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Politics XXXVIII (A Nontotient)


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Oh, there is a terrible amount of fund mismanagement in education, to be sure. I did not mean to imply that it isn't funded. It just isn't ending up in the classrooms with the teachers.

One example is the $25 million LAUSD was paying to the LAPD.

California also lags when it comes to per pupil spending.

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4 minutes ago, Malcador said:

 

 

Sure sounds like people with training that makes them act like thugs are not to be seen as friends, no ?

you keep trying to rationalize your terrible stereotype. 

the vast number o' police encounters most o' us will possible face will be o' a kinda and quality unlikely to trigger the cop's flight or fight anxiety. no danger. no trigger. when you need a cop, you will want them to be friends as 'posed to enemies.

that said, we have mentioned at least one police encounter we had which coulda' gone south very easily and the cop were definite not our friend. our behaviour, treating the cops as if they were dirtbags getting a contact high off their own inflated sense o' self importance were a contributing factor to us almost getting twisted up... which should never have been a concern for us and is not an excuse for cop behaviour. nevertheless, perception has a way o' becoming reality, particular if you got obvious biases. 

when you need a cop, you will want them to be friends as 'posed to enemies. treat 'em same way you treat the dog you do not know whether is dangerous. don't be stoopid, but also do not show fear and anger and hostility, or in case o' malc, bare contained contempt. 

HA! good Fun!

"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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Chances are, any situation where I'd find myself 'needing a cop', I'd likely be alreadyd ead by the time I'd arrive so I would need a coronor and a funeral director. LMAO

DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.

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46 minutes ago, Gromnir said:

you keep trying to rationalize your terrible stereotype. 

the vast number o' police encounters most o' us will possible face will be o' a kinda and quality unlikely to trigger the cop's flight or fight anxiety. no danger. no trigger. when you need a cop, you will want them to be friends as 'posed to enemies.

that said, we have mentioned at least one police encounter we had which coulda' gone south very easily and the cop were definite not our friend. our behaviour, treating the cops as if they were dirtbags getting a contact high off their own inflated sense o' self importance were a contributing factor to us almost getting twisted up... which should never have been a concern for us and is not an excuse for cop behaviour. nevertheless, perception has a way o' becoming reality, particular if you got obvious biases. 

when you need a cop, you will want them to be friends as 'posed to enemies. treat 'em same way you treat the dog you do not know whether is dangerous. don't be stoopid, but also do not show fear and anger and hostility, or in case o' malc, bare contained contempt. 

HA! good Fun!

It is not friend or enemy, heh, three states with people.  If I need a cop, I need them to do their job, that's all. But I am aware of what's likely the reason for it.  Same as when a waiter is nice and pleasant with me, they're most likely just doing good CS not because they like me or anything.  

As for having contempt for cops, that's a curious interpretation, but as you do.

 

42 minutes ago, Volourn said:

Chances are, any situation where I'd find myself 'needing a cop', I'd likely be alreadyd ead by the time I'd arrive so I would need a coronor and a funeral director. LMAO

Well, you live outside of civilization. In Toronto, it is rather impressive to see 6 cops show up pretty promptly for one drunk or an old lady throwing things about. 

Edited by Malcador

Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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3 hours ago, Malcador said:

Aren't people focusing on the municipal budgets not the state? So cutting the LAPD, for example, isn't going to affect a rural area?

LA has rural areas,  I watch a lot of Tim Pool. One of the examples he brings up to show why a popular vote system is bad is LA and it rural areas. Essentially the major cities voted themselves priority water rights over the rural areas. So a bunch of farmers can't use water but golf courses have their sprinklers on. It is also illegal to collect rainwater in LA, at least it was years ago. IDK if that changed.

Edit: my bad, he said California not LA.

