Walsingham Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 So.. using my long dead journalistic instincts for twisting a story upside down... you're saying that if we understood anti-matter there's a possibilty we'd know how the expansion of the universe works, and potentially let SCIENTISTS STOP THE HEAT DEATH OF THE UNIVERSE. "It wasn't lies. It was just... bull****"." -Elwood Blues tarna's dead; processing... complete. Disappointed by Universe. RIP Hades/Sand/etc. Here's hoping your next alt has a harp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humodour Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 So.. using my long dead journalistic instincts for twisting a story upside down... you're saying that if we understood anti-matter there's a possibilty we'd know how the expansion of the universe works Yep! and potentially let SCIENTISTS STOP THE HEAT DEATH OF THE UNIVERSE. Perhaps first we should focus on existing long enough to be able to reach that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walsingham Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 No argument from me there, Krez. Viva life! "It wasn't lies. It was just... bull****"." -Elwood Blues tarna's dead; processing... complete. Disappointed by Universe. RIP Hades/Sand/etc. Here's hoping your next alt has a harp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrath of Dagon Posted May 6, 2011 Author Share Posted May 6, 2011 I love the example of the USB stick for example - it couldn't exist without quantum tunnelling (and thus quantum mechanics). Well, nothing could exist without quantum tunnelling, but are you saying they actually used quantum tunnelling to design it? "Moral indignation is a standard strategy for endowing the idiot with dignity." Marshall McLuhan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humodour Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 I love the example of the USB stick for example - it couldn't exist without quantum tunnelling (and thus quantum mechanics). Well, nothing could exist without quantum tunnelling Uhhh... but are you saying they actually used quantum tunnelling to design it? Eh, lots of things these days use quantum tunnelling. People just don't know it. To be more specific they don't know enough to know how advanced it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrath of Dagon Posted May 6, 2011 Author Share Posted May 6, 2011 You didn't actually answer my question. In other news, saw this in another forum, this is awesome: http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/hi...on-1869187.html "Moral indignation is a standard strategy for endowing the idiot with dignity." Marshall McLuhan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walsingham Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 I love the example of the USB stick for example - it couldn't exist without quantum tunnelling (and thus quantum mechanics). Well, nothing could exist without quantum tunnelling Mmmm... quantum mars bar. "It wasn't lies. It was just... bull****"." -Elwood Blues tarna's dead; processing... complete. Disappointed by Universe. RIP Hades/Sand/etc. Here's hoping your next alt has a harp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raithe Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 I love the example of the USB stick for example - it couldn't exist without quantum tunnelling (and thus quantum mechanics). Well, nothing could exist without quantum tunnelling Mmmm... quantum mars bar. I hate to disturb your image Wals.. but that resembles something that came out of the puppy today.... "Cuius testiculos habeas, habeas cardia et cerebellum." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monte Carlo Posted May 6, 2011 Share Posted May 6, 2011 If you've developed a canine that excretes deep-fried mars bars then I'll give you a large amount of money for it and sell it to the Scots for a gazillion quid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humodour Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 (edited) You didn't actually answer my question. In other news, saw this in another forum, this is awesome: http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/hi...on-1869187.html That's because your question was the equivalent of "are you trying to tell me scientists harnessed a physical phenomenon to make some sort of device?!". I mean how do I answer that? With one word, 'yes'? Perhaps I go further to elaborate that, anyway, making devices which harness the physics we discover actually isn't that new a concept? Edited May 7, 2011 by Krezack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrath of Dagon Posted May 7, 2011 Author Share Posted May 7, 2011 Well, you can explain how tunneling works to make flash memory. "Moral indignation is a standard strategy for endowing the idiot with dignity." Marshall McLuhan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humodour Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 (edited) No. Go read about it yourself. I shouldn't have to try and prove the existence to you of every scientific concept you illogically feel is bogus (possibly each one erodes some of the foundation of your belief in your sky fairy, and that worries you?). NAND flash (the one used in most solid-state drives) uses tunnel injection for writing and tunnel release for erasing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunnel_injection NOR flash also uses quantum tunnelling but in a different way. Edited May 7, 2011 by Krezack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrath of Dagon Posted May 7, 2011 Author Share Posted May 7, 2011 You're funny, I asked because I wasn't aware of what you link said, and it seemed like a far-fetched idea. "Moral indignation is a standard strategy for endowing the idiot with dignity." Marshall McLuhan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humodour Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 You're funny, I asked because I wasn't aware of what you link said, and it seemed like a far-fetched idea. Oh, well, quantum mechanics is a core part of science these days. Nothing far-fetched about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrath of Dagon Posted May 7, 2011 Author Share Posted May 7, 2011 I didn't mean quantum mechanics is far fetched, I meant using it at the integrated circuit level. Usually the geometries are too large to see a quantum effect. "Moral indignation is a standard strategy for endowing the idiot with dignity." Marshall McLuhan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humodour Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Usually the geometries are too large to see a quantum effect. If by 'geometries' you mean 'scale', then no, that hasn't been the case for like 5 or 10 years. It's called nanotechnology (a subfield of materials science). I'm majoring in it. It's very interesting and useful. Look at graphene: http://images.iop.org/dl/physicsweb/2010/phwv19i11a34.