KotoR 3: Ideas and Suggestions

[Shryke]

sounds pretty good

[Jediphile]

Hmmm, I don't know about a Sith academy on Dagobah, particularly not when it's location seems to serve no particular purpose in the plot. The plot really wouldn't play out any differently if you just placed the academy on Korriban, which is already established as a site for a Sith academy in KotOR, and besides, the Sith academy doesn't seem to serve much purpose either, given that you leave it almost immediately.

 

I'm also doubtful of Revan's entry. The whole point of K2 was that he/she was in the unknown regions fighting the true Sith, so I'd be more inclined to say that that's where we should find him/her if at all.

 

You also manage to make the jedi seem like an invasion force assaulting the Sith as they peacefully go about teaching their students. That just seems wrong, somehow. I'd much rather have it the other way around - a jedi academy attacked by the Sith.

 

Also, if there enough jedi to assault the academy and even have a spy on the inside, then that kind of undermines the point of K2 that the jedi were very close to having been completely wiped out. The jedi order might have recovered in time, but since you place the beginning of the story right at the end of K2, it does seem to conflict with that point of K2 and so take away from the severity of it.

 

Anyway, my two credits...

[SteveThaiBinh]

You also manage to make the jedi seem like an invasion force assaulting the Sith as they peacefully go about teaching their students. That just seems wrong, somehow. I'd much rather have it the other way around - a jedi academy attacked by the Sith.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Isn't that one of the issues explored in the latest movie? Is it justified for Jedi to attack and kill Sith for no other reason than that they are Sith? I'd rather see Jedi attacking a Sith Academy, for the ambiguities involved. After all, there are bound to be children there...

 

Nah, LucasArts would never allow it.

[metadigital]

Jedis do hide / deceive / disguise their intentions ... when it's tactically sound:

- Ep2: Anakin was tasked with protecting Padme, and they travelled incognito to Naboo; Obi-wan used tactical deception to evade Jango Fett in the asteroid field and then follow him to the planet's surface, and spy on the separatist meeting

- Ep3: Obi-Wan on Utapao - arrived with a flourish, then hid and remained behind as his ship returned in order to sneak up on General Greivous (granted, he dropped in on Greivous in just about the most "unsubtle" way since the "hostile negotiations" on the droid ship at the beginning of Ep1); the Jedi Council asked Anakin to spy on Chancellor Palpatine

- Ep4: Obi-Wan suggested hiding once the Millenium Falcon was being tractored into the Death Star - even Han Solo complained about all the "sneaking around", and then made his way from the hangar to the tractor beam power deal and back without being detected by anyone but Vader (who probably still had some of the "force bond" left over with his old master)

 

I see LS Jedi Sentinels and Watchmen as investigators, and as such stealth and deception have their place.  I just wish stealth worked a bit better, or the adversaries and PC's had three modes of awareness - in the d20 system, a "take 0" mode for running/fighting, a "take 10" mode for casual observation (while walking), and a "take 20" mode for active searching (standing still).  The default mode for anything but a stationary droid/turret on guard duty should be "take 10" until a stealthed PC/NPC is initially detected, then switch to "take 20" with a visible change of stance (giving an alert Jedi PC a chance to "mind trick" them back to "take 10").

 

As far as disguising your lightsaber as something else (a hydrospanner, etc.) - I think that's probably going a bit too far - just keep it up your sleeve (like Palpatine).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, yes, yes. As a battle tactic (i.e. hiding to gain the advantage of surpirse), I can see it being useful. As a diplomatic tactic, it is also sound; but that is more a deception of intent, not of presence.

 

Obviously, if you are outnumbered several million to one (e.g. Millennium Falcon tractored into the Death Star in ANH), and facing extirpation, then discretion is definitely the better part of valour. Or, as Yoda and Obi-Wan did at the end of RotS, a strategic retreat to regroup is essential (even Sun Tzu would approve).

 

But outright sneaking around, like an assassin, is not a Jedi tactic.

[metadigital]

It would be nice (or at least different) to start Kotor 3 as part of a team or gang that was already established.  It would make a change from always starting alone and confused and gaining allies one by one.  The relationships with your team could be interesting; there might be romances, betrayals, personality clashes and a dramatic death.

