Jediphile

Have you finished the game? If not, then you really should before you look for the explanation for Kreia's comment about what's best for the galaxy - it's pretty central to the end of the game. Can't remember the part you refer to, but it should be fairly simple to extract it from the dialog.tlk file if we can identify it.

Yes, it's difficult to live with...

Yeah! At least you never defiled Mystara with 3e. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Actually I did in one scenario with players outside my usual group. They were dedicated to 3e, and I wanted to show them a corner of what Mystara was. Still, I focused heavily on the skills (which aren't so bad in 3e, except for the level limitations) and had little or no combat or spell use. Oh, and I cowrote a 3e Mystara series of adventures... But this was before I broke with 3e. I gave it chance and hated it, and when 3.5 appeared on the horizon, I'd had enough...

My point is that with this scenario, Revan's motives remain his own and so the player remains free to interpret them however he prefers to. Seems to me to be a good way to compromise the various possible outcomes of K1 and K2 and yet have an interesting setup for K3.

Much better than the competing (A)D&D stuff, but as games go, I actually like Call of Cthulhu better. Mystara is tied way too closely to the more silly aspects of D&D rules... I've been considering the idea of Mystara with GURPS rules, but it'll be a major rewrite and I'd lose or have to heavily convert a lot of the feel in the process <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Why don't you try a FUZION Mystara? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Nah, then I might as well go for GURPS anyway. My current Mystara campaign is winding down and will use 2e player option rules (with my heavily modified house rules) until it ends. I've been considering what to do after that, but circumstances might choose for me - I really can't find the time to GM anymore - the Mystara campaign has only survived the last six months because I already had the entire progression of all remaining events and adventures plotted out and therefore could improvize them whenever convenient... And I know Mystara pretty much by heart now...

It is and should be limited by the laws of course, yes. I guess I forgot to mention that. And if I understand it correctly, Jyllandsposten was reported for their cartoons, only the prosecutor decided to drop the case, since he saw no way to win it.

A consensus is useless unless there is some measure of force to make sure that consensus is respected. Be it social ostracism, criminal prosecution, or whatever. In this case there is not only no such consensus, but enforcing it should it be reached would undoubtedly entail undermining individual freedoms. Reaching a consensus may be enough for you and me, and even then, only as long as we keep respecting each other. The question here is, do they respect us? I doubt it, because if they did, they would not tell us what should or should not publish in our press. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> To me this very discussion is an example of whether there should be a right to free speech. This is a controversial subject, and yet we discuss it here. Should we be prevented from that in some cases or should there be limits to what opinions we can express? We may not reach a consensus, but to me the point is whether we are even allowed to look for one through discussion and debate or whether we should accept limitations based on what 'someone' might find offensive. Since we are all still here, it seems most of us prefer the right to free speech. I may not like the cartoons and think the reason for publishing them was questionable - they seemed to serve only as provocation - but if it's a choice between that and censorship of any kind, I'll support the cartoons, since I find that to be the lesser evil, even if it has ghastly consequences, since the alternative is even more scary.

Don't feel so bad. There is no reason to feel like a failure. After all, it's not your fault that KotOR-fans cannot agree on what they would want. In that sense we're really not different from any other fans. Just trying jumping onto a Star Trek board and ask the fans what should be done and which stories should be told to revive the franchise. It's a sure road to havoc and disagreement, I fear... And KotOR fans have better cause to dissent, since the games allow you to end up as both good and evil and choose the gender as well... for two characters now. I mean, just suggest that Revan or Exile should be set to male/female or LS/DS by canon and K3 should then assume that choice, and it'll be certain to cause dissent.

Mystara had specific guidelines for "dominions" in the old rules (and in the Rules Cyclopedia) with castles, servants, and such. Take a look at some of the articles here. Mystara also had rules for becoming an immortal (god). Still, Birthright had rules where the players were the leaders of entire nations...

If the player goes DS, he should stab Revan and Exile in the back, leaving them both dead, and then rule the true Sith while the republic is left to rebuild.

Much better than the competing (A)D&D stuff, but as games go, I actually like Call of Cthulhu better. Mystara is tied way too closely to the more silly aspects of D&D rules... I've been considering the idea of Mystara with GURPS rules, but it'll be a major rewrite and I'd lose or have to heavily convert a lot of the feel in the process

I like that idea, it's good. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well, I don't. To play Revan and Exile over two games just to see them killed off by the plot is disappointing. I want them in the game, and I'd like them as group members too. It shouldn't happen until late in the game, however, or the dreaded level-gap will rear it's ugly head - we don't want any more amnesic jedi, who just lost all their powers again, so I'd either let them appear only toward the end or else to let them be unplayable NPCs (or a little of both).

