Obsidain why you lie to us?

[oldmanpaco]

Actually, I was thinking of the way Freedom Force did it (inactive heroes got less XP, but still got some) but carry on. Clearly it's impossible to make a good RPG that isn't a clone of Baldur's Gate, so I bow to your superior knowledge.

The Freedom Force way is better I agree.

 

 

And I'm not saying that BG/PS:T/IWD are the only way to make an RPG. But wasn't the whole project pitch about making a new IE experience?

 

Truth in advertising people!

[nikolokolus]

Good to see hyperbole isn't dead.

[Troller]

One of the important things that they gotta have in the game IMO is the choice to play the game solo, or maybe with just one or two companions, and of course give way more XP if you are soloing all the monsters

[oldmanpaco]

The party size is an issue. The IE games had 6 members. The 6 member party was iconic in RPGs before the decline.

 

5 Companions + 1 PC= 6 man party.

 

BG1: 25 Companions

BG2: 17 Companions

PS:T: 7 Companions (but they were all awesome)

IWD2: 15 Companions

[Fluid29]

Maybe we all wait a little bit more for info from the developers before starting to panic

[oldmanpaco]

I count 8 companions if we get all the stretch goals. I don't mind having fewer companions if it means they will be very in depth story wise. 6 is fine for party size.

 

It's been pointed out that maybe they always indented for 8 companions and now that they look to be assured of reaching several million in backing they put them in there for show. But 8 is sure better than 5.

[oldmanpaco]

Maybe we all wait a little bit more for info from the developers before starting to panic

 

I'm not panicking. I said in the OP that they devs needed to clarify things before the drive is done. This whole secrecy thing is tired and old. Are they saving the facts for their exclusive interview with PCGamer?

 

Is PCGamer even still in business? Because if they are not then MCA and Josh really need to rethink this strategy.

Edited September 16, 2012 by oldmanpaco

[oldmanpaco]

One of the important things that they gotta have in the game IMO is the choice to play the game solo, or maybe with just one or two companions, and of course give way more XP if you are soloing all the monsters

 

I agree. Forced companions are just as bad as not enough companions.

[Hurlshort]

Companions, and really all content, cost money. For a million bucks you are only going to get so much content. I expect this game to be awesome, but I don't expect it to be gigantic.

[Metabot]

How many companions do you need? Aren't you one of those rpgcodex retar*s?

Edited September 16, 2012 by Metabot

[BruceVC]

I canceled my pledge after reading the stretch goals. I'm not normally a hater (as the kids say) but the stink of bioware is all over this project.

 

1) Only 5 companions. That means you need to take them all with you if you have a 6 person party. Worked in PS:T but that was a RPG unlike any other.

2) Only 5 classes. Unless there are 'kits' like BG this limits the diversity of the party and NPCs. Best option is like Diablo with skill paths to differentiate the players. Oh joy.

3) They are not even man enough to call it a stronghold. They call it a house. Maybe we can have tea parties there.

4) They say companions can stay relax at said house. This implies a crappy 'camp' mechanic, small party sizes and ****ty everyone gets XP even if they are not in the active party.

5) The whole soul crap is gong to be incredible forced. Without knowing anything about it besides it having something to do with the magic system I can tell it's going to be a construct shoved down our thoats.

6) The magic system is going to be stupid. See number 5.

 

Right now I'm afraid they think the IE games just means isometric perceptive. Jesus have they even confirmed it will have painted 2D background? I really hope I'm wrong but right now this is not the BG/IWD/PS:T we were promised.

 

 

And if anyone says that I am just guessing right now you are correct. I would loooooove for Obsidian to actually tell us what they are planning. Am I completely wrong? Am I right? It's not like it's some sort of state secret. The W2 Kickstarter was about 100% better at communicating what they were trying to build. Obsidian seems like they are playing those of us who want another IE experience.

 

Seriously Oldmanpaco

 

I have no issue with constructive criticism or someone who wants to discuss issues. But do you know how stupid your post makes you look?

• You start with a belligerent and annoying title. The game was only announced days ago and some of your points are speculation
  
• You then claim you won't fund the game but expect answers, and yet you have the audacity to claim you aren't one of those "haters" and "kids"
  
• Why don't you stand by your convictions, leave the forum and find another RPG. After all Obsidian lied to you and this type of reaction is perfectly understandable?
  

 

How do you expect people who think logically and rationally to react to your petulant outburst?

Seriously...WTF

[Nakia]

As for stronghold vs house I was not aware that Obsidian initially promised us a stronghold. So I see no broken promises there. In fact I see no false advertising or broken promises. Before I made my pledge I watched the video read about what they aware planning. Having played quite a few of the games made by Obsidian I have faith in them. In fact I date back to Black Isle Studios. You want hype and broken promises? Go to DA:O and DA2, go to Skyrim.