 

Pizza is optional.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, except building a team or gang is part of the fun, and where is the challenge if you start off with a bunch of people you don't even know? I agree that K2 did it wrong by keeping you alone for a very long time, but K1 had it right with one companion right from the beginning and then building on that.

 

However, I'm still hoping that K3 will begin with a young jedi PC with his or her own master from the very beginning, sort of like a Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan thing, where you take the apprentice part.

 

And stop talking about pizza - you're making me hungry!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually, I wouldn't mind cutting right down on companions, at least for some of the game.

 

Some of the best bits of K1 and K2 were solo, and considering the woeful implementation of the group combat dynamic of K2 (i.e. solo stealth mode to sneak up on a turret, and then your companions run into the fray ... ), I wouldn't mind starting off alone; or if with another, then a lengthy solo mission shortly after (maybe dual-solo missions, so that each can achieve some part of a joint goal).

[GhostofAnakin]

I'd really like to start the game as a Force sensitive who doesn't really know, or understand, these powers he has as he grows up. I was half kidding about the Undercity villagers, but the general concept of the PC starting out in some out-of-the-way tribe and being looked upon by the rest of the tribe as "different" because of these weird powers he seems to have (the Force).

 

Then the early stages of the game (and maybe throughout, for an added twist), he has poor control over his powers. For example, in early combat sometimes his Force powers just don't even respond when trying to use them on an opponent, or they even backfire (Force Stunning his friends and knocking them out of the fight rather than stunning his enemies).

[Vagrant 66]

Here's the last part of my story.

 

BACKLOG:

http://forums.obsidianent.com/index.php?showtopic=35628 - part 1-5

http://forums.obsidianent.com/index.php?sh...ic=35628&st=105 - Part 6

http://forums.obsidianent.com/index.php?sh...ic=35628&st=150 - Part 7

http://forums.obsidianent.com/index.php?sh...ic=35628&st=465 - part 8

http://forums.obsidianent.com/index.php?sh...ic=35818&st=135 - part 9

http://forums.obsidianent.com/index.php?sh...ic=35818&st=150 - part 10

 

 

Anyway, here's the final part.

--------------------------------------

Part 11

--------------------------------------

The Ebon Hawk flies towards the Throne of Naga Sadow. Light siders will have Ben tell them that he has contacted the Republic and the Jedi and that they will be

[hawk]

Hmmm, I don't know about a Sith academy on Dagobah, particularly not when it's location seems to serve no particular purpose in the plot. The plot really wouldn't play out any differently if you just placed the academy on Korriban, which is already established as a site for a Sith academy in KotOR, and besides, the Sith academy doesn't seem to serve much purpose either, given that you leave it almost immediately.

 

I'm also doubtful of Revan's entry. The whole point of K2 was that he/she was in the unknown regions fighting the true Sith, so I'd be more inclined to say that that's where we should find him/her if at all.

 

You also manage to make the jedi seem like an invasion force assaulting the Sith as they peacefully go about teaching their students. That just seems wrong, somehow. I'd much rather have it the other way around - a jedi academy attacked by the Sith.

 

Also, if there enough jedi to assault the academy and even have a spy on the inside, then that kind of undermines the point of K2 that the jedi were very close to having been completely wiped out. The jedi order might have recovered in time, but since you place the beginning of the story right at the end of K2, it does seem to conflict with that point of K2 and so take away from the severity of it.

 

Anyway, my two credits...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I appreciate your response Jediphile.

I will tell you what I had in mind about this. About the Sith academy on Dagobah. There are reasons why your character starts at a Sith academy and, as I said you ended up there. Later in the story more will become clear about your character. I choose Dagobah as the location since it is a pretty remote system far in the Outer Rim, It could be replaced with another planet but not Korriban. The Korriban academy is empty on Kotor II.

 

And quiet possibly, the "unknown regions" could have been much closer to the core then they were 4000 years later. If you look at the Star map on www.nav-computer.com you will notice that Dagobah is an Outer Rim world.

 

About the Jedi entering as in invasion force. No way. We are talking about Revan himself here, on his own, not the Jedi. Revan enters the academy but the Sith obviously recognizing Revan will try to kill him on site. If Revan would be Light side he will not kill a passive meditating Sith. Which isn't a thing which is happening. Also he will not kill you, which will say something.