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walsingham Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Being left handed correlates with symptoms of PTSD being worse. "It wasn't lies. It was just... bull****"." -Elwood Blues tarna's dead; processing... complete. Disappointed by Universe. RIP Hades/Sand/etc. Here's hoping your next alt has a harp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orogun01 Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Being left handed correlates with symptoms of PTSD being worse. Interesting theory, but subtle verbal recall errors isn't really proof. I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"* *If you can't tell, it's you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tale Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 (edited) I'm going to need to see that study. I'm fine with subtle verbal recall errors. But I'm skeptical that they're looking at legitimate PTSD symptoms. I haven't looked it up in a while, but I was under the impression PTSD symptoms all occurred over a long period of time. Immediate symptoms are not PTSD anymore than getting sad is depression. Edited May 7, 2011 by Tale "Show me a man who "plays fair" and I'll show you a very talented cheater." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walsingham Posted May 7, 2011 Share Posted May 7, 2011 Could be symptomatic of having received a cognitive battering in the same way that someone with PTSD would. If there is some bio-cognitive architecture which predisposes people towards PTSD this might be helpful in getting soldiers to seek help, since it's not their 'fault' or a 'weakness'. "It wasn't lies. It was just... bull****"." -Elwood Blues tarna's dead; processing... complete. Disappointed by Universe. RIP Hades/Sand/etc. Here's hoping your next alt has a harp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrath of Dagon Posted May 7, 2011 Author Share Posted May 7, 2011 Usually the geometries are too large to see a quantum effect. If by 'geometries' you mean 'scale', then no, that hasn't been the case for like 5 or 10 years. It's called nanotechnology (a subfield of materials science). I'm majoring in it. It's very interesting and useful. Look at graphene: http://images.iop.org/dl/physicsweb/2010/phwv19i11a34.pdf I wasn't talking about nanotechnology, I was talking about conventional lithographic integrated circuits, which is what flash is so far as I know. So feature size is limited to the current process, something like .28 nm at the moment, but obviously they can still use the tunneling effect. That may have something to do with the thickness of vapor deposition, don't know. "Moral indignation is a standard strategy for endowing the idiot with dignity." Marshall McLuhan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orogun01 Posted May 8, 2011 Share Posted May 8, 2011 Could be symptomatic of having received a cognitive battering in the same way that someone with PTSD would. If there is some bio-cognitive architecture which predisposes people towards PTSD this might be helpful in getting soldiers to seek help, since it's not their 'fault' or a 'weakness'. I always though of PTSD as a failure to adapt to society after a dangerous event. The same defense mechanisms that would protect you in that situation are hindering your ability to function in a different environment. I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"* *If you can't tell, it's you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humodour Posted May 8, 2011 Share Posted May 8, 2011 (edited) Usually the geometries are too large to see a quantum effect. If by 'geometries' you mean 'scale', then no, that hasn't been the case for like 5 or 10 years. It's called nanotechnology (a subfield of materials science). I'm majoring in it. It's very interesting and useful. Look at graphene: http://images.iop.org/dl/physicsweb/2010/phwv19i11a34.pdf I wasn't talking about nanotechnology, I was talking about conventional lithographic integrated circuits, which is what flash is so far as I know. So feature size is limited to the current process, something like .28 nm at the moment, but obviously they can still use the tunneling effect. That may have something to do with the thickness of vapor deposition, don't know. Um, these days chip design is ALL ABOUT nanotechnology, and has been for like a decade. I mean gosh isn't it pretty obvious that when your units are nm (NANOmeters) you're doing **** on the nanoscale, using the tools of nanotechnology? The scale at which quantum mechanical properties become dominant (although there are plenty of novel examples of quantum mechanical properties dictating macroscopic properties). By the way it is most certainly NOT 0.28 nm. Mind your decimals, dude. Chips from the 2008 era are 45 nm, but there has been a bunch of advances since, and etching distance has now fallen to 22 nm (Intel's Sandy Bridge architecture which will start shipping in early 2012). Below 22 nm is going to be pretty damn hard to do without relying even more heavily (indeed entirely) on novel quantum-mechanical properties. It will likely require the abandonment of conventional photolithography in favour of something like nanoimprint lithography or lithography using a scanning probe (a modern type of microscope invented in 1981 which operates on the principle of quantum tunnelling). But independent of all this, flash memories have been using quantum tunnelling for I don't even know how long - definitely a while (i.e. at least half a dacade). For the record, quantum tunelling itself had become a widely accepted scientific principle by 1957. And now, I shall leave you with a simple pressure-sensitive button thingy for turning on electronic devices which operates on the principle of quantum tunnelling: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_tunnelling_composite Edited May 8, 2011 by Krezack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humodour Posted May 8, 2011 Share Posted May 8, 2011 Anyway, silicon is so yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoraptor Posted May 8, 2011 Share Posted May 8, 2011 By the way it is most certainly NOT 0.28 nm. Mind your decimals, dude. Chips from the 2008 era are 45 nm, but there has been a bunch of advances since, and etching distance has now fallen to 22 nm (Intel's Sandy Bridge architecture which will start shipping in early 2012). Not Sandy Bridge, it's out already. I think it's the next iteration (Ivy Bridge) that is using the smaller size, at least according to wiki. Not 100% sure but I think ARM may already have a 22nm chip released, as they're big on the energy saving side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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