NWN2 bashed and thrashed

[alanschu]

Poor Spider

[17243_1556103691]

Neither have you.  You're just guessing.  I'm basing my statements on the trends that have existed, and continue to exist, in gaming.

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Trends? Like the trend of NWN multiplayer progressively growing in population over time? That trend holds more validity as it can be verified by anyone. Just ask around.

 

 

Because your points are baseless conjecture.  They are what you THINK is happening.

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Wrong again, several of my points are trends I witnessed happening. The rest aren't 'baseless".

 

 

But you had no problems counting the few thousand of them that you have just recently met....

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That part is easy to remember considering i heard it all the time over nearly a five year span.

 

I'm curious, how on Earth do you plan on encountering people that don't play the game online to begin with?  (and it's not deductive reasoning at all, because you cannot verify whether or not your premises are actually truth)

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I don't and never said that. I plan on encountering people that will inevitably make the switch.

 

 

But people don't need to play video games to experience companionship, acknowledgement, or to interact with others.  You're making an assumption that the majority of people that buy video games fit your category of "gamer" which you just gave.  Believe it or not, a lot of plain jane average people buy video games.  The type that play maybe a few hours a week.  I doubt the type of gamer that is narcissistic and wants to prove how powerful they are make up more than a rather insignificant amount of the total gaming populace

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Those needs and aspirations apply to people that play more than a few hours a day and will eventually want to share their D&D experience with someone else. The game is built around this concept. - And how would you know how many narcissistic gamers there are? You wouldn't, and certainly have little to no experience with online gamers to begin with. Which inherently makes you unfamiliar and unqualified to make such sttements. I encountered egomaniacs cropping up constantly online, and not just for this game either.

 

Deductive Reasoning based on unverified assumptions is not useful.  You're making blind suppositions based on what you THINK the world of gaming is actually like.  You talk about the "gaming community" as if it is made up of people vastly different than everyday people.

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Deductive reasoning based on my own interaction with so many online, and to be an eye witness of trends. To me it's verifiable, and lends more credence than your bias views. What is clear is you have no experience with online multiplayer trends (at least none that you've managed to bring up yet) yet have been campaigning for some truth doesn't exist or has yet to bear out in statistics. Your argument is less valid from the perspective that you offer no counter examples, simply hyperbole.

Home broadband use has doubled in the past 2 years alone, common sense should tell you that trickles over into the gaming community and certainly affects NWN to some degree.

Edited November 13, 2006 by Guest

[Hurlshort]

It seems like people are just resistant to change. NWN2 is out, toolset and all, which means the original NWN community will be slowly changing over to the new game. NWN1 PW's will slowly disappear, new mods will steadily trickle out, and eventually all but the most hardcore will make the transition.

 

Do people think that if they complain enough, everyone will ignore NWN2 and stick to the original? It ain't happening, NWN1 is at the end of its capabilities. It's time for change.

[alanschu]

Trends? Like the trend of NWN multiplayer progressively growing in population over time? That trend holds more validity as it can be verified by anyone. Just ask around.

 

Absolute values mean nothing. It doesn't matter if suddenly a few thousand more people are playing the game online. Who is to say that there haven't been significantly more people buying the game playing it offline? Or that a large chunk of these people are the same MP players that took a year or two off from playing the game before?

 

 

Wrong again, my points are what I witnessed happening.

 

And that is why they are worthless. Just because it's what you see happening, doesn't mean that that is an accurate reflection of the actual customer base. Your sample size is far to small, and heavily biased (since you're not talking to offline gamers).

 

 

That part is easy to remember considering i heard it all the time over nearly a five year span.

 

It's easy to remember the "thousands" of unique identities you met while playing a game over five years?

 

 

I don't and never said that. I plan on encountering people that will inevitably make the switch.

 

Exactly. Since you only talk with people that are online, all of your information comes from them. You're sample is not representative.

 

 

Those needs and aspirations apply to people that play more than a few hours a day and will eventually want to share their D&D experience with someone else. The game is built around this concept. - And how would you know how many narcissistic gamers there are? You wouldn't, and certainly have little to no experience with online gamers to begin with. Which inherently makes you unfamiliar and unqualified to make such sttements. I encountered egomaniacs cropping up constantly online, and not just for this game either.

 

The people you meet playing the game online are not an unbiased sample. As for my experience with narcisstic gamers, I played Counterstrike, the grand poombah of total asswipes. So don't go talking around about how I don't have experience playing online. The thing is, (as I've stated over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over) you cannot base your assumptions of a game that offers a single player experience purely on the fans that you see playing MP. If NWN was an online MP only game, your views would have a bit more validity. But since you have zero information about the single player users, your sample is worthless. It doesn't account for them.

 

 

Deductive reasoning based on my own interaction with so many online, and to be an eye witness of trends.

 

For the last time, you're not using deductive reasoning. Take a logic course. Your premises aren't true.

