Is Customer Service dead?

[Cantousent]

I can't imagine firing someone for a single complaint unless it is something truly bad. However, if you can't treat the customer with respect, we'll probably have a problem. ...But I figure more employees are fired for stealing than being rude to the customer. That's because you can dance on the line in terms of customers without actually stepping over it. With all things being equal, I'm going to believe my employee before any single customer. However, if enough customers complain, then I'll take for granted that there is a problem. Also, many companies have secret shopper programs. The level of hatred spewed on customers in this threat is ridiculous nonetheless. Damn it, men, you're customers also.

[metadigital]

It's a simple question. Who can fire or hire an employee? An employee or a customer? Only one of those do that. I know that as a customer I can't walk into McDoinalds, and fire the staff and hire my own friends to work there. It simply doesn't work that way.

 

The business exists for two reasons - customers' need/desire for a product/service; and the owner's need/desire to deliver product/service.

 

So, both are needed for a business to be in place. But, only one has the power to fire or hire employees.

 

 

P.S. At my current job, customers complain a lot. Sometimes they are right in their complaint; sometimes they'r enot. I have never seen someone fired because of a customer complaint. I have seen someone fired due to lack of respect TOWARDS THE BOSS, and not doing the job (ie. being late all the time, missing shifts, taking hour long smoke breaks, etc.); but NEVER because of a customer complaining.

 

Go figure. *shrug*

Volo, you're trying to fit the world into an employee's perspective.

 

Really, try to think outside your box.

The business exists for two reasons - customers' need/desire for a product/service; and the owner's need/desire to deliver product/service.

The owner doesn't have a "need/desire to deliver product/service", they have a "need/desire" to make a profit.

 

I'm not so na

[Volourn]

"In the end it's the boss who makes the final decision,"

 

I win.

[metadigital]

Why do you have such a burning desire to "win"?

 

Try to understand, rather than "win", because you might actually win then, too.

[Volourn]

I alreayd understand what you are trying to say. And, while parts of it are true; it's a cop out to say that 'without cusatomers there'd be no business'. That's just silly. It's true; but it's not why an employee has a job. That's why there is a business.

 

Employer interviews you.

 

Employer hires you.

 

Employer pays you.

 

Employer fires you.

 

Not the customer(s).

 

Period.

[LostStraw]

I can't imagine firing someone for a single complaint unless it is something truly bad. However, if you can't treat the customer with respect, we'll probably have a problem. ...But I figure more employees are fired for stealing than being rude to the customer. That's because you can dance on the line in terms of customers without actually stepping over it. With all things being equal, I'm going to believe my employee before any single customer. However, if enough customers complain, then I'll take for granted that there is a problem. Also, many companies have secret shopper programs. The level of hatred spewed on customers in this threat is ridiculous nonetheless. Damn it, men, you're customers also.

 

I wasn't actually in any sort of customer service position at the time. I had worked a long day (pushing carts) and got a little snippy with a customer who was pestering me with complaints.

 

I was a temp at the time and the store had a policy that if any of their temp employees received a customer complaint -- it was the boot for them. They "let me quit" instead of firing me (my record was otherwise spotless). It was probably less messy for them to do it that way and it was better for me too.

[Cantousent]

The final decision doesn't even end with the boss. After all, if your business goes under for lack of customers, then you lose your job. Your boss can want to keep you, but the job ends when the customers stop buying.

 

That doesn't just go for customer service, either. It can be salary demands or quality of goods. For example, employees can demand so much compensation that the product won't carry enough prophet (call it a sudden epiphany) or the product might be shoddy and folks won't want to buy it. For example, US steel workers or GM factory workers of a decade or two back. A lot of businesses go under every year, and the decision that an employee loses his job when the business goes under does not come from the boss. It's comes from the customer.

Edited February 26, 2007 by Cantousent

[Surreptishus]

Employer interviews you.

 

Employer hires you.

 

Employer pays you.

 

Employer fires you.

 

Not the customer(s).

 

Period.

 

Why is the employer looking for workers?

[alanschu]

Because he is looking to eat into his profit margins and spend money.

 

A philantropist really.

[Oerwinde]

Customers are the reason people have job. A single customer is not. The problem is primarily when a customer expresses a gross sense of entitlement due to their status as a customer and they attempt to willfully abuse anyone they see fit. I don't know if it's just typical human arrogance or rampant consumerism, but customer, clerk, or service provider, you're all humans and need to act with dignity and respect. I don't care the cost of the product or the problem with it, it does not entitle a person to be a prick.

 

Exactly. We have a lot of good customers. Most of our regulars are great, except for the crazy guy. Everybody hates the crazy guy because he's picky about the dumbest things. Like if the guy in front of him orders a 6 inch, so we cut a footlong in half, then try to use the other half for the crazy guy, he freaks out that its not fresh enough. Even if it had just come out of the over like 15 minutes ago. No one would care if he stopped coming, it wouldn't hurt our bottom line either since all he orders is 6" cold cuts, which are the cheapest on the menu.

 

Now on the other hand, if the cool Indian guy who comes in twice a day to order 3 footlongs stopped coming, that would be bad.

