Politics Episode 7: Remake of Episode 4

[BruceVC]

I would go one further, DNA samples taken at birth of every single person born in the US.

Whats wrong with that? Surely if you not breaking the law it wouldn't be a problem ?

[Gfted1]

It means that I am investigated against when I am literally as innocent as can be (since I was just born!) what about innocence until proven guilty? No?

What are you talking about?

 

The police show up to a crime scene, collect physical evidence (including your DNA), and run it through the database. BINGO! Ben No.3 left a hair behind whilst robbing the German equivalent to 7-11 (probably called 8-25 cause they work so hard) and they can roll right up to his residence and slap the cuffs on.

[Elerond]

 

It means that I am investigated against when I am literally as innocent as can be (since I was just born!) what about innocence until proven guilty? No?

What are you talking about?

 

The police show up to a crime scene, collect physical evidence (including your DNA), and run it through the database. BINGO! Ben No.3 left a hair behind whilst robbing the German equivalent to 7-11 (probably called 8-25 cause they work so hard) and they can roll right up to his residence and slap the cuffs on.

 

 

Problem is in partial DNA matches which can cause unfounded suspicions, which can in bad day lead in imprisonment of wrong person because they can't afford to defend themselves.

[BruceVC]

 

 

It means that I am investigated against when I am literally as innocent as can be (since I was just born!) what about innocence until proven guilty? No?

What are you talking about?

 

The police show up to a crime scene, collect physical evidence (including your DNA), and run it through the database. BINGO! Ben No.3 left a hair behind whilst robbing the German equivalent to 7-11 (probably called 8-25 cause they work so hard) and they can roll right up to his residence and slap the cuffs on.

 

 

Problem is in partial DNA matches which can cause unfounded suspicions, which can in bad day lead in imprisonment of wrong person because they can't afford to defend themselves.

 

There may be the odd 2-4 % mistakes but they can build in additional proof checking and analysis of the DNA to reduce false positives? 

[Gfted1]

Problem is in partial DNA matches which can cause unfounded suspicions, which can in bad day lead in imprisonment of wrong person because they can't afford to defend themselves.

The first result of Googling "partial DNA match" offers an interesting result from the Denver District Attorney:

 

When a crime-scene DNA sample matches a profile in the database at most, but not all loci, the individual from the database is excluded. However, it is very likely that a close relative is the source of that DNA rather than a random, unrelated individual. These partial matches can be used by investigators to find the individual who left the DNA at the crime scene, providing potentially valuable information in an ongoing investigation. Although a familial search software was not used to help solve the following cases, they represent examples of investigations where a partial DNA match with a close relative was used to solve crimes.

So at least in Colorado, a full match is needed. But the information is still valuable.

[Wrath of Dagon]

220K criminal aliens in Texas prisons over the last 6 years! http://www.breitbart.com/texas/2017/06/14/220k-criminal-aliens-incarcerated-texas-6-years-says-dps/ And that's just Texas. These are criminals who wouldn't be here at all if the government did its job.

 

Edit: Comey reportedly confronted Lynch about interference in Clinton investigation: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/06/14/comey-reportedly-confronted-lynch-over-clinton-email-probe-involvement.html

 

Yet he didn't see fit to leak it to get a special council appointed. Not that that would've worked, as the Obama administration was completely shameless.

Edited June 14, 2017 by Wrath of Dagon

[Gfted1]

Even better. Police show up at the crime scene with your DNA and plants it as a physical evidence.

Or your DNA is leaked to the opposing party and they use it to discredit you.

Imagine how fun it would be if it was sold as data to insurance companies, employers etc.

What fun!

Those are all good points but if you're living in a society that corrupt then they don't need your DNA to "get you". Also, the pattern of your DNA existing in a database does not provide anyone with the actual physical DNA.

[Valsuelm]

 

Wow! A steel skyscraper completely engulfed in flames and burning for over 6 hours. It hasn't collapsed!! How could this be?!!?

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4601902/Huge-inferno-West-London-tower-block.html

Minus structural damage from a plane strike. Not a suitable comparison, I think.

 

 

Who said anything about a plane strike?

 

[Malcador]

Who said anything about a plane strike?

Don't think anyone needed to. Seems the building was concrete as well. That cladding was a genius idea in hindsight, as well.

