Barbarian Help?

[Cyrus_Blackfeather]

Hey guys, 

 

So... Here I am again. I really ought to create an alt-itis support group or something, but it's kind of mitigated somewhat by the fact that I Still. Haven't. Started. My BoW playthrough yet. Granted, part of it is waiting for 2.1 to hopefully iron out some of the major bugs I've been hearing about, but another part is coming up with a bunch of good ideas and then discovering flaws in them. But now, I think I have a somewhat clear idea of what I want, so I can more freely talk about it with you guys. 

 

1. Why a Barbarian? 

 

Simply put, I like the idea of building around Lord Darryn's Voulge, because I think it's a really unique/cool weapon with a nice effect. Barbarian synergizes really well with it, because Carnage procs the Static Thunder effect on every enemy hit by it. Berserker is the go-to subclass. Plus I like the idea of running a build that doesn't just default to sabers. 

 

2. What am I looking for? 

 

A front-line fighter that deals good damage (I'd like to see triple digits on a regular-ish basis and at least have most attacks be in the upper 80s and 90s) while having reasonable survivability. An offensive tank, basically - someone who could clear adds while Eder keeps the big boss occupied, or swap in to take pressure off of him and not immediately keel over. 

 

3. What have I considered?

 

- Brute (Tested): (Berserker/Devoted) Fighter for Armored Grace, Unbending, Vigorous Defenses, and Mob Stance. Offers lots of action speed boosts as well as a very good hit-to-crit skill in addition to Frenzy. 

 

- Fanatic: (Berserker/Bleak Walker) FoD for an extra melee attack skill, Inspired Beacon for an AoE 40% damage taken debuff and Blind. Extra defenses through Deep Faith

 

- Ravager: (Berserker/Shattered Pillar) - Wound spender, uses lots of primary attacks (So I don't lose anything by using a two-handed weapon. Has Stunning Surge as another refundable attack skill. Essentially three different types of resources to use (Rage, Mortification, Wounds). Blade Turning for redirecting melee attacks at other enemies. Anti-synergy with Swift Flurry and Lord Darryn's Voulge though, because I'm not sure if Swift Flurry and Lightning Strikes would stack or if one would overwrite the other. 

 

- Pure Barbarian: Access to upgrades to Barbaric Shout, as well as Heart of Fury and Rage on being crit. 

[knownastherat]

Streetfighter, because it provides insane bonuses and synergies and anything else, in my opinion, just waters down the monster Marauder is for questionable benefits. Devoted is less impressive than flexibility to inflict the appropriate type of damage, Bleak Walker provides FoD but Barbaric Smash is better to click and same goes for Shattered Pillar resource refound. 

 

As we talked about this before, it depends on what you want to do with the character. Massive AoE damage of all types, strong CC and even DoTs, mobility, utility and tactical options via invisibility and blink, high risk and reward play, this is Streetfighter/Berserker.   

[Cyrus_Blackfeather]

Streetfighter, because it provides insane bonuses and synergies and anything else, in my opinion, just waters down the monster Marauder is for questionable benefits. Devoted is less impressive than flexibility to inflict the appropriate type of damage, Bleak Walker provides FoD but Barbaric Smash is better to click and same goes for Shattered Pillar resource refound. 

 

As we talked about this before, it depends on what you want to do with the character. Massive AoE damage of all types, strong CC and even DoTs, mobility, utility and tactical options via invisibility and blink, high risk and reward play, this is Streetfighter/Berserker.   

 

My issue with that is having to remain bloodied and/or flanked to proc the Streetfighter's bonuses. And I really don't like relying on Blunderbusses to achieve that, if at all possible. 

[whimper]

Was the final option you were considering a no-subclass Barbarian, or a Berserker?

[Haplok]

 

Streetfighter, because it provides insane bonuses and synergies and anything else, in my opinion, just waters down the monster Marauder is for questionable benefits. Devoted is less impressive than flexibility to inflict the appropriate type of damage, Bleak Walker provides FoD but Barbaric Smash is better to click and same goes for Shattered Pillar resource refound. 

 

As we talked about this before, it depends on what you want to do with the character. Massive AoE damage of all types, strong CC and even DoTs, mobility, utility and tactical options via invisibility and blink, high risk and reward play, this is Streetfighter/Berserker.   