Edited by Orogun01
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I'd say the answer to that question is kind of like the answer to "who's the sucker in this poker game?"*

 

*If you can't tell, it's you. ;)

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"Well, you live outside of civilization. In Toronto, it is rather impressive to see 6 cops show up pretty promptly for one drunk or an old lady throwing things about. "

 

Nah, our cops are just as likely to bethe drunk ones. LMAO

You also forget that while those 6 cops are dealing with the crazy not threatening old lady and one drunk, that there's a shootout going on a cross the town with no cops.LMAO

The reason why they show up 'in time' to deal with old lady is she's isn't in a rush.

 

But, a robber, murderer, etc. are gonna come in, do their crime, and get the hell out. ie. By the time the cops show up  all they got to do is listen to the victim's whining, and then it takes forever to 'see justice'. 

Again,m any time I'd absolutely need a cop I'd likely already be dead by the time they show up even in the city. Your exmaples don't disprove those concpts since neither of those situations are likely 'deadly'.

DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.

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OK, funny story about something @Gromnir said about the police being your best friend when your car is broken down. I believe it was 1998. '97, something like that. I was working in my own business (electronic and mechanical test equipment calibration and service) and going to school at Broward Community College in the mornings. I had just worked the entire night at Florida RF Labs up in Stuart and was on my way to BCC in Davie for a class. Going down I-95 one of my radiator hoses burst. So I pulled over and it took two seconds to realize what was up. I didn't have a cell phone then, just a pager. Anyway there was a Discount Auto Parts store less than a mile away in Pompano so I climbed down the berm, over the fence and walked about four blocks. Less than an hour later I'm walking back with a new hose and a bottle of antifreeze. 

When I got back to my truck a FHP car (Florida highway Patrol) was behind it with the lights on. I walked up, waved to the trooper, popped the hood, got some tools from my test kit, and got to work. The Trooper walks over to me and right away he's being a d--k. 

"This your truck"?

It strikes me as an exceedingly stupid question that begs a sarcastic riposte, but I figured I needed this guy on my side.

"Yes sir" I reply and give him my license and registration. He looks at it for a moment and asked if I needed him to call a tow truck. 

"No sir, give me time to replace this radiator hose and I'll be on my way" 

At this point I was back to work and he looked me up and down and said, brusquely,  "You have 20 minutes and then I'm having your truck towed". No offer of help or advice or anything. 

Then he turns on his heel, walks back to his car and gets in. Some how I figured "calling me a tow truck" and "having your truck towed" were two VERY different outcomes from my perspective. Well, thankfully the Chevy S10 left plenty of room between the radiator & engine front and I had the hose replaced and engine running in 15 minutes. Before leaving I walked back to the trooper and told him in a tone that only an idiot would think was gratitude "Thanks for all your help"

He replied back without a hint of irony or understanding "That's what we're here for"

You ever get the feeling that you just met someone whose continued  existence it a complete waste of valuable air?  That was how I felt that day! :lol:

Edited by Guard Dog
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"The man of virtuous soul commands not, nor obeys. Power, like a desolating pestilence, pollutes whate'er it touches; and obedience, bane of all genius, virtue, freedom, truth, makes slaves of men, and of the human frame a mechanized automaton."

P.B. Shelley

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4 hours ago, Guard Dog said:

You ever get the feeling that you just met someone whose continued  existence it a complete waste of valuable air?  

all the time. comforts us to consider the number (no doubt considerable) o' times such thoughts were directed at Gromnir.

by same token, if a coworker pulls you aside and says that the guys in accounting are, "not your friends," you will no doubt assume he is talking 'bout something more than the capacity o' potential bad accountants to screw with your paycheck, or simple a generalized observation that the accounting guys is paid to make sure you get minimum possible money as demanded by terms o' your employment.

*shrug*

there is a-hole cops. some cops is born bad. cops are people. however, the cop job does involve daily tarumas and stressors which we eulogize in domestic violence victims and combat vets. is also unfortunate but much o' the bad behaviour malc and others appear to wanna warn you 'bout insofar as the oakley wearing and shaven headed cops is the result o' ubiquitous training as 'posed to ill will or foul demeanor.