[Zoraptor]

Plenty of genius on display there. One stairwell, no central alarm system, no sprinklers, no fire suppression system, instructions to stay inside in case of fire, no fire drills plus the candlewick insulation on the outside. And apparently that situation is pretty common too.

[Valsuelm]

Huh....

 

Does anyone here know to what I refer?

[Valsuelm]

instructions to stay inside in case of fire

 

'Darwin test' maybe?

Edited June 15, 2017 by Valsuelm

[Malcador]

Plenty of genius on display there. One stairwell, no central alarm system, no sprinklers, no fire suppression system, instructions to stay inside in case of fire, no fire drills plus the candlewick insulation on the outside. And apparently that situation is pretty common too.

Instructions are to stay inside here as well and shelter in place, block door off, etc. - http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/high-rise-fire-1.3966746

 

Granted I suppose that reasoning presumes the previous four items are not an issue and the building is well made (though with the condos they build these days I am unsure ). Hopefully some heads end up rolling

Edited June 15, 2017 by Malcador

[Hurlshort]

Huh....

 

Does anyone here know to what I refer?

Nope, we are all too daft here to understand. I thought you knew that already?

[Zoraptor]

 

Plenty of genius on display there. One stairwell, no central alarm system, no sprinklers, no fire suppression system, instructions to stay inside in case of fire, no fire drills plus the candlewick insulation on the outside. And apparently that situation is pretty common too.

Instructions are to stay inside here as well and shelter in place, block door off, etc. - http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/high-rise-fire-1.3966746

 

Granted I suppose that reasoning presumes the previous four items are not an issue and the building is well made (though with the condos they build these days I am unsure ). Hopefully some heads end up rolling

 

 

Stay still makes sense with sensible building practices, certainly, and especially if there are suppression measures in place. Though the only large buildings I've ever spent time in all used evacuation plans they were relatively small compared to that apartment building and had other reasons to evacuate (chemicals etc).

 

OTOH there's a lot of evidence that people knew the building was a fire trap before this happened and in that case getting people out ought to be priority one. If you know the building has no sprinklers etc then the risks of evacuation (panic, smoke etc) are less than the risks of being trapped.

[Malcador]

Ah, it was council housing, heh, that explains a lot.

[BruceVC]

 

Even better. Police show up at the crime scene with your DNA and plants it as a physical evidence.

Or your DNA is leaked to the opposing party and they use it to discredit you.

Imagine how fun it would be if it was sold as data to insurance companies, employers etc.

What fun!

Those are all good points but if you're living in a society that corrupt then they don't need your DNA to "get you". Also, the pattern of your DNA existing in a database does not provide anyone with the actual physical DNA.

 

@ Sharp_one

 

I can understand your concern but dont confuse corruption and incompetence that exists within the police force where you live as a global standard. This wont be used to frame innocent people I can assure you 

[Blarghagh]

Trump under investigation for obstruction of justice. On his birthday, I'm getting the gift it seems.

[BruceVC]

 

 

 

Even better. Police show up at the crime scene with your DNA and plants it as a physical evidence.

Or your DNA is leaked to the opposing party and they use it to discredit you.

Imagine how fun it would be if it was sold as data to insurance companies, employers etc.

What fun!

Those are all good points but if you're living in a society that corrupt then they don't need your DNA to "get you". Also, the pattern of your DNA existing in a database does not provide anyone with the actual physical DNA.

@ Sharp_one

 

I can understand your concern but dont confuse corruption and incompetence that exists within the police force where you live as a global standard. This wont be used to frame innocent people I can assure you

I side with Sharp. Brucie, it doesn't even have to never illegal or attached to corruption if people buy your data. Remember the NSA spying on you? Remember that law that your browsing history can now be bought and sold? Same thing, Brucie. Would you be comfortable with that? That people can essentially buy who you are?

 

"This won't be used to frame innocents"... how can you possibly ensure that?

 

Bennie the NSA  is our friend, they are an invaluable instrument in the war against extremism

 

There decisions need to be accepted in the interests of the greater good,   

[majestic]

 

 

 

 

Even better. Police show up at the crime scene with your DNA and plants it as a physical evidence.

Or your DNA is leaked to the opposing party and they use it to discredit you.

Imagine how fun it would be if it was sold as data to insurance companies, employers etc.

