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This has probably been discussed before and if so I probably missed it. When you talk to Canderous he tells you that the Sith came to them with an offer to fight in one of the greatest battles of all time. Who were these Sith and why did they retreat back to their empire? Are these leftover Sith from Exar Kun or could these be the new Sith Lords. Sidious started a war to gain power could these three have done the same? If this is the case then why did Revan claim to be Dark Lord of the Sith? :blink::huh: I am bored so here's to some good posts.

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This has probably been discussed before and if so I probably missed it. When you talk to Canderous he tells you that the Sith came to them with an offer to fight in one of the greatest battles of all time. Who were these Sith and why did they retreat back to their empire? Are these leftover Sith from Exar Kun or could these be the new Sith Lords. Sidious started a war to gain power could these three have done the same? If this is the case then why did Revan claim to be Dark Lord of the Sith?  ;)  :huh:  I am bored so here's to some good posts.

 

That's what they like to refer to in the industry as a "Bio Blunder". ;)


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This has probably been discussed before and if so I probably missed it. When you talk to Canderous he tells you that the Sith came to them with an offer to fight in one of the greatest battles of all time. Who were these Sith and why did they retreat back to their empire? Are these leftover Sith from Exar Kun or could these be the new Sith Lords. Sidious started a war to gain power could these three have done the same? If this is the case then why did Revan claim to be Dark Lord of the Sith?  ;)  :huh:  I am bored so here's to some good posts.

Yes it is interesting, it does seem to be a mistake by bioware. I wonder if obsidian will address this but i dont think so as it was not a major plot point.


Another great idea by the people who brought you beer milkshakes!

 

"I don't see a problem...then again, SW isn't my life, so what do I know...." - some who makes 27.8 post per day on a SW forum!

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Read "Sith War" comic book. Exar Kun's right hand man Ulic Qel Droma came to mandalorian planet Kuar and in single combat duel defeated their leader Mandalore (who earlier demanded the duel). Then Mandalore sweared loyalty to Ulic and promised his aid in Sith conflict with the Republic. Mandalorians had most modern army in the galaxy by that time and this event fueled the sith potential greatly. The entire sith army of Exar Kun was comprised by: military machine of Empress Teta System, Mandalorians recruited by Qel Droma and millions of Masassi warriors that inhabited Yavin IV (they were remnants of original sith race and Exar Kun discovered them). With this army Ulic who was an excellent strategist, nearly conquered Coruscant and later eliminated most of Republic's armies. Republic prevailed but I won't tell how - buy this cheap comic on Amazon and find out...


HERMOCRATES:

Nur Ab Sal was one such king. He it was, say the wise men of Egypt, who first put men in the colossus, making many freaks

of nature at times when the celestial spheres were well aligned.

 

SOCRATES:

This I doubt. We are hearing a child's tale.

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Nur Ab Sal, stop plugging TOTJ. :p

 

Anyways, I was under the impression it was remnants of Exar Kun's group or perhaps the Krath were the ones that Canderous mentioned. It is also the reason why I think they're the ones that introduced Revan & Malak to the Sith cult.

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Why not? KOTOR originated from TOTJ and everybody should know this classic series. And I think that Canderous was speaking about previous war (with exar kun) becouse in that war Mandalorians were fighting with the Republic and aiding

the Sith. After the Great Sith War Mandalorians retreated to the Outer Rim, there rebuilded their forces and several decades later started the war that introduced Revan.

 

And I hope that Krath will have some role in TSL storyline. This is probably most important secret society of that era...


HERMOCRATES:

Nur Ab Sal was one such king. He it was, say the wise men of Egypt, who first put men in the colossus, making many freaks

of nature at times when the celestial spheres were well aligned.

 

SOCRATES:

This I doubt. We are hearing a child's tale.

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The mysterious offer from the Sith makes me think that maybe Revan and Malak's turn to the Darkside and subsequent conquest of the galaxy was all part of some greater plot.

