Gromnir Posted February 22, 2020 Posted February 22, 2020 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Guard Dog said: @Gromnir True the biggest threat to anything is the inability of humans to behave. It's why we can't have nice things. "nice things" is the sticking point. bump stocks, for example, is maybe not the best example o' nice things being ruined by the inability o' folks to behave. a worst possible outcome o' bump stocks should not have come as a surprise to anybody. we had no idea bump stocks even existed until vegas, and like gd, when we saw/heard the video, we thought it were obvious the shooter were using automatic weapons which woulda' necessarily have been prohibited by law. discover a simple mod made legal weapons behave like full-auto were surprising to us. we will go a step further and claim that if every handgun in the US disappeared tomorrow (impossible) am thinking we would all be safer and only a few would genuine miss their nice things. baseball bats, hunting knives and crow bars have utilitarian value complete divorced from their lethality. handguns... is some folks who enjoy going to the range with their handgun. additional, have met some extreme small number o' people who hunt with a handgun and it takes a herculean effort not to roll our eyes in their direction... with the possible exception o' folks who hunt bear and keep a .454 casull or something similar as a sidearm. yeah, am thinking the government (particularly the fed) should not be in the business o' telling gd what is a nice thing. also, the second amendment affords gd certain protections (less than he likely believes and more than a good reading o' history would suggest) which makes it improbable the government will ever take his guns from him. even so, am having a hard time working self up to agree with the general proposition regarding nice things when issue is handguns and bump stocks and similar. kinda our cliff edge for nic things is https://goldpawseries.com/product/st in another anecdotal story in support o' climate change. our little dogs started suffering from serious sunburn the last couple years. tell us five years ago we would soon be clothing our dogs and we would ridicule you. even so, here we is. if the small canines is out in sacramento valley sun for more than an hour or two, they get sunburned, so we had to buy them t-shirts. is embarrassing, but doggie safety first. toes the line for nice things. HA! Good fun! Edited February 22, 2020 by Gromnir "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Maedhros Posted February 22, 2020 Posted February 22, 2020 (edited) "Just pull yourself together"- success stories are nice and all, but as you say, you can do everything right and still not get the outcome you hope for. The state's job is to maximise the chance of positive outcomes. Edit: @Guard Dog Edited February 22, 2020 by Maedhros
Guard Dog Posted February 22, 2020 Posted February 22, 2020 (edited) @Gromnir I wasn't referring to anything specific when I said that. But you know I would almost go along with you on a pistol ban. I do agree if handguns disappeared today the country would be a safer place. Almost go along though. If I thought that would be the end of it. If a line were drawn, a binding agreement between the people and the government that the elimination of private handguns is the last thing they ask of us with regard to gun control I would go along and give mine up. Of course that can never happen because the government or the people in it so least do not give a f--k about crime. And gun control is not even about crime anyway. That is just a pretext. For many people, myself included, it is the canary in the coal mine. The necessary first step in the evolution of a relatively free country to one that is not. No private property is safe if that canary dies. The 4th Amendment follows the 2nd into the dustbin. Edit: I do agree with the elimination of bump stocks however. If full auto weapons are illegal for the general public then it follows that accessories that make them function as full auto should also be illegal. Edited February 22, 2020 by Guard Dog "While it is true you learn with age, the down side is what you often learn is what a damn fool you were before" Thomas Sowell
Guard Dog Posted February 22, 2020 Posted February 22, 2020 5 minutes ago, Maedhros said: "Just pull yourself together"- success stories are nice and all, but as you say, you can do everything right and still not get the outcome you hope for. The state's job is to maximise the chance of positive outcomes. Edit: @Guard Dog No. The State's job is to enforce the law and ensure a mostly level playing field. The State's job is to ensure the opportunity exists. The State should have nothing to do with the outcome. It should not be in the business of choosing winners and losers. I realize your philosophy and mine have a deep and unbridgeable gap and that is ok. But I do not trust any government with that kind of power. "While it is true you learn with age, the down side is what you often learn is what a damn fool you were before" Thomas Sowell
ComradeYellow Posted February 22, 2020 Posted February 22, 2020 Now is not the time for rugged individualism, now is the time for collective action. U.S. history is full of times we all got together for the common good, and I think now is one of those times. Wait a few more decades and people will decide they wanna go back to rugged individualism again...