 

My issue with that is having to remain bloodied and/or flanked to proc the Streetfighter's bonuses. And I really don't like relying on Blunderbusses to achieve that, if at all possible. 

 

 

Well, one solution is to have your party wizard cast Chill Fog within combat area. You'll probably fail the save... eventually. Even better if you have the Defiant Apparel hat, as it will downgrade the Blindness and remove the 50% speed and 10 Accuracy malus.

 

Of course sometimes you can afford to get Flanked. 

 

My understanding is that Shattered Pillar is not so good nowadays. Needs to use lots of basic attacks to gain Wounds. And better forget about Blade Turning.

Edited August 22, 2018 by Haplok

[knownastherat]

 

Streetfighter, because it provides insane bonuses and synergies and anything else, in my opinion, just waters down the monster Marauder is for questionable benefits. Devoted is less impressive than flexibility to inflict the appropriate type of damage, Bleak Walker provides FoD but Barbaric Smash is better to click and same goes for Shattered Pillar resource refound. 

 

As we talked about this before, it depends on what you want to do with the character. Massive AoE damage of all types, strong CC and even DoTs, mobility, utility and tactical options via invisibility and blink, high risk and reward play, this is Streetfighter/Berserker.   

 

My issue with that is having to remain bloodied and/or flanked to proc the Streetfighter's bonuses. And I really don't like relying on Blunderbusses to achieve that, if at all possible. 

 

 

How is that an issue? I do not use the Blunderbuss mechanic myself. Lord Darryn's Voulge is AoE weapon. Melee AoE implies being surrounded by or being engaged by multiple enemies. The other halberd is also AoE with transfer effect ability. Unless you heavily RP Marauder can use any other weapon occasionally without the need to invest in weapon specialization. For tanking there is Eder for everything else melee related there is Marauder. If you want a good fighter with good survivability you pick Rouge/Fighter or Paladin. If you want a tornado you pick Berserker. The malus to recovery from Streetfighter is negated by Frenzy alone. Add speed bonuses on kills, and there will be many bloody slaugthers, and even without the Streefighter recovery and crit bonus, fast sneak attacks on debuffed enemies will do good damage. And when it gets Bloodied, gg for mooks.

[Cyrus_Blackfeather]

 

 

Streetfighter, because it provides insane bonuses and synergies and anything else, in my opinion, just waters down the monster Marauder is for questionable benefits. Devoted is less impressive than flexibility to inflict the appropriate type of damage, Bleak Walker provides FoD but Barbaric Smash is better to click and same goes for Shattered Pillar resource refound. 

 

As we talked about this before, it depends on what you want to do with the character. Massive AoE damage of all types, strong CC and even DoTs, mobility, utility and tactical options via invisibility and blink, high risk and reward play, this is Streetfighter/Berserker.   

 

My issue with that is having to remain bloodied and/or flanked to proc the Streetfighter's bonuses. And I really don't like relying on Blunderbusses to achieve that, if at all possible. 

 

 

How is that an issue? I do not use the Blunderbuss mechanic myself. Lord Darryn's Voulge is AoE weapon. Melee AoE implies being surrounded by or being engaged by multiple enemies. The other halberd is also AoE with transfer effect ability. Unless you heavily RP Marauder can use any other weapon occasionally without the need to invest in weapon specialization. For tanking there is Eder for everything else melee related there is Marauder. If you want a good fighter with good survivability you pick Rouge/Fighter or Paladin. If you want a tornado you pick Berserker. The malus to recovery from Streetfighter is negated by Frenzy alone. Add speed bonuses on kills, and there will be many bloody slaugthers, and even without the Streefighter recovery and crit bonus, fast sneak attacks on debuffed enemies will do good damage. And when it gets Bloodied, gg for mooks.

 

 

That's fair. And I suppose I can afford to be flanked - and drop Might a tad (It's at 17 base now) to maybe boost Constitution a bit for extra HP/longer Bloodied states. 

 

Honestly, a big part of the reason why I swapped to Barbarian/X over Swashbuckler or Holy Slayer was because of the synergy between Carnage and Static Thunder from Lord Darryn's Voulge, so I'd like to keep that. It's nice to have synergies between the class you're playing and the weapons you like to use. 

 

If it helps, this is the kind of mood I'm trying to evoke. 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxBd05c0STo

[Theosupus]

The Fanatic is my new Favorite play-through. 

But I dual wielded the OP "on crit" combo.

