Boeroer

Nightshroud is inferior because you can't refine it and it's on-hit effects will not trigger often. I had that exact rogue build. It's very good - I would still guess that in 100 one-on-one fights between a good monk and that rogue the monk would win more often.

Stupid mobile version... double post again.

No it does not - sadly. So neither greater frenzy nor the belt do anything for the sanguine plate induced frenzy. At least that was the case with Version 2.01. I had to retrain my barb because of that.

When I did some 1:1 fights where I send one of my party members against a single powerful foe my monk was always best. But I have to say that my rougue didn't have invisibility or an overbearing/stunning weapon. I had the classic dual wielding sabre setup which was very powerful regarding dps. If the invisible rogue would cause a crit with prone or stun then the monk would be in trouble. But a crit is not ensured and neither is the disabling effect that also has to overcome defenses. Just dual wielding with annihilating sabres would not be enough in most cases I think. Disabling is the key because if you don't do it, the monk will prone you for a long time. I also think that a monk with durgan refined speed weapons would be more powerful than with fists - although I love fighting with fists. For most of the game they are great. But after you get Durgan Steel I think you should switch to weapons.

Okay - invisibilty together with some stunning or overbearing effect on your weapon is really dangerous. But keep in mind that this is restricted by uses per rest. If you just look at one encounter after you've rested than you're probably right. Would be fun to have some sort of PvP arena to try this out. It's a pity that pausing will not work in this case.

Exactly! Well said. Because Barbs have quite low base accuracy and carnage attacks are even more inaccurate you need some kind of acc buff and/or defense debuff to make him crit a lot. And this tactic is easy and effective.

But wouldn't your Lady of Pain be even more powerful if it were a monk? Your (aoe) DPS with Turning Wheel, Torment's Reach and Lightning Strikes would be awesome together with that stellar might of yours... wouldn't it? Of course you would be a little slower because of not having Armored Grace.

Blade of the Endless Paths for the win! Why don't you add Ryona's Vembraces for another 3 DR bypass? With that attack speed it would contribute enormously against high DR foes in PotD. But 13 DR bypass might be overkill most of the time.

In my memory Pilferer's Grip did -16%. But since I'm an old fart it's possible that my memory doesn't serve me right. Just looked it up: it's -10%. Sorry for the wrong numbers. But still a good item.

Bounties can be hard. I suggest that you go to Stalwart - at lvl 7 it's doable and there are lots of quests.

Of course he will - but only if he uses Sacred Immolation and that comes quite late. Now if he doesn't have this ability a fighter will be a better damage dealer because of his damage bonuses. And I think that nobody says that a paladin under lvl 13 does more DPS. But if he uses Sacred Immolation the fighter will certainly fall behind. I'm also not saying that a paladin is the best DPS guy out there - he surely isn't. But you can skill him for DPS and will have a very sturdy char that does solid and consistent damage at first - and on top of that you will have very useful on-kill effects that help the whole party. If you want to build around that (which can be very effective) than you have to build a dps paladin and not a supertanky one - no DPS, no kills, no on-kill effects. So you will have a very useful party member. He will do way more dps than a chanter and still support greatly with buffs, heals, auras and on-kill effects. After lvl 13 however his DPS and kills will improve immensely and his overall usefulness will go through the roof. I agree that lvl 13 is very late and you shouldn't rely just on that single ability when you plan your (dps) paladin. But you will always at least have a very solid frontliner that not only stays up and keeps hitting for OK damage but also buffs and heals all the time. Until lvl 13 a fighter can be the better face-to-face DPS dealer and is also very sturdy - but he doesn't add anything else to the party. If you want exactly that: a sturdy DPS melee guy that doesn't have to do anything else than hitting enemies - then of course a fighter is a good choice. But saying a DPS paladin is bad overall because you simply reduce him to his +damage abilities is just ignorant. And saying that you HATE it that people do something different in this game than you (and they think it's good) is not only ignorant but generally a questionable attitude. Why would you hate that? It's ok when we don't agree and also bearable that we seem to constantly talk past each other. Screaming HATE is not.

Thanks for the info mate! I'm on holiday with wife and kids atm - when I get home I will look into this.

When you're dual wielding the recovery penalty of heavy armors isn't so bad anyways - in absolute frame numbers. That's because the basic recovery time is way shorter than it would be if you use two handed weapons. So there's a good tradeoff when you dress your dual wielding rogue in plate. Not so if you're using two handed weapons. But anyways you can durgan refine your armor and put on Pilferer's Grip. That drops the penalty from +50% to +19%. You will have good protection, can get into melee earlier and you'll have lesser knockouts while being only slightly slower. That would result in more dps most of the time I think.

That's what +defense against disengagement attacks is for. And nobody said that every stupid mob has to have these special talents that boost disengagement attacks. I just think that these mechanics would make fights more interesting and it would be fun (at least for me) to try out builds that delve in this special area. I tried it - but at the moment it's just neither fish nor fowl. So I just ignore engagement most of the time - which is a pity.

