!"

 

 

It's the lack of diversity and homogenization that has been killing this industry in the first place.

[Volourn]

"Bioware rightly realized at the time that it was a stupid limitation to impose on a computer game. And subsequent games, theirs and others have cut what little was left of that system."

 

Oh, please,. You make it sound like BIo came to some genious relaiztion that TB DnD doesn't work in video games. They did no such thing. The IE was deisgned for an RTS before they knew theyw ere doing a DnD GAME. On top of that, there have been plenty of TB Dnd games that have been fantastic and done well just like there's been non TB DnD games that did crap.

 

This stupid Tb vs RT argument is lame no matter what direction one argues in favor of.

[Drowsy Emperor]

"Bioware rightly realized at the time that it was a stupid limitation to impose on a computer game. And subsequent games, theirs and others have cut what little was left of that system."

 

Oh, please,. You make it sound like BIo came to some genious relaiztion that TB DnD doesn't work in video games. They did no such thing. The IE was deisgned for an RTS before they knew theyw ere doing a DnD GAME. On top of that, there have been plenty of TB Dnd games that have been fantastic and done well just like there's been non TB DnD games that did crap.

 

This stupid Tb vs RT argument is lame no matter what direction one argues in favor of.

 

It doesn't matter whether they did it on purpose, by accident or ****ing Zeus intervened. The point was that turn based was dead and left to fanatics and JRPG's of which the latter imploded after the PS2 era.

DnD is a tabletop ruleset that makes no sense in a fully interactive 3D computer game. That's why the big RPG's of this generation are games like Mass Effect (which I still detest) and not any tabletop based, rules strict games.

 

Progressive RPG's that is, not spreadsheet simulators like WoW.

[Oner]

I remember a wonderful scene in NWN when my character couldn't attack for three turns, because the turn was over by the time the 3 enemies finished their attack animations and me my dodge moves.

 

And then I died.

[Volourn]

"It doesn't matter whether they did it on purpose, by accident or ****ing Zeus intervened. The point was that turn based was dead and left to fanatics and JRPG's of which the latter imploded after the PS2 era.

DnD is a tabletop ruleset that makes no sense in a fully interactive 3D computer game. That's why the big RPG's of this generation are games like Mass Effect (which I still detest) and not any tabletop based, rules strict games.

 

Progressive RPG's that is, not spreadsheet simulators like WoW. "

 

You are posting gibberish. Nothing what you wrote makes any sense,. Even my constant typos make more sense.

 

 

 

"I remember a wonderful scene in NWN when my character couldn't attack for three turns, because the turn was over by the time the 3 enemies finished their attack animations and me my dodge moves.

 

And then I died"

 

All the hours I've put into NWN, I've never seen this happen. *shrug*

[Hiro Protagonist II]

Gamebanshee slams BGEE in every possible way:

 

http://gamebanshee.c...ion-review.html

 

Incredible how they broke a game that was almost bug free and stable.

 

I wouldn't say they slammed it. They mentioned the good and bad of BGEE. It's a fair, balanced and honest review which is a rare ocurrence these days from game reviewers. I completely agree with the review.

 

A poster on the BG forums has accused the review of bias and alleges that it's someone from RPGCodex that has written the review. Quote from the guy at BG Forums http://forum.baldurs...#Comment_165842

 

I smell bias.

 

Aren't also some of the GB members part of the RPGCodex as well, where vitriol is the only thing used for BG:EE? Short answer is yes, they are, and some are trashing it there as well.

 

Regardless of what people think of the game, people over there were biased about this EVEN BEFORE more info was known. They were searching for stuff to troll about, and now they have some reasons.

 

I have substiancial hints that this is a RPGCodex vitrioled review written more politely.

 

 

 

I've been playing it over the weekend and it's interesting to note that:

 

1. the new NPC (Dorn) encounter when you meet him before the Nashkel Mines. When you defeat the ambush, one of the enemy is wearing an Elven Chain armour but doesn't drop it. So there's a new Eleven Chain armour in the game but the encounter is bugged and doesn't drop the armour.

2. According to the BG forums, huge problems with Rasaad's dialogue when you have him in your party after 10 days.

 

I've only encountered the Dorn encounter and the armour didn't drop for me. I've stayed clear of Rasaad because of all the problems that have been reported at the BG forums. Disappointing that the new content they added is also bugged.

 

Some things they enhanced for the game:

The two Rings of Wizardry don't stack. So no more ~20 magic missiles for your mage.

The Ankheg Armor stacks with Rings of protection.

[Lord of Lost Socks]

I'm wondering about the sorcerer class. Is its stats fixed from BGII? Or does it still lack a primary stat?

 

What should I focus on if I rolled one?

[Zoraptor]

The guy who wrote the GB review does post at the Codex though complaining about that is as silly as blaming /v or the codex for negative reactions to DA2. Every GB review I've ever read has been quality even if I haven't always agreed with them, and the chances of them writing a review to garner Kodex Kool Kredits is... negligible.