Gromnir Posted February 22, 2020 Posted February 22, 2020 42 minutes ago, Guard Dog said: @Gromnir I wasn't referring to anything specific when I said that. But you know I would almost go along with you on a pistol ban. I do agree if handguns disappeared today the country would be a safer place. Almost go along though. If I thought that would be the end of it. Edit: I do agree with the elimination of bump stocks however. If full auto weapons are illegal for the general public then it follows that accessories that make them function as full auto should also be illegal. oh, and giant foam fingers being sold at sporting events. not a nice thing. if they purchase then 'course some fan is gonna equip their 2' foam digit and block the view o' a handful o' people. get rid o' foam fingers and handguns to make the world a better and less angry place. HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Guard Dog Posted February 22, 2020 Posted February 22, 2020 16 minutes ago, Gromnir said: oh, and giant foam fingers being sold at sporting events. not a nice thing. if they purchase then 'course some fan is gonna equip their 2' foam digit and block the view o' a handful o' people. get rid o' foam fingers and handguns to make the world a better and less angry place. HA! Good Fun! Plus they sell those at Mets games. That is clearly misleading people! "While it is true you learn with age, the down side is what you often learn is what a damn fool you were before" Thomas Sowell
PK htiw klaw eriF Posted February 23, 2020 Posted February 23, 2020 3 hours ago, 213374U said: whynotboth.gif I don't know, seems to me that more and more discussions get bogged down in interpretation of data and methodological technicalities because every tom, **** and harry on social media can always come up with statistics to "prove" that average temperatures in Alaska and Florida are about the same. So it's not just getting at what's technically true that's an uphill battle, but also deciding whether it's significant. One should only trust statistics that they have doctored themselves and so on, but I'm pretty sure that solipsism is an intellectual cul-de-sac. TL;DR: At times I wonder why I have given up drink. Yeah, rather than being post-truth it seems we're in a multiple-truth world where any random data set can be used to argue whatever the **** you want. I guess truth, along with everything else, really did end up being a spook. 2 hours ago, Maedhros said: "Just pull yourself together"- success stories are nice and all, but as you say, you can do everything right and still not get the outcome you hope for. The state's job is to maximise the chance of positive outcomes. Edit: @Guard Dog If we're going by how states have historically functioned, the state's job is to pursue it's own interests and those of a select group, call them the elite or ruling class or whatever suits your fancy. Anything beyond that is incidental to this function, and will change to meet such requirements. "Akiva Goldsman and Alex Kurtzman run the 21st century version of MK ULTRA." - majestic "you're a damned filthy lying robot and you deserve to die and burn in hell." - Bartimaeus "Without individual thinking you can't notice the plot holes." - InsaneCommander "Just feed off the suffering of gamers." - Malcador "You are calling my taste crap." -Hurlshort "thankfully it seems like the creators like Hungary less this time around." - Sarex "Don't forget the wakame, dumbass" -Keyrock "Are you trolling or just being inadvertently nonsensical?' -Pidesco "we have already been forced to admit you are at least human" - uuuhhii "I refuse to buy from non-woke businesses" - HoonDing "feral camels are now considered a pest" - Gorth "Melkathi is known to be an overly critical grumpy person" - Melkathi "Oddly enough Sanderson was a lot more direct despite being a Mormon" - Zoraptor "I found it greatly disturbing to scroll through my cartoon's halfing selection of genitalias." - Wormerine "I love cheese despite the pain and carnage." - ShadySands
Gorth Posted February 23, 2020 Posted February 23, 2020 May be old news, but my inner tinfoil hat guy wonders if it entirely coincidental that the Chinese government has a biological warfare research center in Wuhan? Someone forgot to put the lid on a specimen jar? Sold test animals to the local food market? http://english.whiov.cas.cn/News/Events/201502/t20150203_135923.html Edit: I don't care who gets the movie rights as long as Milla Jovovich is in it 1 “He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice.” - Albert Einstein
Skarpen Posted February 23, 2020 Posted February 23, 2020 1 hour ago, Gorth said: May be old news, but my inner tinfoil hat guy wonders if it entirely coincidental that the Chinese government has a biological warfare research center in Wuhan? Someone forgot to put the lid on a specimen jar? Sold test animals to the local food market? http://english.whiov.cas.cn/News/Events/201502/t20150203_135923.html Edit: I don't care who gets the movie rights as long as Milla Jovovich is in it You might get your wish come true since this is the labs logo: 1
ComradeYellow Posted February 23, 2020 Posted February 23, 2020 But it's cyan instead of red so it should be ok.
