Boeroer

In terms of CC effects AoE nearly always beats single target though - which makes carnage + on hit/crit effect more effective than single target hit + on hit/crit effect. This is even more crucial if you have spell chances on weapons. With a barb + overbearing weapon you can jump into certain bounties and start hitting - there will be a big chance that you won't get hit at all and can kill everybody without getting interrupted. You can't do that with any other melee class. This walking CC effect is one of the reasons I value barbs. The other are creative and unique abilites like Blood Thirst for example. I mean how awesome is Vengeful Defeat? Kill people around you while going down? Hilarious! By the way: doing a "The Ultimate" run with a dual wielding barb atm. We'll see how it goes. So far I'm at lvl 3 in Anslög's Compass. Didn't have to use pulling, kiting or consumables so far (exception: I lured the trolls to the bandits of Magran's Fork because of this infamous and annoying outlaw who uses Unbending 3 times in a row. ).

The lvl-bonus for carnage is another reason why barbs get better and better with every level. At the beginning of the game they start with a big malus in ACC and damage for carnage and their base ACC also isn't top notch. In later levels it's the opposite. No wonder some people think that barbs suck when you only look at the first few levels, how can they not? It's those "hidden" improvements that make the barb effective. But, as was said before: probably the class whose usefulness depends on items the most.

I'm not emotionally attached to any class. I'm just judging from (somewhat large) experience. I just think that barbs are way better than most people think. I guess you haven't watched Kaylon's video.

Both (melee or ranged) works well with a cipher. When ranged there are three approaches which grant good focus: 1. Quick Switch + multiple guns or arbalests or crossbows: you want to get as many weapon sets as possible (Island Aumaua + Arms Bearer talent = 4 weapon sets) and fill them with your weapom s of choice, e.g. arquebuses. Once you want to focus you switch to an unfired weapon set and shoot. This can give you immense focus bursts when you need them, but only 4 times until you have to reload. Another variant is to use a bow or implement for the 4th weapon set and use that after all guns got fired. Pro: very fast focus gain at the beginning of the combat Con: slower focus gain once you used all guns, intensive micromanagement because of manual switching Special feature: there's a crossbow in the game that works with every weapon focus and shoots two times before you have to reload and it also gives +3 extra focus per shot for ciphers. I would recommend 4 arquebuses. 2. Bows: Yeah and that's basically it. Bows have higher sustained DPS when the fights are longer. Hunting Bows are faster and do better against foes with low DR, war bows also work ok against armored foes but are slower. Pro: higher DPS Con: sometimes takes a few more shots to get enough focus against high DR foes. Special feature: there's a Hunting Bow in the game that works with every weapon focus causes -6 shock DR on the target and does shock damage (works with Heart of the Storm talent). I would use war bows. 3. Implements: Same as bows basically, implements have a bit less base damage but two damage types which can be a big advantage against foes who are resistant or immune to pierce damage as well as meeting foes who are vulnerable to crush or slash. There's also an implement with the speed enchantment fairly early in the game (Engwythan Scepter) which will be the best ranged DPS (or better: focus per second) option overall for a cipher - at that point in the game. Pro: very flexible, better DPS when meeting pierce resistant foes or foes who have a certain weakness. Con: a bit less DPS against foes with no special resistance to pierce damage Special feature: there's a rod in the game that shoots two projectiles instead of one and it can proc a spell on hit that lowers enemies' DR by 5 points and debuffs their defenses. I would aim for the Golden Gaze (rod, ruffian) or stick to the Engwythan Sceptre (scepter, noble). The good thing with wands rods and scepters is that they are both in the same weapon group and thus you can cover all physical damage types (crush/slash/pierce) with a wand rod and a scepter in your weapon slots. All those approaches work well. At the moment I like the implements best.

Still you can alter the stats when retraining (in an inn for example).