The other way around, a Jedi academy being attacked by the Sith? Sure, it will happen. Just wait. That's all I am going to say right now.

 

I am curious as to how many Jedi you were thinking about in my story, the Jedi spy is something different. If there are almost no jedi left why wouldn't you send a spy into a Sith academy and try to turn Sith to the LS which is exactly what Trisha was trying to do with your character.

a line from Bastila: "What greater weapon is there to turn an enemy to your cause, to use there own knowledge against them".

 

I hope this answers your points.

 

O, now I understand. You tought about this line of Master Arath telling that the Jedi have entered the academy, well he is just overwhelmed by Revan's assault and thinks about a Jedi invasion force here. Haha, I made it a lot more dramatic then I thought, you also meet no Jedi other then Revan. Yeah, sure.

[Jediphile]

And quiet possibly, the "unknown regions" could have been much closer to the core then they were 4000 years later. If you look at the Star map on www.nav-computer.com you will notice that Dagobah is an Outer Rim world.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Perhaps, but if you look at the official maps, you'll note that worlds like Korriban, Yavin IV, Ossus, Nar Shaddaa, Sullust and Eriadu are also pretty far away from the core, which doesn't exactly suggest that Dagobah would have been unknown by the Republic at the time. In fact, Dagobah is only slightly further away from the core than Eriadu and Sullust, which are well established worlds in KotOR's era, and it actually seems to be to be closer than Yavin IV, Dantooine, or Korriban, which we have all visited in these games...

 

I am curious as to how many Jedi you were thinking about in my story, the Jedi spy is something different. If there are almost no jedi left why wouldn't you send a spy into a Sith academy and try to turn Sith to the LS which is exactly what Trisha was trying to do with your character.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Actually I wouldn't - I couldn't risk losing that jedi if she was discovered or, even worse, that she turned and joined the Sith against the order. Sure I'd want to convert Sith into Jedi, but at what price and what risk? Among the Sith she's even likely to be killed even if she isn't discovered if it suits the interests of some Sith opportunist...

[LeVeRRe]

Hawk,

 

I have a few notes, if you're interested.

 

1. On the topic of the Jedi infiltrator/spy character. Not sure if the Jedi would do this even if their ranks were in desperate decline as they are in the KOTOR series. If you know much of the EU, Ulic Qel-Droma was lost to the darkside if only for a time, upon trying to infiltrate the Krath, a lesser group of darksiders. The council warned him this would be the case, and if a Jedi as powerful as Ulic could fall to the Krath's lure, imagine how hard it would be in an actual Sith academy. Somehting you might want to bare in mind.

 

2. I agree with Jediphile about the use of Dagobah. You might want to consider if you are using it for the purpose of story, or if you are maybe using it out of a Yoda or movie loyalty. I think the purposes of your story could be served better on another planet. Just my thoughts.

 

3. You may want to elaborate on the DS option when Revan attacks you in the Sith academy. To me it read like Revan and you fought to a standstill (at least for a few blows) and then he retreated, blocking his path behind him. At this point it would make no logical sense to have it that way, as a Sith as powerful as Revan would not flee from a fight with a currently much weaker PC. Seems forced.

 

Hope these help or at least gave you another view on some of your story aspects.

 

Cheers, LeVeRRe

[hawk]

Jediphile / Leverre, thanks for your input.

 

About Dagobah, well I was examining the planets surrounding Dagobah and thought that none will make an appearance in the Kotor games. Sure I would place this academy on another world, Rattatak would be another idea. Might explain where their species lust for war came from. But I would like Dagobah since:

 

People would like to see some worlds they know about and I considered it a bit of a cliffhanger.

 

Dagobah is strong in the Dark side of the force which will grap the interest of the Sith.

 

A planet that wouldn't fit in my storyline would be a planet on the "eastern" side of the galaxy (near Ziost) since then, it should have been a known planet as well.

 

About the spy character. Yes, there are risks.

How big where the risks to:

1) Send Revan in charge of finding the starmaps to find the star forge

2) Send Luke Skywalker, an "untrained Jedi" after Darth Vader and the Emperor

 

You will find out later why I choose the spy thing since the main character is very important to return to the jedi. My main character isn't "just another very powerful Jedi".

