Going to ultimate achivement, class suggestion?

[Dr <3]

Before start i'm in doubt between paladin and Priest.

 

For paladin the idea could be to go max tank ( wild Orlan, High resolve and so on) and slowly grind all game. At lvl 13 respect for more int to put sacred immolation at good use.

 

For Priest the plan could be to go for something like the fire Priest of maxquest, not sure if ethoas or berath ( his sigil do corrode dmg and maybe is more useful against the dragonns? )

 

Paladin feels like the most stable route, i have just fear that the game could become overwhelming boring, Priest on the other hand gives you more potions but is a bit fragile, i have fear to lost him in a breath ( of dragon... )

[Jojobobo]

I'm PotD soloing as a Paladin currently, and I don't find it too bad - I've got to level 14 of the Endless Paths and did all the Act II quests without starting Act III yet, this allowed me to hit level 13 and get Sacred Immolation before WM part I. If you use Munacra Arret, figurines and take Envenomed Strike (which you can always respec out when you get Sacred Immolation) you have enough going for you to deal with mobs and make combat a little interesting. I normally use my two FoDs against one enemy (usually getting the kill), use Sworn Enemy and Envenomed Strike on a second, use Whisper of Treason on a third/forth and pop figurines as I go - which is quite a bit of micro-ing so personally I don't find it boring (well, maybe a little in Act I when you don't have these options). You can always use Whisper of Treason on the Sworn Enemy to score Charm crits easily, but I find it's not usually necessary.

 

I think the beauty of Paladins is that their high defences make them amenable to any weapon combo you want to choose, so even going after The Ultimate achievement you can easily use a non-standard interesting weapon choice without really feeling the pinch. Of course if you want to go the standard route Bittercut with Outworn Buckler and or arquebuses are an easy pick. I wouldn't necessarily worry about high Resolve - I've had 13 the entire game so far without a shield, with Wild Orlan plus taking the Black Path I've found it tanky enough for most uses (with Res 13, Cape of the Master Mystic, Deep Faith Faith and Conviction plus a frightened enemy attacking my will save it's equivalent to 110 deflection). Llengrath's Displaced Image can be used for tough fights as and when you need it to bump up deflection and reflex, I've found that honestly fortitude is one of the more important saves to try and boost as unlike reflex there's no magic potion or shield to make it soar to insane levels and several annoying effects (paralysis, petrification) target it.

 

I still haven't properly played a Priest, but MaxQuest's builds did look rather incredible. Either way it seems like you'll be in for a little wait with either class before them become powerful. I would recommend playing a separate PotD save alongside so you can step by step work out what you can and cannot do at each step easily and go from there.

Edited August 15, 2016 by Jojobobo

[DynEira]

I don't know how viable this is but I am still looking to take up the challenge myself. 

I was wondering about a druid pale elf with the boar or stag spiritshift 
Mig   12

Con  14

Dex  10

Per   14

Int    14

Res  14

 

Sword and Shield Style

Veterans Recovery

Interrupting blows

Body Control

 

as preferred talents.

Scrolls and foods and plenty of back tracking to rest as possible. 

Curious how everyone would think I would do? How would I go about defeating all of those damn phantoms/wisps in Caed Nua? 

 

Is most of Act 1 spent sneaking past various places and just earning cheap ways to get exp (new maps/locations/easy/entering&exiting dungeons quests and low level mob groups) 

[Raven Darkholme]

1. Chanter

2. Druid

3. Paladin

4. Wizard

5. Priest

 

Would be my top 5 for Ultimate.

 

Blights might make the druid slightly stronger but I think the better defense does it for Chanter.

