HBO's Game of Thrones pt 2

[melkathi]

 

Glad to see Rob Stark and John Snow out of it, that just leaves Bran and there should be fewer segments you are tempted to skip.

 

 

You actually believe Jon will stay dead?

Worst thing for me is that apparently Sansa has been confirmed for the next book.

With Tyrion getting boring, Danny's story better pick up again, or there will be nothing to not skip. Unless all of a sudden there is a Varys stand alone book...

 

[AGX-17]

How is the quality of the show in season 2? I've about halfway through the season 1 Blu-Ray. I see a few people complaining here and there, but don't know if it's anything genuine.

Probably depends a lot on whether the people have read the books or not plus tolerance for (s)extraneous (s)exposition and relatively complex plots for those who haven't. For those (like me) who've read the books there is a certain amount of inevitable "why did they change that?" "[charname] isn't done well compared to the books" "where's [charname] have they been cut?" and the like, though I'd rate it as a pretty decent adaptation overall.

 

The biggest issue for me is the amount of vital details that have been excluded. i.e. It's made clear in the book A Game of Thrones that Tyrion was not responsible for the assassination attempt on Bran, as he wonders to himself whether it was Cersei or Jaime, while (if I remember correctly,) dismissing the possibility that it was his father, because his father would not have sent such an incompetent assassin. Not to mention Ned's fabled promise to Lyanna, something he obsessed over throughout the book.

 

Basically, the series suffers from the fact that it's trying to squeeze 900+ pages of book into about 10 hours of TV.

Edited December 5, 2012 by AGX-17

[Gorgon]

 

 

Glad to see Rob Stark and John Snow out of it, that just leaves Bran and there should be fewer segments you are tempted to skip.

 

 

You actually believe Jon will stay dead?

Worst thing for me is that apparently Sansa has been confirmed for the next book.

With Tyrion getting boring, Danny's story better pick up again, or there will be nothing to not skip. Unless all of a sudden there is a Varys stand alone book...

 

 

 

Ohh yeah I forgot, he's some kind of shapeshifter who can inhabit the nearest life form when he dies. We will never see the end of him, or Bran.

 

[Zoraptor]

Not to mention Ned's fabled promise to Lyanna, something he obsessed over throughout the book.

That's the one that puzzles me as the whole R+L=J equation is such a prominent part of the books and it is difficult to see how it can be handled now, given the lack of a perspective character to use for exposition/ flashback. Well, there is a certain Bog Devil, but he hasn't even turned up in the books because he knows too much.

[Guest The Architect]

Finished season one. Very good, looking forward to the next.

[AGX-17]

Not to mention Ned's fabled promise to Lyanna, something he obsessed over throughout the book.

That's the one that puzzles me as the whole R+L=J equation is such a prominent part of the books and it is difficult to see how it can be handled now, given the lack of a perspective character to use for exposition/ flashback. Well, there is a certain Bog Devil, but he hasn't even turned up in the books because he knows too much.

 

Rhaegar hasn't even been mentioned in the series as far as I can remember (may need to rewatch both seasons.) And the more you learn about the backstory, the more Robert Baratheon looks like a lustful ***hole and Rhaegar looks like a kind and just man torn between familial piety and the well-being of the realm he was to inherit.

 

Naughtywords filter lol.

 

Anyway, the lack of internalized thoughts and flashbacks is another major stumbling block for the series, as a lot of major plot devices ride on memories of past events.

Edited December 6, 2012 by AGX-17

[melkathi]

 

 

Ohh yeah I forgot, he's some kind of shapeshifter who can inhabit the nearest life form when he dies. We will never see the end of him, or Bran.

 

 

That and there is always Melisandre.

[Guest The Architect]

Finished season two. Didn't like it as much as the first season, but it was still an excellent follow up from the first, especially compared to underwhelming second seasons in television shows with great first seasons, like Heroes.

[AGX-17]

Finished season two. Didn't like it as much as the first season, but it was still an excellent follow up from the first, especially compared to underwhelming second seasons in television shows with great first seasons, like Heroes.

 

The differences between the books and the series are more dramatic in the second season, Riverrun, Brynden & Edmure Tully and Meera & Jojen Reed being rather glaring omissions. I hope they don't keep that trend going as the series continues. I realize they sacrificed faithfulness to the book in Arya's story to make Tywin Lannister an actual character rather than just this looming shadow, but it's surprising for HBO to be going to lengths to tone things down and soften them up, considering how Arya deals with Harrenhal in the book, which was more interesting in her development as a character.

 

 

Arya uses Jaqen's third life debt to help her plot a revolt and mass slaughter of the Lannister garrison at Harrenhal, which is then captured by Roose Bolton, but she doesn't reveal her identity to him (despite his being a Stark Bannerman,) and skillfully executes her own plot to escape after Jaqen has departed, dragging the somewhat unwilling Gendry and Hot Pie along with her. Most notable is that she murders one of her brother Robb's men guarding their escape route in cold blood in order to accomplish this.

