Marceror

Oh, that's just human nature. People don't like change because... they don't like change. "Back in my day we only had 50 - 60 posts a day around here, and that's how we liked it! Now we're getting more than that in an hour lots o' times. Site's going to hell in a hand basket I tell you," and all that.

Sah-ree I've never even noticed a post from you before this one, so you weren't really the target. But given your oversensitive reaction, I'm not really going to change my stance. I don't think I had ever noticed a post of yours before either, so you're in good company there. Regardless, I was attempting the channel the collective spirit of the "new member influx" when I posted that ("new members" being those who joined up since the PoE Kickstarter, I assume). And I wasn't being oversensitive. I was really apologizing, though was trying to use a cute internet voice in hopes that I might ever so slightly endear myself and the many thousands of brethren that I presume to represent. But I guess that didn't quite work out, based on your response. I'll just see myself out then.

Did you have a fever at the time? And was she your mother?

I haven't spent much time with crafting/enchanting yet. I think I'll wait until the game is a bit more stable before I do so. For those suggesting it should go away, well, it was a stretch goal so if it wasn't included in the game that would put a lot of people off I'm sure. So Obsidian is just going to have to make sure it's well done instead. I have absolutely no problem with a well done, well balanced system for crafting and enchanting. I do agree that placing restrictions on when and where you can do it makes sense. I'd suggest implementing crafting benches similar to those in NWN2. Creating a sword and imbuing it with magical properties should NOT be something you do as you're walking to the cave of horrible and eternal death. It should be one of those "in between" adventure activities.

It's quite a morale boost when fans come together to propose productive alternatives for perceived weaknesses in the game, and the project director comes in to interact with those fans, and really everyone who is contributing, to talk through potential solutions together. That's a rare and, dare I say, beautiful sight to behold.

I do and don't understand that perspective. I understand wanting a justification, but it's always seemed fitting to me. Many AoE spells/effects originate at a point and spread outward. Fireball is probably the most obvious example, but I tend to think of most effects that way. You're a super smarty, so as you extend the AoE outward, you are able to selectively shape it at the margins, where it terminates. You can't do it on the interior because that's the origin of the effect, where it's emanating from. That's always been my view of it, anyway. Makes perfect sense to me, and eliminates some micro to resize the AoE.

Dump her!

Sah-ree

He already did a short Let's Play. I don't think got very far, but I'm pretty sure he's done. You should be able to find it with a google search. EDIT: Here you go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aO9Qa8KbeMc

Yep.

This is the crux of the matter, so I figured I'd post it here for quick visibility. I'm still taking it in, but on the whole I'm liking it. I'm definitely feeling that it addresses the "no dump stat" requirement better.  Might: +% Damage and Healing (+2% per pt)  Constitution: +% Stamina and Health (+2% per pt)  Dexterity: +% Increased Action Speed (+2% per pt)  Perception: + Accuracy and +% Interrupt (+1 and +1% per pt)  Intellect: +% Durations and AoEs (+5% per pt)  Resolve: + Deflection & +% Concentration (+1 and +1% per pt)

Thanks Sensuki and Matt. I'm looking forward to giving this a read.

Right now, Health:Stamina is 1:1. For every Health, you have one point of Stamina. The loss ratio is 1:4, so that every every 4 points of Stamina damage, you lose 1 health. That's ideally how the system should function. You get knocked out more easily than you are killed. The change sounds like a semantic difference. Both are Health and Stamina/Endurance are lost at the same rate, but your Health will be multiplied by a class Hit-Die; logically making your health value greater than your stamina. That must be how its going to work. If they move the ratio to 1:1 without increasing health & stamina/endurance values four-fold or greater, characters will both get knocked-out less and die more quickly. That can't be right. I imagine that this change will be semantic only then. That's my point. It largely is a semantic difference. One of their goals is to make the system more clear, though personally it has been pretty to me from the beginning. That's what the change from 1:4 to 1:1 with a multiplier addresses. The second part is to give classes more staying power. They could have just as easily stayed with the existing system and changed the ratio for fighters and paladins to 1:6, priests and druids 1:5, etc.