Skarpen Posted February 23, 2020 Posted February 23, 2020 2 hours ago, ComradeMaster said: But it's cyan instead of red so it should be ok. Red is known for disguising under different colors
Zoraptor Posted February 23, 2020 Posted February 23, 2020 Red/ green colourblindness and the logo could look identical. Though r/g colourblindness is most prevalent in male whities rather than Han Chinese. I know the suggestion was not exactly serious but the coronavirus pretty much definitely isn't an escaped bioweapon. Disease crossing species are relatively common events (last forty years would include Variant Creuzfeld-Jakob from cows/ sheep, MERS (camels), SARS (civets/ bats), Ebola/ Marburg (primates) and longer term possibly syphilis and plague too)
Raithe Posted February 23, 2020 Posted February 23, 2020 1 1 "Cuius testiculos habeas, habeas cardia et cerebellum."
ComradeYellow Posted February 24, 2020 Posted February 24, 2020 ^Or maybe stop bombing and invading countries which creates a massive refugee crisis in the first place? We lefties got it figured out. Send food and supplies instead of bombs and BAM! No more refugee crisis.
Skarpen Posted February 24, 2020 Posted February 24, 2020 11 hours ago, Raithe said: Don't bring Jesus into your mess. He suffered enough.
Gromnir Posted February 24, 2020 Posted February 24, 2020 christian evangelicals not wanting to talk 'bout christian values? am thinking such is cause for suspicion. the need to proselytize and spread the word is part o' the definition o' what is evangelical after all. that said, clearly skarp doesn't speak for anybody (perhaps not even skarp) much less christian evangelicals, so is unfair to make him the poster child for an entire group. HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Skarpen Posted February 24, 2020 Posted February 24, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Gromnir said: christian evangelicals not wanting to talk 'bout christian values? am thinking such is cause for suspicion. the need to proselytize and spread the word is part o' the definition o' what is evangelical after all. that said, clearly skarp doesn't speak for anybody (perhaps not even skarp) much less christian evangelicals, so is unfair to make him the poster child for an entire group. HA! Good Fun! I see that after no one was interested in your fake stories about who you know and have picture with and how much you earn. So you came back to harassing people from other countries to earn some attention. That said no one made me a poster child for anything let alone Christian Evangelicals mainly because I'm not Christian Evangelical. Edited February 24, 2020 by Skarpen
Chilloutman Posted February 24, 2020 Posted February 24, 2020 10 hours ago, ComradeMaster said: ^Or maybe stop bombing and invading countries which creates a massive refugee crisis in the first place? We lefties got it figured out. Send food and supplies instead of bombs and BAM! No more refugee crisis. yeah, just wait after Africa will not be able to feed them all.... oh wait.. I'm the enemy, 'cause I like to think, I like to read. I'm into freedom of speech, and freedom of choice. I'm the kinda guy that likes to sit in a greasy spoon and wonder, "Gee, should I have the T-bone steak or the jumbo rack of barbecue ribs with the side-order of gravy fries?" I want high cholesterol! I wanna eat bacon, and butter, and buckets of cheese, okay?! I wanna smoke a Cuban cigar the size of Cincinnati in the non-smoking section! I wanna run naked through the street, with green Jell-O all over my body, reading Playboy magazine. Why? Because I suddenly may feel the need to, okay, pal? I've SEEN the future. Do you know what it is? It's a 47-year-old virgin sitting around in his beige pajamas, drinking a banana-broccoli shake, singing "I'm an Oscar Meyer Wiene"
Malcador Posted February 24, 2020 Posted February 24, 2020 (edited) 11 hours ago, ComradeMaster said: ^Or maybe stop bombing and invading countries which creates a massive refugee crisis in the first place? We lefties got it figured out. Send food and supplies instead of bombs and BAM! No more refugee crisis. Well, if it's the US, it's not quite bombing and invasions so much as political interference or the legacy thereof. Edited February 24, 2020 by Malcador Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra
Gromnir Posted February 24, 2020 Posted February 24, 2020 1 hour ago, Skarpen said: I see that after no one was interested in your fake stories about who you know and have picture with, and how much you earn you came back to harassing people from other countries to earn some attention. That said no one made me a poster child for anything let alone Christian Evangelicals mainly because I'm not Christian Evangelical. almost as amusing as your attempt at using kids as a human shield. you of all posters decrying fake? HA! regardless, don't say stoopid stuff and you will avoid Gromnir harassment. is hard to see how christ pov is inappropriate when issues o' christian values arise, but perhaps you can convince somebody, anybody, that you ain't just talking nonsense. lord only knows why you would bring up "people from other countries." you somehow see your victimization as