Pretty sure it'd still work as a 2hander with a few adjusts.
You wouldn't have to be Bleakwalker either, any type of pally would work.

[Mocker22]

As you have made up your mind on Darryn's I think devoted would be a great choice. You named a bunch of the best reasons, but some other food for thought here. Having two sources of bonus penetration will help guarantee those big hits your looking for. Between fighter and berserker skills your hit to crit is huge and you have great bonus to crit damage. Also, I remember you wanted to be tanky. Unbending will bring a lot to this. Keep your might and intel very high and it will make you nearly unkillable, not to mention some of the other great fighter benefits for survivability. Brute's skill sets just feed off of each other SO good.

 

I'd also maybe recommend fairly low dex. You want to crit a lot so don't let your per slack too much. Barb offers tons of speed boosts, Armroed Grace will take DoC BP to zero recovery, and you can throw in the Falcon helm if you want since your going 2her.

 

Seriously bro I've seen all your posts lately, and I'm BEGGING YOU to make a Brute and stick with it.

Edited August 23, 2018 by Mocker22

[Cyrus_Blackfeather]

As you have made up your mind on Darryn's I think devoted would be a great choice. You named a bunch of the best reasons, but some other food for thought here. Having two sources of bonus penetration will help guarantee those big hits your looking for. Between fighter and berserker skills your hit to crit is huge and you have great bonus to crit damage. Also, I remember you wanted to be tanky. Unbending will bring a lot to this. Keep your might and intel very high and it will make you nearly unkillable, not to mention some of the other great fighter benefits for survivability. Brute's skill sets just feed off of each other SO good.

 

I'd also maybe recommend fairly low dex. You want to crit a lot so don't let your per slack too much. Barb offers tons of speed boosts, Armroed Grace will take DoC BP to zero recovery, and you can throw in the Falcon helm if you want since your going 2her.

 

Seriously bro I've seen all your posts lately, and I'm BEGGING YOU to make a Brute and stick with it.

 

I know, I know. I'm terribly indecisive. My issue is that I keep testing these, and they all seem to work fine, it's just a matter of finding which one is the most fun. 

[Parasol_Syndicate]

Devoted is a strong option if you're building around a specific weapon. 

[Theosupus]

Another thing to know is a devoted/monk can still use unarmed without penalty iirc. (not that you'll need it; I don't think there is anything that is slash and shock immune).

[Cyrus_Blackfeather]

Another thing to know is a devoted/monk can still use unarmed without penalty iirc. (not that you'll need it; I don't think there is anything that is slash and shock immune).

 

I'm pretty sure Earth Blights might be shock vulnerable? I know the Sand Blights were - you can stunlock them. 

 

Mhmm, main reason I went with the weapon, really. Even at Superb, with a class combo that offers solid Penetration it's a really good option. 

[Ascaloth]

Shattered Pillar is the one Monk subclass you don't want to multiclass with a Berserker, because it's the only one that doesn't gain Wounds from damage incurred. And since Berserker Frenzy deals Raw damage to himself on a continuous basis, going Shattered Pillar robs you of the synergy where the Frenzy's Raw damage feeds Wound generation.

 

Literally any other type of Monk would synergize better with a Berserker than the Shattered Pillar would.

[Haplok]

Sure, Devoted is a good pick. But personally what is off-turning for me is that with other classes I can use any weapon well. With Devoted I would be locked to Voulge and maybe Wahai Poraga. While otherwise late game I could play with the likes of Engoliero de Espirs, Voidwheel or the new Oathbreaker's End.

[Theosupus]

Just for fun I made a quick Devoted/Helwalker test vid so you can see what i meant about the playstyle.

It wasn't fully optimized or anything, just kind of what I thought was a pretty fun use of the Poleaxe

Edited August 23, 2018 by Theosupus

[Elric Galad]

Could a Single Class Berzeker become a armored tank ?

 

With Thick-Skinned and Hardy inpiration, he would have a great AR.

 

One of the ultimate shout buff engagements and inflict the longest Dazed of the game, for an equivalent +6/+7 AR increase.

 

With Barbaric retaliations, huge HP pool and No Recovery on kill (great with the heaviest armors), it could provide a good level of sustainability along with Barbarian DPS.

Edited August 23, 2018 by Elric Galad

[Theosupus]

Could a Single Class Berzeker become a armored tank ?