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The mysterious offer from the Sith makes me think that maybe Revan and Malak's turn to the Darkside and subsequent conquest of the galaxy was all part of some greater plot.

 

That's my whole theory right there in a nutshell. The Dark Lord of the Sith and Sith Lords usually, I would guess, rule for a significant amount of time but Revan and Malak lasted for what... two, three years!?! There has to be something going on bigger than Revan and Malak and I think that these Sith Lords have something to do with it and the mysterious Sith I mentioned in my post. Just have to wait and see I guess. :ph34r:

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didnt revan and malak lasted 5 years?

 

and besides revan lead a very agressive war against the republic... they had to be stopped quicly or the rep would have fallen.

 

though one thing does strikes as odd. if they needed about the whole jedi order to stop exar kun then why does it take one very lousy jedi padawan named bastila to board his/her ship????

 

even when malak fired on rvn's bridge it still seems too easy to me.

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The Force matey. The force decided it.

Bastila used her Battle Meditation to help the jedi board Revan's ship, and if u notice, in the cutscene where Bastila confronts Revan, there r 3 other jedi with her. Malak saw his oppurtunity and fired.

In the end, it was the force.

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didnt revan and malak lasted 5 years?

 

and besides revan lead a very agressive war against the republic... they had to be stopped quicly or the rep would have fallen.

 

though one thing does strikes as odd. if they needed about the whole jedi order to stop exar kun then why does it take one very lousy jedi padawan named bastila to board his/her ship????

 

even when malak fired on rvn's bridge it still seems too easy to me.

 

I believe Revan and Malak came back 5 years before the events of Kotor but they only lasted 2 or 3 years. I believe it's Master Dorak who tells you the whole timeline.

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maybe this could be wrong but revan and malak arranged the war as an excuse to hunt for the star forge

 

No, Malak and Revan didn't arrange the war. When these "Sith" came to the Mandalorians with their "offer" Revan and Malak were Jedi. What they did do was tell everyone they were going to get the last of the Mandalorians in unknown space as an excuse to find the Star Forge.

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Well for one, Canderous isn't speaking of the Exar Kun war. He's talking about after the war the Sith came to them. He says something like,"The Sith Came to us with an offer, to fight a worthy enemy. Afterwards the Sith locked themselves in their Sector cutting themselves off from the rest of the Galaxy." It's something like that or close to it.

 

Canderous coudn't have been talking about the sith War because Ulic didn't offer Mandalore anything. If it was the EK war Canderous would ahve said so, not go into a whole new story about how, after the whole offer thing, they conquered the outer rim worlds to prepare for the Mandalorian Wars.


KOTOR 2 must be completed

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That's what they like to refer to in the industry as a "Bio Blunder".    :)

 

No, it's what's called people not understanding the plot.

 

The Sith convinced the Mandalorians to start the Mandalorian war. At the end of the war, when Revan and Malak had gone bad, they went hunting for the Star Forge. Once they found it, Revan would have slain the Dark Lord of the Sith and taken the position himself. It makes perfect sense.

 

I'd hardly see the Sith who convinced the Mandalorians as some strange, mysterious faction. It was probably just whoever was the leader of the Sith before Revan took over.

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That's what they like to refer to in the industry as a "Bio Blunder".    ;)

 

No, it's what's called people not understanding the plot.

 

The Sith convinced the Mandalorians to start the Mandalorian war. At the end of the war, when Revan and Malak had gone bad, they went hunting for the Star Forge. Once they found it, Revan would have slain the Dark Lord of the Sith and taken the position himself. It makes perfect sense.

 

I'd hardly see the Sith who convinced the Mandalorians as some strange, mysterious faction. It was probably just whoever was the leader of the Sith before Revan took over.

 

 

Wrong.