Which will also explain later why a very powerful Sith Lord (Revan) actually fought you to a standstill and then left. Yeah, just wait. Do you allready have an idea where this is going?

 

Hmm, the last question, does anyone ever consider that Ziost should have been a known planet at that time, being so close to Korriban?

We all seem to want to end on this planet with Naga Sadows throne.

[hawk]

Another reply to Vagrant's story:

 

"And everything here just clicks into place". Good job!

 

A change in my storyline. It will take place a year or 2 after the events of Kotor II. I discovered some problems if it takes place at the end of Kotor II.

[Calax]

If they really wanted to be cheap they might just make a new engine but have you port your exile and continue his story from the end of Kotor2.

[hawk]

Well Calax I certainly hope they wouldn't do that.

 

Here is part two of my story

 

I do have a few words before I continue with the next chapter:

A true Sith academy could well be on Dagobah. Remember that Revan is a person who is able to move in a spaceship. If Revan discovered there would be a true Sith academy on Dagobah, he would no doubt leave the unknown regions and go to this place. Dagobah is one of the best hiding places in the galaxy, you know.

 

I have thought about using the hidden Jedi academy on Telos to go next but I decided against this from a game playing point of view because I wouldn

[Jediphile]

Dagobah is strong in the Dark side of the force which will grap the interest of the Sith.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Quite true, but we still have no idea why that is. Yavin IV is also strong in the force, but that's because Naga Sadow built his temple there, and probably because Exar Kun made his base there as well. Yoda is on Dagobah 4000 years after the KotOR era, and a lot of stuff can happen in that time... It would really be a shame to place the academy there and then discover later that what caused the place to be strong in the dark side didn't happen until a few thousand years later...

 

About the spy character. Yes, there are risks.

How big where the risks to:

1) Send Revan in charge of finding the starmaps to find the star forge

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That was Revan's choice, and certainly not the choice of the jedi council. They didn't even want him to fight the Mandalorians, and note how Malak comments to Revan in the flashback cutscene on Dantooine that they will be expelled from the jedi order if they pursue their search for the starmaps.

 

2) Send Luke Skywalker, an "untrained Jedi" after Darth Vader and the Emperor

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

In ESB Luke went against the wishes of Yoda and Ben - they knew he wasn't ready, but he felt compelled to save his friends and went anyway. In ROTJ they sent him, but not because they were willing to take a risk as much as because they had no other choice - he was now trained as much as he could be.

 

Hmm, the last question, does anyone ever consider that Ziost should have been a known planet at that time, being so close to Korriban?

We all seem to want to end on this planet with Naga Sadows throne.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I'm fairly certain that Ziost is still unknown. After all, none of the Sith worlds were known when the Daragons found Korriban, and even though Empress Teta found her way into Sith space by following the fleeing Naga Sadow, she still did not let her fleet stay there any longer than necessary to bring down the remnants of the Sith fleets after the battle between the forces of Naga Sadow and Ludo Kressh. We don't even know which system this all took place in. However, it was unlikely to be Ziost, I think, and there is nothing to suggest that the fleet of Empress Teta retained any useful knowledge of Sith space and the locations of its worlds. It seems more likely to me that the Republic simply expanded to learn of more worlds in the meantime and that Sith worlds like Korriban and Malachor became known that way. And even so, Kreia says that these worlds are on the borders of the true Sith empire.

 

Oh, and my plot didn't end on Ziost

[Jediphile]

You will notice that I will bring back Master Vandar into the story. Some of you might say that he died on Katarr or got blown up with his ship if Revan was DS.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The trouble I have with that is that we actually saw Vandar die in the dark side ending of K1. Yes, you can argue escape pod, but it didn't seem to me that there was time for it, and even if we assume it, he's right in the middle of a battle in Sith space... Looks like the end for Vandar in any event, at lest to me, and the point of Vandar being killed on Katarr, would appear to have been thrown in there to confirm that, yes, he's quite died, whether he was killed by Revan's deception or not. Besides, if he was still alive, then what was he doing during the crisis of K2? You could argue the same for the Sunriders, I guess, but then they were not on the council...