[Dr <3]

Yeah actually Chanter is an interesting alternative, you can play it like a pala with burning aura perma-active

[Jojobobo]

Paladins on the flip side have a much higher natural defences over Chanters (there's +deflection, +will and +fort/will chants, but they don't match up to the offerings of a Paladin). Their offensive chants are better than a Paladin's (Dragon Thrashed > Sacred Immolation IMO), and there's more versatility there by use of invocations (summons, charm effects, decent other offensive effects) - but the trouble is running an offensive chant means you can't often run a defensive one as the linger for most of them doesn't continue for the entirety of Dragon Thrashed leaving you with defensive blindspots in your chant setup. Plus there's the fact Ancient Memory still turns off after your first invocation, a bug I know but definitely something you have to factor into playing the character (I presume Ancient Memory does affect the Chanter and not just other party members, I've not played them to a great extent).

 

While I don't see Chanters as a bad option, I find it hard not to find the solid defensive backbone of Paladins somewhat preferable - unless you are going for a kiter rather than a tank. Tanking dragon matches seem to be a tit for tat how high can I get my defences game, which Paladins surely win over any other class. As I mentioned I'm not a Chanter veteran however, so if someone wants to school me on why they dramatically outstrip Paladins I'm all ears.

Edited August 15, 2016 by Jojobobo

[Dr <3]

I'm looking the number: paladin's faith&conviction gives + Deep faith gives you +13 to deflecion, +27 to other def, that is clearly a lot. On the other hand, a "tanky" Chanter that chains the fist 1 lvl chant can have steady +10 to all defences exept deflecion, and starts with base +5 deflection. So paladin can have at max +8 deflection and +17 to all other def, but the Chanter on the other way can spam massive Ice aoe DMG or call ogres in support, so i think they are pretty even. I soloed the game quite easily with a Chanter at normal, the thing that bother me most are the dragon fights, the game itself will not be much a trouble ( in comparison my bare handed barb is doing everything fine up to now).

 

Oh and with the Chanter i don't have to double check every dialog choice for bad disposizione, that is a huge plus

Edited August 15, 2016 by Dr <3

[Boeroer]

If you use the lvl 1 defensive chants for +10 to all defenses except deflection and then use the 2 invocations that give you +5 to all stats for 30 sec base (if both are cast) you can actually get +5 to all stats permanently which, besides being awesome, also raises all defenses except deflection by +20 (deflection by +5).

A lvl1 chant only takes 2 sec at lvl 16 and you need 5 phrases to cast those self buffs. They last for 30 secs with 10 INT. Leaving aside that most chanters have higher INT and the fact that you will cast invocations with +5 INT. So you can easily keep up the +5 to all stats and even use longer chants - like the lvl 2frightening one which is the equivalent of another +10 to all defenses through fear (if enemies are not immune).

I think you can even use The Dragon Thrashed at lvl 16 (takes 4 secs) and still keep up the permanent +5 to all stats. 4*5 = 20. That's too long for the base duration of 30 secs. But keep in mind that you might have >20 INT and +5 from the invocation itself. 25 INT will give you durations more than 50 per buff which is enough to compensate even the recovery after invocations. So at lvl 16 you can use The Dragon Thrashed and have +5 to all stats all the time which also means +20 to all defenses except deflection (+5).

 

A paladin can get the Outworn Buckler very early though.

 

Edit: corrected the numbers... again

Edited August 16, 2016 by Boeroer

[Arranvin]

What do you guys think about trying for The Ultimate with a ranger? I've started a run but because I'm using one TOI file and one non TOI, I find doing everything twice pretty dull and so I only play now and again, making progress slow. So far it seems fine, so hopefully I'll eventually get there!

[Jojobobo]

So chants take less time to, erm, chant with higher level? This really should be mentioned somewhere, anywhere, in game (and I'm not talking about when you're a high level Chanter and it's obvious) or on an external source like the wiki. It seems like something that should be readily apparent to everyone, which it certainly wasn't to me.

 

If that is the case, then yes it sees like Chanters are a slightly stronger contender (defensively) for a tanky build, and they obviously pack more utility as a class on the whole.

[Boeroer]

By the way I was talking total crap in my previous post. Obviously you will have +5 to all stats and not +10. But that still means +20 to all defenses besides deflection. No idea when my brain stopped working...

