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Cipher should be able to self buff in Deadfire

cipher buff inspiration

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17 replies to this topic

#1
Takkik

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In Deadfire inspirations don't stack and most classes have access to self buff inspirations. Priests & chanters can even AOE self buff. But the 2 buffs spells Cipher get (inspirations) are single target and ally only. Valorous Echoes and Pain block could serve the cipher the most. Or Wild Leech need to be less random.

 

Attack spells that target allies are fine, but the restriction on the buff spells make no sens. Description wise nothing block the cipher to apply them on himself. Balance wise, with all the buff most classes have access that don't seems to be a problem to allow cipher to self buff and that would boost the class.

And you have the recovery. In one cipher cast, the wizard can full buff himself and be ready to cast an offensive spell. I don't see how allowing cipher to buff himself would unbalance the game. That would give more options for multiclassing too. MC is here for versatility, but if you mc some classes you loose that capacity to buff them with the ciper. Rogue & ranger + cipher, or druid + cipher.

 

Just a little change to make the class more interesting to play.


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#2
jones092201@gmail.com

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borrowed instinct and body attunement are pretty strong self-buffs...


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#3
Wormerine

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Ciphers thing is manipulating people souls. Manipulating your soul seems... irresponsible.
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#4
Big-Ben

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Ciphers thing is manipulating people souls. Manipulating your soul seems... irresponsible.

 

I agree. Making your own character remember terrible things sounds like a great debuff.


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#5
Volourn

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Maybe the cipher is into self ahrming and is masochistic. Maybe they think pain makes them stronger. Don't judge.


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#6
dunehunter

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I would like to design a passive talent or a gear attribution called 'Empathy' which will let your character to receive the same buff as the target you buffing. Too bad I shall create this item for my 'make an item' tier :p


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#7
Jorian Drake

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Ciphers thing is manipulating people souls. Manipulating your soul seems... irresponsible.


Actually not a bad idea to do. In PoE1 we can already eat other souls or manipulate others, why shouldn't a cipher be able to do it to itself? That would be like how in Shadowrun/Cyberpunk people intentionally cut out/off body pieces to replace them with cybernetics to improve various skills. A cipher could alternate or steal memories for its own use and benefit, make the soul immune to some things like being frightened, or immune to manipultion by anyone else (charm effects and such)

edit: also, obviously recall knowledge from past lives to increase skill levels or (re)learn abilities, maybe even from other classes.

Edited by Jorian Drake, 21 May 2018 - 08:30 PM.

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#8
Takkik

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Ciphers thing is manipulating people souls. Manipulating your soul seems... irresponsible.

 

I agree. Making your own character remember terrible things sounds like a great debuff.

 

 

Valorous Echoes :

The cipher bring echos of an ally's past lives to the surface, inspiring the ally who greater feats of heroism.

 

Pain Block :

Provides an ally with a mental block on their pain

 

Nothing terrible about these spells. Someone capable to control mind sould be able to exerce same level of control on themself. It could be a early passive that unlock it, why not. I don't think that would break the balance. The problem is when you multiclass you loose the ability to buff the other class. the point pf MC isn't to be versatil and combine two roles together?

 

Another way, just rework wild leech to not be random, or add a similar ability(ies) that mimick valorous echoes/pain block as debuff/self buff.


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#9
BlessedHeretic

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Honestly with how the new system is working for the per-encounter resource system, I hope this happens. Would definitely be great to be able to try to solo in PoE2 with that low cost accuracy buff as well.



#10
Suxamethonium

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I buff my cipher all the time. Body attunement and borrowed instinct at the time I hit ascended before I let fly with a series of shred spells, with borrowed instinct helping me score hits to rebuild focus once out.

#11
dunehunter

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Ciphers thing is manipulating people souls. Manipulating your soul seems... irresponsible.

 

I agree. Making your own character remember terrible things sounds like a great debuff.

 

 

Valorous Echoes :

The cipher bring echos of an ally's past lives to the surface, inspiring the ally who greater feats of heroism.