For this system to increase the longevity of melee classes, the resource which governs their mortality must be higher when applying damage at a 1:1 between them. Otherwise the character will die before they get knocked out. Mortality Statistic: Knockout Statistic 50:150 - Character takes 50 damage, distributed at a 1:1 ratio. Character's statistics are now 0:100. They are dead, but still fighting? 150:50 - Character takes 50 damage, distributed at a 1:1 ratio. Character's statistics are now 100:0. They are alive, but incapacitated. From the quote, it sounds like Mr. Sawyer is using Endurance as the mortality stat, while Health is the knockout stat. Whatever they call them, let's just hope that it works out like supposition #2. I'm not reading it that way at all. My understanding is that endurance/stamina is completely unchanged as a mechanic. You run out of endurance/stamina and you are knocked out. Similarly, health will still be the mortality stat. It's just that you will have a lot more of it, and it will be lost at the same rate as endurance/stamina. I think you're reading too much into this. The change is far less sweeping than you are thinking.

Either expansion or a sequel could be... you are the spawn of the missing deity Woedica. But there are many other children and most of them are vying for dominance. Will you rise up and claim the fabled Throne of... Woe? Or will you opt to live the life of a mortal, albeit one with eventual demigod-like power? The choice is yours! That could be a stellar premise for a game.

The idea is that classes with higher ratio can take more punishment on their health which will make them require less frequent resting to replenish it. The system remain unchanged beside this. For example, a Barbarian might have a 100 endurance and 500 health (5 * Endurance). In the first encounter, the Fighter is hit for a total 80 points of damage. His health is now down at 420. In the second encounter, the Fighter is hit for 120 points of damage. His Health is now 300. In the third encounter, he gets hit for 50 points of damage. Health is now 250. In the final boss fight, he gets hit for 200 points of damage (this was boss). Health is now 50 and resting should be envisaged. Except, the multiplier that you use as an example would cause a barbarian to need to rest a lot more often than current. At present, from third level on (IIRC) a barbarian takes 1 health damage for every 8 stamina/endurance damage. So for a barbarian to be on par with current, in your example, they would need to have 800 health (8 * endurance). For them to become "more resilient" they would need an even higher multiplier. 9 or maybe even 10 would probably be appropriate. I don't think they are going to remove the Barbarian "thick skin", they are probably going to keep it that their endurance/health damage conversation is different than the other classes once they gain the passive. The system is already in place for it. That's a fair point. Maybe they will start at x5/x6, and then thick skinned will add an additional x4, or something.

The idea is that classes with higher ratio can take more punishment on their health which will make them require less frequent resting to replenish it. The system remain unchanged beside this. For example, a Barbarian might have a 100 endurance and 500 health (5 * Endurance). In the first encounter, the Fighter is hit for a total 80 points of damage. His health is now down at 420. In the second encounter, the Fighter is hit for 120 points of damage. His Health is now 300. In the third encounter, he gets hit for 50 points of damage. Health is now 250. In the final boss fight, he gets hit for 200 points of damage (this was boss). Health is now 50 and resting should be envisaged. Except, the multiplier that you use as an example would cause a barbarian to need to rest a lot more often than current. At present, from third level on (IIRC) a barbarian takes 1 health damage for every 8 stamina/endurance damage. So for a barbarian to be on par with current, in your example, they would need to have 800 health (8 * endurance). For them to become "more resilient" they would need an even higher multiplier. 9 or maybe even 10 would probably be appropriate.

Yes, in that regard I think it will work exactly as it does now. The difference is that endurance and health will be lost at the same rate, but health will draw from a much larger pool. Endurance = stamina, and as it is currently, will be the resource that takes a player out of a fight when depleted. Health will be the resource that is important for character death.

More like Endurance = x, health = x * y, where y equals the multiplier applied by class. I'm expecting multipliers between 4 - 8, maybe as high as 10 for a barbarian. But this is still being worked out by the design team. EDIT: Reread your post. A player would be knocked down when X = 0. They would be dead when XY = 0 (depending on difficulty level).

1 to 1 ratio loss, but health will be a multiplier of endurance, so expect multipliers larger than x4 for tankier classes, to make them go longer without needing rest.. I'll link the post in a sec. Josh posted here a couple of nights ago. EDIT - From My Sawyer:

But... the stamina health system is already getting actively reworked. Is the OP not aware of that, or somehow not happy with the proposed ideas? And it's now the endurance/health system. No more stamina. health will be a multiplier of endurance, so 30 endurance might by 120 health for a wizard (x4) and 180 health for a fighter (x6). This should contribute to less resting for frontliners.

Bleh. No thank you. I like our 11 classes. Many of them just need to be further fleshed out.

Really well done. I'm amazed that you were able to gather so much lore so early. I've been sneezing a bit since watching, so I may in fact be allergic to your accent. .... Ahhh....CHEEEW!

Wow, nicely done Palior/Nilsor! What an honor.

Warrior is another name I like.