KotoR 3: Ideas and Suggestions

[Plano Skywalker]

Well Dantooine is not actually home. It is not so old either. Vodo-Siosk [insert surname here] master of Exar Kun founded it.

 

True homeworld of jedi is Ossus

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

well, I think we need to eventually see all the ancient Jedi worlds including Utapau and Ossus.

 

however, Dantooine has become the "base of operations" for the Jedi. Sure, they have operations on Coruscant (and any world of political importance) but Dantooine is where they talk inside baseball and live and breathe as a community.

 

I would like to see that continue in these games.

[Xard]

Wha? Utapau? Explain please

 

No, main jedi temple is on Coruscant. Coruscant is heart of jedi order and Republic.

 

Dantooine's is just training academy.

 

Explanation for it's importance for Kotors: Kotors are set to same time as Exar Kun wars. In those comics Dantooine holds great significance. So Dantooine is put because of that, since at the time, it is somewhat "original" whem compared against Coruscant AND it is much easier to code and do than Coruscant. Heck, if you are going to put Coruscant in game, it must be big place, not some sloppy small area. That eats memory A LOT, and since Kotor was designed in limits of Xbox, Coruscant couldn't be in.

 

In k2 people (well most of players I presume) wanted to see what has happened to Dantooine. And it was part of Kotor contiunity.

 

But I don't want to see it in k3

Edited June 16, 2006 by Xard

[Plano Skywalker]

well, it appears my source is unsourced: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Utapau .

(you might want to do a keyword search for "birthplaces").

 

this is probably based on a scant reference somewhere in the body of EU literature.

 

 

here is another bit from another site (http://jnana.wikinerds.org/index.php/Jedi_origin):

 

"Through study, meditation, communion, debate, and experimentation, the first coherent theories about the Force developed. Scientific, religious and philosophical groups documented living and unifying aspects of the Force and opened other, less defined attributes to theory and speculation. The part of the Force dedicated to knowledge and defense came to be considered the light side of the omnipresent energy field. The aggressive, jealous, covetous aspects of the Force were labeled aspects of the dark side. At some point, the groups gathered on one planet to create a new society dedicated to the study of the Force. The society came to be called the Jedi, although who named them and exactly what the significance of this name is remains unclear. The identity of the world where this happened has been lost to the mists of time; candidates include Coruscant, Corellia, Ossus, Utapau, and even lost worlds such as Had Abbadon and Ondos."

 

 

I agree that Coruscant is one of the ancient worlds of Jedi knowledge. But I think the Jedi don't really like

urban centers and/or politics. They have operations on Coruscant because they have to. That is my take anyway.

 

And I agree that having Coruscant in the game would be a logistical nightmare to do justice to it.

The way to do Coruscant is to either have a lot of good cutscenes (in other words, not really a playable world)

or to have it in a more linear segment of the game (you are seperated from your ship and someone shuttles you there).

You only get to explore a tiny portion of the slums. Anytime you go somewhere "important", you are flown there (could

be cutscene or some sort of flying minigame).

 

That is how such a thing could be done. Coruscant cannot be on your astrocharts,

it has to be in an extremely linear segment of the game.

 

 

Bottom line:

 

* we need to see more of Coruscant (in some fashion or other).

 

* we need to see ancient Sith AND ancient Jedi worlds.

 

* we need a constant thread in the games (I vote for Dantooine).

[DAWUSS]

Coruscant - Sure, I'd love to see the center of the universe, maybe even play as a Senator for a short time (the senator would not be PC however)

 

Dantooine - Sure, why not? It can be the constant planet of the KOTOR series

 

Korriban - I have a feeling it will, even though I really don't want it to

 

Anyway, I would like to see the planet Deralia. Hopefully it's nice and purdy like Naboo and Rakata Prime. Kuat wouldn't be too bad a planet either... We could get ship upgrades there. If we still have the Ebon Hawk we could outfit it with faster engines, better guns, etc...

[Plano Skywalker]

I agree with you about Korriban. There are so many other Sith worlds we need to see.

 

however, if they use Korriban, they need to blow us away with it. it can't just be a rehashing of what we have already seen.