 

We are backers and backers take a gamble. No game is perfect because you can't make everyone happy. We each have different likes and dislikes. At least this game is being made for PC players. Too bad if the console players get left out but I am very happy that I will get a game made for the machine I use and prefer.

 

At the moment I have no idea how they will handle the class system. As for magic I have yet to play one I really like. Skill perks? Again I have not been that happy with any I have played.

 

The main things I want in the game are: A good story, fun quests, interesting companions with good dialogue who interact with each other, challenging battles and puzzles. I don't want my hand held, I don't want to be treated like a numskull, I want to need to think, to use strategy. I want to have fun and be entertained.

 

If Obsidian could make a game like Planescape/Torment I have trust in them. I also enjoyed Fallout NV. IWD I & II, Arcanum. Probably left something out.

 

Also, if someone decides to withdraw their pledge that is their right but please this is a fan site, official fan site, We are free to speculate, to make suggestions, to discuss. Bashing the game before it is off the drawing boards is bad manners. It is counterproductive.

[oldmanpaco]

How many companions do you need? Aren't you one of those rpgcodex retar*s?

 

Spoken like a codex reta*d.

 

Seriously who are you?

Edited September 16, 2012 by oldmanpaco

[gaqzi]

And I'm not saying that BG/PS:T/IWD are the only way to make an RPG. But wasn't the whole project pitch about making a new IE experience?

 

Truth in advertising people!

 

So what is the IE experience in your mind?

They're making their own IP so they can't exactly copy the game mechanics from D&D based games straight off.

 

Personally I'm hoping for some great characters, largely dialog based game. A game that isn't just another ugly 3D-game that is dumbed down for the FPS players on a Xbox and want to seem deep by playing RPGs.

 

So I'm one of those that hopes this game will take many queues from the game play of Planescape: Torment, probably the best game I've played.

Edited September 16, 2012 by gaqzi

[alanschu]

Actually, I was thinking of the way Freedom Force did it (inactive heroes got less XP, but still got some) but carry on. Clearly it's impossible to make a good RPG that isn't a clone of Baldur's Gate, so I bow to your superior knowledge.

The Freedom Force way is better I agree.

 

 

And I'm not saying that BG/PS:T/IWD are the only way to make an RPG. But wasn't the whole project pitch about making a new IE experience?

 

Truth in advertising people!

 

 

So it's too different than Planescape: Torment?

 

 

PS:T: 7 Companions (but they were all awesome)

 

I love this qualifier....

Edited September 16, 2012 by alanschu

[Freddo]

The 6 member party was iconic in RPGs before the decline.

Not really. Most CRPGs from the 90s, like Eye of the Beholder, Might & Magic and so on, "only" allowed for 4 member parties. Which I also think is a much more reasonable number.

 

Also, I hope the companions in this game will have a brain and will be able to equip their own armor and stuff and don't need to tell them to wear socks every morning. I hate all that inventory micro management. I take care of my business and they take care of theirs.

[oldmanpaco]

I canceled my pledge after reading the stretch goals. I'm not normally a hater (as the kids say) but the stink of bioware is all over this project.

 

1) Only 5 companions. That means you need to take them all with you if you have a 6 person party. Worked in PS:T but that was a RPG unlike any other.

2) Only 5 classes. Unless there are 'kits' like BG this limits the diversity of the party and NPCs. Best option is like Diablo with skill paths to differentiate the players. Oh joy.

3) They are not even man enough to call it a stronghold. They call it a house. Maybe we can have tea parties there.

4) They say companions can stay relax at said house. This implies a crappy 'camp' mechanic, small party sizes and ****ty everyone gets XP even if they are not in the active party.

5) The whole soul crap is gong to be incredible forced. Without knowing anything about it besides it having something to do with the magic system I can tell it's going to be a construct shoved down our thoats.

6) The magic system is going to be stupid. See number 5.

 

Right now I'm afraid they think the IE games just means isometric perceptive. Jesus have they even confirmed it will have painted 2D background? I really hope I'm wrong but right now this is not the BG/IWD/PS:T we were promised.

 

 

And if anyone says that I am just guessing right now you are correct. I would loooooove for Obsidian to actually tell us what they are planning. Am I completely wrong? Am I right? It's not like it's some sort of state secret. The W2 Kickstarter was about 100% better at communicating what they were trying to build. Obsidian seems like they are playing those of us who want another IE experience.

 

Seriously Oldmanpaco

 

I have no issue with constructive criticism or someone who wants to discuss issues. But do you know how stupid your post makes you look?