...

oh, and while we believe gd implicit in spite o' his reliable skew towards the hyperbolic, you got no idea how many times we has listened to one side o' a story and then seen videotape o' an encounter and were dismayed (not) by by reality v. narrative. can't count the times we has heard, "i went out of my way to be polite," or some variation. gd has a somewhat colorful view o' cops. is difficult to imagine such preconceptions not having an impact on how he viewed a cop encounter at the time, and even more so how he remembers years removed.

regardless, is a bit like any other human endeavour: confidence in an outcome has a tendency to lead to such outcomes. sure, no matter how much confidence we got in our game, we ain't gonna take stephen curry in a one-on-one basketball competition. converse, if team facing stephen' curry and his mates is morale broken and certain they got no chance o' beating golden state, then chances o' victory for those facing mr. curry is even more slim than a statistical accounting might assume. 

however, and again, even if a person does become verbal abusive with a cop, is no excuse for the cop to resort to violence. none. never. the attitude test needs to die. 

HA! Good Fun!

"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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hard to imagine that during a pandemic a political campaign might suffer organizational issues which hurts their efforts to reach key demographics. yeah, given how important is florida, and recognizing biden is current polling better in that state than trump, hopeful they don't bungle the advantage through incompetence.

just so long as biden don't pull a clinton and largely ignore key battleground states during the remaining months, it will be an improvement. pandemic is gonna make even the best efforts appear flawed, so am willing to cut folks a break as long as it ain't willful or reckless mistakes.

HA! Good Fun!

"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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1 minute ago, Volourn said:

L0L DOUBLE LOL L0L

am suspecting vol didn't get past the clickbait headline. however, is just a guess as "LOL" is hardly the rejoinder which offers substance for reply. 

HA! Good Fun!

 

"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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Uh. That video didn't prove anything of the sort. Just a lot of scenes out of context. LMAO

 

FYI Antifa/BLM have murdered a couple of black Trump supporters the last few days.  So much about this 'BLM/Antifa are all about anti violence and anti black racism crimes0.). But, people like Grom don't care about those people. I mean, his idol Biden said it best,"If you vote Donald Trump you aren't really black."

DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.

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12 hours ago, Gromnir said:

hard to imagine that during a pandemic a political campaign might suffer organizational issues which hurts their efforts to reach key demographics. yeah, given how important is florida, and recognizing biden is current polling better in that state than trump, hopeful they don't bungle the advantage through incompetence.

just so long as biden don't pull a clinton and largely ignore key battleground states during the remaining months, it will be an improvement. pandemic is gonna make even the best efforts appear flawed, so am willing to cut folks a break as long as it ain't willful or reckless mistakes.

HA! Good Fun!

It seems  highly unlikely that Biden could somehow do something that will make people support Trump over him...but I do have a concern. Biden will win because of the virus impact and  the mismanagement of the virus in certain states but the main reason is the economic lockdown has ravaged all economies and wiped out the last 8 years of US economic growth. Once there is a vaccine the USA will recover but some businesses have permanently closed and there will be real residual economic damage that will be addressed through normal economic growth....the point being its not really Trumps fault or the Democrats brilliant, reasonable polices that have changed this election outcome....it  does change the real reasons Trump wont win and this does have an impact for how people will view the inevitable Biden victory 

Personally I still think  its better we dont go through another 4 years of the Trump circus but what concerns me is a new US political reality where the Democrats want to over compensate for some Trump decisions and inadvertently the Democrats are seen as extreme left or they end up just alienating normal citizens who end up believing there normal way of life and culture is being undermined ....then we go back to another future where a Trump candidate wins on making claims that are exaggerated or similar comments like " I am going to drain the Washington swamp " 

Anyway I doubt we will ever see another Trump candidate but I am concerned about what changes the Democrats will implement that could be well meaning but just add to the current, unnecessary political dichotomy. And the reality is the actual political intransigent that  currently exists between the left and right are mostly ideological and certain issues I wouldnt expect to see 

 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

 

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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58 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

It seems  highly unlikely that Biden could somehow do something that will make people support Trump over him.