[Plano Skywalker]

Deralia would be cool. Obviously, the world does exist, whether or not it really is Revan's homeworld.

 

I also would like to see Droid World and some sort of ice world.

[vaxen83]

I agree with you about Korriban.  There are so many other Sith worlds we need to see.

 

however, if they use Korriban, they need to blow us away with it.  it can't just be a rehashing of what we have already seen.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Perhaps Korriban might have had another darker name in past times that might be revealed through a legacy of True Sith in K3.

Edited June 17, 2006 by vaxen83

[Xard]

Korriban is TRue Sith world already, as it was part of Old Sith Empire

[vaxen83]

Well, there are always other ways of looking at it, aren't there?

[Xard]

That's true

[Guest The Architect]

I continue to see a lot of posts along the lines of "I want more planets and bigger worlds in KOTOR III" While yes, it would be nice to have more planets and bigger planets in KOTOR III, I prefer quality over quantity in KOTOR III. What is the point of having lots more planets and bigger planets in KOTOR III if the plot and characters in KOTOR III suck? The point I'm trying to make is, PLOT and CHARACTERS are the PRIORITY above anything else for KOTOR III.

 

The game developers of KOTOR III (if it is made) need to focus on making a good, solid plot in which you go a new main character and you can set the genders/alignments of Revan and the Exile and also bring closure to the Revan/Exile/True Sith story-arch as well as tie up all the loose ends and answer the questions that need answering.

 

I don't think enough people are looking realistically at what the game developers of KOTOR III can actually do, size, time and costing must be taken into consideration when someone gives a plausible idea or suggestion regarding KOTOR III.

 

I have seen a lot of good suggestions as to what planets should be in KOTOR III, I'd say there should be seven to eigght planets in KOTOR III, just like in the previous KOTOR's and the planets we visit should be relevant to the plot and be good in terms of roleplaying, so the planets I suggest should be in KOTOR III are...

 

Coruscant

Alderaan

Slehyeron

M4-78

Mykr

Khar Shian

Ziost

Zonama Sekot (and no, the Yuuzhan Vong ARE NOT the 'True Sith but I've got something in mind plotwise in which the backstory makes a bit more sense in terms of what the 'True Sith' were doing in the unknown regions all this time, why they haven't returned for so long and why they went into the unknown regions in the first place)

[Dark Wastl]

Yup, that's exactly how I see it as well.

The story is what drives this series, it has to be top notch and I'm sure it will be top notch again, when KOTOR III comes out after "it is done".

 

I'd love to see a Happy End for the lightside ending. And I mean a real Happy Ending, not one of the "half of the people are dead but at least it's over" ones.

There is a time for such endings, but I don't think that it' would be a fitting ending for such a storyarch.

In this case, I mean something like a reunion of Revan and Bastila (or Carth for the females) plus a survival of all the other crew members of KOTOR I and II. There has been quite a bit of war over the last few years in the story, time to end it. If it's possible, without anything that makes the game downbeat.

 

As long as I get something like that, I'm happy

[Jediphile]

Yup, that's exactly how I see it as well.

The story is what drives this series, it has to be top notch and I'm sure it will be top notch again, when KOTOR III comes out after "it is done".

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Actually, it needs to be better than K2, since it needs to bring closure to several characters (not least Revan and Exile) as well as have a huge climactic ending that ties in with the other two games.

 

I'd love to see a Happy End for the lightside ending. And I mean a real Happy Ending, not one of the "half of the people are dead but at least it's over" ones.

There is a time for such endings, but I don't think that it' would be a fitting ending for such a storyarch.

 

In this case, I mean something like a reunion of Revan and Bastila (or Carth for the females) plus a survival of all the other crew members of KOTOR I and II. There has been quite a bit of war over the last few years in the story, time to end it. If it's possible, without anything that makes the game downbeat.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

But killing off characters is essential to underscore the danger of the main characters and the point that no great victory can be achieved without sacrifice.

