Nobear

Hoople, first of all I did not know that Faith and Conviction only became active sometime into combat. I hope it's soon, like within a second of starting? I guess that means my effective defenses are higher than I thought they were. Second, which version are you playing on which platform, and is it Steam, GoG or Mac App Store? I'm playing 1.0.6 Mac GoG version. It seems there are minor inconsistencies between the versions. They ought to do a better job of keeping them consistent, although I am not a developer so I don't know how much of a challenge this is.

I'm curious about why this is taken so universally true as gospel in this game. In other games, there is debate over whether to prioritize endurance (i.e. health, typically) or defensive stats. I have not gotten very far in the game, but are there no enemies that can one-shot a tank with minimized Constitution on PoTD? If heals are put aside, 3% endurance would translate to 3% longer survival at values close to normal. Yes the value of this would decrease slightly the more there is, but not tremendously, as we are just talking numbers up to around 30% above normal. Conversely, minimized Con would mean your tank survives 21% less time than normal, or 79% of normal. Heals of course can help compensate, but they are also harder to get off the lower your tank's health pool, all things equal. Of course, all things aren't equal, and I don't know how I'd begin to calculate the impact of Perception or Resolve on average survival time. It would depend on which defense the attack was targeting, obviously. Then again, Constitution also improves Fortitude. I don't know how common damaging Fortitude attacks are throughout the whole game, but Prone and the other disabling attacks are certainly annoying. Hmm... this discussion probably belongs elsewhere. Does anyone have a link handy?

That is true. Your character sheet out of combat should tell you what to expect when you go into combat. You shouldn't have to pause combat just to check your character sheet for something that should be in effect all the time.

I have a request pedroelm: I'd love it if you could test a cipher's Recall Agony, or maybe you know how it works already, but I have searched and cannot find a conclusive answer for this. There are a lot of conflicting opinions. Some possibilities: a) It does nothing. The combat log doesn't report it, and if it feels like an enemy has gone down faster, it may just be a placebo or a coincidence with lucky hits/crits from other party members. Perhaps your methods can help reveal this. b) It reapplies 30% of ALL damage done by ALL party members BEFORE you cast Recall Agony, over the stated time. This would make it potentially very powerful if you apply it after a single tough enemy has gone down say 50% or so. c) It reapplies 30% of ONLY the Cipher's damage done before you cast Recall Agony. With b or c, there are still the questions of whether this is applied with a single DoT totaling 30% of damage done, or a separate DoT for 30% of each instance of damage done, and what % of DR these go against. d) It starts applying DoTs based on 30% of each hit done AFTER you apply Recall Agony. In this case, would DoTs from future hits override or add to previous ones, or would the strongest suppress the others? Finally, with possibilities b through d, would higher Int reduce the DPS and possibly even total damage done (if each tick has to go through some portion of DR)?

I read that thread Fessels, but it doesn't answer if the Outworn Buckler effect being group wide is intended (the developer who answered is from a different team), or whether it's intended that it suppresses items that raise defenses once you enter combat. Considering that it does suppress, I think the ability is not overpowered and no change needs to be made. PS I have checked in other fights: the suppression as listed on each character sheet with defense-raising items who are in range of Outworn Buckler is consistent.

What I have found with Outworn Buckler is that, while it seems amazing (especially for its level), once you get in combat, it seems to suppress the effects of items on your party members that raise defenses. I don't know if this is intended or not. I guess you could argue that it balances out an enchant that would otherwise be overpowered, and maybe no change is necessary. However, wow would it be sweet if it stacked lol.

Well Drath, that mouseover advice sounds good, looks like that fight is going to require insane micromanaging! Yipikayey, a melee rogue can do really good single target damage, which would theoretically rock for a fight with two shades and tons of shadows. The main problem is that he dies fast, but same with the casters. I will definitely come back at higher level, doing all the outdoor areas in Act 1 first, maybe even taking Caed Nua first. Those shade fights probably aren't any harder than the Temple of Eothas ones, and I'll get plenty of XP for advancing the main quest.