Well, he has no fleet anymore and the republic is too weak to fight the true Sith. My take is that he will willingly become DS and then have to ambition to rule the Sith empire before taking on the republic. But naturally the current leaders will not want that, so there will be conflict, and that's what "good" Revan is counting on - that the civil war he begins among the true Sith will - no matter which side wins - leave them so weak that they cannot take on the republic afterwards. He may also have left alone so that his friends could kill or redeem him later.

I actually prefer that they leave it unanswered. The worst thing a story can do is to reveal all of its mysteries. Besides, if there is an answer, then how can we have fun topics like this one?

Interesting. Especially given that I have actually tried to cite examples to support my position. Unlike you, I might add. But then I guess you just know so much better than me that you don't to worry about little things like supporting your position with the very facts you mention. You also fail to distinguish between my opinion and myself. Don't feel too bad, though - sadly, it happens rather more frequently than I should like to admit, which makes the chance of a civil discussion astronomically small... What are we supposed to gather from that? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That I can't very well argue in favor of open discussion where any opinion should be heard while I run to the moderators when I don't like something that someone else says. If I did that, then I would be a hypocrit. But then I'm sure someone will twist that to mean that I am anyway... Based on this topic, my opinion of some members of these boards did not so much drop as plummet. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thank you. It should be quite clear from the phrase "religion was still an issue that served as a convenient pretense for pursuing the jews" that I did not say religion was the cause of the entire war. That is the only rational conclusion. The use of the word "pretense" is rather clear. And of all the possiblities, religion was the focus of the - to use your own words - "convenient scapegoat" he chose to polarize the germans against an "foreign" threat. To me that says rather a lot about religion, but feel free to draw your own conclusions. Just consider my point before you dismiss it, please. Criticizing my statements is the not same as criticizing me. You made comments like "coming from you" and similar. Those do not refer to my arguments or statements by to me as an individual. I am grown up. I have not become angry or voiced attacks against you. I have discussed the topic and called you on it when you strayed from it. But I will continue to demonstrate that you are a bully as long as you give me cause and as long as I feel like it... So whether I continue is really up to you - if you stop giving me cause, then I cannot and will not continue. I'm more tolerant than you give me credit for. But when someone attacks the right to free speech, I do take it very seriously, as it is far more important to me than any religion. I didn't like the cartoons and didn't see their purpose, so I thought printing them was a mistake, but if someone says the newspaper can't print them, then I'll stand 100% behind the newspaper, because nobody should censor the press. Similarly, I may not like it when you misrepresent and criticize me, but I'll support your right to do so.

The easiest thing is probably to check out the progress reports at both Team Gizka and The M4-78 Restoration Project respectively.

Call of Cthulhu is a horror RPG based loosely on the works of H.P. Lovecraft. It is typically set in the Boston area in the 1920s and is all about evil cults trying to awaken ancient evil gods of incredible power, the most powerful being Cthulhu, who will unquestionably destroy civilization and enslave mankind if the cultists succeed. The cultists can call on magical lore to summon nasty monsters and similar, and generally you're screwed as a player, because you'll never gain the power of the cultists without learning more about their mythology (the dreaded Cthulhu Mythos skill), yet the more you learn about it, the more insane you get. You used to play with a percentile die (1d100) and roll against your relevant skill (between 0 and about 90). It's one of the few games to have rules for insanity. You begin with a number of sanity points determined by your stats, typically around 60-70, but lose them as you experience traumatic experiences (seeing a dead corpse for the first time, witnessing a horrible murder, or seeing one of the monsters). Typically you will need to make a sanity check in these cases (which is initiatially the same as your number of sanity points), and missing the check always costs points. Use of magic also costs sanity points, but then magic use is based solely on the aforementioned Cthulhu Mythos skill. Trouble is that your sanity is never higher than 100 minus your Mythos skill, so learning more about it will automatically drive a character insane. It's really a fun (well...) game to play. But the gaming company decided to make it all d20 years ago, and the conversion fails (IMHO) miserably to capture the feel of the original rules. Oh, and it's good for non-fight RPGs - here a fight usually means that you're finished, because the monsters will eat the PCs for lunch in a second. Even a single zombie is a lethal threat to any player. The way to complete adventures here is to investigate and solve the problems, not just kill the monsters. The PCs aren't even called Player Characters but rather 'Investigators'. Exalted is a heavily anime-inspired game of some prehistoric period of high fantasy is a japanese-like fantasy world. All the players are "chosen of the gods" with special powers, yet are seen as demons in the eye of the public and therefore hunted by the authorities. It's not D&D, but it's just as high-fantasy if not more so. It's also good fun, at least it was the times I played it. It uses the storyteller RPG system from White Wolf just as vampire, werewolf, mage, and all those other games do.

