BattleCookiee

Untill I find a better quote from Bush here's Rumsfeld claiming it

Double moral for us? How about you and the US-government. After 9/11 you guys got full support of the European people and governments to invade Afghanistan, since it housed the people that attacked your country. But for some reason that support and government has been "lost" over time? Uh huh, maybe the revenge was already largely completed when there was an stupid "side-walk" allowing many Al-Quada to escape? Don't confuse your oh-so-tiny (for good reasons) support for the War in Iraq with the major (for good reasons) support in Afghanistan. And for the Americans who say "Bush didn't say so" why don't you look at your OWN media instead of going "European media" sucks right away. If so many report it in various countries over the continent, well, there has to be some truth in it, doesn't it. Or do dozens of country had a major scam written for the US to feed to their people for... eh, nothing? And sofar I never heard people here say you deserved 9/11. Europe isn't Palestina mind you... but ofcourse you forget Iraq isn't Afghanistan, so it wouldn't be so hard to make that misconception... And now for the "Why we totally do not care what Chirac says": Hello, it is France. It isn't like their is a chance that they actually gonna do it... It isn't like people as Blair and such have said worse things that totally slipped the loop. Oops, such is the fate of being a leader of a "non-meaningfull" country not trying to predict "World-Freedom"... If this comment was made by Putin, the Iranian president or the North-Korean it would have world-wide spread though, as they 'are capable of doing so'. Not just the US. But, well, they are clever and don't say things like this, and I don't have to tell you how "smart" your president is...

Split of from Kotor2's "Was it worth it" and moved here... And just this little bump to make sure that it gets noted at all, since C&C is alot busier than Kotor2 general...

Speculation

Pretty darn good Zulu 86 And that for "just a quick one"

On-Topic discussion about Replayability moved to C&C. Thread locked

Indeed. But one major difference between Christianity and the Islam is here that with the Islam it has actually been used mostly by violent conquering type of guys to explain their violence (Bin Laden), while the crimes of the Christians have actually been done by an institution (The Church) that is the "official voice" of Christianity, and thus "in order of God". It is one thing to blame your violence on a believe. It is an other thing when you are The representive of your religion arguing for the killing of thousands of people...

And a little bit further on the Muslim killed more/Christian killed more from before; Also the cause of my thinking Christians killed more is because with the Christians there is a direct way of seeing their wars/killings... as they have... "The Pope" and "The Church". The Islamatic do not have such figureheads, and thus do not have people who actually influence all of the belief-holders (against the Taliban and such who only reach the radical part) saying that wars should be started to widen their "view" and heretics should be executed, just because they don't believe (the same). And on religions themselves. I still wonder why 1000's of years later people still believe in books which have been scientifically proven false 100's of years ago and caused millions of deads in the process. You would suspect that if people are proven to be lied to and numbers mentioned of people died due to such a thing it would vanish. See this and all other "war threads". You need proof, or nobody would believe you. Everything proven false 100's of years ago do no longer count in any way? What about the cassualties? You would still wan't to preach for something that caused suffering for the millions? I don't mind if people would believe in God. Maybe he even exists. But man can believe in Him without books with "scientifically falsified" facts and rules who ended the lives of several (millions of) people in the past... and even now on the moment this is written...

Power loss of Dictators can only be gained by military efford resulting in many casualties. That is atleast 1 thing we learned from Iraq...

Who said I was talking about Jerusalem? If the muslim go killing other religions for being other relegions then why do you only post about how THEY EVEN dared to give a Tax to Non-Muslims By pointing out that the Muslims made alot of wars for their belief to spread? Wow, newsflash, also alot of wars spread Christianity, and also alot of "diplomatic missions", which included learn or die. And hey, even before religions war were fought... how odd is that? Just to blame wars only on the spreading of believes... Atleast we were sure that it was by the Church that all the Cathar and Heretics have been tortured and killed. Do you have evidence that it was a Muslim order to start these wars to spread their belief? Or was it just a "we need more land, let's conquer and right away spread our beliefs"... as that happened damn often here in Europe too, but it was seldom that it was actually called upon by the leaders of the religion and more by the leaders of the land... And yes, I am not afraid to tell I find religion ridicilous, especially if millions of people die or have died for it, and yet there people didn't think it was extremely wrong... But was it Muslim? Or was Islamitic believe just a secondary goal. I have to note that there have been quite some other races, like the Monguls, that have been able to conquer the whole of Asia without having the Islamatic believe, and still gave alot of their "experience and beliefs" to the people they conquered. But there are no facts. If two sides fight, and both think they do it for the good stuff, who are we to say that one is "good" and the other "bad"... mainly if they both do the same?