I was doing just dandy in all the outdoor forest areas in Act 1 on PoTD. I was playing much more carefully and slowly than on Hard, but I was making it. Then I went into the Temple of Eothas while everyone is still level 3. Lower level, shades have 16 DR, making shadows and everything teleporting everywhere. You cast a summon to protect your weak members, hope they have a clear path to get away and don't die in the meantime, and just as soon... FOOM! Teleport again. I cleared half the lower level, but there's one fight that's just killing me, with full food buffs and all. I guess this is the weakness of having four ranged DD and two tanks who are useless there. I'll probably be able to clear Anslog's Compass much easier and maybe gain an extra level before I come back. As long as I can tank stuff I'm good. The Forest Lurkers in NE Black Meadow made my tanks seem like they were naked, but I brought em down. I think I'll aim to get some Spirit Slaying and Burning enchants on my weapons, seeing as the shades have "only" 8 DR against fire. Dayum... I know there's some hardcore players that want an even bigger challenge, but I'm not that pro and I'm playing with the story companions. I do like the challenge where you actually face defeats, and have to regroup and rethink and optimize before coming back. This game is too freaking good. Alright, I need to go to bed now, cheers.

Oh ok thanks.

It is indeed amazing and unexpected that it applies to the whole party. I determined it was an upgrade over a large shield thinking the defenses only applied to the paladin. And despite its description, it seems to work regardless of your order, because my paladin is not Darkozzi. BUT... I had an experience in combat that makes me question whether it stacks when it matters. I was fighting Will O Wisps, which are a bit weird granted, as they seem to steal your buffs on top of confusing you. But when I checked in combat on the character screen, it indicated that other defense boosts from items were being suppressed by the Worn Buckler effect. When I exited combat and checked again, the Worn Buckler effect was still listed, but the other defense effects from items no longer had Suppressed written next to them. I will do more testing, but does this match anyone else's experience?

I double checked. On GoG version 1.0.6 (at least the Mac version), Perception's description has not changed. To test it, I ate some food that grants perception, and my character's accuracy did not change. The patch notes did not mention this, so my guess is it was something the developers were playing with but it wasn't meant to go live. Of course, this is speculation, I can't speak for them. On the plus side for me, I don't have to start over yet again, so I can keep going on my PoTD play through! lol

Yeah I'd say your first idea is better for his party setup, because he already has two tanks plus a pet. More melee (unless they are DDs with reach) would just get congested in narrow passages and be useless. If you can stand to give up Eder or Pallegina for your main being a tank, that'd have the advantage that high resolve and perception on your main open a lot of dialogue choices, and a paladin also benefits from being your main in a similar way that a priest would: by gaining power in one ability through dialogue choices. Then you could take Kana and have him speed up your ranged, especially if they are gunners. But if you're set on your companion choices, yeah priest is probably best for your main.

Wow, I didn't notice this, I'll have to check if it's present on the GoG Mac version.

No, each point of Perception still grants 1 Deflection, 2 Reflex, and 3% higher chance to interrupt, which is not the same as accuracy. It doesn't affect your chance to hit or quality of hit, just the chance it will interrupt your enemy's current action, attack or spell.

Sounds good. 5) I have heard that blunderbusses are the best weapons for ciphers, although I'm not 100% sure if that's still true. One of the drugs that increases their focus gain (Blasconn) was changed to be percentage based, so it wouldn't care what weapon type you're using as long as it's high DPS. The other drug (Golan Carow I think it's called) still gives a flat focus gain per hit, so blunderbusses would still be the best with that since they fire 6 pellets (6 separate hits) per shot. If you go with blunderbuss, you probably eventually want both Gunner and Penetrating Shot, so the low damage per pellet can pierce through DR effectively. See, guns spend far more time reloading than actually shooting, so reload speed gains are tremendous while attack speed losses aren't quite as bad. 6) I will tell you that I enjoyed ranger in Hard, and a ranger pet can even off tank in the early game on PoTD, but the problem comes that the pet doesn't scale with gear or level (aside from a fixed 3 DR boost which probably won't go far enough). Since you already have three melee, I think a fourth would be overkill, even a pet. What you'll find is that, in many cases where you are going through narrow spaces, that many melee can't all fit and get to the enemy. That's why I think you made a good choice with your barbarian being a second row guy who can reach. Personally I love ranged chanters with their Sure-Handed Ila chant, which boosts both ranged attack speed AND reload speed by 20% (and yes, each one independently affects guns). Then again, I have three gun users and one other ranged in my party. Chanters also have lots of summons, which I think are better than a ranger pet, because you only use them when you need them. When you are in a narrow space, for instance, the chanter can do a different powerful spell instead. Druids can also summon blights, but I don't know how good these are. If my party had one less gun user, I'd be tempted to take druid over chanter. Ranged rogue is something I haven't tried, but I've heard they can be at least as high DPS as rangers without having to worry about a pet.