 

Edited December 9, 2012 by AGX-17

[melkathi]

Finished season two. Didn't like it as much as the first season, but it was still an excellent follow up from the first, especially compared to underwhelming second seasons in television shows with great first seasons, like Heroes.

 

The differences between the books and the series are more dramatic in the second season, Riverrun, Brynden & Edmure Tully and Meera & Jojen Reed being rather glaring omissions. I hope they don't keep that trend going as the series continues. I realize they sacrificed faithfulness to the book in Arya's story to make Tywin Lannister an actual character rather than just this looming shadow, but it's surprising for HBO to be going to lengths to tone things down and soften them up, considering how Arya deals with Harrenhal in the book, which was more interesting in her development as a character.

 

 

What a friend and I have been wondering is:

 

 

Who will throw Jaime to the bears now? Bolton? Then that would make the future Lannister - Frey - Bolton alliance rather wierd as it would probably have Tywin go all Castamere on Bolton.

Or will the whole Jaime story change as well?

And with Dondarion and Thoros of Myr not really in the story, what will happen to Catelyn Stark after the Red Wedding?

 

 

[AGX-17]

Finished season two. Didn't like it as much as the first season, but it was still an excellent follow up from the first, especially compared to underwhelming second seasons in television shows with great first seasons, like Heroes.

 

The differences between the books and the series are more dramatic in the second season, Riverrun, Brynden & Edmure Tully and Meera & Jojen Reed being rather glaring omissions. I hope they don't keep that trend going as the series continues. I realize they sacrificed faithfulness to the book in Arya's story to make Tywin Lannister an actual character rather than just this looming shadow, but it's surprising for HBO to be going to lengths to tone things down and soften them up, considering how Arya deals with Harrenhal in the book, which was more interesting in her development as a character.

 

 

What a friend and I have been wondering is:

 

 

Who will throw Jaime to the bears now? Bolton? Then that would make the future Lannister - Frey - Bolton alliance rather wierd as it would probably have Tywin go all Castamere on Bolton.

Or will the whole Jaime story change as well?

And with Dondarion and Thoros of Myr not really in the story, what will happen to Catelyn Stark after the Red Wedding?

 

 

 

Well, they're going to have to shoehorn them in somewhere. It's strange that the Brotherhood without Banners hasn't been mentioned considering they're practically a late night ghost story for Lannister troops. There's zero chance of

Lady Stoneheart

being excluded from the series. We already know that Meera and Jojen will finally be appearing in season 3 (they'll probably just be waiting in Bran and co.'s path and Jojen will be all cryptic and say "I knew you'd come here, we've been waiting," etc.) so maybe they'll make up for last season's omissions somehow since they're getting another extension in number of episodes.

[melkathi]

I sure hope so. I loved the Brotherhood aspect to the war of the four kings.

 

They may just add the brotherhood as an encounter for Jaime and have them chop off his hand... meh

 

Edited December 10, 2012 by melkathi

[Pidesco]

Finished season two. Didn't like it as much as the first season, but it was still an excellent follow up from the first, especially compared to underwhelming second seasons in television shows with great first seasons, like Heroes.

 

The differences between the books and the series are more dramatic in the second season, Riverrun, Brynden & Edmure Tully and Meera & Jojen Reed being rather glaring omissions. I hope they don't keep that trend going as the series continues. I realize they sacrificed faithfulness to the book in Arya's story to make Tywin Lannister an actual character rather than just this looming shadow, but it's surprising for HBO to be going to lengths to tone things down and soften them up, considering how Arya deals with Harrenhal in the book, which was more interesting in her development as a character.

 

 

Arya uses Jaqen's third life debt to help her plot a revolt and mass slaughter of the Lannister garrison at Harrenhal, which is then captured by Roose Bolton, but she doesn't reveal her identity to him (despite his being a Stark Bannerman,) and skillfully executes her own plot to escape after Jaqen has departed, dragging the somewhat unwilling Gendry and Hot Pie along with her. Most notable is that she murders one of her brother Robb's men guarding their escape route in cold blood in order to accomplish this.

 

 

While the second season fell short of the first season as a quality TV series, it still wasn't half as bad as the book. Clash of Kings was a gigantic drop in quality from Game of Thrones, and GoT was nothing particularly brilliant anyway. I can't imagine how the subsequent can get worse, but the internet tells me the quality drops as the series goes along.

[Guest The Architect]

Not according to some guy on the IMDb who said and I quote, "Storm of Swords (which they'll be adapting for this and next season) is largely hailed as the best book in the series.... and for reasons you'll just have to find out for yourself."