What fun!

Those are all good points but if you're living in a society that corrupt then they don't need your DNA to "get you". Also, the pattern of your DNA existing in a database does not provide anyone with the actual physical DNA.

@ Sharp_one

 

I can understand your concern but dont confuse corruption and incompetence that exists within the police force where you live as a global standard. This wont be used to frame innocent people I can assure you

I side with Sharp. Brucie, it doesn't even have to never illegal or attached to corruption if people buy your data. Remember the NSA spying on you? Remember that law that your browsing history can now be bought and sold? Same thing, Brucie. Would you be comfortable with that? That people can essentially buy who you are?

 

"This won't be used to frame innocents"... how can you possibly ensure that?

 

Bennie the NSA  is our friend, they are an invaluable instrument in the war against extremism

 

There decisions need to be accepted in the interests of the greater good,   

 

 

Here's the ultimate truth of this forum: When Ben agrees with Sharp (and/or Guard Dog) on that your position is wrong... you're dead wrong and should stop immediately.

[BruceVC]

 

 

 

 

 

Even better. Police show up at the crime scene with your DNA and plants it as a physical evidence.

Or your DNA is leaked to the opposing party and they use it to discredit you.

Imagine how fun it would be if it was sold as data to insurance companies, employers etc.

What fun!

Those are all good points but if you're living in a society that corrupt then they don't need your DNA to "get you". Also, the pattern of your DNA existing in a database does not provide anyone with the actual physical DNA.

@ Sharp_one

 

I can understand your concern but dont confuse corruption and incompetence that exists within the police force where you live as a global standard. This wont be used to frame innocent people I can assure you

I side with Sharp. Brucie, it doesn't even have to never illegal or attached to corruption if people buy your data. Remember the NSA spying on you? Remember that law that your browsing history can now be bought and sold? Same thing, Brucie. Would you be comfortable with that? That people can essentially buy who you are?

 

"This won't be used to frame innocents"... how can you possibly ensure that?

Bennie the NSA is our friend, they are an invaluable instrument in the war against extremism

 

There decisions need to be accepted in the interests of the greater good,

You did not answer the question. You did also not give valid reasons as too why we should accept the NSA in its current state, aside from "they're good because they told me they were".

 

Bennie there are people in this world who have worked for decades in government security departments who you must admit will know more than you about real threats countries face. This is based on accurate and quantifiable intelligence and information gathering using numerous sources and mediums 

 

You need to learn to trust these people, they have  your best interests in mind 

[Gfted1]

Federal judge orders more environmental analysis of Dakota pipeline.

 

 

 

The judge said in a 91-page decision that, while the Army Corps substantially complied with the National Environmental Policy Act, federal permits issued for the pipeline violated the law in some respects, saying in a court order the Corps did not "adequately consider the impacts of an oil spill on fishing rights, hunting rights, or environmental justice."

"To remedy those violations, the Corps will have to reconsider those sections of its environmental analysis upon remand by the Court," the judge said.

The tribe had sued the Army Corps over its approval of the controversial Dakota Access Pipeline in North Dakota, arguing the line could contaminate their water source, the Missouri River.

 

Heres a picture of my shocked face:   

[Namutree]

 

 

Wow! A steel skyscraper completely engulfed in flames and burning for over 6 hours. It hasn't collapsed!! How could this be?!!?

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4601902/Huge-inferno-West-London-tower-block.html

 

 

It has got to be one of the worst demonstrations of ignorance to still suggest in 2017 that  9/11 is a conspiracy theory committed  by the USA  to itself 

 

Appeals to [current year] are worse.

[Blarghagh]

Not really. That's at most some people's pet peeve because they don't understand it's just a roundabout way of saying 'you're a backwards moron' and the actual year number isn't relevant, which makes it deliciously self-demonstrating.

[Valsuelm]

 

Huh....

 

Does anyone here know to what I refer?

Nope, we are all too daft here to understand. I thought you knew that already?

 

 

Speak for yourself.

 

As a history teacher, you should most definitely know to which I refer, though it doesn't surprise me even remotely that you don't.

 

It would surprise me however if no one here knew. There are a few relatively astute people on this forum.

 

I may start a thread on this, or I might pm a few that I suspect might know. Not sure yet.