I just find it amusing how he criticizes the same things he's guilty of. The same one who thinks religion is responsible for WWII and has been the cause of most wars throughout history. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> This is the sort of misrepresentation that I really should report to the moderator as per the rules, except that I don't believe in moderated boards in general. It's true that I believe religion is the cause of most wars and that I said so. It is not true that I said it was the cause the WWII, however. I just said that religion was an issue that Hitler misconstrued to his advantage in order to escalate the conflict in the direction he desired. And it's incredible that you call for tolerance and yet change the subject to be about me and even bring out posts where I alone am the subject of your criticism on a personal level. That means you wrote a post which was solely a personal attack against me alone. This topic is called "Muslim anger towards Scandinavia...". It is not called "Troll and flame ad libitum against Jediphile". I am not nearly interesting enough to warrant my topic or even personal posts on these boards. After all, they say that opinions are like as*holes - everybody's got one and they all stink. This does not exclude mine. Opinions are not right or wrong, they just are. To discuss them is fine. To use them to flame against the people who expressed them is not. However, since I do not wish to troll, I shall refrain from responding in a similar manner. Agreed, but muslims aren't the only people in the world. There are those of us, including myself, for whom concepts like liberty, democracy, freedom and the right to free speech are just as important as islam are the muslims, yet nobody seems to respect our "faith". Respect goes both ways.

Coming from you, I find that comment rather amusing. And ironic. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yes, with that comment I can see how you are undoubtedly more mature than I am... I stand corrected.

GURPS would be a major one - no classes at all, just skills. Also depends on what you call 'classes' - Call of Cthulhu (Chaosium's original, not the d20 half-brew) has "professions", but all they do is force a character to distribute his major skill points on eight relevant skills during character creation, while there are still plenty left after that. Definitely more skillbased. Exalted has a very loose class-structure (they're there, but nowhere as forced as D&D), but then that's another storyteller game like vampire and all the rest. Hmm... not sure I can think of others right now. Paranoia?

Hey, it's Bao-Dur, not General Grievous from the Clone Wars cartoons :D As for gaining influence, just look up Bao-Dur's options in the influence guide.

Oh no I could never let that slide. I tear that doll up. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Precisely :D That's what I like about Fallout 2 - it really does require strength of character to continue beyond that point without tearing up the doll instead of giving it to the kid :cool:

You can do that even without Myron, so effectivevly he has no redeeming qualities at all. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yes, but it's worth more xp this way and you can get the antidote right away.

Levels - completely d20 classes - the jedi division into consulars and guardians is from d20, while the sentinel is a new invention. The prestige classes are also from d20, but they are not as in K2. For one, they can have any sort of prerequisites, demanding certain levels in certain skills and certain combat modifiers (which means having certain levels of experience). But rarely do the rules demand a specific level. The prestige classes aren't as LS/DS as in K2. The Sith Marauder and Jedi Master are prestige classes in d20, but not the others. On the other hand, there are Dark Side Devotees, while the jedi can become Jedi Ace (fighter pilot) or Jedi Investigator (which is probably a bit closer to the sentinel/watchman). The non-jedi classes in KotOR are just as in d20, though. vitality/wounds - completely d20 feats - these have been revised a bit and new feat-trees added in KotOR, but they are still very obviously inspired by the d20 rules. Most of the feats seen in K1 have clear counterparts in d20. skills - these are pretty much carbon-copies of d20, except there are far more skills in d20, which also had skills like piloting, knowledge, professions, etc. weapon stats - completely d20 combat - KotOR games have a system that give a fair representation of the d20 system in the sense of initiative order and number of attacks. The feats work quite differently, though. In KotOR the various combat feats (Flurry, Power Attack, etc.) are mutually exclusive in that you can use only one at a time. Not so in d20 - if you several feats, then they can all be used cumulatively - it's completely possible to use Heroic Surge (which became Flurry in KotOR) with the added chance of double damage from your Critical Strike and the extra damage of Power Attack.