Duel / multiplayer / pvp PoE II: Deadfire

[Nail]

Hello everyone!

 

I've tried to pass question about multiplayer / co-op / pvp on Twitch streams / Twitter / Forum while crowdfunding was a thing (not counting slacker baker), but every time my question was ignored.

For me it's clearly that Obsidian don't want to do this, and that's a pity!

 

Baldur's Gate 1-2, Icewind Dale 1-2, Neverwinter Nights 1-2 - they had Co-op / MP

Those are cult games for me, nostalgia and, maybe, the reason why I play PoE.

I recall Storm of Zehir with pvp arena, clunky, but you could try out builds and duel with your buddies, and that was awesome.

 

We will have ships, design etc., but nobody will see them except you or your Twitch / YouTube viewers (I have doubts)

Then why there is no option to fight with somebody via exported characters from the game using your ship? That would be so cool.

 

PoE II: Deadfire intend to be such a masterpiece, but why cutting a good bunch of possible fun / replayability (trying out new builds / making better character)?

I don't get it - is it narrow vision or just no time to implement?

 

Please vote, it means a lot to me to understand if I'm not the only one with such thoughts.

Maybe this poll will have some influence on Deadfire devs (I have serious doubts)

 

[Hertzila]

While I can see why you might want it, I have absolutely no interest in it. I don't play PoE for its combat and I have no real interest in a duel multiplayer setup, especially when it's real time with pause.

 

More importantly, internet multiplayer is time-consuming as ****. If they were to implement any kind of net multiplayer, it could easily add a lot of work into the mix and would almost certainly delay the release. It's just not worth it.

[illathid]

nothankyou.gif

[Nail]

Ok, I see where it's going.

Here is an example -  I've completed PoE I "the ultimate" - I have nothing to do. Game is good, but no reason to spend more time in it.

I would really like to duel guys who know the game.

Edited March 20, 2017 by Nail

[Icesong]

I'm not particularly interested in PvP, but I would like an RPG these days to actually try focusing on co-op/roleplaying for MP instead of some horde mode. It seems no one, even fans, considers that as a possibility anymore when thinking of MP.

Edited March 20, 2017 by Icesong

[Hertzila]

I'm not particularly interested in PvP, but I would like an RPG these days to actually try focusing on co-op/roleplaying for MP instead of some horde mode. It seems no one, even fans, considers that as a possibility anymore when thinking of MP.

 

You say that as if one of Divinity: Original Sin's big features wasn't multiplayer co-op.

[Icesong]

 

I'm not particularly interested in PvP, but I would like an RPG these days to actually try focusing on co-op/roleplaying for MP instead of some horde mode. It seems no one, even fans, considers that as a possibility anymore when thinking of MP.

 

You say that as if one of Divinity: Original Sin's big features wasn't multiplayer co-op.

 

I think I say it more like one game doesn't change the prevailing trend. 

[Abel]

I would see an interest in a pure co-op multiplayer. I don't tink, though, that RTwP, along with PoE's ruleset would allow good PvP experience. Actually, i may be wrong, because even on PvP games, i tend to avoid PvP and i may not have the right to say this, because of my low pvp experience. Reason i avoid PvP is: i hate it. All the more in a RPG like Pillars. Unless one play the Watcher and the other Thaos.

 

While i think there would be some interest in co-op multi, i know for sure that i would find no one to play Pillars with me. And i'm not interested in playing with random guys on the net. Only good old friends in real life. They don't have time. Those who would be interested are away.

 

In the end, while i'm not opposed to co-op multi, i have no interest in it. And i think it's already too late for Pillars 2 anyway, since this is a feature you would probably need to build the game around, like Wasteland 3, which have a very interesting concept for multiplayer. Plus, implementing multiplayer is not free.

Edited March 20, 2017 by Abel

[Hertzila]

I think I say it more like one game doesn't change the prevailing trend. 

 

 

 

I'm not particularly interested in PvP, but I would like an RPG these days to actually try focusing on co-op/roleplaying for MP instead of some horde mode. It seems no one, even fans, considers that as a possibility anymore when thinking of MP.

 

Emphasis mine. There exists a CRPG that has, if not focuses, on co-op multiplayer. Two in fact, since D:OS has a sequel. So claiming that there isn't a single one that focuses on co-op is just false.

 

It's not the prevailing trend, but considering how much time that feature assumes people have, I doubt such a trend would survive for long.

[Icesong]

Been dealing with nothing but pedantry these past few days...

 

Yes, you're right. I was wrong that in all of creation there exists exceptions. 

[eselle28]

I actively do not want there to be PvP in Deadfire or other Pillars of Eternity games. It inevitably leads to complaints about unbalanced classes, which leads to class balancing, which often leads to boring sameness.

 

As for coop play, I wouldn't object to it (but also wouldn't engage in it) if Deadfire had a huge budget and could do everything its players wanted. As it is, the developers are working with limited funds, and adding coop play would take a huge investment of resources. I could see there being a place for a coop-focused title in the Pillars of Eternity universe if there's demand for such a thing, though.

 

As for what can be done when the game is finished, I don't think there always has to be something. I think there's plenty of room in the world for games that say that when you've seen everything the game has to show you, it's time to step away from that series for a little while, play other games or do other things, and return to the universe when the sequel comes out.

Edited March 20, 2017 by eselle28

[Boeroer]

I would like it. If it's possible to make an arena mod: also fine.

[Nail]

I would like it. If it's possible to make an arena mod: also fine.

 

Arena mod can't hurt anybody.