 

Edit: again number tweaking, +20 to defenses was correct, my my...

Edited August 16, 2016 by Boeroer

[Boeroer]

It's called Brisk Recitation. It was introduced in some patch some time ago after a lot of people complained that chanters' mechanics are too slow.

 

It will shorten your chant durations (not the linger time) every four levels if I recall correctly. At lvl 16 you will have 50% of the original chanting time. So basically it halves all chant durations at lvl 16. You can find it on the character sheet as well.

[Climhazzard]

So chants take less time to, erm, chant with higher level? This really should be mentioned somewhere, anywhere, in game (and I'm not talking about when you're a high level Chanter and it's obvious) or on an external source like the wiki. It seems like something that should be readily apparent to everyone, which it certainly wasn't to me.

 

If that is the case, then yes it sees like Chanters are a slightly stronger contender (defensively) for a tanky build, and they obviously pack more utility as a class on the whole.

 

Not sure when it was added into the game, but Chanters now automatically get a talent called "Brisk Recitation" that improves as you level up.  At level 16 it gives you -50% recitation time.

[Jojobobo]

Thanks to both of you guys, I guess that makes their chants a lot more worthy. Silly me for ever thinking there would be a fanbase that likes to keep up to date wikis, though it's hard to blame them when mechanics are still being comprehensively edited in the third iteration of a main patch. I stopped playing between v1.0 and v3.0 to wait for the full expansion release, so I guess I'm behind the curve in assuming a developer wouldn't need to continuously massively overhaul class mechanics in between that time.

 

Now let me sit here to feast upon my sour grapes. This may have factored into my current PotD solo playthrough, as I was currently class-building a solo Paladin whereas with the extra knowledge a Cipher may well have been a superior choice now - it's very hard to say.

Edited August 15, 2016 by Jojobobo

[Dr <3]

Ok boeroer had the right idea: with the "courage" lvl 1 chant + swift Wind of death ( wengridth chant for +10 reflex was eliminated because llengrath potion suppress it) i was able to chain the two +5 stats invocation AND a seven nights ( doing really good dmg) before the other 2 expires. After some trials i was able to defeat llengrat in solo potd tanking both dragons ( no running around, i tanked them like in kylon video), so i'm confident i can try my run now.

 

Btw boeroer was wrong about beign wrong: the +5 stats invocation gives you +5 to all attribuite when chained, so for example +5 str and +5 const --> +10 x 2 fortitude --> +20 fortitude. So yes, you can actually buff yourself +20 in every defence apart from deflecion.

This was also changed in the last pach, before Chanter invocation had no effect on self.

 

Thanks to everyone as usual for good idea and inspirations

Edited August 16, 2016 by Dr <3

[Boeroer]

Ah yes, sorry. You won't get +10 to all attributes but of course +20 to all defenses. Man, it was really late for me yesterday when I posted that.

Edited August 16, 2016 by Boeroer

[Boeroer]

I can't say what suppresses the stat buffs of a chanter. That potions don't stack was expected though.

 

Cool that you can squeeze in Seven Nights. Means that there's also room for other experiments/ mixtures of chants/invocations while keeping up the +5 to all defenses.

Edited August 16, 2016 by Boeroer

[Kaylon]

It should also be mentioned that +5buffs will suppress the food bonuses, which means the effective gains are less important...

[Jojobobo]

It should also be mentioned that +5buffs will suppress the food bonuses, which means the effective gains are less important...

I suppose that makes Paladins slightly better defensively with the food bonuses as they have equivalent defences (Deep Faith Faith and Conviction giving +10 to 20 base deflection, +20 each to the rest, +5 to each stat for the Chanter giving +5 to 25 base deflection and again +20 each to the rest) otherwise.

[Boeroer]

It should also be mentioned that +5buffs will suppress the food bonuses, which means the effective gains are less important...

I expected that but didn't test it.