It gives you +2 RES and -1 INT and that's it. It's the only "fancy" hat that does anything besides covering your head. But basically it's for the looks, yes.

They should have a 3d-model.

Yes, I agree to that. In the early game the shortcomings of the barb (mainly his lower starting value in deflection) are very obvious. At the beginning of the game +15 deflection is a huge advantage while having a bit more endurance just means you can take one more hit. This totally favors fighters and monks for example which feel a lot sturdier. You need quite some levels in order to balance out the 15 points of deflection with a lot more endurance and health. The high health is very beneficial later on though because if you rely on healing (Veteran's Recovery, Savage Defiance and stuff) a lot you want to have as high health as possible or you have to rest all the time. Of course, the 3 CON barb only has the same endurance and only a little bit more health than a 10 CON fighter - so he needs to stack more defenses (or ACC debuffs) than a usual barb in order to survive. The best thing about that barb tank isn't even his own tankyness, but the ability to stack his ACC debuffs with every other deflection buffs the party can give. That was a reason why he was pairing up so well with a Shieldbearer Paladin: the deflection buffs of the paladin plus the AoE ACC debuffs of the barb result in a super sturdy party even though the other party members where build squishy.

Huh? I was just about to donate another batch. How dare you, anonymous patron! Well, more toys for my children I guess. Now voted for trinket. But there it's even more difficult to know what is allowed and what not. But since OBS won't have to create 3D-models and animations around trinkets (like they would have to do with weapons, hats, cloaks and armors) I guess there are less boundaries...? Maybe Aarik will know.

That is correct. You should always target the toughest foe if you are dual wielding + HoF. If the initial target dies after the first swing then HoF will not execute the second swing of the Full Attack. (same with Torment's Reach by the way, just for info). This is no problem of course if you are not dual wielding. Blooded triggers at 50% endurance, not health, but I guess you meant endurance. Just want to be clear. Barbaric Blow (BB) seems to be a bit meh - but it can be really good when you're dual wielding. First of all it's a Full Attack, but the best feature is the hit-to-crit conversion and the +0.5 crit damage mod. With annihilating sabres or battle axes, Doemenel Talent, Dungeon Delver, Rabbit Fur Gloves or Azalin's Helmet and Barbaric Blow you will deal +50(crit)+50(annihilating)+50(doenemel+delver+items)+50(BB) = +200% base damage on crit. So it's one of those abilites that you have to shape for yourself - like mst of the barb's stuff is to be honest. Barbaric Retaliation: that's right. But it's raw damage and thus works reasonably well against high DR foes as well. As I said I didn't mean the barb is particularly good against single enemies - but he's better than other melee guys (e.g. chanter) who don't have any abilites that improve their performance against single enemies a bit. At least the barb has some tools that also work okish against single targets. Nothing fancy of course. It strongly depends on your party composition and how you play. When the barb is your main tank and you don't have other tough frontliners than maybe 3 CON is too low for the early to mid game. I had a two handed priest of Berath and a Ploi paladin as additional frontliners, too, and I think he went down 3 times in the whole playthrough. The healing alone could balance out the lower starting deflection if he missed the shouts or got diabled too quickly. About barb in general: despite people saying he isn't viable for soloing or he isn't good for this and that - I did a solo PotD run with a dual wieldung sabre barb and is was one of the most "easiest" solo runs with a melee (non-caster) guy. Mostly due to the AoE capabilities and the very high endurance and health pools. It's true that a barb needs more levels and some special items to bloom. Their advantages around endurance and health are not visible in the early levels and you don't know yet how aweseome the combination of carnage + special weapons enchantments can be. I think that's the main reason why a lot of people think that barbs suck. Since I have no problem to work around his weaknesses (especially not with a party) that's no problem for me. I really like barbs. Also they way how you play them. Due to the nature of casters (very strong in tough fights, good enough in trash fights) those will always be superior to the other classes after some levels, but in terms of fun (also concerning build variability and in comparison to other dedicated melees) the barb is a good class. I wouldn't substitute a barb with a caster - not because the later isn't more powerful, but because they play differently and usually I play to have fun. If I would be looking for the most OP party I would use 6 chanters with Dragon Thrashed and will have the most boring playthrough ever. Or 6 wizards... Wait... why did I say "would"? I already did it...