Moreover I would pay for it. 

 

All they have to do is character transition like in BG2 and some instance for 2+ players.

There could be no pause system - in this case intelligent AI scripts could be handy (like in DA:O)

Edited March 20, 2017 by Nail

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

If they think they can do it then sure why not. Wouldn't mind getting a party of 5 and yelling at people to learn how to play their class.

[Katarack21]

No. I don't play multiplayer, and I'd rather the money and development time be spent on improving the single-player experience.

[JerekKruger]

No. I don't play multiplayer, and I'd rather the money and development time be spent on improving the single-player experience.

 

This pretty much. If there was some magic, zero time/cost way of adding multiplayer into the game then I'd have no objection, but since adding multiplayer would be costly (both in terms of time and money) I'd rather Obsidian focused their resources on making a great single-player game.

[Nail]

All great singleplayer games share same destiny.

 

Just think about - what will you do when there is nothing to achieve in the game you like, when you would like to spend more time, but you know every nook and cranny...

At that stage game begin to be boring. Yes, if it was an interesting game - it will stay in your memory for a lifetime.

 

But such games can be compared to a good book, just with scripted interactions leading to certain conclusions.

Why not to make a book / game you can read / play again and again with the same zeal?

 

My thought one can be with an option to compete with somebody, to show your superiority, with competetive spirit.

This is more then just duels / MP - it's the end game content, which could be based on these features or something around that.

I'm talking about interaction / fun. 

Why not to make it like Card hunter for instance, but using Unity 5.0+ engine?

 

Right now, looking at PoE I - it's hard to do interesting video footage highlight, even reaching "The Ultimate", cause almost nobody cares.

For me it's top notch to compete with equal passionate player, but when it's not an option - it makes me sad.

 

No need to do MMO, just some kind of arena mode to prove your superiority, not only via forum threads.

[Katarack21]

 

Just think about - what will you do when there is nothing to achieve in the game you like, when you would like to spend more time, but you know every nook and cranny

Play it again. Seriously. There's a game I love called Castle of the Winds. Windows tile-based Roguelike that was released in 1992.

 

I have played this game from start to end literally several *thousand* times. I play it *ALL* the time. I stopped playing it when I got a 64 bit system because it won't run, and it makes me sad that I can't.

[Nail]

 

 

Just think about - what will you do when there is nothing to achieve in the game you like, when you would like to spend more time, but you know every nook and cranny

Play it again. Seriously. There's a game I love called Castle of the Winds. Windows tile-based Roguelike that was released in 1992.

 

I have played this game from start to end literally several *thousand* times. I play it *ALL* the time. I stopped playing it when I got a 64 bit system because it won't run, and it makes me sad that I can't.

 

Roguelike games share infinite replayability cause of random generated layout.

[eselle28]

You can't just make an arena mode and set it off to the side. The minute there is one, people will start complaining that priests are OP and that barbarians don't stand a chance, and there will be calls for patches to address a problem that didn't exist or was fairly minor before the arena was introduced.

 

Developers already get plenty of flack for things like making a stronghold that's not fleshed out or interesting enough, and that didn't even come with the frustrations of competitive play. If people are actually losing battles because of class design, they'll want that to be fixed, and will have a right to. The problem with that is that it will inevitably intersect with the single player experience and result in mechanical changes for characters that will never step into the arena.

 

There are a ton of great multiplayer and PvP games out there. I enjoy some of them, but I find it refreshing to play a game that concentrates on the single player experience.

[JerekKruger]

All great singleplayer games share same destiny.

 

I don't see this as a bad thing myself.

 

Just think about - what will you do when there is nothing to achieve in the game you like,

 

 

Play another game or do something else altogether probably.

[Nail]

You can't just make an arena mode and set it off to the side. The minute there is one, people will start complaining that priests are OP and that barbarians don't stand a chance, and there will be calls for patches to address a problem that didn't exist or was fairly minor before the arena was introduced.

 

Developers already get plenty of flack for things like making a stronghold that's not fleshed out or interesting enough, and that didn't even come with the frustrations of competitive play. If people are actually losing battles because of class design, they'll want that to be fixed, and will have a right to. The problem with that is that it will inevitably intersect with the single player experience and result in mechanical changes for characters that will never step into the arena.

 

There are a ton of great multiplayer and PvP games out there. I enjoy some of them, but I find it refreshing to play a game that concentrates on the single player experience.

Right now PoE I has good ballance. Any character is able to complete it solo and that's a sign. MP / Duel ballance should not be significative for the storyline, it should be just for fun.

[eselle28]

 

Right now PoE I has good ballance. Any character is able to complete it solo and that's a sign. MP / Duel ballance should not be significative for the storyline, it should be just for fun.

 

I have never seen that work. If a game includes a feature, even an incredibly minor and cosmetic one, there will be at least some players who expect it to be done well. If it's a popular feature - one that's used enough that there will actually be someone online for you to play against - there will be a lot of players who expect it to be done well.

 

The fact that all the classes can complete the game solo does not mean they'd be balanced in individual pairings against other players. PvE play is fundamentally different in that developers can control the strength, numbers, and composition of enemies to give all classes a chance to show their strong points. In PvP, you have only the classes the game provides, playing against you one on one or in groups of equal numbers.

[Nail]

Even if it's only 5% of all PoE I / PoE II players - in numbers it's kinda 5% of 4.550.000 =  227.500 USD for a simple arena mode.

And why not Obsidian?

[Katarack21]

Because thatvmoney could flesh out two whole companions or add a whole dungeon.