• You start with a belligerent and annoying title. The game was only announced days ago and some of your points are speculation
  
• You then claim you won't fund the game but expect answers, and yet you have the audacity to claim you aren't one of those "haters" and "kids"
  
• Why don't you stand by your convictions, leave the forum and find another RPG. After all Obsidian lied to you and this type of reaction is perfectly understandable?
  

How do you expect people who think logically and rationally to react to your petulant outburst?

Seriously...WTF

 

Yeah Yeah. Like I said earlier I copied a post from a much more belligerent site because I couldn't be bothered to make a family friendly one. My mistake.

That being said Obsidian 'promised' us all a throwback game to the IE days. And stretch goals are still part of the deal.

 

I

[salty]

Dear Obsi-DISDAIN, how you do this lieing to us? Promise us a well-written, classic RPG on a tiny budget, and then you dare to focus on giving a few options with all your love and attention rather than 50 shallow choices? This won't stand, I am upping my pledge to get more things!

[aVENGER]

Only 5 classes. Unless there are 'kits' like BG this limits the diversity of the party and NPCs. Best option is like Diablo with skill paths to differentiate the players. Oh joy.

 

Personally, I'd much rather have a smaller number of distinctive and properly developed classes than a huge number of unbalanced kits/prestige classes. Take BG2 as an example. While the kits did bring a lot of flavor to the game most of them were not balanced properly, both against each other and against the core classes. Ideally, I'd like a small number of classes, but have several distinctive specialization paths for each one, i.e. similar to Diablo 2, but more complex.

 

They say companions can stay relax at said house. This implies a crappy 'camp' mechanic, small party sizes and ****ty everyone gets XP even if they are not in the active party.

 

Over the years, I've come to appreciate this design approach. Although it does require a bit of suspension of disbelief, it basically saves players the trouble of mindless grinding just to level up a rarely used companion.

[oldmanpaco]

PS:T: 7 Companions (but they were all awesome)

 

I love this qualifier....

 

Well PS:T is probably he greatest RPG ever made. If the NPCs in this game are even half as good as PS:T's were I will apologize for my outburst.

[oldmanpaco]

Dear Obsi-DISDAIN, how you do this lieing to us? Promise us a well-written, classic RPG on a tiny budget, and then you dare to focus on giving a few options with all your love and attention rather than 50 shallow choices? This won't stand, I am upping my pledge to get more things!

 

Well you're just being mean now.

Edited September 16, 2012 by oldmanpaco

[Longknife]

Dear Obsi-DISDAIN, how you do this lieing to us?

 

Off-topic, but I will never understand how people consider those little pun-names to be clever or witty.

I just always picture some guy in a nerdy outfit going "OOOOOOOOOOOOH ~~ He just pointed out the similarities between the sound of your name and the sound of a word with a negative connotation!! BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURN!"

[alanschu]

Well PS:T is probably he greatest RPG ever made. If the NPCs in this game are even half as good as PS:T's were I will apologize for my outburst.

 

 

Agreed. Look who made that game. Look who's making this one.

[Oerwinde]

PS:T: 7 Companions (but they were all awesome)

 

I love this qualifier....

 

Well PS:T is probably he greatest RPG ever made. If the NPCs in this game are even half as good as PS:T's were I will apologize for my outburst.

 

They did say that they wanted the story and characters to be as deep and engaging as PS:T, hence putting their focus on fewer companions. PS:T also only had 3 classes and one race, so they're going a step up with this giving us 5 classes and 3 races.

 

I do think if they want to attract more people, tossing out a bit of concept art and a few more ideas of the direction they want to take in terms of story and characters would be a good idea. Give a bit of an example of what they want it to look like, even if its just a concept mock up someone did in a day or two, covered in disclaimers of course. Right now basically we're going on "IE games were awesome, we want something like that, give us money" I have enjoyed everything Obsidian has done, even back to the guys at Troika and Black Isle, so I have complete faith in whatever it is their vague promises are aiming at, but others don't have the same faith.

[Stun]

Not gonna comment about the companion and classes stuff because frankly, I really don't care at the moment, since they've given us zero information.

 

But this, I will:

3) They are not even man enough to call it a stronghold. They call it a house. Maybe we can have tea parties there.

Honestly, this makes me happy. I'd prefer a house over a stronghold. I want a good old fashioned cabin in the woods, actually. The term "stronghold" projects a high profile vibe, like my character is a general, or a "captian". I'm kinda sick of that. I just want to be an adventurer.

 

6) The magic system is going to be stupid. See number 5.

I assume you're coming to the conclusion that magic will be tied to our "souls", and thus you feel that such a mechanic is going to feel forced and contrived? I don't know about that. From what miniscule information we have, I'm getting the impression that mages in this game will be akin to Sorcerers in the old D&D games. if so, count me among the giddy. I LOVED playing sorcerers in the IE games.

Edited September 16, 2012 by Stun