 

If it contradicts EU, then it isn't cannon. Obviously, you haven't read Tales of the Jedi. Otherwise, you would realize that your half-assed explanation actually contradicts the events following the war with Exar Kun. There simply was no 'empire for the Sith to retreat into' as Canderous explained. :)

 

'Tis false, counterfactual, erroneous, inaccurate, specious, unsound and untrue. :D

 

After all you don't earn the title of "Bio weenie" for nothing. ;)


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I am amazed both by bugs made by uneducated bioweniee devs and by blind faith

that gamers put in that bugs. People try to understand that KOTOR originated from EU (which means that it should be rated by EU standards) and if you don't know EU just don't discuss. Canderous is a primitive macho and what he says is not always truth. Sith Empire disappeared during decades that followed Great Hyperspace War - 1000 years before KOTOR events. Exar Kun left some assassins and acolytes after he was defeated and they maybe corrupted Revan during Mandalorian War. But there wasn't any "sith empire" in KOTOR times (just like there's no title "darth" - it appeared 3000 years later) simply becouse Republic would destroy any official sith rule (before mandalorian war republic was strong enough to handle Exar's orphans and they were hiding) The word of devs is worthless compared to the official canon and better read some EU info before you post.

 

At least Tales of the Jedi were designed by the best - like Tom Veitch and Kevin Anderson who is one of prominent american writers. A pity that they didn't took over KOTOR's storyline (cause then it would be better linked with EU and more ancient) and instead of them some bioware lackeys made it - the effects are pathetic (neverwinter nights clone + lack of real EU knowledge). Only graphics, music and NPCs development are superb. Rest is let's say moderate.

 

I remember how Avellone was speculating about existence of the Sith Empire during KOTOR...no comment really but good that Anderson didn't hear that total nonsense.

 

Is it so difficult to read those 6-7 comics and feel the climate of the ancient era instead of copying everything from the movies (from yoda to tie fighters)?

 

Let's hope that KOTOR 3 will be made by Lucasarts and real EU specialists like James Luceno (who is for sure better author than all those bioware devs) will be in charge of the storyline.

 

Eventually Lucasarts' Jedi Academy is more close to EU than KOTOR - just look at Korriban.


HERMOCRATES:

Nur Ab Sal was one such king. He it was, say the wise men of Egypt, who first put men in the colossus, making many freaks

of nature at times when the celestial spheres were well aligned.

 

SOCRATES:

This I doubt. We are hearing a child's tale.

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QUOTE(Master Jedi @ Sep 22 2004, 07:37 PM)

maybe this could be wrong but revan and malak arranged the war as an excuse to hunt for the star forge

 

No, Malak and Revan didn't arrange the war. When these "Sith" came to the Mandalorians with their "offer" Revan and Malak were Jedi. What they did do was tell everyone they were going to get the last of the Mandalorians in unknown space as an excuse to find the Star Forge.

 

they were publicly known as still being jedi but who's to say when they were corrupted, by the way malak was talking to revan as they find the star map on dantooine they were still jedi, and it sounds like they go off to fight the mandalorians and come back as sith, and since they may not have visited the star map after defeating the mandalorians it is feasible that they find it before the war and become sith but put on a jedi front, to get support of their army that was turned into the sith.

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I am amazed both by bugs made by uneducated bioweniee devs and by blind faith

that gamers put in that bugs. People try to understand that KOTOR originated from EU (which means that it should be rated by EU standards) and if you don't know EU just don't discuss. Canderous is a primitive macho and what he says is not always truth. Sith Empire disappeared during decades that followed Great Hyperspace War - 1000 years before KOTOR events. Exar Kun left some assassins and acolytes after he was defeated and they maybe corrupted Revan during Mandalorian War. But there wasn't any "sith empire" in KOTOR times (just like there's no title "darth" - it appeared 3000 years later) simply becouse Republic would destroy any official sith rule (before mandalorian war republic was strong enough to handle Exar's orphans and they were hiding) The word of devs is worthless compared to the official canon and better read some EU info before you post.

 

At least Tales of the Jedi were designed by the best - like Tom Veitch and Kevin Anderson who is one of prominent american writers. A pity that they didn't took over KOTOR's storyline (cause then it would be better linked with EU and more ancient) and instead of them some bioware lackeys made it - the effects are pathetic  (neverwinter nights clone + lack of real EU knowledge). Only graphics, music and NPCs development are superb. Rest is let's say moderate.