I just said I didn't say that. Let's see; Doesn't exists, right? And here in Holland the largest part in the Parlement in Catholic... Killing their leaders would be the **** them then, and be sure you will be ****ed back worse than 9/11... Ofcourse, that will make you guys more pissed off than ever. Who talks about peace, let's have war! As it seems that is a "common thought" in the UK things may finnally work out their after all and prevent you guys from becoming a mini-US. (And just to add Blair doesn't even goes that far for "protecting" as some other politicians)

Yeah, it would be so bad if they had to give the country the conquered with the Roman Empire would have to be given to some other religion. Christians had a real hatred for other religions, did you know? Maybe that was the reason. Why do they strike at the Moslim, but not the Vikings? No objection here OMG. Not being able to practice your own religion! How freakingly mean. LOADS less worse than the Christian way of just murdering, locking up and torturing everybody having another a religion. Look like the Cathar for example. The were all killed by the Church... Reason: Heretic I don't accuse the Christianity for anything else than that they did. I am not saying any of the religions was good, or they were either *peacefully* in any way, but the conquering and laws of the Muslims was alot less worse than the wars and laws of the Christian... And the Crusades because of "Muslim aggression", eh? Maybe they looked like it from the same way as "Christian aggression", and they were the liberators. Hey, that looks alot like the current situation in the middle east, no (we should really get away from arguing about silly religions). The Christian Liberators saving people from the Muslim Aggression. But for the Muslim it shows Christian Aggression and they have to the Liberator stuff... From all points of view; "Aggression" and "Liberation" just depends on your POV. There is no wrong to either thinking... but not everybody will agree with your "right choise"

Well, you said when the leaders were dead there would have been peace. But killing a few leaders and more would show up, so the only way to actually end such a thing is to kill every "potential recruit". And I don't think anybody will ever do that... And christian priests ignored and such? Damn, when the Americans go to school they have to hail God. No Christianity anywhere ofcourse... " And I would think that the Arabs would be less Anti-West if we don't invade them, convict every moslim as terrorist and help that little country that bothers them alot from being overrun..., not by removing radical leaders. Yes, but everyone you just mentioned are idiots... And yet we listen and follow these and convict the others as warmongering/evil etc. See the thread about Chirac. If an Arabic country would have done that it would probably been enough reason to invade. Since; nukes (actual or non-existant) = Invasion, no?

As you source from Wikipedia, here is what it has to say on the Crusades. Make sure to read the boldend parts

What do you wan't dead now? The leaders of countries, or the radical leaders of the Islam? Or maybe you just wan't everybody there dead? And as said, kill one radical leader, and more will rise, deadlier (and more radical) than before. And for every Iranian president there is a Bush, a Chirac and a Blair... and for every mulsim cleric and following there are an equal number of people who wish all Muslim dead... If you think THAT list is impressive, look up the list of wars/killings due to Christianity... Both religions suck, and are war mongering and useless, but that doesn't mean that we need to loose which of the 2 is worse throughout history (it would be different in the "now" form...)

As any religion, they indeed make alot of deaths (silly thingies, religions). But just to make a statement when the Islamatic Leaders are dead there will be peace can never become true, and even if the Islamitic religion (like any religion) killed many people, not a single religion can be called more bloodlust or has caused more deads than the Catholic one...

Well, leaders of a country can be put out of office (that were the leaders applied on in both posts I hope). The killing of Religious leaders is just working against you... severly, and it thus (except if you wan't to improve hostility) useless. Over 100's of years religious leaders died... peacefully (old age) and by being killed. Is religion passed out? Nope, since there is always somebody to take over that position. One pope dead, and a new one rises. One imam dead, and a new one rises. One religious leader "killed" and you might have yourself an "additional" war... Really, the Islam hasn't made as crazy wars YET as the Christian people did. Crusades, 80-years war, the forcefully persuading inhabitants of Africa and Asia to be catholic. The burning and killing of everybody not-catholic. Entire religions have been erased by Catholics, just for not being Catholic... (remember the Inquisition |(sp?)?) Uh... what? War is Peace? If people are ruled by Iron Fist, there won't be war, since the person who tries to collect an army or following for a war get's killed before being able to do so...

Alright, enough fun... let's get back OT. Discussions about specific games can (and have) be done in C&C, and if you wan't to discuss about replay value of game X I would also advice hopping into C&C to ask. I would just say, if you wan't a replay value of 100+, don't trust on RPG's, and do trust on RTS...

*Thread pruned* Having said that some other Pro's and Con's of Kotor2 on the console; Pro's Faster (that is, unless you were a European X-Boxer) Always compatible (Kotor2 has some *hardware configuration issues* to say the least) No 1.0B Con's No mods Same bugs as PC version, but un-fixable Uglier Etc.

Lots of cutting occured yes, and alot wasn't succesfull (HK-Factory anyone, or the locked navi-computer, Go-To and Remote scene?), but it is still interesting to see that there was something different planned for the meeting...

After reminders in another thread, explain the "Traya Academy left or right path" Kreia talks about or why Mandalore think blowing the Ravager will piss off the republic? Ain't you confused with the EP I Padme (14) played by a adult actor (Natalie Portman)?

I forsee trouble when not having Zaalbar when you reach Kashyyyk...

Except for the warmongerers are not their leaders, but their citizens, so even without these leaders there may be the same amount of war... or maybe more (see Iraq for example) since they are no longer ruled upon and wan't to rule over others. Leaders = Metal Fist to keep peace Leader-less = Total chaos, suicides everywhere, some grasps for power leaving many deads YAH! That'll be peace...

*Thread pruned* This is NOT a Kotor3 thread

You have to press the Yes button several times in a row... (everytime she stops talking untill the sequence starts) Good luck (that mission SUCKS)...