 

I want to believe!

[AGX-17]

Finished season two. Didn't like it as much as the first season, but it was still an excellent follow up from the first, especially compared to underwhelming second seasons in television shows with great first seasons, like Heroes.

 

The differences between the books and the series are more dramatic in the second season, Riverrun, Brynden & Edmure Tully and Meera & Jojen Reed being rather glaring omissions. I hope they don't keep that trend going as the series continues. I realize they sacrificed faithfulness to the book in Arya's story to make Tywin Lannister an actual character rather than just this looming shadow, but it's surprising for HBO to be going to lengths to tone things down and soften them up, considering how Arya deals with Harrenhal in the book, which was more interesting in her development as a character.

 

 

Arya uses Jaqen's third life debt to help her plot a revolt and mass slaughter of the Lannister garrison at Harrenhal, which is then captured by Roose Bolton, but she doesn't reveal her identity to him (despite his being a Stark Bannerman,) and skillfully executes her own plot to escape after Jaqen has departed, dragging the somewhat unwilling Gendry and Hot Pie along with her. Most notable is that she murders one of her brother Robb's men guarding their escape route in cold blood in order to accomplish this.

 

 

While the second season fell short of the first season as a quality TV series, it still wasn't half as bad as the book. Clash of Kings was a gigantic drop in quality from Game of Thrones, and GoT was nothing particularly brilliant anyway. I can't imagine how the subsequent can get worse, but the internet tells me the quality drops as the series goes along.

 

ASOIAF is above average as far as my opinion, for fantasy. The series is well produced and well acted, the rest falls in Jorge Rico Rodriguez Martin's hands.

 

Not according to some guy on the IMDb who said and I quote, "Storm of Swords (which they'll be adapting for this and next season) is largely hailed as the best book in the series.... and for reasons you'll just have to find out for yourself."

 

I want to believe!

 

A Storm of Swords is where, for lack of a better term, **** gets real. in the sense that it gets less realistic but more emotionally charged.

 

At any rate, it's a big leap from text and imagination to real actors on the TV, so that does give some improvements. And some downsides, as well.

Edited December 11, 2012 by AGX-17

[melkathi]

I find ASOIAF criticism funny sometimes.

You know those discusions where group A says the later books are terrible because not enough people are dying anymore, while group B is saying that the series is terrible because too many people are dying...

 

I am a bit disappointed that the wrong people are always dying.

Probably why my favourid quote is:

Though mayhaps this was a blessing. Had he lived he would have grown up to be a Frey

[Tasaio]

I've read ASOIAF 1-5 and the three prequel novellas, but only just now got around to watching the TV series.

 

I thought it was a worthy effort. I'm looking forward to the 3rd season.

 

However, the story began to diverge too much from the books in episodes 2x08 through 2x10. I found the portrayal of events in Winterfell disappointing, not to mention the House of the Undying.

[AGX-17]

I've read ASOIAF 1-5 and the three prequel novellas, but only just now got around to watching the TV series.

 

I thought it was a worthy effort. I'm looking forward to the 3rd season.

 

However, the story began to diverge too much from the books in episodes 2x08 through 2x10. I found the portrayal of events in Winterfell disappointing, not to mention the House of the Undying.

 

Yeah, they screwed up some stuff, but they're cramming a 1000 page novel with multiple perspectives into 10 hours of TV per year. Besides, Daenerys stuff is boring.

Edited December 25, 2012 by AGX-17

[melkathi]

If you fund Danny boring, I don't dare ask your opinion on Sansa

[AGX-17]

If you fund Danny boring, I don't dare ask your opinion on Sansa

 

I'm still convinced she's only popular because of female readers/viewers who want to be ravished Harlequin-novel style by a ripped exotic war chief.

 

The only thing interesting about Daenerys is wondering how she'll react when she learns she's not the only Targaryen left, and the possibility there might be people with a stronger claim to the Iron Throne than her.

 

And you're right to assume I'm even less interested in Sansa chapters. The only known living Stark to the people of Westeros also happens to be the most astonishingly boring.

Edited December 26, 2012 by AGX-17

[Malcador]

https://twitter.com/redweddingtears

 

Might be funny for you guys.

[melkathi]

https://twitter.com/redweddingtears

 

Might be funny for you guys.

 

Well, the ones that are blaming HBO for the Red Wedding are hillarious

[Hurlshort]

 

https://twitter.com/redweddingtears

 

Might be funny for you guys.

 

Well, the ones that are blaming HBO for the Red Wedding are hillarious

 

 

It's odd that so many people act like the books don't exist.

[melkathi]

Nearly as fun as the people who blame G.R.R. Martin for the deaths of characters who don't die in the books

[Malcador]

 

Book reader vs non-book reader.

 

I still love that .gif.

Edited June 3, 2013 by Malcador