the result o' national origin? and we specific observed you ain't a poster child for evangelical christians already and that it would be unfair for your curious views to be read as representative. more relevant to thread, 'cause a skrap scrape is predictable pointless: bernie on 60 minutes whole lotta pivots and non answers which is gonna get tougher as the field narrows. get asked 'bout shifting a % o' private corporate ownership to employees and answer is trump is a liar? get asked bout cost o' all his social programs and bernie admits he don't know, but that a modest wall street tax will cover? how does that work? lack o' willingness/ability to answer obvious questions has been our biggest complaint regarding bernie... other than bernie bro behaviour and a few recent outright lies from the sanders campaign senior leadership regarding bloomberg and others. oh, and to avoid double-post: modi HUMAN RIGHTS IN INDIA UNDER ATTACK not a fan o' modi. however, am gonna note a weird fact related to the oliver vid... and not the elephant dung. the textbook reference "on page twenty-two" which got the oliver crowd torqued is, well, weird. ... is actual from seminole oral tradition. one o' the earliest verified written records involved neamathla sharing the story with the governor o' florida in the 1820s. so the indian government, w/o proper attribution, uses an american indian folktale to teach racism to schoolchildren? HA! Good Fun! 3 "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
ComradeYellow Posted February 24, 2020 Posted February 24, 2020 1 hour ago, Chilloutman said: yeah, just wait after Africa will not be able to feed them all.... oh wait.. 54 minutes ago, Malcador said: Well, if it's the US not quite bombing and invasions so much as political interference or the legacy thereof. I'm not sure I grasp what either of these replies mean but the Bush/Obama duo is largely responsible for the refugee crisis in Europe, which is emboldening the European far right, and we can't have that so the solution here is not to invade the 3rd world for resources but to establish a home base and provide developing countries with basic needs where necessary. I'm not a China buff or anything but they seem to have their **** together in that regard. Solidify home turf, provide services overseas for those who need it, w/o bombers and tanks!
Skarpen Posted February 24, 2020 Posted February 24, 2020 13 minutes ago, Gromnir said: regardless, don't say stoopid stuff and you will avoid Gromnir harassment. is hard to see how christ pov is inappropriate when issues o' christian values arise, but perhaps you can convince somebody, anybody, that you ain't just talking nonsense. lord only knows why you would bring up "people from other countries." you somehow see your victimization as the result o' national origin? and we specific observed you ain't a poster child for evangelical christians already and that it would be unfair for your curious views to be read as representative. Yeah... listen mr phot op, I replied to a meme so I don't know what imaginary conversation or views you are ranting about. Which you do a lot it seems.
Zoraptor Posted February 24, 2020 Posted February 24, 2020 The capital letters Refugee Crisis was almost entirely from two countries that had been directly invaded by the US and a western protectorate- Iraq, Afghanistan and, which always makes me lol, Kosovo. The only one of the top four that hadn't been directly invaded was Syria where instead they merely armed nutbar jihadis- often directly, eg Timber Sycamore- and created the conditions for ISIS by invading Iraq. Which is hardly much better. But nowadays the refugee problem is largely Africans leaving countries that have been asterisked over by (neo)colonialism but that influx is at least theoretically sustainable and- economically at least- desirable/ essential due to there now not being a single EU country with above replacement level birthrate and, to be frank, most Euros considering themselves far too important to pick up the garbage or clean toilets or pick vegies for minimum wage. Probably the best anti refugee measure for the present issue would be to stop the IMF/ WB being all about 'economic development' and shift towards actual self sufficiency. Which ain't going to happen. And, for war refugees, to invest in the countries effected without it being directed solely at improving spreadsheet numbers or being verboten due to the 'wrong' side winning. Which also won't happen. 1
ComradeYellow Posted February 24, 2020 Posted February 24, 2020 8 minutes ago, Zoraptor said: And, for war refugees, to invest in the countries effected without it being directed solely at improving spreadsheet numbers or being verboten due to the 'wrong' side winning. Which also won't happen. ....As long as the Ziocons in the U.S. remain in power that is. That's the problem with the American power structure, they're too busy looking at maps and graphs yet they fail to see the data going on in their home territory. This has been going on since Vietnam. Most Americans want nothing to do with any of this and are more than willing to let other "powers" intervene.
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