 

That said, I did something along the lines of what you suggest in my own plot... Albeit with a few bitter consequences, particularly for Revan

[Dark Wastl]

You can kill some people off without touching the old crew for that

 

There is enough time in the game to create interesting characters which are expendable. Most of the old party members won't be in the new crew anyway, so these new characters would be much closer to the things which happen in KOTOR III, their death would be much more meaningful for your character. Disregarding Revan, the Exile and Bastila, of course, as they have a big impact on the overall storyarch.

 

But then again, you didn't have to lose any party members in KOTOR, so you don't necessarily need death if you want to create a fantastic story.

Edited June 17, 2006 by Dark Wastl

[TheHutt]

Well there are a couple ways you can look at it... here me out now.

 

KOTORIII would be the third installment in the soon to be trilogy of KOTOR games. When people say they want bigger and more in-depth experience when it comes to the planets, no where have they said they want this over the amazing plot and sidestories that KOTOR provides in the past. I think why not?! Why not just have both and make it a great KOTOR.

 

Now there are some flaws with that argument because.... some people would agree that the KOTOR series has always been small world experience, which, while small, still remains pretty rich, and allows the player to continue on with the story without getting lost//bored//etc.

 

But than there is the fact that this game would most likely be on the Xbox360 and PC, both pieces of hardware which have grown since the last installment of KOTOR. So there is that potential to have so more much in the game. Maybe be a part of a bigger and epic battle.

 

As long as people choose not to be stubborn and hang onto outdated ideas that a series needs to remain the exact same in structure and design in order to stay true to the series. If there were bigger//more planets and they felt a weakness in the story they would end up blaming the planets when maybe that had nothing to do with it at all.

 

In the end, people will always want another facet through which they can gain more knowledge on the Starwars Universe. This is what makes KOTOR's plot so interesting always, they have so much to draw from.

Edited June 17, 2006 by TheHutt

[Dark Wastl]

Technical possibilities are only one part of the problem, though. I'm sure the PC could have handled bigger planets years ago.

 

You need a reason why your character has to visit a certain planet and you need enough idea's to fill such a planet. More and bigger planets are only possible, if you spend more time on the game and have enough ideas to fill all the planets. The more time you spend on small sub-plots, the less you have for other parts of the game. If it had been possible to make the planets twice as big without making the overall product worse, they would have done it.

 

Hardware might get better every single day, but it isn't able to slow down time or make humans more creative. Hardware might be able to pull of photorealistic worlds the size of Earth some day, but that doesn't mean that it improves the game itself.

[Jediphile]

You can kill some people off without touching the old crew for that

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That sounds uncomfortably like Trek's "redshirting"

 

Besides, watching Jolee, Juhani and particularly Mission die in K1 was a massive emphasis on just what it means to embrace the dark side... Same with Vandar btw. That's difficult to get without doing it to characters you care about as a player. Why should I care if some extra or "crewman no. 6" (for those who've seen Galaxy Quest) gets killed? Did anyone care about Tiree or Hutch getting killed during Episode IV? Doubtful... Luke having his hand chopped off in Episode V was far more powerful, as was watching Han being merely frozen.

 

There is enough time in the game to create interesting characters which are expendable. Most of the old party members won't be in the new crew anyway, so these new characters would be much closer to the things which happen in KOTOR III, their death would be much more meaningful for your character. Disregarding Revan, the Exile and Bastila, of course, as they have a big impact on the overall storyarch.

 

But then again, you didn't have to lose any party members in KOTOR, so you don't necessarily need death if you want to create a fantastic story.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You don't need it, but you shouldn't shy away from it as a plot mechanic either. Of course, killing characters just for the drama of it is pointless. It must serve a greater purpose to the plot if it's to have true impact on the player and enhance the experience.

[Lord Satasn]

I agree with Jediphile, along those same lines...dont kill off people unless it's NEEDED and dont sacrifice ppl unless its NEEDED.

For example.

In k1, the first encounter with Malak was a joke, I was owning him. I'd hit him once, maybe twice, and it would skip to the cut scene of him putting me in stasis and all that bull****. Then I'd own him again and all of a sudden bastila sacrifices herself so we can escape and gets captured....as far as the way I was fighting him he would have been dead in moments and we would have ended the game right there...but they didnt make him hard enough, and didnt make bastila's decision to get captured believable....

 

They need to make the main bosses MUCH harder....