 

the issue raised in the article vol linked is legit, but as we noted, the headline is clickbait. is not that the biden campaign is turning folks into trump voters or is somehow preventing latinos from voting at all. if enough people don't vote, biden will lose. the number o' democrats in this country for decades and decades and decades has outnumbered republicans, and even the electoral college goofiness wouldn't prevent near universal wins for democrats in the Presidential election if democrats actual voted consistent. the percentage o' democrats who actual bother to vote trails republicans by a significant amount. such indolence is enough to level the playing field. democrats know they have a voter turnout problem, which is why it is so important for democrats to encourage as many democrats as possible to register and vote.  problem ain't turning folks into trump voters. most fundamental issue is getting democrats (and independents) to vote.

as we stated so recent, am likewise concerned the democrats, if they get control, is gonna continue the same shady shenanigans as trump utilized, but they will feel justified in doing so 'cause is payback for trump. idiots. one o' the reasons senate republicans backed trump in spite o' their concerns 'bout his character and competence is they believed they were mistreated by obama and the Congressional democrats. is not they like trump. nope.

four years o' republicans running roughshod over democrats is gonna result in some ill will. coupled with the terrible polarization we are suffering from in this country, a return to government by compromise is improbable in the extreme.

HA! Good Fun!

 

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"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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And, that is why politics sucks. Because politicians don't care about the people they govern. It is about power, control, slavery, and winning. It is why I haven't voted for a good amount of time and have no intention to, because no matter which side wins everyone else loses.

DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.

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3 hours ago, Gromnir said:

 

as we stated so recent, am likewise concerned the democrats, if they get control, is gonna continue the same shady shenanigans as trump utilized, but they will feel justified in doing so 'cause is payback for trump. idiots. one o' the reasons senate republicans backed trump in spite o' their concerns 'bout his character and competence is they believed they were mistreated by obama and the Congressional democrats. is not they like trump. nope.

 

This is exactly what concerns me and you have already seen this as one of the reasons some  people supported Trump as you mentioned

And the Democrat " extreme left " like Warran and Sanders can sometimes really come across in a condescending way that creates its own real problems because you sometimes feel people in the USA( who have created success in the USA through hard work,  prudent choices and understanding real opportunities....yes of course some people have resources given to them by family and they dont really deserve it but generally people have worked to achieve degrees of success and this should never be dismissed or ignored ) will be expected to fund social projects and massive ideas to address what they consider are examples of unfairness and inequality ...

But Biden is more of a centrist and not likely to want to implement potentially unhelpful policies that .....Im just raising this because ideally you want people to learn lessons from the past so we dont repeat them. And both parties can be better at how people react to each other and how objectives get framed....its about diplomacy and I do believe the words matter to many of us and how respond 

 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

 

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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2 hours ago, Volourn said:

And, that is why politics sucks. Because politicians don't care about the people they govern. It is about power, control, slavery, and winning. It is why I haven't voted for a good amount of time and have no intention to, because no matter which side wins everyone else loses.

volo do you mind if I raise some constructive criticism around your general views ....Im not sure if you being serious about raising the same issues that most of us accept. Of course any violence committed by any group needs to be condemned and that includes unprovoked  violence against white people

You seem to keep suggesting that someone like Gromnir doesnt care about this, he has never suggested this and he keeps disputing your generalizations 

But why would you honestly keep posting links that will generally support what we all know? In a world where this was a reality that would have to be addressed ....but its not a legal reality 

And Antifa is a problem for me personally because they have no recognized leadership and the spokesman I heard blatantly admitted that he believes Antifa is justified in damaging property and being involved in violence. Here is a good link that summarizes my core issues with them, please watch the video of the Antifa activist who thinks the violence is just  a game ....its a slippery slope as violence begets violence. She thinks its okay to be armed with weapons to kill but she is laughing during the interview which makes her view worse as its so out of touch with what the potential risk is to this type of response

https://edition.cnn.com/2017/08/14/us/what-is-antifa-trnd/index.html

So for me in summary Antifa is not BLM and we shouldnt conflate the groups or generalize 

 

 

 

 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

 

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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3 members of armed militia injured in shooting at Breonna Taylor protest

Oh man is this funny! They were shot by one of their own members accidently! This fool is walking around with a full magazine, locked and loaded, no safety. Bo NOT bring live ammo if you are going to carry a firearm to a protest. And don't even give a firearm to members who don't know WTF they are doing!

