No romance!

[bugarup]

 

That's the Obsidian forum for ya. A distant relative of RPG Codex. Want cheering for romances? I guess the BioWare boards?

 

I think it's a pity we see these reactions but they have been consistant since many years I'm afraid.

 

 

Me, I find it really amusing, the idea that supposedly grown-up people feel so scared by mere presence of romances that they actually cheer in relief when there are none. "Hey guys, look -- romances! BooOooOOOooOOO!   " 

[Epaminondas]

Romances in video games have never been, in my experience, 'grown-up.' Fighting over whether you're going to do either something fun for Thanksgiving or go to the in-laws for a lackluster meal... that's almost there. Not fighting over it in the first place because you know how important it is to your wife of 22 years... that's grown up. I'm never going to a be a hero who defeats a whole slew of bad guys. That's something I can only achieve in a video game. Being a loyal and faithful husband? I've got that covered in real life. The video game just doesn't do much for me in that regard.

 

I don't hate video game romances as an idea. I just hate the pathetic attempts I've seen in video games.

[bugarup]

I'm never going to a be a hero who defeats a whole slew of bad guys. That's something I can only achieve in a video game. Being a loyal and faithful husband? I've got that covered in real life. The video game just doesn't do much for me in that regard.

 

But what about very-not-vanilla or even better, creepy, dysfunctional and destructive romances? Sure, you could experience those in real life too, but I (and 9 doctors out of 10) strongly recommend against it 

[neotemplar]

Her good personal story + maybe a good personal quest for her is way better than "do stuff she is programmed to like, get X points, watch boob cutscene or dark screen or read some wet text" romance.

 

New Vegas, KotORs and Planescape did it well.

 

Hope we'll get the same level in ToW.

[Chilloutman]

 

Fallout 2 done it best xD

 

Do you mean shotgun wedding or Francis? ...wait, it's not important. The best either way. 

 

 

Shotgun wedding was on my mind

[Triple - A Foxy Lad]

 

I'm never going to a be a hero who defeats a whole slew of bad guys. That's something I can only achieve in a video game. Being a loyal and faithful husband? I've got that covered in real life. The video game just doesn't do much for me in that regard.

 

But what about very-not-vanilla or even better, creepy, dysfunctional and destructive romances? Sure, you could experience those in real life too, but I (and 9 doctors out of 10) strongly recommend against it 

 

pump all those toxins straight into my veins doc.

[FlintlockJazz]

I knew the moment I heard there was to be no romances that this thread would be here and that it would be the longest thread in the Outer Worlds' forum.

[Chairchucker]

To be fair there would also be a long thread if they'd confirmed there were romances.

 

And probably also if it was left kinda ambiguous.

[AwesomeOcelot]

 

 

My bad. I meant it would not support other operating systems like Windows 7.

You mean the 2009 OS that mainstream support ended on January 13, 2015? I am shocked that Obsidian isn't supporting Windows 7.

 

 

Yes, the 2009 one that nearly 40% of the desktop market still uses and has no desire to upgrade. Now that Obsidian is Microsoft they won't support their older OS's. Keep sucking up I'm sure they're just about to make you a mod.

 

Around 30% of Steam gamers use Win 7. Less for gamers in the West, the target market. Less among FPS gamers. Obsidian, Private Division, and Microsoft will have statistics on the market, they won't leave 40% on the table. Microsoft don't decide on OS support they're not publishing. Extended support ends 2020, desire to upgrade is incoming.

[Vitalis]

 

Strangely, this is something interesting that Dragon Age 2 addressed by allowing "Rivalry" romances. Hawke and the romance could disagree about choices, but still come together by the power of player sexual attraction!

 

Which was universally panned and sabotaged with the colors/names Blue/Friendship and Red/Rivalry to denote the relationship status.

i was actually a fan of this approach. rivalmances are sexy af and offer means for different mc concepts to pursue the same character. im sad nothing more came from this.

There was a lot to like about the roleplaying options presented in Dragon Age 2, but since the reception for the game was so negative all of the good changes were tossed out leading to Dragon Age Blandquisition.

[the_dog_days]

Let's be real folks you all want to romance the ship.

Navigator: Sir, I have visual on an unintentional pun.

 

Me: Open torpedo bay . . .