Edited February 26, 2007 by Oerwinde

[metadigital]

The final decision doesn't even end with the boss. After all, if your business goes under for lack of customers, then you lose your job. Your boss can want to keep you, but the job ends when the customers stop buying.

 

That doesn't just go for customer service, either. It can be salary demands or quality of goods. For example, employees can demand so much compensation that the product won't carry enough prophet (call it a sudden epiphany) or the product might be shoddy and folks won't want to buy it. For example, US steel workers or GM factory workers of a decade or two back. A lot of businesses go under every year, and the decision that an employee loses his job when the business goes under does not come from the boss. It's comes from the customer.

I'm reminded of the management team of Marconi in the last few years, too: just because they have a Fortune 100 company started by a genius (the guy who invented radio!), doesn't mean that losing touch with the customer won't end the job of not just the employees, but the management team, as well. :D

 

Volo, your little model of reality is incomplete, you have a line from the employee to the manager, but you are forgetting the line from the manager to the customer, who hires the manager through purchase of the product/service.

[Calax]

I can't imagine firing someone for a single complaint unless it is something truly bad. However, if you can't treat the customer with respect, we'll probably have a problem. ...But I figure more employees are fired for stealing than being rude to the customer. That's because you can dance on the line in terms of customers without actually stepping over it. With all things being equal, I'm going to believe my employee before any single customer. However, if enough customers complain, then I'll take for granted that there is a problem. Also, many companies have secret shopper programs. The level of hatred spewed on customers in this threat is ridiculous nonetheless. Damn it, men, you're customers also.

this threat???

 

anyway, the accusation of somthing you didn't do is enough to get you booted from a job. my former owner (of the mcd's franchise) fired some poor sod (who then became homeless) because the guy came out from the bathroom and got a pair of sweatpants stuck in the fly of his work pants. Customer said that he was masturbating and "exposing himself" to her.

 

I NEARLY got fired because a joke I made came out the wrong way and the customer took it as a racist remark and DEMANDED my removal. Fortunatly I am one of the few people who actually WORK while at Mcd's so I was given leniancy and a very harsh write up.

[alanschu]

"This threat" = "This thread.

[Fenghuang]

I can't imagine firing someone for a single complaint unless it is something truly bad. However, if you can't treat the customer with respect, we'll probably have a problem. ...But I figure more employees are fired for stealing than being rude to the customer. That's because you can dance on the line in terms of customers without actually stepping over it. With all things being equal, I'm going to believe my employee before any single customer. However, if enough customers complain, then I'll take for granted that there is a problem. Also, many companies have secret shopper programs. The level of hatred spewed on customers in this threat is ridiculous nonetheless. Damn it, men, you're customers also.

this threat???

 

anyway, the accusation of somthing you didn't do is enough to get you booted from a job. my former owner (of the mcd's franchise) fired some poor sod (who then became homeless) because the guy came out from the bathroom and got a pair of sweatpants stuck in the fly of his work pants. Customer said that he was masturbating and "exposing himself" to her.

 

I NEARLY got fired because a joke I made came out the wrong way and the customer took it as a racist remark and DEMANDED my removal. Fortunatly I am one of the few people who actually WORK while at Mcd's so I was given leniancy and a very harsh write up.

 

 

Dude, you need to get out of McDonald's.

[Tigranes]

*shrug* Big organisations will always be much much more picky about customer image in that way, and will always value the geenral customer impression over a few dispensable employees. After all, it's not like you're very valuable to them; they could hire anybody off the streets, usually. They don't care about clearing misunderstandings because if that customer goes away and thinks "Calax was a racist but McDonalds still hires them", by law of rumour, everybody who hears it will th ink badly of McDonalds, even if they dont quite believe it, and McDonalds can't do anything to change that. It is only sensible of them, if harsh, to act the way they do.

[thepixiesrock]

Or at least stop making racist jokes.

[Fenghuang]

You don't even know the half of it, I've met the guy; has a "I hate negros." bumper sticker on his car.

[Walsingham]

Volo, Meta, I think the point is that the boss OUGHT to run his team based on what level of service you are providing. But he/she may not do this, and usually doesn't. Equally, however, people don't become saints by virtue of where they shop and hence you get wrongful complaints. I've always thought the guy who said "The customer is always right" should have been forced to live by that maxim. They'd have run for at most six months.

 

On the other hand you customers/clients are absolutely everything. You exist for them, not the other way round as many service industries seem to think. Losing track of this can and does account indirectly for virtually every nutsup plaguing big businesses today. So when Meta and I say "Don't forget you're there for the customer" we're talking death or glory. This is not about an extra topping, this is about the livelihoods and security of yourself and everyone depending on the business.

 

So like I say, the customer is always vital. I would say you should approach them all as if they are great. But they can be and often are - when they approach you - incorrect. The best approach generally is - with respect - chase down the misapprehension and remove it.

 

On the other hand I have no objection to dealing with the harshest abusers of your hospitality with permanent bars to service. My old boss handed out as many of these as he did firing of staff.He may have been as mad as a trout, but he was fair and absolutely loyal to his people who worked hard for him.

