Spellcasting system vs. Sleep spamming

[Virgil]

I hate those idea that you have to sleep.

 

I think Obsidian is capable of inventing great spell system, for example I liked DA:O spell system a lot, you had cool down as well as mana = less powerful spells were very useful and it was great from tactical standpoint.

[Freddo]

The sleep to gain spells system from DnD is one of the main reasons why I feel the DnD ruleset is horribly unfit for a computer RPG and not something I want to see here.

 

The ruleset is easily the thing I dislike the most in BG, Planescape: Torment and so on.

[Moonlight Butterfly]

What about if you could only relearn spells out of combat. So you would have a fight then afterwards your mages prepare their spells ready to fling. It's not perfect but it eliminates imagining your mage whining that he needs a nap every five minutes

Edited September 18, 2012 by Moonlight Butterfly

[fan]

I'd like

 

- always available spells

- no mana

- no resting while exploring

- casting times

- cumulative exhaustion from casting

 

When mages get fatigued, their overall effectiveness (spells do less damage, mages become more vulnerable etc.) decreases. This happens with each spell they cast. Only rare items or a good night's sleep regenerates the exhaustion.

 

The same should be true for physical characters and their abilities. When using abilities, they get tired and more vulnerable to attacks.

Edited September 18, 2012 by fan

[Elerond]

In my opinion best magic system is one where you don't have mana bar, cooldown or number of spell what you can cast in one day. In my opinion best magic systems are those where you can cast unlimited numbers of spell, but spells take their time to be cast.

 

For example if we you combat phases and magic levels then level 1 spells would take 2 phases to cast, second level spells would take 3 or 4 phases and so on. This of course will drop casting rate of high level spells what is it purpose. But there should also be compensating system, which gives you limited number of fast use spells for example mage can bind spell on item/rune/etc. where he/she can invoke it instanly but is one use only. Or sytem could be some soul based, like your mage can store your enemies souls in his/her staff/wand/crystal ball/etc. and invoking spell instantly eats one or more souls depending on factors, which could be spell level, spell's range, spell's area effect and etc.. In this system mages can be very powerful and they could have battle ending spells, but they need rest of the party protect them while they cast that powerful spell and in end game mage has ability to invoke several spells instantly so he/she will not never change as hinderence for the party.

 

And if you want system where adventure party can get tired then create stamina system, where fights/running around/casting/etc. slowly eats yours partys stamina to zero when you must rest.

[Paul D]

I thought sleep was necessary because of Mana's intrinsic link to Intelligence (ergo: the Brain). This game is suggesting a construct as the soul. Perhaps the soul can be regenerated through meditation, praying, chanting, whatever. The connection isn't intelligence (although useful to learn complex spell constructs I am sure), but the health of the soul. These things still take "time-out" to regenerate, but it does't involve sleep.

[DCParry]

In my opinion best magic system is one where you don't have mana bar, cooldown or number of spell what you can cast in one day. In my opinion best magic systems are those where you can cast unlimited numbers of spell, but spells take their time to be cast.

 

For example if we you combat phases and magic levels then level 1 spells would take 2 phases to cast, second level spells would take 3 or 4 phases and so on. This of course will drop casting rate of high level spells what is it purpose. But there should also be compensating system, which gives you limited number of fast use spells for example mage can bind spell on item/rune/etc. where he/she can invoke it instanly but is one use only. Or sytem could be some soul based, like your mage can store your enemies souls in his/her staff/wand/crystal ball/etc. and invoking spell instantly eats one or more souls depending on factors, which could be spell level, spell's range, spell's area effect and etc.. In this system mages can be very powerful and they could have battle ending spells, but they need rest of the party protect them while they cast that powerful spell and in end game mage has ability to invoke several spells instantly so he/she will not never change as hinderence for the party.

 

And if you want system where adventure party can get tired then create stamina system, where fights/running around/casting/etc. slowly eats yours partys stamina to zero when you must rest.

 

This is an interesting approach, and I think it has some great potential. I know someone here hates cooldowns, but class abilities/specializations could make certain spells faster for making others slower, or lock out spells for x phases if you blow your load, so to speak.

 

Another option would be to have something like a mana/stamina(or soul) bar that only regenerates with certain actions, so you have certain, low level, low effect spells that actually builds energy. So if you have something like 20 soul, you can cast a lightening bolt for 12 soul, leaving you at 8. Next phase you have to build up soul with a minor attack like Shock, that builds 1 soul everything it used. This adds a level of tactical management to spell casting that might actually mimic how physical abilities are activated too.

[metiman]

So basically you guys want god-like mages that are even more overpowered than in most games? Great. I say nerf 'em. Make them rest for a week between spells, after which they can start casting magic missiles and knock spells. The whole point of a class like a mage is to have a character with strengths and weaknesses. If you take away their weaknesses to try to achieve 100% AWESOME, what you end up really achieving is something that is not at all fun to play. You don't need much strategy when a 5th level mage can spam fireballs at will until they waste an entire town of high level characters. If you want cooldowns, fine, but they better be at least 8 hours long. Either that or their spells have to get seriously nerfed. See how Master of the Universe you feel when your uber-wizard's best damage spell averages 3-4 HP. I have an idea! Cheat codes. If you want to be an unstoppable super-wizard-diety you can enter God mode with a console entered cheat code and continuously spam Meteor Storms and Mass Death while remaining indestructable yourself.

[Haplok]

I really liked the rest shrines solution from DDO for resting. They were one-shot and placed strategically trought dungeons. It's a neat solution that both allows the developers to control how many resources the players have at their disposal between the shrines and place the encounters approprietly not to be easy and forced the players to think strategically in order to make it to the next rest opportunity. It works extremly well, I'd say.

Of course these don't have to be shrines... can be campfires or whatever.

[Zephyr Falcon]

One way to limit the power of mages without taking away their usefulness is a system where they have to switch from one active spell to the the next but only one (or a few) can be used at one time. It kinda becomes resting, but only for mages and could have a logical ingame explaination.

The tactical implication would be to pick the right spell before the combat. And if you want powerful spell-combinations your wizard has to spend half the combat "switching" from one spell to the next.

[Pidesco]

Something like the system suggested here would tickle my fancy.