 

force lessons from Master Vandar. After you complete the tasks, you will head out to solve a murder quest, hunt down some threatening beasts and find a crystal cave which is the source of the threatening beasts.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

This all sounds awfully similar to the whole Dantooine part of K1. I'd suggest you try to revise this bit to make it seem less like K1. Have smuggerls use the crystal cave as a base of operations and the PC track them there while investigating a crime or something like that. I'd even get rid of the cave if there is a viable alternative.

 

Upon heading out of the cave you will be confronted by Shaela and HK-47, Shaela is a bounty hunter sent by the true sith to capture or kill you. When you defeat her and HK-47 Shaela says you should kill her. Naturally, you don

[JediMasterNalik]

in kotor 2 when you learn light saber forms i want the guy to change stances

[metadigital]

I'd really like to start the game as a Force sensitive who doesn't really know, or understand, these powers he has as he grows up.  I was half kidding about the Undercity villagers, but the general concept of the PC starting out in some out-of-the-way tribe and being looked upon by the rest of the tribe as "different" because of these weird powers he seems to have (the Force).

 

Then the early stages of the game (and maybe throughout, for an added twist), he has poor control over his powers.  For example, in early combat sometimes his Force powers just don't even respond when trying to use them on an opponent, or they even backfire (Force Stunning his friends and knocking them out of the fight rather than stunning his enemies).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That was my idea!

 

The good bit, the bit about the FS with no clue. (The sucky bit about the poor control over Force Powers wasn't; that belongs in a Harry Potter film.)

 

I think it's necessary for someone who is not a Jedi nor a Sith to do a complete overhaul of the Jedi code; it needs to be taken out and shaken hard, and then put back together from the ground up. Someone who has been inculcated into the Jedi order at a young age is not really in a position to do that, nor would a Sith be interested in the LS, regardless of ethical compass. Certainly anyone reading Sith material seems to be instantly Sithified.

 

So that just leaves someone who is neither Sith nor Jedi, but who has a strong LS leaning, to come and knock the kinks out of the Jedi code, in time for the films ...

[hawk]

Thanks for your input Jediphile,

 

here are my answers.

 

About the dagobah question. Yes, we don't know and that is the reason that they could build a Sith academy there for Kotor III. Nobody ever build a story about what happened 2000 years before ANH so we can't find out now.

 

The send Revan quest.

I am referring to what happened in Kotor I. Revan and Bastila found the starmap on Dantooine the Jedi Council gave Revan the order to find the Star Forge

It is a great risk, true. But there are reasons for this which will be explained later.

 

The Luke Skywalker quest.

Believe me when I say it is of at least paramount importance to them that you return to the Jedi. I guess you don't want to hear to many spoilers, I do wonder what you think I am up to.

 

Ziost quest

You may be right about that. And yes, I know your plot doesn't end on Ziost but it will be near the end or the end that all our storylines will take place on Ziost.

 

Master Vandar quest

Yes well, you can set Revan as a DSider and you will see Vrook telling you that Vandar died on Katarr (in the Jedi Enclave) so he didn't die on the Star forge. I guess he could be still alive. What he was doing in Kotor II. Hiding, like Bastila, Zez Kai Ell and to a lesser extent Kavar and Vrook. Possibly he cut of his connection to the force to stay hidden from Nihilus.

 

The Jedi Training quest

Well, by the time that we play Kotor III, the original Kotor will not be on anyone's harddrive any more. It might be allright to develop another story but I guess Crystal caves should appear in each game, don't you think.

 

Shaela quest

If you look closely you see that the bad guys are making lots of mistakes. They send Calo Nord after a Jedi and when that fails, Darth Bandon and also some minor Dark Jedi on Kashyyyk and Tatooine. What about weak Sith assasins who the Exile just hack into pieces. In Vagrant's Storyline they sent Canderous against a Jedi.

They think a force sensitive bounty hunter could do the job. Well, I thought about coming up with an idea to get an extra party member and bring back the Ebon Hawk to you.

 

Vandar as party member

But nobody have ever seen him in combat. Bastila was level 4 after we rescue her on Taris and she was with the strike team to capture Revan. T3-M4 will start as a level 3 droid in Kotor II while we leveled him up to 20 in Kotor I.

And the list goes on. How much combat has Carth, Canderous, Atton, Mira and so on seen to begin at a level below 10 in our games?