[Volourn]

"I would say you should approach them all as if they are great."

 

Nope. Never. Customers are pieces of crap, and I say whether or not I'm working or I'm a customer as well going whereveer. This doesn't mean that as a employee I treat them like dirt - I can take all sorts of abuse - but, customers aren't the be all end all for employees. the boss is.

 

Customers do not hire, or fire employees. Bosses do. I've seen rather successful owners/bosses poo pah frivilous/or even non frivilous customer complaints and their business still do well. i've seen these bosses fire employees for other reasons ie. taking 1 hour smoke breaks/non coming in for work for invalid reasons/etc.

 

As an employee, my job may be to service the cusztomer; but the goal is to make the boss happy.

[Cantousent]

As an employee, my job may be to service the cusztomer; but the goal is to make the boss happy.

 

Here, I'll give you cause for your happy dance. :D

 

I agree with this statement completely. Your job is to make the boss happy. However, your boss probably wants to make the customer happy. There are very few industries where they can take the customer for granted, and none where they can take the customer for granted forever. That's why you've got call monitoring even in government agencies.

 

The point, for me, is that it's not healthy to view the customer as an enemy. Sure, specific customers, but not every one. I mean, Vol, you've never had a nice customer? Once? Where the hell do you work?

 

I've taught literally hundreds of customer service seminars and I always try to impart the idea that our customers aren't the enemy. We have a partnership with them. That doesn't mean I'm going to fire an employee because some nut is angry because he doesn't like her brand of perfume. On their end, they receive something that we provide. They can also expect friendly service. We should be able to expect payment and respectful treatment. It doesn't always work out exactly as planned, but that's the idea nonetheless.

 

Even in fast food, with its bad reputation, I've had friendly exchanges with the employees. Joked or laughed about something that happened while I was in the line. In fact, most of the time, I have a pretty uneventful visit to the fast food joint. I go in, make an order, pay for it, get the bags, and leave. Even then, the cashier and I almost always exchange at least one smile somewhere in there. Yeah, I've had surly cashiers. I've also been damned angry about something else when I entered the joint and undoubtedly sounded unfriendly. That's how it works, but not very often, really.

 

Okay, time for a funny story. I was in a mcdonald's on the way to Las Vegas with my wife about a year ago. Some lady comes in with a problem regarding her order. It turns out that some of the items in the order are wrong. So, she's talking to the manager, telling him the stuff she wants in the order. She ends by saying she wants two hamburgers. The manager asks, "Do you want cheese on those?" The lady says firmly, "No, I don't want cheese." The cashier says, "If she'd wanted cheese on her hamburger, she'd've ordered a cheeseburger." Okay, okay, you had to be there, but we were all busting up. I just hope the cashier didn't get herself written up for the quip.

[Volourn]

"The point, for me, is that it's not healthy to view the customer as an enemy. Sure, specific customers, but not every one. I mean, Vol, you've never had a nice customer? Once? Where the hell do you work?"

 

I think you took my extreme view in my first post as fact. It was, I would think, obviously an exagagertaion. I don't view customers as anything but customers. And, I've dealt with plenty of nice customers. Again, I wrote was is often referred to as an exagegrtaion. I just don't care for the idea that the customer is the 'holy grail' or 'the customer is always right'. That's bogus. And, I've seen employer after employer side with their employees at least 80% of the time whena customer goes off on one.

 

btw, Outside of my time working in a call center, I've never personally had a problem witha customer. And, as a customer, I've tende dto always get along with those employees servicing (lol) me. Then again, when I go into a store for business as a customer I'm probably be cosnidered the model customer. That's nopt bragging. Just a fact since I don't whine, and am always polite (unlike the 'net, or dealing with jerkoffs outsiude of that situation).

 

P.S. L0LLERZ at McD comedy!

Edited February 27, 2007 by Volourn

[alanschu]

I think you took my extreme view in my first post as fact. It was, I would think, obviously an exagagertaion

 

Weren't you the guy that used to call out people as liars for exaggerating?

[Cantousent]

I've been around long enough to know the customer is not always right. :Cant's grinning icon:

[Volourn]

"Weren't you the guy that used to call out people as liars for exaggerating?"

 

Absolutely. You can feel fre to call me lair for exaggertaing too. I exaggerated. I lied. Big deal. *shrug*

 

 

"I've been around long enough to know the customer is not always right. :Cant's grinning icon:"

 

Heh. It's also true though that there's enough customer service employees that cna be considered poor too. Afterall, these are human beings so you cna get all types on both 'sides'. Like you said though, it's not about viewing the other group as the enemy though I find that feeling is more common on the customer side.

Edited February 27, 2007 by Volourn

[Kaftan Barlast]

There's a famous restaurant back home where the owner rules acording to "Its MY restaurant, youre here on my terms jerk!" Its awesome. If you like ask for applejam for your christmas ham or use the wrong utensils for your food or anything he disaproves of, he will kick you out. Its a very popular place.

 

 

If I had a bussiness, Id run it the same way. I mean, owner and staff should always outrank a mere customer.