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Well, sabre seems to be optimal when looking only at the hit attack resolution, but if you look at the full distribution of outcomes it looks like using the club/dagger/rapier seems a bit better.

i assume it's due to the +5 acc, does it influence that much? what about the spear then?

"Don't believe in yourself... believe in me, because I believe in you"

- Handsome Jack

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Yes, the fact that sabres are optimal when considering only hit resolutions but are not the best when taking everything into account is due to +5 acc. You can find a comparison of the weapons and the model I used for comparing them on post #28 here: https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/96636-two-handed-style-seems-weak/page-2

 

For the spear it seems that the increased dmg with respect to daggers/clubs/rapiers is outmatched by the fact that it's slower (0.7 attack + 4 recovery vs 0.5 attack + 3 recovery). But the difference is quite small.

Edited by kmbogd
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Does the +12 ACC apply if I equip my character with a one-handed weapon and a small shield, or does he have to have nothing in the off-hand to get that bonus?

 

I'm thinking of making the Watcher of my first playthrough a Streetfighter Trickster/Skald, able to stand in the front line and do decent damage with lots of crits, but with a focus on crit-farming for Invocations rather than straight damage; a melee CC build, basically. I was going to give him a small shield for the Binding Block modal and a rapier (as much for the swashbuckling pirate image as anything), for extra survivability and Riposte.

 

But if I'm reading this right, I'd have to drop the shield for the extra ACC? And more importantly, is the extra ACC worth dropping the utility of the shield for such a character?

Edited by Ascaloth
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Does the +12 ACC apply if I equip my character with a one-handed weapon and a small shield, or does he have to have nothing in the off-hand to get that bonus?

you need to have the off-hand free, not even a buckler

all in all i think single weapon is especially good with the pistol modal that halves your reload but gives you -15acc, with single weapon's +12acc and the style you basically nullify the malus... pew pew semi-auto pistol!

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"Don't believe in yourself... believe in me, because I believe in you"

- Handsome Jack

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Which is more likely hit overpenetration - a high pen weapon, or a normal pen weapon with two damage types? I've been thinking the latter, but input from beta players is appreciated.

 

I think the best chance for overpenetrating is to get a critical hit for the +50% penetration.

 

In the case of two handed weapons a Morningstar is crush/pierce and 8 pen while an Estoc is pierce and 9 pen with both doing the same base damage. I think the Morningstar will do better in most circumstances due to the dual damage.

 

Another thing to consider is that basic weapons are only two penetration less than the armor piercing weapons which do less damage. An Estoc does 18 avg damage and a pike does 21. The Estoc does 16.7% less damage and best case the +2 penetration does +50% damage which becomes 33.3% more when the armor = Estoc penetration and +8.3% more damage when armor = Estoc penetration minus one. So basically there are two values of armor where the Estoc does more damage than a Pike, for every other armor value the Pike does better.

 

The variance for two handed are the closest at 16.7%, one handed slow (maces) are 23.1% less than battle axes, and stilettos are 20% less than hatchets.

 

The take away here is that its pretty much always better to just go for the more damaging weapon with the lower penetration rather than going for a lower damage high penetration weapon. If that is available in a dual damage type or it has accuracy so much the better.

 

 

 

I'd add that the main way you're going to find yourself "overpenetrating" is on a debuff of enemy armor, and if you debuff enemy armor low enough, you can overpenetrate even with low pen, high damage weapons.

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Confident Aim will only add effectively 25% graze to hit as you'll have Disciplined Strikes up for 50% already so its not as essential but remember that the ability choices at low level Fighter are really limited so Confident Aim might end up being the best of a bad choice.

 

Dual wielding will do more damage and clear trash faster but the toughest fights will do better with the super accurate single weapon style. The Devoted getting better crit damage has a nice synergy with the extra accuracy and hit to crit that single weapon style gets. Maybe go with robes instead of armor to keep the attack rate up. Even heavy armor looks like its frequently breached so might as well go naked.

With this build is it important to raise Per, or could you leave it at 10 what with all the extra accuracy and conversions?

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Confident Aim will only add effectively 25% graze to hit as you'll have Disciplined Strikes up for 50% already so its not as essential but remember that the ability choices at low level Fighter are really limited so Confident Aim might end up being the best of a bad choice.

 

Dual wielding will do more damage and clear trash faster but the toughest fights will do better with the super accurate single weapon style. The Devoted getting better crit damage has a nice synergy with the extra accuracy and hit to crit that single weapon style gets. Maybe go with robes instead of armor to keep the attack rate up. Even heavy armor looks like its frequently breached so might as well go naked.

With this build is it important to raise Per, or could you leave it at 10 what with all the extra accuracy and conversions?

It depends on your difficulty, and if u have a priest, which is the only class that can give huge accuracy bonus to team. If u play on PoTD, I’d recommend u to max Per, or at last make it 15, on other difficulty, do whatever u want.

Edited by dunehunter
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  • 4 months later...

For a caster, (wizard) is it worth using just a single handed weapon or does the accuracy and single handed weapon style not apply to spells?

 

If not I'm considering using 2h bow since not got a bow user and quite like bows, but not sure if shield be better for extra DR but again I'll lose accuracy?

 

Thanks

Edited by Stonebridge809
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Single weapon usage and style only add bonuses to the attacks with that weapon, not spells (unless they work with weapon attacks like Taste of the Hunt or Concelhaut's Draining Touch or Kalakoth's Minor Blights).

Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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Firearms have the huge advantage that you can always interrupt reloading and instantly react to situation immediately after shooting or in any moment during reload - cast a spell, use an ability. For that reason I always set my Xoti with a pistol (with her Lantern offhand).

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