[Azure79]

Is there new character interaction? Like old NPCs voicing their opinions on key events and such.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

I thought the review was very balanced. The major flaw it stated(bugs) is something that has been widely reported in BGEE. Whether this is because of Overhaul/Beamdog laziness, or just something that happens when a game is release(almost every modern game released now has some pretty horrible bugs in my experience) will be determined when a patch is released. I would advise anyone who has not yet downloaded BGEE to wait about a month until a few patches have been released to correct the worst of the bugs.

[Volourn]

"Every GB review I've ever read has been quality"

 

L0L :D

[Zoraptor]

They do, of course, pale into insignificance compared to the quality of your reviews Volo. But they're good enough for mere mortals.

[Bartimaeus]

Is there new character interaction? Like old NPCs voicing their opinions on key events and such.

 

Yes. They found every old voice actor that worked on the game over 14 years ago and had them record additional lines.

 

 

I'm wondering about the sorcerer class. Is its stats fixed from BGII? Or does it still lack a primary stat?

 

What should I focus on if I rolled one?

 

1. Sorcerer still lacks a primary stat.

2. In my humble opinion, get constitution up to 16, (max bonus HP per level for nonfighter classes), dexterity up 18 or 19, (if you're an elf), and make your other stats balanced. Wisdom/Intelligence/Charisma all at 12 or so, IMO. Then rest into strength.

 

@Turn-based vs. Real Time With Pausing: Thank goodness it was real time. Would never have played it otherwise.

@BG:EE itself: The game mostly works fine. There's no game-breaking or crash-making bugs that I am aware of yet unless you run with an Intel onboard GPU, (in which case, the game doesn't work at all, thanks to Intel's lack of proper OpenGL drivers for those chips). But there are a bunch of normal bugs, which should hopefully be fixed in the coming week(s).

Edited December 3, 2012 by Bartimaeus

[Nepenthe]

~~ But if the plan was, "How do we take this IP we have access to and make it salable to the 'ADD' generation; streamline it, trim down the verbosity, and up the pacing of it...

I was about to call total bull**** on this, but it's true - they did up the pacing. The walk speed is now the same as in BG2, ie. faster than in BG1.

 

Apart from that, it's still bull****, though.

 

As for bugs: This was released last week, look at the amount of fixes that are still necessary for vanilla bg (ok, it's probably a lot less than bg2, but...). I'm still cutting these guys a lot of slack, because based on the couple of hours I got in over the weekend, they did a pretty good thing. Not perfect, but nobody touching a game as pedestalised as BG would ever manage perfect, anyway.

[BruceVC]

They do, of course, pale into insignificance compared to the quality of your reviews Volo. But they're good enough for mere mortals.

 

I also agree that the GB reviews are generally balanced, helpful and objective.

[Hiro Protagonist II]

Apparently the cinematic at the end has been pulled from the game and replaced with nothing. So it goes Defeat Sarevok > Instant Main Menu.

 

Just for those that want to see the original end cinematic

 

[Nepenthe]

Apparently the cinematic at the end has been pulled from the game and replaced with nothing. So it goes Defeat Sarevok > Instant Main Menu.

Ok, that is ****ing terrible.

[Lorfean]

If that is true and working as intended (which would be a completely baffling decision on their part) and not the result of some bug, then I would like to know how many new cinematics they actually made for the EE? So far I have only seen the intro and Friendly Arm Inn ones, and know that most of the other originals -- Beregost, Nashkel, Gnoll Stronghold, Duchal Palace, Candlekeep Library, Durlag's Tower, etc. -- have been removed without replacement... Are there any other cinematics in the EE aside from the intro and the FAI?

Edited December 3, 2012 by Lorfean

[Bartimaeus]

I was about to call total bull**** on this, but it's true - they did up the pacing. The walk speed is now the same as in BG2, ie. faster than in BG1.

 

That's nonsense, of course. Walk speeds are the same as pre-BG2, (i.e. BG1). It's actually painfully slow. I would've wished for BG2 walk speeds, except that all the other non-(demi)humans should also get a speed increase in order to make it fair, (which they didn't in BG2). Thank God for Boots of Speed.

 

@Lorfean: They did make a new mine flooding one, which actually looks good, (I didn't think the intro/Friendly Arm Inn ones did). Resting one looks decent. There's no Inn resting scene, nor Nashkel; haven't gotten far enough to get to the Duchal Palace/Candlekeep Library/Durlag's Tower to comment, however. Also haven't see the Gnoll Stronghold, if there is one, because I haven't bothered to go there yet.

 

(edit) Just went to Baldur's Gate for you, (was exploring all the wilderness areas): there is a Baldur's Gate one. It's not...bad, in my estimation, but not very good, either. It seems to me that they sort of fall apart whenever the camera moves or there's supposed to be any sort of real action...(hence the failure of the intro and Friendly Arm Inn, especially compared to the originals, whereas the resting and flood cinematic seem pretty good).

 

(edit again) No Durlag's Tower or Gnoll Stronghold, either. So you're right there, too.

Edited December 3, 2012 by Bartimaeus

[Lorfean]

Thanks Bartimaeus, I didn't know about the mine flooding one. I'm pretty sure the ones I listed were already confirmed to have been removed without replacements btw.