 

I remember how Avellone was speculating about existence of the Sith Empire during KOTOR...no comment really but good that Anderson didn't hear that total nonsense.

 

Is it so difficult to read those 6-7 comics and feel the climate of the ancient era instead of copying everything from the movies (from yoda to tie fighters)?

 

Let's hope that KOTOR 3 will be made by Lucasarts and real EU specialists like James Luceno (who is for sure better author than all those bioware devs) will be in charge of the storyline.

 

Eventually Lucasarts' Jedi Academy is more close to EU than KOTOR - just look at Korriban.

 

Preach it to them brother! thbup.gif


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People should also keep in mind that canderous tells his tale from his perspective,this beeing the perspective of a soilder who almost certanly didn't have all the facts of the events,this is not saying that he is lying but that he tells his tales as HE belived they unfolded.

Spend a significent time talking to veterans of WWII and you will realize that more often than not the common soilder knew very little of how and why events came to unfold,most of their "knowledge" came from rumors,speculations and propaganda,needing to see some larger picture the common soilder often constructet a image of truth whitch most of them will cling to even to this day..however untrue it might be.

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There were still Sith After the Exar Kun war. In the Clone War game it shows a picture of the past that has thousands of sith fighting the Jedi. Not to mention in the Sith War comics we only know what happened to 3 of the 20 Exar Kun had.

 

I'm sure many of these Sith survived and went back home.


KOTOR 2 must be completed

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I am amazed both by bugs made by uneducated bioweniee devs and by blind faith

that gamers put in that bugs. People try to understand that KOTOR originated from EU (which means that it should be rated by EU standards) and if you don't know EU just don't discuss. Canderous is a primitive macho and what he says is not always truth. Sith Empire disappeared during decades that followed Great Hyperspace War - 1000 years before KOTOR events. Exar Kun left some assassins and acolytes after he was defeated and they maybe corrupted Revan during Mandalorian War. But there wasn't any "sith empire" in KOTOR times (just like there's no title "darth" - it appeared 3000 years later) simply becouse Republic would destroy any official sith rule (before mandalorian war republic was strong enough to handle Exar's orphans and they were hiding) The word of devs is worthless compared to the official canon and better read some EU info before you post.

 

At least Tales of the Jedi were designed by the best - like Tom Veitch and Kevin Anderson who is one of prominent american writers. A pity that they didn't took over KOTOR's storyline (cause then it would be better linked with EU and more ancient) and instead of them some bioware lackeys made it - the effects are pathetic  (neverwinter nights clone + lack of real EU knowledge). Only graphics, music and NPCs development are superb. Rest is let's say moderate.

 

I remember how Avellone was speculating about existence of the Sith Empire during KOTOR...no comment really but good that Anderson didn't hear that total nonsense.

 

Is it so difficult to read those 6-7 comics and feel the climate of the ancient era instead of copying everything from the movies (from yoda to tie fighters)?

 

Let's hope that KOTOR 3 will be made by Lucasarts and real EU specialists like James Luceno (who is for sure better author than all those bioware devs) will be in charge of the storyline.

 

Eventually Lucasarts' Jedi Academy is more close to EU than KOTOR - just look at Korriban.

 

You seem to see the EU as some high entity or something. Try and look at KOTOR from a different POV rather than comparing it with the EU for just a second. After you do this, does it not seem weird that these Sith that retreated to their "empire" started a war? And I don't see why you would call Canderous a liar seeing as he has so much respect for our character, before the Revan revelation.

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also the "sith empire" that canderous is talking about might not be an empire as you would see it. it could be just a few left overs from the prior wars that have some comunication with each other. Why is it so hard to believe that some sith came to mandalor with a request for a fight that they have always dreamed of.

 

these sith may have been just some comman sith make a play for power in a underhanded way.

 

if you look at it this way it still fits in the EU.

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