Next time they get together she will be carrying this:

5 Best Nerf Guns 2020 (from under $20)

"The man of virtuous soul commands not, nor obeys. Power, like a desolating pestilence, pollutes whate'er it touches; and obedience, bane of all genius, virtue, freedom, truth, makes slaves of men, and of the human frame a mechanized automaton."

P.B. Shelley

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NFAC = No Fire arm control, I guess.  Even funnier as their leader had said they were "expert shooters".  Group seems like a bunch of nutjobs though, wants a chunk of the US for a black only state.

Edited by Malcador
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Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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32 minutes ago, Malcador said:

NFAC = No Fire arm control, I guess.  Even funnier as their leader had said they were "expert shooters".  Group seems like a bunch of nutjobs though, wants a chunk of the US for a black only state.

I say we give them Mississippi.

"The man of virtuous soul commands not, nor obeys. Power, like a desolating pestilence, pollutes whate'er it touches; and obedience, bane of all genius, virtue, freedom, truth, makes slaves of men, and of the human frame a mechanized automaton."

P.B. Shelley

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51 minutes ago, Guard Dog said:

I say we give them Mississippi.

Why not Florida.  The final solution for Florida Man.

Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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2 hours ago, Guard Dog said:

3 members of armed militia injured in shooting at Breonna Taylor protest

Oh man is this funny! They were shot by one of their own members accidently! This fool is walking around with a full magazine, locked and loaded, no safety. Bo NOT bring live ammo if you are going to carry a firearm to a protest. And don't even give a firearm to members who don't know WTF they are doing!

Next time they get together she will be carrying this:

 

kinda appropriate when you realize/admit the breonna taylor tragedy were in part the result o' a guy with a firearm protecting me and mine. attempting to protect himself and his girlfriend, a man with a legal firearm shoots a cop who is exercising a legal warrant. cops return fire, with one o' the sooper cops discharging ten rounds from outside the taylor home and through a window. arguable worst part is that it ain't the guy with the gun who shot the cops who ends up dead, but his girlfriend.

accidents happen every day. accidents happen with staplers, and perhaps you end up with a bloodied thumb. accidents happen with eggs in your kitchen and then perhaps you gotta figure out how to clean (answer btw is to first sprinkle egg with salt or baking soda). accidents happen with lawn sprinklers and perhaps you end up flooding the neighbor's petunias. accidents happen with firearms, 'cause finagle's law says accidents will happen when humans is involved, and all too often a person perhaps ends up dead.

firearms does not make you safer, if only 'cause accidents happen. we know from hundreds o' stories how cops with many hours o' training are subject to accidents; ain't just the bumbling and inexperienced who blunder. 

somebody accidentally gets shot at a breonna taylor protest? is unfortunate, but is also particular appropriate... not that the second amendment folks realize. maybe need read more shakespeare to realize all dramatic tragedy is inevitable. audience knows what is coming from the moment the players step on stage. question is how will events go to hell and not if. 

HA! Good Fun!

Edited by Gromnir

"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/27/us-rightwing-extremists-attacks-deaths-database-leftwing-antifa

Guardian piece on politically motivated violence in the US.

TLDR:

"0 Victims killed in anti-fascist attacks since 1994

21 Victims killed in left-wing violence since 2010

95 Victims killed in jihadist attacks since 2010

117 Victims killed in right-wing violence since 2010

329 Victims killed in right-wing violence since 1994"

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