But you have to eat a lot of food every time to achieve a bonus to every stat - and you won't get +5. But it's right that it lowers the usefulness of those stats buffs to solo play. In a party the chanter could keep up the +5 to all stats for his fellow team members as well.

 

Another thing is that the chanter has some nice chants/invocations against certain types of CC effects (like Cast of their Shackles for example). Although I seldomly used them I can imagine that this can be a plus in certain encounters.

 

The 30pt damage shield stacks in a way (a suppressed shield replaces the first one once it received 30 PDS oft damage) . Maybe at lvl 16 you sing it fast enough to stack 3 of them? I never tested it in a solo game but in a party with more than one chanter it's pretty impressive together with high defenses in order to mainly receive grazes (or misses). I cleared whole Cräghold Bluffs with two chanters this way and nearly experienced zero health loss. From time to time you can also dish out Seven Nights or summon stuff.

Edited August 16, 2016 by Boeroer

[Raven Darkholme]

 

It should also be mentioned that +5buffs will suppress the food bonuses, which means the effective gains are less important...

I suppose that makes Paladins slightly better defensively with the food bonuses as they have equivalent defences (Deep Faith Faith and Conviction giving +10 to 20 base deflection, +20 each to the rest, +5 to each stat for the Chanter giving +5 to 25 base deflection and again +20 each to the rest) otherwise.

 

The difference in defense doesn't make up for the better utility of a chanter solo.

If you want max defense you are better of with the 30 pt damage shield anyway and if you want to clear big mobs SA will never last long enough while Dragon chant lasts .... forever.

Not very interesting with a party but solo it's a different story.

[Dr <3]

During my trials to kill llengrath i tried also the shielding chant and the +20 accuracy vs beast chant, but the results were inferior to simply chain swift Wind + +10fort,+10 will chant.

This for 2 reasons: the phrase building was much slower and doesn't allow for 7 night anymore, and the fact that the phrase is so long actually is like "disable" the effect of the +10 fort, +10 will chant, that is much needed... The effect in itself is quite strong indeed.

 

Another thing: i have also thought for sure that a wild Orlan Would have been the best race for this, but after seeing how the large majority of dragon attacks are prone-based or stun-based i'm wondering if a costal amanua (for his +20 def to stun & prone) can actually performance better and give you better utility game-long, since they are by far the most common disable ( warrior's, monks, most mobs with cc have prone)

[Boeroer]

Or you take the Solace shield and another preservation item with a chanter who chants The Dragon Thrashed - and giggle like Peppa Pig every time you are prone or stunned.

[DynEira]

Any feedback on my initial Druid build? 
Was also thinking of a Cipher with

M: 10

C: 16

D: 11

P: 15

I: 16

R: 10

 

Using door ways to my advantage with a shield and rapier build to build up focus and possess/charm enemy mobs to take the pressure off my Cipher and then bouncing defensive things off him on to the enemy with CC. Early 4 points in lore and mechanics and then investing in to survival/athletics as I can to earn good stats for healing. 

Early upgrading some high end medium armour to fine stats and taking the sword and shield style + rapier proficiency to ensure extra accuracy and consistent focus income. 

Feedback would be appreciated! 

[Raven Darkholme]

Any feedback on my initial Druid build? 

Was also thinking of a Cipher with

M: 10

C: 16

D: 11

P: 15

I: 16

R: 10

 

Using door ways to my advantage with a shield and rapier build to build up focus and possess/charm enemy mobs to take the pressure off my Cipher and then bouncing defensive things off him on to the enemy with CC. Early 4 points in lore and mechanics and then investing in to survival/athletics as I can to earn good stats for healing. 

 

Early upgrading some high end medium armour to fine stats and taking the sword and shield style + rapier proficiency to ensure extra accuracy and consistent focus income. 

 

Feedback would be appreciated! 

Don't go low Mi with a cipher cause Echo.

I'd rather lower Con and put it in Mi at least as soon as you have access to Botanic Garden and Creature parts in your stronghold chest and can craft unlimited Vital essence potions.