[Xard]

Well, first time when I met Malak on Leviathan it was quite tough fight. I won of course, but not that easily.

 

Making bosses to be very tough is hard on RPG's. They become easily overpowered, but even more easily pushovers

[Dark Wastl]

That sounds uncomfortably like Trek's "redshirting" 

 

Besides, watching Jolee, Juhani and particularly Mission die in K1 was a massive emphasis on just what it means to embrace the dark side... Same with Vandar btw. That's difficult to get without doing it to characters you care about as a player. Why should I care if some extra or "crewman no. 6" (for those who've seen Galaxy Quest) gets killed? Did anyone care about Tiree or Hutch getting killed during Episode IV? Doubtful... Luke having his hand chopped off in Episode V was far more powerful, as was watching Han being merely frozen.

 

 

You don't need it, but you shouldn't shy away from it as a plot mechanic either. Of course, killing characters just for the drama of it is pointless. It must serve a greater purpose to the plot if it's to have true impact on the player and enhance the experience.

 

I don't mean random soldiers.

Look at the crew in KOTOR II. Apart from Canderous and the droids it had nohting to do with the crew of the original game, yet you cared about them (or should have, for those who didn't).

 

Revan had his crew, just like the Exile had his crew. If you play a new character in KOTOR III, you will have your own crew as well. Characters you care about, characters who are important to you. They travel with you all the time, unlike those from the old crews who don't. They are much closer to your character than anyone from KOTOR I and II who isn't in your party.

 

In this case, these new characters play a much bigger role in the game than anyone from the old games not named Revan or maybe the Exile.

 

 

As for fights like the one against Malak on the Leviathan or the beginning of the fight against Nihilus; I don't know if the game mechanics had allowed it, but I would have tried to make them basically impossible to beat. Triple their health or something like that. That way it doesn't look like it is easy. I mean, you are not supposed to beat them at that point, you don't need the game to act like you can.

Edited June 17, 2006 by Dark Wastl

[SamuraiGaijin]

Regarding the Malak fight on the Leviathan, and the Sion fight on Korriban, for that matter ... I think encountering a major antagonist about halfway through the game is a pretty good idea ... the problem is, neither of you can die.

 

I agree 100% that the Malak fight was too easy ... but the plot wouldn't have worked with Malak beating Revan, taking Bastila, and leaving Revan alive.

 

Regarding character deaths ... I think they can be a good thing, if they are necessary to advance the plot ... "red shirt" deaths are not appreciated, especially if they kill off a character I care about for no apparent reason (i.e.: Tasha Yar ... and the Playboy pictorial wasn't even that good)

[Plano Skywalker]

Perhaps Korriban might have had another darker name in past times that might be revealed through a legacy of True Sith in K3.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

how about ancient Sith holocrons? I'd much rather find a cache of holocrons with people like Marka Ragnos speaking than the deck officer of the Peragus Mining Facility.

 

don't get me wrong, Peragus was well done. but I think the point is clear: there are ways to make the familiar new. Dantooine is another example....I'd love to see it again but there has to be something new....I don't know, maybe a long-distance adventure of some kind.

 

and I personally think Iziz would make a great urban hub for the game.

 

as someone else alluded to, part of the solution might be to have different segments of the game. just as you had no choice about when to go to Peragus or Malachor V, maybe there could be certain segments inside the "middle game" in which you are seperated from your ship and go to a certain world during that time.

you can't go back, since the world is not on your astrocharts. since this segment would be linear, it would allow the devs to have a lot of quests, FMV sequences and lush terrain (since they know no one will miss out on it).

 

I like having freedom in the middle game but I wouldn't mind if the middle game worlds were often little more than trading posts and side quests. I have no problem with much of the main plot being on worlds that I cannot return to.

[Guest Ajunta Pall]

In my opinion, these are all great ideas.

 

First, I think that KOTOR III should be targeted towards Next-Gen graphics, physics, and particle effects. Second, more physical maneuvers and feats should be included for combat use.

[ralf_snake]

I hope i make a comback in kotor 3 :D

[DAWUSS]

I wanna' see Force Crush in a highly detailed GCI movie