 

Something else that I see being reported on the official forums now is that several minor enemies, such as Bassilus (the insane Cleric with an army of resurrected relatives) and Nimbul (the assassin that attacks you outside the Nashkel Inn after you return from the mines), are missing their original opening dialog audio files. Stuff like Bassilus saying "Oh brother Thurm, why not grace our ears with a ripping tale of the old days! Always a delight!" and Nimbul's line "I am death, come for thee. Surrender, and thy passage shall be… quicker."

[Tigranes]

So... yeah. The Real Baldur's Gate has been working great for the last 14 years, if anyone actually wants to play.

 

 

As for bugs: This was released last week, look at the amount of fixes that are still necessary for vanilla bg (ok, it's probably a lot less than bg2, but...). I'm still cutting these guys a lot of slack, because based on the couple of hours I got in over the weekend, they did a pretty good thing. Not perfect, but nobody touching a game as pedestalised as BG would ever manage perfect, anyway.

 

They could do exactly the same things they did to BG to Lionheart and it would still not be worth the money. It was clear that they didn't have the resources, direction, or the competence to make any 'enhancements' that could really wow anyone that's ever tried BG mods.

[Bartimaeus]

Yes...I remember Bassilus' audio for that line missing, though I thought Nimbul's was intact. Perhaps that's just poor memory, though. I'm pretty sure that's probably the result of some bug occurring, though, not them actually taking the lines out. That'd be terrible if they actually did take them out, since they obviously had no plans to replace any audio lines, whereas it at least sort of makes sense for movies, because the style would be extremely inconsistent. Too bad my DLTCEP, (Infinity Engine game editor), isn't working correctly with BG:EE - it refuses to play any sound at all, even ones that I know are there. However, I checked into the creature files, and the sounds are still being referenced to play, (line "Heh hurh heh! Oh, brother Thurm, why not grace our ears with a ripping tale of the old days! Always a delight!" should be playing BASSL01, but it doesn't appear to be working in game - don't know if that's because the sound is not present, or whether they introduced a new engine bug, or...), so I'm not completely sure what's going on. The lines will be no doubt restored pretty sharpish, however, regardless of the cause, given the amount of complaints on the forums.

 

(edit for the rest of you) As far as I can see, the release actually offers more for modders than players - though, hopefully, that should translate for it being more for players as more mods are introduced. As I understand, a load of stuff was unhardcoded, (I have no idea what, not being much of a real modder), which should make things a lot easier to mod or make some things actually possible whereas they weren't previously. I just hear modders like Ascension64, (ToBEx creator, essentially my lord and master), praise BG:EE just because of the things they did on a coding level, even if things aren't looking great on a content level. So...we'll see.

 

As for me, I hope they fix the content-level stuff and get around to BG2:EE. I really, really wish they hadn't introduced 3 new party members, or the Black Pits, as I feel that they were the two most unprofessional things they did to the game. The game is supposed to be "Enhanced", not "shove mod-quality content down your customers' throats while breaking other things". Pfah. Not that it matters to much to me, anyways, as I'll probably be disabling any area references made to the new party members to begin with, (i.e. disabling their appearance in-game at all). I've always hated NPC mods.

Edited December 3, 2012 by Bartimaeus

[Nepenthe]

I was about to call total bull**** on this, but it's true - they did up the pacing. The walk speed is now the same as in BG2, ie. faster than in BG1.

 

That's nonsense, of course. Walk speeds are the same as pre-BG2, (i.e. BG1). It's actually painfully slow. I would've wished for BG2 walk speeds, except that all the other non-(demi)humans should also get a speed increase in order to make it fair, (which they didn't in BG2). Thank God for Boots of Speed.

Seems faster to me. Must be old age catching up.

 

You sure it doesn't just seem that way to you because you're seeing more of the level?

Edited December 3, 2012 by Nepenthe

[Bartimaeus]

Seems faster to me. Must be old age catching up.

 

You sure it doesn't just seem that way to you because you're seeing more of the level?

 

You'll have to forgive me, for I was wrong...but then again, so were you. :D I had forgotten how *truly* slow BG1 walkspeeds were. But, similarly, you forgot how fast BG2 walkspeeds were.

 

Time Test: (From Candlekeep Inn door to the steps up to the Temple of Oghma at 30FPS for each game; from the click to the moment the character gets there, as well as making sure the character doesn't bump into any patrolling guards)

BG1: 31-32 seconds

BG2: 20-21 seconds

BG:EE: 25-26 seconds

 

Looks like they went smack in between the two speeds. I recorded the results via Fraps, but don't have the inclination to upload the videos right now. Maybe in a little bit. Still wish they would've just systemically upped the speeds of everything. If creatures went at speed 5, they should've went at 10. If they went at speed 4, they should've went at 8 or 9, (probably 9, to maintain balance for slower creatures). Et cetera. But that's just me. I feel as though BG2 walkspeeds are still too slow at default FPS - at 40-45, it's the best, IMO. I have no patience for walking around.

Edited December 3, 2012 by Bartimaeus