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Same here. Although I did the same with KOTOR I, where I'd give up at the beginning of the Star Forge. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I think what I'll do on my current playthrough is just increase my level/stats/HP to something ridiculous once I hit , blast through without actually fighting any enemies and play the plot portions, such as they are. I mean, I actually like the for the dialogue. What I can't be bothered with is . Yeah, might as well make me sit there for half an hour hitting the attack button while bright lights flash across the screen. Exciting.

It should technically be possible to run a Planescape campaign or even produce a Planescape game in 3E using the 3E Manual of the Planes though. It'd just be more work. No more work than, say, producing an RPG that doesn't already have a complete P&P campaign canon written ahead of time, though. You'd just have to tweak existing characters and Planar lore a bit to fit 3E. I guess moreso it's just a matter of whether WotC would be willing to permit licensing for the Planescape setting toward such a use in the present. And no one here (except perhaps a couple of devs) could possibly even guess how WotC, in the present, feels about licensing their IP to the purpose of such a strange arrangement. Atari currently has the D&D rights, but does this include the rights for 2E materials (for all D&D products and settings and materials everywhere, ever?!?!), and is it to the exclusion of other publishers' access to such rights? D&D licensing politics baffle me.

Best D&D game ever? Well, let the sig and av speak for themselves

Well, your seeming disgust for the game doesn't seem to stop you from trolling the forum on a persistent basis. If many a fan of the KotOR universe is as virulent a troll as you yourself are, I don't see why there wouldn't be more KotOR I biased posters around here. After all, what's the fun of posting on a forum for a game you like and finding constructive common ground, when you can be here, posting on one for a game you dislike and stirring up ire?

I suppose KotOR II certainly makes it into my top 10 RPGs of all time, specifically for its writing. But that's not saying a great deal: there are no more than seven or eight RPGs which I would count as being among the truly great, that I have played, and I have played most of history's major RPGs. In gaming, I absolutely do believe it to be a competitor for the status of having the best written character dialogue of all time in an RPG. Unsurprising, though, given who was behind it. And unsurprising, as well, that its nearest competition I can name would be Planescape: Torment. KotOR I might be up there for quality of writing, but I wasn't reading it with adequately conscious critical intent, so I can't say I'm sure where to place it among the greats for its dialogue quality.

After having pursued a careful examination of the relative merits of these two games, Knights of the Old Republic I and Knights of the Old Republic II, I have determined the following: Knights of the Old Republic II by comparison to Knights of the Old Republic I, is undeniably possessed of a higher titular numeric value than its predecessor, and in this respect, its predecessor simply cannot compete. This is my position, and I'm sticking to it.

Speling corections as an ad hominem aproach two intarnet argumentatoin? A path too the dark sied this is.

Good call. There's more than enough spittle-flinging LA-bashing on the LA boards themselves to sate even the sternest of critics. Any time I get too uptight about the way KotOR II turned out, I take a look over there, and all of a sudden, fans here seem so sane and supportive again, and furthermore, justifiably so.

Surely there's concept art out there though, eh?

Seeing as I did not receive the power, selecting the non-existent power in question from the lower left corner is obviously not an option. Anyway, I just decided I might as well add it to my current save data using KSE, since I'm supposed to have it, anyway.

In my current game, I went through the dialogue to get it, and reached the conclusion in which Visas teaches me the power, but the power itself was never given to me at the point where it should have been. Must be a bug. Ah well. Not like it matters greatly. I can just use Visas for that purpose anyways, as she tends to be in my party.

I'd say this is certainly true of the Exile. There's really barely anything at all to go on regarding his functioning as a leader for good or ill prior to the game (wherein whether he is a good leader or not is entirely up to the player). But KotOR II offers substantial additions to Revan's backstory and all in all gives us a fair amount to work with regarding his own leadership.

One gets a stronger sense of Revan's leadership ability than the Exile's, I think. As for Revan, he seems indeed to have been a great leader, and most particularly, a great leader of the Sith, insofar as one can be a great Sith. The thing is, it would appear that when one has gathered all the power of the Force to oneself, especially in being open to the dark side, power over others comes somewhat naturally, with the KotOR games taking this principle and making it fundamental to game mechanics and character development (though in somewhat different ways). So to ask "was Revan a great leader" is more particularly to ask "was Revan a great Sith and/or Jedi?" Revan and the Exile both drew on all the power that the Force made available to them, while being strong enough not to be destroyed by it. In that, is almost limitless power, and power over others.

I'm talking within the last 5 or so years. Was Morrowind developed or published by anyone associated with the companies I mentioned? If so, then that's the only one I can even think of that is considered of high quality (relatively speaking). <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Indeed not. Bethesda is its own entity, with its own long history on the PC RPG scene and its own RPG setting. Westwood is another formerly important name in PC RPGs (as well as RTSs), most prominently for the Lands of Lord series, but EA ate them up and crapped them out, as EA is wont to do. I expect Bethesda will do Fallout 3 right. They've long been the kings of the open-ended RPG (Arena really was the first of its kind).