You're welcome. I think Tall Grass is a good choice. It's more powerful in the hands of a rogue or barb - but if you don't have them in your party it's one of the best weapons for you I think. Depends on your build, but still. Merciless Gaze plus Eldritch Aim (and maybe Minor Threat) produce a lot of crits. You should also think about Firebrand on the Forgemaster's Gloves. It's not only a great DPS weapon but also works well with your two duplicate spells. If you play a tanky melee wizard with heavy armor you can easily summon a duplicate and be two tanky dps wizards with flaming great swords instead of this stupid wand the duplicate would wield otherwise. Add that heavy armor "White Crest" from Stalwart and you add some more spells to your duplicate while also adding lots of DR. Then get the boots of speed from Russetwood for two fast tankywizs - or use some boots with spell bindings. Stack all spell binding gear that fits your playstyle with this char - like Cape with mirrored image and so on. It makes your duplicate a second caster and improves your party performance immensely.

Of course it is. It's even no big problem to create a new talent for that. Then nobody has to be annoyed since you could just ignore that talent. The question is if the devs like the idea or not.

Tehehe - right. I'm also wondering why there's two of them. One would have been powerful enough (maybe costing 6 wounds or so). But I don't complain - I love it! Did I already say that I love it?

Well said.

No, I just like the idea that you can't turn your back to an enemy and walk away without consequences. And that you can't just run through a gap between two enemies when one of them or both are not fully occupied. So a disengagement attack could be a kick with the boot or a hit with the ellbow or whatever - maybe that's why it is invisible But a proper animation would also be nice.

Hey - no need to get c0cky. I didn't intend to hurt any feelings - just a little teasing. All right. Overall: definitely wizard at the moment. Best spell composition for any playstyle. If we're talking about non-casters and melee: definitely monk. Even more since 2.02 because of his new skills (awesome!) and the fact that Lightning Strikes + Turning Wheel stack now. Ranged: I would say ranger because of the improved pets, the new skills (great) and stormcaller. Before that it would have been rogue I guess. It's a pity that he only got this crappy smoke bomb. And we're just talking about "solo" builds - without help from other chars. 'Cause like I mentioned in another thread: individual builds are not as effective as a whole "party build" where all characters use perfect synergy. In such a party individual power is not so important. And we should define if this char should be measured regarding PvP or PvE. At the moment I'm thinking about PvE because there is no PvP in PoE. You can get an impression what classes would be hard to fight in PvP when you go to Crägholt Bluffs and see which classes are the toughest one to beat. For me it was the monks (brawlers) and the fighters were also hard - but of course these nps - especially the warmages - weren't very special builds. And that's just my opinion and I may be wrong. And my personal preferences how to play the game may also interfere with my objectivity. But I think I'm not too wrong.

I like the idea of engagement and disengagement attacks because it opens up another way besides DPS and CC to influence combat. It's just not very useful at the moment because it's just doing some little bonus damage if you break it. Nearly all enemies just shrug off one single attack. That's not very threatening. Having the chance to apply some short CC effect (you would still have to overcome the corresponding defense of course) on the other hand could be very useful even if your base damage is whimpy. I would like it if there where some more talents like Hold the Line and Defender or Gracefil Retreat that concentrate on (dis)engagement. But not only adding engagement slots and giving more defense against disengagement attacks, but also adding more dmg or/and some affliction. Something like "painful disengagement attacks" (can add weakened), "powerful dis. attacks" (adds 20% damage), "crippling dis. attacks" and so on. I mean there's also Interrupting Blows which is very special and is only really useful if you plan a certain build - so why not allow builds around disengagement attacks? That would enrich combat and make it more interesting. Another plus: Graceful Retreat, Hold the Line and Defender would become talents that are not a complete waste. Same with items and spells that give bonus defense against disengagement attacks.

I will give you my account number then.

Sacred Immolation alone puts a paladin in front of every fighter DPS build. At least in PotD where you have plenty of mobs. The good thing about a DPS paladin are the on-kill-effects that can be great. A fighter doesn't have this. Aoe heals and deflection buffa on kill are great if you combine this with Sacred Immolation and FoD. A fighter can be built to be a very good dps guy also, against single targets he's doing more damage, and with the durgan refined Sanguine Plate with Pilferer's Grip and Armored Grace he will have max armor without recovery penalty which is supercool. But he's not contributing so much to the party like the pally does. Whatever - the only problem here is that brindle loves his clichee fighters and rogues and will argue till doomsday to convince you that DPS pallies and tanky rogues are inferior. All I can say is that after countless of PotD playthroughs I still discover nice and powerful builds and party compositions that are not straightforward.

Sorry... double post.

What he said. And yes, they profit from all items you have - except weapons. Best armor for you is the padded one that has spell binding Alacrity - because that means your duplicates also have one use of Alacrity every time you summon them. Then they hit like whirlwinds. You can also give them formemaster's gloves or rotfinger gloves and whatever holds spells. They will be like monky wizards or wizzy monks. It's hilarious and I love it! Or them...