Nothing can compete with Dragon Thrashed to be honest. It's the best combination of tank + damage that you can have without using any resources at all. About barb tanks: we have different perceptions then, because my barb tank (like described above), who stacks at least -30 acc malus on enemies in every fight, was absolutely awesome and added a lot of survivability to the whole party, not only to himself, while doing more damage (countin carnage damage, too) than most other tanks. He's not as tanky as a full tank paladin of course, but who needs that in a party? Heart of Fury is the best "active", per encounter damage ability in the game. But you have to do some preperations to make it superpowerful. It is also able to kill dragons - if the dragon is surrounded by enough of his minions. First of all you have to be dual wielding or wearing Badgradr's Barricade or Dragon's Maw, then you have to skill everything for maximum damage on hit (not dps). Because speed is of zero use when using HoF. Also, the radius of HoF is bigger than the initial circle you see when you apply it. That's because every enemy who gets hit by your HoF radius will trigger a carnage attack that reaches beyond that radius. So, you can even hit enemies utside that circle, but with less hits overall. It's good to have a wizard with Pull of Eora if you want to use HoF. Another advantage is that HoF generates a lot of hits (with enough enemies around) and thus works with Combusting Wounds (unlike Dragon Thrashed) and it also works with things like Vulnerable Attack (you don't have to care about attack speed here) and all on-hit/on-crit effects of weapons. For example using We Toki (left hand, in order to attack with it first in a Full Attack - offhand hits first with Full Attacks) + another battle axe will result in tons of crits with annihilation. Every additional enemy will increase the overall HoF damage exponentially (literally, not just figuratively). So you want to have max INT and an overseeing item, too. With 4 enemies in that initial range of HoF you will generate 16 hits, with 5 enemies 25 hits, with 6 enemies 36 and so on. You will trigger 36 Combusting Wounds with one attack. You can imagine how much damage this will be - even without the damage from HoF itself (which is also huge, at least you will hit every enemy 5 times, not counting additional effects from weapons with spell chance or whatever). With Combusting Wounds + Heart of Fury, maybe even adding Vengeful Defeat + Second Chance, you can solo upscaled Magran's Faithful without kiting and splitting. Whiping them out in a few seconds. Watch Kaylon's video where he did it. You can't do that with most other builds or classes. This can be very valuable! Even better than Dragon Thrashed if you look at the tactical perpective, because you will kill right at the start of an encounter, instantly, not over time. You can even combine instant AoE CC and AoE killing with one attack. It needs better positioning and preperation than Dragon Thrashed of course, but is has its advantages. HoF is level 11 by the way, not 14. Quite the difference... And how can a barb with be useless against a single enemy? His abilities evolve around AoE damage, that's true, but he will have things as Frenzy, Blooded, Barbaric Retaliation, Barbaric Blow and other stuff that also work well against single enemies. Therefore he's better against single enemies than the usual chanter for example. He will never be the dedicated single target damage dealer, but he's far from being "useless". Wizard's Blast is very nice as well, I will not argue with that. But it is not connected to the weapon damage, it doesn't profit from talents that benefit weapon damage, not from dual wielding and has crush only. It does work with spell chances and on-crit-effects, but it will not cause draining in a AoE like Tidefall + carnage, it will not apply lashes or durgan steel's enhanced cit damage, it will not profit from Vulnerable Attack or any other DR bypass other than its own (Penetrating Blast, you need to put a precious talent point into that) and its AoE size is smaller, too. It works very well with Kalakoth's Minor Blights & Combusting Wounds though and I like it a lot. But that's a totally different way of playing. There is fun in jumping into the fray an hacking at stuff rather than standing aside and swinging an implement.