 

With Thick-Skinned and Hardy inpiration, he would have a great AR.

 

One of the ultimate shout buff engagements and inflict the longest Dazed of the game, for an equivalent +6/+7 AR increase.

 

With Barbaric retaliations, huge HP pool and No Recovery on kill (great with the heaviest armors), it could provide a good level of sustainability along with Barbarian DPS.

 

-Very much so.

 

-The reason why it's not so common though is that Barbs crit, a lot, and that matches with other classes' (and equipment) "on crit" effects so well that a lot of people don't pass up the multi-class option.

 

 

-Barbaric Retaliation is not usually good on a tanky (high deflection, lots of crit->hit) character though since you only retaliate when crits are made on you. (so it's typically used on low resolve, high HP, and regen heavy builds (or "Barring death's door").

 

Edited August 23, 2018 by Theosupus

[Elric Galad]

Barbarian tanking does not seem to require high Deflection, so you don't have to put a lot of point in Res, you can even dump it in favor of Con since barbarian benefits a lot from it.

[Cyrus_Blackfeather]

So, right now, and I know this is going to drive some folks nuts, I'm trying to decide between these three options. 

 

1. Brute (Berserker/Devoted): Basically, Regen tank. Stacks high Might and +Healing to get the best use out of Unbending and then just soaks damage and heals up while laying into enemies. 

 

2. Pure Barbarian (Berserker): Access to higher level Barbarian powers like the Dazing upgrade to Barbaric Yell and Heart of Fury, as well as Barbaric Retaliation. 

 

3. Marauder (Berserker/Streetfighter): Basically a food processor of whirling death and destruction, that can't take a hit until I grab better armor and Nemnok's Cloak to allow for on-Bloodied/Near Death effects. Basically, a big bundle of hit points to soak the first few crits to proc Ironskin, followed by Barring Death's Door. 

 

Leaning toward the Brute or the Marauder. 

[Verde]

I hate Streetfighter but it screams to be paired with a Barb/Beserker.

[Haplok]

2. Pure Barbarian (Berserker): Access to higher level Barbarian powers like the Dazing upgrade to Barbaric Yell and Heart of Fury, as well as Barbaric Retaliation. 

 

3. Marauder (Berserker/Streetfighter): Basically a food processor of whirling death and destruction, that can't take a hit until I grab better armor and Nemnok's Cloak to allow for on-Bloodied/Near Death effects. Basically, a big bundle of hit points to soak the first few crits to proc Ironskin, followed by Barring Death's Door. 

 

Pure Berserk also gains access to Rage recovery on kill (which he should be doing a lot of). Pick 2 awesome PL IX abilities out of 3.

 

And regarding Streetfighter... well particularly for two-handed combat... once you taste Streetfighter speed its damn hard to go back to moving like molasses. Sure there's Blood Thirst... but you need to be pretty high level (unless pure) and score the first kill.

[Cyrus_Blackfeather]

 

2. Pure Barbarian (Berserker): Access to higher level Barbarian powers like the Dazing upgrade to Barbaric Yell and Heart of Fury, as well as Barbaric Retaliation. 

 

3. Marauder (Berserker/Streetfighter): Basically a food processor of whirling death and destruction, that can't take a hit until I grab better armor and Nemnok's Cloak to allow for on-Bloodied/Near Death effects. Basically, a big bundle of hit points to soak the first few crits to proc Ironskin, followed by Barring Death's Door. 

 

Pure Berserk also gains access to Rage recovery on kill (which he should be doing a lot of). Pick 2 awesome PL IX abilities out of 3.

 

And regarding Streetfighter... well particularly for two-handed combat... once you taste Streetfighter speed its damn hard to go back to moving like molasses. Sure there's Blood Thirst... but you need to be pretty high level (unless pure) and score the first kill.

 

 

Oh, definitely. It's just a matter of finding ways for me to be able to survive long enough to make best use of it. Which is why I was considering things like Nemnok's Cloak. But I've tried several different Streetfighter builds, and you're definitely correct as far as the speed goes. Nothing compares. Once you get a good momentum going, you're basically a food processor. 

[Haplok]

Yeah, with dual weapons and some other good bonuses, it's okay not to have the Streetfighter bonus for me. But two-handed or single weapon/shield are just too slow once you get used to that speed...

[mosspit]

That's probably why I have not done a proper playthrough with a Streetfighter yet.