[Epaminondas]

To be fair, I've thought that romances have gotten to the point where I don't mind them. Mostly, they're possible, but you don't feel pressured to pursue them. I even got into a romance with the scarred chick in Pathfinder briefly just to check it out. I'm also not averse to a romance in a game if the story is good and it doesn't feel trite. Like neotemplar said up above, a good story is a good story. That's why, even being straight and probably about as white bread as they come (and certainly straight laced), I still enjoyed the Sens8 series. Weird, but it was well done. I don't mind romance and I don't mind if it's between non-traditional partners. It's just that if they're going to do it, do it well.

 

For right now, I'm glad romance got the ol' heave ho, but it's not like I would refuse to buy the game based on some side romance stuff that isn't obtrusive and isn't pushed on me. I actually would like romantic elements, but I already mentioned some of those up above.

[Mikeymoonshine]

I don't hate romance in RPG's like some people do but it's hard to do and pretty much always causes some kind of drama. So this is a good decision.

[BillyCorgan]

No kidding ... the first topic of the forum on such an ambitious game is about "no romance" ?!

And then we are surprised by the caricatures of the "gamers" ...

[Mikeymoonshine]

I wouldn't mind if they did what NV did where you could flirt with people and that kind of thing. That's an aspect of roleplaying, maybe not the gay perk though.

[Wormerine]

No kidding ... the first topic of the forum on such an ambitious game is about "no romance" ?!

And then we are surprised by the caricatures of the "gamers" ...

Yes, and it is good news. If you add romance into an RPG, its smart to cater to many tastes/roleplaying options. A big chunk of time is spent to develop fairly shallow romance options for multiple companions. Its also limits who your companions can be. While romancable companions can, and have been good after so many RPG they all become samey. I personally felt original Pillars greatly benefited from not having romances - as the result it had quite a few "fresh" companions. I do find it odd when every person who spends time with you is an available date. Hard to believe all those super attractive people don't have lifes on their own and all wait for their chosen one and the chosen one is you!

 

Deadfire had a shot at it, and I see it as one of the elements which weakened its companions (this and ambitious way of delivering their story, which in my opinion, didn't pay off).

 

So yeah, not having romancable companions is a plus in my book. 

[rjshae]

Sexual addiction should be an in-game flaw that leads to the very hard and extended sex bot side quest. Plus therapy. Lots and lots of therapy.

[the_dog_days]

Sexual addiction should be an in-game flaw that leads to the very hard and extended sex bot side quest. Plus therapy. Lots and lots of therapy.

NPCs refuse to talk with you because of your obvious . . . eagerness.

[Wormerine]

 

Sexual addiction should be an in-game flaw that leads to the very hard and extended sex bot side quest. Plus therapy. Lots and lots of therapy.

NPCs refuse to talk with you because of your obvious . . . eagerness.

 

[slopesandsam]

 

And there's romances in Planescape: Torment, Jade Empire, etc.

 

I'd argue there's a difference between writing some dialogue options that might lead to a romantic encounter with a couple of the companions vs the full-on dating sim-esque mechanics that seem to have become the norm in RPGs.

[slopesandsam]

Here is my three-point explanation of why I don't really like romances (as they've been implement thus far) in RPGs:

 

1. The first point is one I've already stated: the romance systems that I've encountered have always involved some sort of point-scoring system (either hidden or laid bare).  I find that this causes me to cease thinking of the companion as a character in the narrative and start thinking of them as a minigame by themselves.  It also will often cause me to have my character behave in ways that I otherwise wouldn't, simply to increase my affection points with the companion I decided to romance.

 

2. They're unrealistic.  Maybe it's just me, but my real-life experience of romance has never been a situation where I was interested in someone who was indifferent towards me, and I won them over with my words and deeds.  Nor has anyone managed to win me over when I was initially indifferent towards them.  In fact, I've found that the opposite is usually true: people have been immediately interested in me, but I've managed to balls it up by saying or doing the wrong thing, or I've been interested in someone until they said or did something that really turned me off.