 

 

To me it's verifiable, and lends more credence than your bias views.

 

My biased views? And I'm sure the guy that loves NWN MP and has been beating on NWN2 before it even came out is a beacon of objectivity on the issue.

 

 

What is clear is you have no experience with online multiplayer trends (at least none that you've managed to bring up yet) yet have been campaigning for some truth doesn't exist or has yet to bear out in statistics. Youre argument is less valid from the perspective that you offer no counter examples, simply hyperbole

 

The examples you cite are worthless, because they are based upon personal experience. And I've been playing games online since 1999, starting with Action Quake 2. I've sunk mountains of time into games like Counterstrike, Starcraft, Diablo, Diablo II, Battlefield 1942/Vietnam/2, World of Warcraft, Eve Online, Half-Life, Team Fortress, Guild Wars, and so on.

 

 

What counter example would you really like me to cite? Me speaking with many people that don't like playing games online?

[Diamond]

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Edited November 13, 2006 by Diamond

[Volourn]

"It ain't happening, NWN1 is at the end of its capabilities. It's time for change."

 

NWN1 isn't going anywhere. Not for a long while at least.

 

 

Anyways, those who ignore NWN2's faults are foolish. Those who are gonna nitpick it to death for every fault are also foolish. If you hate the game outright then don't play it. Simple as that.

 

Anyone who tries to diretcly comapre NWN2 to the KOTORs and then try to claim it has nothing in common with NWN1 are braindead since, you know, the KOTOR engine is like based on NWN1. And, NWN2's gameplay engine is the Aurora while the graphics engine is a new one obviously based on the Aurora. Heck, the graphics have the basic of style of NWN1 except obviously (Ovcerall) much better - well... except for animations and some special effects which are *really* dissapointing. The combat is, quite frankly, identical to NWN1 outside of the ability to control the joinables diretcly.

 

 

LONG LIVE NWN SERIES!!!

[Darque]

Thread pruned a little.

 

Could we please stop with the fighting?

[Sargallath Abraxium]

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[Riftworm]

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[Diamond]

I hear what Soulthief is saying about more people playing online than before, that's just a given. Sounds more credible to me than those pointing to ancient statistics like they were gospel.

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This was not questioned, unless I'm missing something. His initial claim was that NWN2 will have more people who will play online than people who will play just the OC.

[Hurlshort]

"It ain't happening, NWN1 is at the end of its capabilities. It's time for change."

 

NWN1 isn't going anywhere. Not for a long while at least.

 

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Why don't you try quoting my entire statement, instead of just pulling stuff out of context? I already stated what will happen to the community. It will continue on, but it will slowly lose steam. It already has started to see a decrease in new user mods over the last year, and there aren't as many PW's available as a year ago. It may take another couple years, but eventually there will be no excuse for not having a decent enough computer for NWN2, and the core NWN1 audience will drop the original. There will always be a harcore few, but the glory days of NWN1 are gone.

[Volourn]

Not yet.

[Diamond]

J.E. was about to post something (most probably insightful) but then he left.

[Jorian Drake]

J.E. was about to post something (most probably insightful) but then he left.

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maybe his PC crashed ? ^_^

[Volourn]

"J.E. was about to post something (most probably insightful) but then he left."

 

Sorry. My bad.

[17243_1556103691]

J.E. was about to post something (most probably insightful) but then he left.

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No, he's always in here just reading.

 

*sigh* Time for me to get moving, once my posts and others start getting deleted.

[Diamond]

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Edited November 13, 2006 by Diamond

[17243_1556103691]

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[kirottu]

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[Pidesco]

And benchpressing was totally on topic too.

[Darque]

This topic seems to be flying out of control, can someone bring it back on course? "

[Riftworm]

This topic seems to be flying out of control, can someone bring it back on course?  "

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Yes I agree with the bash and trash author at sorcerers.net. There, back on topic.. :D

[Jorian Drake]

This topic seems to be flying out of control, can someone bring it back on course?  "

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Yes I agree with the bash and trash author at sorcerers.net. There, back on topic.. :D

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He gets more support

[kirottu]

This topic seems to be flying out of control, can someone bring it back on course?  "

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Yes I agree with the bash and trash author at sorcerers.net. There, back on topic.. :D

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He gets more support

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I agree too. NWN2 is a copy of Kotor, actually you could call it Kotor III, actually it is Kotor III, actually it was published by Lucasarts and not by Atari.

 

Naming it NWN2 was just Obsidian

Edited November 13, 2006 by kirottu

[Jorian Drake]

This topic seems to be flying out of control, can someone bring it back on course?  "

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Yes I agree with the bash and trash author at sorcerers.net. There, back on topic.. :D

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He gets more support

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I agree too. NWN2 is a copy of Kotor, actually you could call it Kotor III, actually it is Kotor III, actually it was published by Lucasarts and not by Atari.

 

Naming it NWN2 was just Obsidian