For me, that' a feature.

Same. Brilliant & Aggrandizing Radiance are pretty nice (and their bonuses stack with everything), but Brilliant Radiance is bad, even if it hits in a big AoE. The damage is so low that most of it will be eaten up by enemies' DR. Just a wasted talent point. You can make it work as MC with a lot of MIG (Aggrandizing + item + Champion's Boon/Minor Avatar), lots of ACC for crits, Doemenel talent and Scion of Flame (not DoT, so it should work). But why all the hassle when you can just cast something better without wasting casting time for a low damage ability and wasting a precious talent point?

Totally forgot about that.

It would be really helpful if OBS would give out some "guidelines" around the item. Until then it's fishing in muddy waters...

Low DEX is not so crucial with a barb since you will have Frenzy, Bloodlust (both stack). With Spelltongue both get prolonged a lot. You can also try this with dual wielding and Two Weapon Style to be even faster and balance out the lowish DEX even more. Also don't forget that Spelltongue itself will give you an additional speed buff.

Should work OK. With Maneha you can also go two handers with Frenzy + Bloodlust + Blood Thirst. Low DEX is not a problem with those abilities. I really like Hours of St. Rumbalt with a barb.

Heart of Fury kills whole encounters without using up resources. I'd say it's better than most spells if used properly. Also, a barb with an overbearing or stunning weapon will be a great walking CC effect that doesn't use resources and at the same time deals great damage. Of course you can nuke everything to pieces with a caster after the early game if you have to. And that's the strength of the casters. But you will have to rest all the time if you want to unleash everything you've got in every encounter. The barb however can unleash most of his potential in every encounter and thus can be a lot of fun and effective. It's relatively easy to solo with one after Act I is over without kiting and pulling while it's difficult with other non-casters. And they can make awesome tanks, too, if you want more than the usual tincan that can't do anything but standing around and get rushed by. You just need to follow a different approach: https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/89991-class-build-the-golden-dragon-barbarian-tank/ Not only will they have high virtual defenses (by lowering the acc of attackers) but all other party members will profit from their debuffing, too.

I would have voted "trinket" instead, but there's no option for it, tehehe.

Yeah - I also suggested that option in another thread. It would merge our "ingame-recognition-ledger" with a trinket item that gives a bonus. It would also be a bit more creative than a sword.

Yeah - that's why I like survival's healing bonuses with Veteran's Recovery much better: you don't even need to click on an icon.

With a retaliation build it's also very nice to use potions of Infuse with Vital Essence when the fight starts. It will give you a health buffer which will be used first before your own gets scratched.

Right - the ring and the cloak don't stack. The only cloak whose defense bonuses stack with everything is Cloak of Comfort. Athletics gives you Second Wind - it doesn't scale with level and has awful casting time and recovery. I don't put a single point into Athletics no matter the build. I nmy opinion it's better to invest in lore and cast Moonwell or invest in survival and get healing bonuses instead. Edit: corrected some horrible grammar mistakes (left some in for your amusement )

Soul Whip & Biting Whip stack with Apprentice's Sneak and also with Savage Attack and Two Handed Style. I find Draining Whip more useful than Greater Focus, but as was already said GF is ok in earlier levels because it lets you start an encounter with a power from a higher tier or lets you use two Whisper of Treasons instead of one before you have to regain focus. Particle effects are buggy but do not affect the damage you deal. It's just a graphics glitch.

So I did some quick'n dirty vector graphics to show what I meant with the "standard shape" and the "obsidian edge + inlays" in one of my previous posts. In this case it's the model/shape of a fine great sword in PoE, no changes to the shape, only the textures. This could be done to any weapon with a blade, not only great swords. Of course great swords has the biggest "blade canvas": This could be ivory + obsidian or so... What do you think?