 

3. Romances - at least, as they've been implemented in the RPGs I've played - actively conflict with the sort of character creation systems I like.  By this I mean that the romances I've encountered in games are all determined by your dialogue choices or how you choose to resolve quests.  Sometimes, rarely, there'll be a companion who isn't interested in you because you created a character of a particular sex.  And even more rarely, they won't be interested because, say, they're a dwarf and you're an elf.  But none of them have incorporated character stats, that I've seen (in fact, I might be misremembering, but do the DA games even have stats anymore?).  Why isn't one of the companions only interested in very muscular players, and will only hook up with a player who has 8+ strength?  Or one who only likes brainiacs, and requires the player to have high intelligence?  And what about the player who only has 1 charisma?  None of the companions should be interested in that loser.

 

All of which is to say, I could get behind a romance system in which it isn't about scoring artificial affection points, but instead where the companions are interested in you right at the outset.  But where there are things you can do to turn the companions off (just as there are already things you can do in tOW to make the companions leave).  And also, where the initial interest of the companions is predicated on the type of character you created, where some of the companions will like a meataxe, some will like a nerd, or various other companions of stats.

Edited December 12, 2018 by slopesandsam

[Big-Ben]

Here is my three-point explanation of why I don't really like romances (as they've been implement thus far) in RPGs:

 

2. They're unrealistic.  Maybe it's just me, but my real-life experience of romance has never been a situation where I was interested in someone who was indifferent towards me, and I won them over with my words and deeds.  Nor has anyone managed to win me over when I was initially indifferent towards them.  In fact, I've found that the opposite is usually true: people have been immediately interested in me, but I've managed to balls it up by saying or doing the wrong thing, or I've been interested in someone until they said or did something that really turned me off.

 

 

Games by and large are at some level Mary Sue simulators. People fall in love with you because it's a fantasy and isn't at all realistic. This is also why in a game like Obvlion you can somehow be an Archmage, Arena Champion. Guildmaster of the Fighter's Guild, the head of the Thieves Guild, the hero of Kvatch and Cyrodill and lastly Speaker for the Dark Brotherhood. It's completely and utterly preposterous but it's a thing that CAN happen so I tend to just leave my brain at the door.

 

I don't disagree with you actually but games are well, games and have to be at some level, gamey.

[AwesomeOcelot]

 

And there's romances in Planescape: Torment, Jade Empire, etc.

 

I'd argue there's a difference between writing some dialogue options that might lead to a romantic encounter with a couple of the companions vs the full-on dating sim-esque mechanics that seem to have become the norm in RPGs.

 

Jade Empire might be the worst and best implementation of romance ever. Really simple to implement, bring back the good/evil meter and then just a few checks of dialogue in one conversation.

 

Every single new game, people ask for the same ****: romance, multiplayer, crafting, different views, turn-based/VATS... Obsidian are constantly fighting feature creep as it is. This is not the way to design things. People will keep banging these drums in every chat, forum, survey, and audience questions.

[Foamhead]

 

 

 

My bad. I meant it would not support other operating systems like Windows 7.

You mean the 2009 OS that mainstream support ended on January 13, 2015? I am shocked that Obsidian isn't supporting Windows 7.

 

 

Yes, the 2009 one that nearly 40% of the desktop market still uses and has no desire to upgrade. Now that Obsidian is Microsoft they won't support their older OS's. Keep sucking up I'm sure they're just about to make you a mod.

 

Around 30% of Steam gamers use Win 7. Less for gamers in the West, the target market. Less among FPS gamers. Obsidian, Private Division, and Microsoft will have statistics on the market, they won't leave 40% on the table. Microsoft don't decide on OS support they're not publishing. Extended support ends 2020, desire to upgrade is incoming.

 

 

As much as it might shatter your entire sense of reality to absorb this fact, not everyone uses Steam as a platform so it isn't a proper metric. Current estimates are 40% regardless of what Valve says.

 

Microsoft owns both State of Decay 2 and Sea of Thieves also, they didn't release either for Windows 7 or 8. Microsoft's studios only support the current OS because that's how they roll.

[bugarup]

 

Sexual addiction should be an in-game flaw that leads to the very hard and extended sex bot side quest. Plus therapy. Lots and lots of therapy.

NPCs refuse to talk with you because of your obvious . . . eagerness.

 

 

"Star Wars: the Old Republic" has some options like that. You roll up to some NPC, hit that [flirt] choice and hear "Sorry, married. Happily married." Or "Dude, it's a war zone, there are lasers shooting, wounded people howling, gibs flying and you think this is is the perfect moment to hit on me?!"