 

Pain Block :

Provides an ally with a mental block on their pain

 

Nothing terrible about these spells. Someone capable to control mind sould be able to exerce same level of control on themself. It could be a early passive that unlock it, why not. I don't think that would break the balance. The problem is when you multiclass you loose the ability to buff the other class. the point pf MC isn't to be versatil and combine two roles together?

 

Another way, just rework wild leech to not be random, or add a similar ability(ies) that mimick valorous echoes/pain block as debuff/self buff.

 

 

If a cipher are allowed to buff himself. A paladin should be too. I demand to use Exhortation on myself.


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#12
BlessedHeretic

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Ciphers thing is manipulating people souls. Manipulating your soul seems... irresponsible.

 

I agree. Making your own character remember terrible things sounds like a great debuff.

 

 

Valorous Echoes :

The cipher bring echos of an ally's past lives to the surface, inspiring the ally who greater feats of heroism.

 

Pain Block :

Provides an ally with a mental block on their pain

 

Nothing terrible about these spells. Someone capable to control mind sould be able to exerce same level of control on themself. It could be a early passive that unlock it, why not. I don't think that would break the balance. The problem is when you multiclass you loose the ability to buff the other class. the point pf MC isn't to be versatil and combine two roles together?

 

Another way, just rework wild leech to not be random, or add a similar ability(ies) that mimick valorous echoes/pain block as debuff/self buff.

 

 

If a cipher are allowed to buff himself. A paladin should be too. I demand to use Exhortation on myself.

 

+1 to just being able to self buff with anything period. The only spells that should require an allied target are ones that work like echo beams IMHO. As you need to latch it onto a friend to be usable anyway and self casting would do nothing.



#13
Tagaziel

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Ciphers thing is manipulating people souls. Manipulating your soul seems... irresponsible.


Plus I'm pretty sure people would frown on you manipulating yourself in public.

#14
Boeroer

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I don't get why paladin's exhortations shouldn't work on themselves. I mean I remember a lot of situations when I shouted at myself to push me further. :)

 

In PoE1 ciphers could at least cast Pain Link on themselves (which made them potentially good at being retaliation tanks - even without focus generation via retaliation). Now even that is not possible anymore. While it's not that bad in a party the solo cipher would be more fun if you could cast Pain Block etc. on yourself. Or create a passive (great opportunity for meaningful passives) that allows you to cast those "ally-only" buffs on yourself.


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#15
dunehunter

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I don't get why paladin's exhortations shouldn't work on themselves. I mean I remember a lot of situations when I shouted at myself to push me further. :)

 

Haha yeah I think it make sense we can motivate ourself too. This is an issue for soloing when u are excluded from half of your abilities, which is the main reason i avoid a single class paladin.



#16
Takkik

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I can't talk for the Paladin, but in this game I find selfbuff superior to support buff, because most of the time the selfbuffs are instant cast/recovery. A barbarian can have strong, robust (make pain block 'useless'), swift... A fighter have lot of defensives abilities... The classes that need the most the buffing are classes that lack selfbuff, like the cipher himself (he has 2 good debuff/buff, but no inspiration selfbuff outside wildleech who is too... wild/random), rogue, ranger... if you multiclass them you loose the ability to support them.

 

It's hardly a problem of balance comapred to other selfbuff and aoe buff that feel superior overall, but that would give more freedom.

 

I've checked the paladin, you have the exact same problem. It's inspirations. Solo or multiclass with another class that don't have these inspirations and you loose the ability to buff you. Compared to chanter inspirations that are AOE & Selfbuff, I don't understand why you can't use on yourself too.


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#17
Lord_Mord

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Psychovampiric Shield? Wild Leech? Borrowed Instinct? Didn't check the higher levels so far, but that's what my Cipher/Barb-Serafen is using. Works good.



#18
Saito Hikari

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Cipher would be straight up absurdly broken in terms of the absolute utility they already have if they could cast Pain Block on themselves, just saying.

 

Time Parasite by itself is ludicrous enough to the point where Cipher is one of the most viable single class options, and it's a self buff.







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