You could say that he cut of his connection to the force to bring him back, maybe to much Kotor II ish, I guess but also logical.

 

Shaela - Mira connection

Yes, I developed Shaela as a replacement for Mira since Mira could very well have died on Kotor II and if she didn't, well then Kreia tells you she would die on an Unknown planet or on Ord Mantell and I would like her back. I believe Vagrant also made Darth Aumen as some sort of replacement for Yuthura Ban.

New Idea's are off course quiet all right but I think we have got a lot of idea's and I picked up one. Maybe John Dodonna is also to much like Carth. Trisha is a very new concept. allthough there are better I admit. Okay, I do say that there are some NPC's that join you later that are really new.

 

Why do we go to these places. Yes, sorry I didn't explain very well. You go there to find Naga Sadows holocrons except for Coruscant which is merely to solve some quests and discuss plans for the future, with the right people of course.

 

Thanks for your responses again Jediphile.

 

To JedimasterNalik. That is what he is also going to show you! We need a "Yoda" Species as an NPC!!! At least, I think that you want Vandar to show you the Lightsaber forms, right?!

[Calax]

degobahs' darksiddedness comes from a Dark Jedi who fled there during the clone wars from Bpfsssh (i have no clue how it's spelled) Just wanted to clear that little bit up, but I think Jediphile might have said that before in this thread.

 

And for the Record the DJ was killed by Yoda.

[The Coordinator]

Saberwhips are part of the EU canon 

 

Leatherish looking powered armor existed in KotOR as a buyable at Yavin Station. 

 

Woo woo! Me for the win!  :D

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Saberwhips.... it

[LeVeRRe]

Hawk,

 

A couple points. First of before I do, it seems in your last response to Jediphile that you sounded a bit defensive. If that was not the case, be aware that it reads that way, at least to me. I thought the reason for posting a story on the forum would be to have people find possible areas of improvement, voice opinions or point out flaws in continuity that perhaps you were not aware of. My posts are simply there as constructive criticism to you in an attempt to guide your creative process a bit, or refine it.

 

1. To add to the Revan being sent after the Star Maps issue. He was ordered by the council after having taken every precaution they had. However they knew it was still a risk. They did so because they had no other choice not because it was a sound strategy. Revan's shattered mind was the only clue to follow.

 

2. A viamently agree that Vandar shoudl not be a party member. I personally thought his death was all but covered as best as they could do in KOTOR2, but that is not the problem I see in it. If you look hard enough for holes, you could bring almost any character in any film, book, etc back to life, because you never actually saw it, or the doctor didn't check a pulse, etc. It seems you're stretching out of a yoda species loyalty. The real reason I disagree with your choice to include him is that you have him join the party. Jediphile raised very logical issues as to his far to high level to be included. Your Bastilla comment had merit, but remember she was a member of the strike team, but she was neither a master or a vertern Jedi as the game outlines. She was a young Jedi strong in the force in the area of battle meditation. Vandar was a Jedi Master on the council, and saying that you never saw him fight with a lightsaber is not justification as he could be more focused on force control, etc. There is no possible way that he could be lower than level 20, as both characters from KOTOR and KOTOR2 were absurdly strong and were not Jedi masters, at least yet. I think if you really want a Yoda species character introduce a new one, don't rehash a familiar face.

 

3. In addition to the above point, you argued that T3 started at level 3 in KOTOR2 after being powerful. This was explained in the beginning in convo about having lost functionality and what not in battles. Not the best excuse, but believable for a droid to a degreee. It was still considered a flaw to most. Unless Vandar lost his memory (please god no) it could not be explained logically.

 

4. If you want to include characters that are reminiscent of former characters feel free, I will not challenge you in that. I simply would like to raise the issue that a truly good story is often a great story because of its originality in plot and character. A new and unique character would please me a lot more than a clone of an old character, no matter how much I liked them. Just food for thought there.

 

There yah go, LeVeRRe

[Shryke]

3. In addition to the above point, you argued that T3 started at level 3 in KOTOR2 after being powerful.  This was explained in the beginning in convo about having lost functionality and what not in battles.  Not the best excuse, but believable for a droid to a degreee.  It was still considered a flaw to most.  Unless Vandar lost his memory (please god no) it could not be explained logically.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

what about Candyman?