1) http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=416939844&insideModal=1 has some good info and ideas that might inspire you. He has certain unconventional ideas, though, like one of his paladin tank builds minimizes Constitution. He argues that Perception and Resolve carry more weight as defensive stats, seeing that they increase one defensive stat by 2 per point, as well as Deflection by 1 per point. I keep going back and forth, and I've restarted the game more times than I'd like to say and therefore not gotten very far >.>, but currently my paladin tank has the following stat spread: 10/14/4/18/14/18 Minimizing might would gimp Moon or Fire Godlike or Darkozzi abilities. You could tweak this a little by having 10 Constitution and 18 Intellect, but keep in mind there is an inn in Defiance Bay that grants 4 Intellect, and I chose to have decent Constitution partly because, along with the Intellect resting bonus, I think that'll open up just about as many dialogue options as I can (which have to be on your main character). 2) I would still argue for Zealous Endurance on PoTD even if you don't have a priest for accuracy, largely because the range of the paladin's aura may not be enough to cover the casters in the back that would benefit most from accuracy. That said, if you choose to have 18+ Int and take the 4 Int resting bonus mentioned above, your auras just might get big enough to do the trick. 3) I have chosen Moon Godlike for my Shieldbearer paladin tank's race, but for a Darkozzi maybe you would prefer Fire Godlike to add to the retaliation pain. Especially in the latter case, I'd choose Moon Godlike for your monk. A monk's abilities depend on being hit, and it'd be awesome if he in turn healed everyone including himself, recovering that damage that he depends on taking. Barbarians are not my style simply because their frenzy conceals their health and endurance and I want to always see that info. Therefore, I am not qualified to give you advice on barbarian race. I don't know if they depend on being front liners (meaning another Moon Godlike would seem fine and dandy for PoTD), or if they can be played well in the second row with reach weapons, so that you might consider Hearth Orlan to maximize their DPS. I just don't know barbarians, so you'll have to ask someone else about that. Next is which character you want as your main. I have chosen my paladin tank, because paladins get their defenses boosted as a result of your dialogue choices, but only if it's your main character. It's up to you whether you want to restrict your dialogue choices for the sake of roleplaying and/or ultimate min-maxing. Lore skill helps your main character the most out of the skills, and I will eventually get decent lore for all my characters except maybe my mechanic cipher, but I will prioritize it for my main. Of course, 3 Athletics for everyone to avoid fatigue and pass checks that could injure weak party members, and I like to have a decent amount of Stealth too on everyone, but that's personal preference. If you're going to take Stealth, you need it on everyone, at least your front liners so that you can position your tanks at the beginning of the battle. Have fun!

You mean while it's in a character's quick slot?

Thanks, those are super helpful answers! Seems like I'll be taking Inspiring Radiance after all, and Zealous Endurance so my priest is freed up for other spells/attacks. And the direct + indirect debuffing mechanics make Miasma of Dull-Mindedness seem really sweet for PoTD.

Thank you. I'm new to the engine, so I was shift-clicking out of habit from other RPGs, which sends things to the stash here.

Like when you have 3 of the same potion and you want to give 1 to another character, can a stack be split?

That grumpy old man and his staff lol, gotta give him credit for being so different from your typical benevolent, meek and mild healer archetype.

Thanks for the info!

I'd like to know this as well. I'm pretty sure Marksman applies to any range attack, including guns and probably even implements (correct me if I'm wrong). The range is important to me, as I'm considering taking Sure-Handed Ila on a chanter off tank. The chant range is pretty big, but I'm not quite sure if it's big enough to reach PCs standing far enough back to make use of Marksman and the Wood Elf racial. The other factor, of course, is that priest/druid buff/heal spells wouldn't reach everyone at once, but maybe they wouldn't need to because some would be more helpful to tanks and some to ranged. Decisions, argh!

http://pillarsofeternity.gamepedia.com/Fighter Starting level 5, it's one of many abilities to choose from. It's not strictly necessary for a tank, but if you're surviving fine and want to increase your damage of course it's good. BTW that website is the official one, but it's pretty outdated and inconsistent. However, it is accurate in this case.

I'm not sure whether temporary active effects like that are supposed to show up on the character sheet or not. Down by the portraits though, when you mouse over the right side of each character's portrait, do you see the bonus listed? Edit: Also, do you have any other active effects that increase accuracy that might be suppressing it, like a paladin's Zealous Focus? I think I read somewhere that this is how effects (don't) stack, but I can't find the info now. A link to that would be great BTW.