I doubt it. How many people even know about this mod? It's a small percentage of their market that actually follow the progress, so if they shut down the mod only a small percentage will be outraged. Not enough to seriously hamper their revenue stream. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yep, call me a cynic, but the serious fanbase who follows this kind of thing, and knows the story of KotOR II's omissions and fast-tracked development is a small minority of minor consequence to the Lucasarts bottom line. The Lucas outlook on franchise management as a whole is not one which concerns itself with serious fans, at present, nor has it ever been as far as I can tell. Hardcore fans just aren't adequately crucial to profits, really. And what did we expect the masters of the franchise to be concerned with? The majestic expansion of the Star Wars expanded universe as a multi-platform fantasy setting? Hah! The relative success of Jar Jar Binks dolls on the children's market: now that's a serious franchise concern! Lucasarts has bigger concerns than the modding community.

Thank you. Its nice to finaly know whats going on. Perhaps some one could have told us the honest truth a bit earlier but hindsight is always 20/20 Thanks again for saying somthing. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Indeed, nice to hear from the devs. But it irritates me that so many of the fans expect the devs to be constantly relaying information regarding the internal operation of the company regardless of any detriment a lax public relations policy might do to the company and its relationship with its publishers. Obsidian Entertainment is a very visible company within its industry, whose public relations policy cannot consist of developers randomly blabbering about every single thing going on inside the company to the public, for better or worse. This idea some people seem to have, that the mechanics and politics of internal operations and Obsidian's interaction with Lucasarts, especially during this patching process, should just be a big huge public spectacle is baffling to me.

I doubt any of the rational fans will be angry absolutely regardless of what the patch ends up containing. We already know its a fix patch, not a content patch, so anyone who complains when they find out the patch doesn't contain new content is just being a twit. And furthermore, virtually everyone who had game-breaking problems and was willing to try the known fixes has managed to fix the major bugs already on their own end, so it won't really change much of anything for the PC fanbase: the bugs which we've already worked around no longer need the workarounds we already have in place? Terrific. Changes nothing. Maybe they'll fix the Telos swoop race and get rid of the 'jump' bug and things like that. But since we know how to get around that, and most of us can beat it as is, what difference does it make. I view the patch as a non-event, really, for fans who bought at release and found their fixes already.

Yeah, this is the primary reason I got the game for PC, even though I have an Xbox. Having played KotOR 1, I knew what the mod community was capable of, and that the modders were already there and ready to get to work. I couldn't cut myself off from that.

As time goes by, it matters less and less to me what the patch contains. Mods and the unofficial content patch are far more important, now. I mean, most of us have come up with workarounds for all the major problems in the meantime, while waiting for the patch. I finally eliminated intermitent crashes by underclocking my video card once I'd tried everything else. That's after having unpacked the ATI Cat 4.11 OGL driver into my directory to prevent even more frequent crashes which I originally had occurring. I found a separate Catalyst version which allows cinematics to run without crashing if installed as my primary display driver (with the Cat 4.11 OGL driver in my KotOR directory). And I know how to avoid whatever else is broken now, or how to fix it on my end. Actually, I've gotten adequately used to all the problems with the game that if they all get fixed, it's going to feel like I'm not playing the same game. All the challenge of avoiding and fixing the broken bits will be ruined!

Man, this board really does manage to turn thread derailment into an artform. As all good boards do. P.S., sorry for derailing the derailment in order to talk about derailment.

Terrific stuff. I can't wait to see the results. The modding community continues to exceed my expectations, with the scale of its ambition.

6 hours though? I still say it's impossible. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, I don't see how it'd be done, though on a planned and mapped out speedrun, it's probably possible. I think the kicker is that without doing sidequests and getting the XP involved, you'd be weaker, making it impossible to just blaze through the enemies in mob-heavy areas and necessitating a slow approach marked by lots of sitting and waiting to regen force points, whereas if you do the sidequests and gain the XP necessary to level up to the levels at which you become powerful and consequently blaze through the enemies with Form Storm and what have you, you've wasted a lot of time on the sidequests. It seems like a catch-22.

Well, on the bright side, if you take seriously the KotOR III news you read on that forum or any other, I have some penile enlargement medicine you might be interested in.

I'm assuming it's Best Story or Least Stereotyped Story

Excluding Revan then, I thought Nihilus was the most interesting concept among them for a villain. Traya was the most fully developed. And I thought Sion, believe it or not, was the most satisfying and intriguing, in the end. Particularly due to . I found it to be, for me, probably the most meaningful and clean resolution of a character's role within the plot.