[metadigital]

...

3. In addition to the above point, you argued that T3 started at level 3 in KOTOR2 after being powerful.  This was explained in the beginning in convo about having lost functionality and what not in battles.  Not the best excuse, but believable for a droid to a degreee.  It was still considered a flaw to most.  Unless Vandar lost his memory (please god no) it could not be explained logically.

 

4. If you want to include characters that are reminiscent of former characters feel free, I will not challenge you in that.  I simply would like to raise the issue that a truly good story is often a great story because of its originality in plot and character.  A new and unique character would please me a lot more than a clone of an old character, no matter how much I liked them.  Just food for thought there.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

3. T3 might have just been cannibalised for scrap, and some of her experience lost in the barbarity of the process. Or, Revan might have gimped the little one, in order to prevent her from becoming too large a threat ... "

 

4. Just leave old characters as cameos. Don't include Canderous (again!) or anyone else in the main party: for sanity's sake, people get old, y'know? Not fit for galavanting around the galaxy getting shot at.

 

New blood. New story. New ideas. New. Not OLD.

[hawk]

Hawk,

 

A couple points.  First of before I do, it seems in your last response to Jediphile that you sounded a bit defensive.  If that was not the case, be aware that it reads that way, at least to me.  I thought the reason for posting a story on the forum would be to have people find possible areas of improvement, voice opinions or point out flaws in continuity that perhaps you were not aware of.  My posts are simply there as constructive criticism to you in an attempt to guide your creative process a bit, or refine it.

One's again thank you for your input. Yes, after I read my last post I was also just a bit shocked to see my writing. I have edited the post to make it more reasonable. Sorry about this, (I guess Jediphile is reading this as well).

 

1. To add to the Revan being sent after the Star Maps issue.  He was ordered by the council after having taken every precaution they had.  However they knew it was still a risk.  They did so because they had no other choice not because it was a sound strategy.  Revan's shattered mind was the only clue to follow.

 

Yes off course, I understand. In my story they take a great risk as well. But they do have a reason which will be explained in another part of my story.. I would love to know what you think I am up to.....

 

2. A viamently agree that Vandar should not be a party member.  I personally thought his death was all but covered as best as they could do in KOTOR2, but that is not the problem I see in it.  If you look hard enough for holes, you could bring almost any character in any film, book, etc back to life, because you never actually saw it, or the doctor didn't check a pulse, etc.  It seems you're stretching out of a yoda species loyalty.  The real reason I disagree with your choice to include him is that you have him join the party.  Jediphile raised very logical issues as to his far to high level to be included.  Your Bastilla comment had merit, but remember she was a member of the strike team, but she was neither a master or a vertern Jedi as the game outlines.  She was a young Jedi strong in the force in the area of battle meditation.  Vandar was a Jedi Master on the council, and saying that you never saw him fight with a lightsaber is not justification as he could be more focused on force control, etc.  There is no possible way that he could be lower than level 20, as both characters from KOTOR and KOTOR2 were absurdly strong and were not Jedi masters, at least yet.  I think if you really want a Yoda species character introduce a new one, don't rehash a familiar face.

 

Thinking about this, I guess if he would like to remain undetected from Sith Assasins and most important off all Nihilus he could have cut of his connection to the force till Nihilus was defeated. Yes, I know I am referring to much Kotor II but the thought of it, it could be very logical.

 

3. In addition to the above point, you argued that T3 started at level 3 in KOTOR2 after being powerful.  This was explained in the beginning in convo about having lost functionality and what not in battles.  Not the best excuse, but believable for a droid to a degreee.  It was still considered a flaw to most.  Unless Vandar lost his memory (please god no) it could not be explained logically.

 

See the above answer.

 

4. If you want to include characters that are reminiscent of former characters feel free, I will not challenge you in that.  I simply would like to raise the issue that a truly good story is often a great story because of its originality in plot and character.  A new and unique character would please me a lot more than a clone of an old character, no matter how much I liked them.  Just food for thought there.

 

Okay, I respect your opinion. Just a question, what do you think about it that you set foot on Dantooine and Korriban in both games?

 

There yah go, LeVeRRe