Namutree Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/poll-election-2016-shapes-up-as-a-contest-of-negatives/2016/05/21/8d4ccfd6-1ed3-11e6-b6e0-c53b7ef63b45_story.html FivethirtyEight grades ABC News/Washington Post polls as an A-. "Trust in handle immigration": Clinton 50% - Trump 44% Tehehehe. A lot of people fear that if Trump is elected that the USA will collapse. What exactly do you mean? How? Where to begin? How 'bout with the Mexico wall. I don't care how high you build a wall, people will get over it. The shear expense of building it could bankrupt our society while Trumps buddies collect millions from the contracts to build it. Next, Trump has FAILED at every business he has tried. He is still worth approximately what he inherited from Daddy. Such a record of failure gives me every reason to believe he will destroy the US economy. If you watch his interviews, he appears to me to be a very ignorant, or perhaps insane, man. That's already enough to scare the 'whatever' out of me. I watched an interview with him where the interviewer asked him what he thought about being endorsed by David Duke (Grand Dragon Emeritus of the KKK). Trump kept responding that he didn't know the man and has never done business with him. What difference does that make? If Trump is a closet Ayrian, that could destroy the USA. And having the "football" in his possession scares me to no end. He could, without authorization from anyone, launch a nuclear attack against any country, even Arizona (small chuckle). He would need to get us to def con 5 first, but that doesn't take much. Trump has had 8% of his companies fail, the average for an entrepreneur is 80%. His net worth is 10 billion, and he started with 40 million. He said he would pay for the wall through increased border fees, temp visa fees, tariffs on goods not covered under NAFTA, etc. Not direct payments from mexico. Check out that Untruth about Donald Trump video. Contrasts media attention to his actual policies and statements. I was under the impression that Sweet_Sadie was joking. 1 "Good thing I don't heal my characters or they'd be really hurt." Is not something I should ever be thinking. I use blue text when I'm being sarcastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ganrich Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 His comment is specifically designed to elicit the response of: "I'll be tough on illegal immigration and I'll make em' pay for it too." I cant imagine anyone actually believes he can force Mexico to pay. How was this handled in ye ole days? Why don't we just open up some Ellis Island-like facility on the border and process anyone that wants to immigrate? Legally. Let me preface this by saying that I am not for Trump. That said, he has said how he will pay for a portion of that wall. He plans on putting tariffs on all trade coming in from Mexico to this country. All products that come from Mexico will see this tax hike, and he has said it won't be a small hike. If it crosses the border or enters via docks it will be hit with these taxes. There is a lot of "Made in Mexico" stuff out and about here in the US. Most of it is cheap, and these hikes could make those products non-competitive. So, either the Mexican Government pays upfront to assist in the wall, or the tariffs could crush what business they have, make them non-competitive, cause businesses to pack up factories for greener pastures, etc. These scenarios lead to getting money for the project, or really hurting Mexico financially. Not an unintelligent plan. He isn't the bafoon he is painted as, nor as he has somewhat portrayed himself. He is just brash, but he has plans for doing what he proposes, and more solid ones in many cases compared to Hillary or Sanders. He reminds me of a mouthy Columbo. He is playing stupid, but you don't make billions without knowing how to really put it to your competition. His manipulation of the press in general has been masterful. I just don't like the guy, or authoritarian is in general. So, none of the 3 current candidates appeal to me. It's a large gap in the media's presentation on this (and many other policies of Trump). They have painted it as if he is just going to go to Mexico and give them a stern talking to. Which is laughable. As leader of the country where a large portion of Mexico's exports go he would wield considerably more power over Mexico's pocketbook than many realize. Including (based on responses I've read in the media) from the Mexican Government it would seem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurlshort Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 So the strategy would essentially give China an even bigger edge in manufacturing. Great. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet_Sadie Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Believing you know motivations of millions "smacks of leftism"? So marketing is leftism now? The assumption of rationality is leftism? The human nature argument is leftism?My comment should not be construed as anything other than a repudiation of Robert Kagan's eliteist snobbery in that op-ed Bruce linkedWe should know by now almost all of Bruce's arguments are as full of **** as a toilet after eating taco bell. Geez KP. What's with the personal venom? It's time for you to either grow up, or take your ball and go home. I see no need for persoal attacks here where it is easy to be a coward and hide behind the anonimity of the web. It is time to put away your childish behavior and become an adult. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet_Sadie Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Guys, guys, guys! The ego's are starting to run a bit hot in here. Everyone please take a step back and realize you are not going to convince anyone of much of anything, because we are all just throwing our ego's around. Normally I find spirited discussions and stinging jabs to be a fun past time. But when it elevates out of control, it is no longer fun. I'm not going to visit this WoT thread for a few days. If you are still all running super hot, then I can always find my fun on other forums. This particular site enticed me because of the level of intelligence of it's members. So please guys, take a breath or a cold shower and lets get back to intelligent comments without all the egos. OK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volourn Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 "This particular site enticed me because of the level of intelligence of it's members." HAHAHAHAHA! "I see no need for persoal attacks here where it is easy to be a coward and hide behind the anonimity of the web. It is time to put away your childish behavior and become an adult." Cute. Admonish someone for their ';childish behaviour' and 'personal attacks' sling a few of your own. Hypocrisy has a new name and it is Notsosweet Sadie. R00fles! Welcome to the club. DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PK htiw klaw eriF Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Believing you know motivations of millions "smacks of leftism"? So marketing is leftism now? The assumption of rationality is leftism? The human nature argument is leftism?My comment should not be construed as anything other than a repudiation of Robert Kagan's eliteist snobbery in that op-ed Bruce linkedWe should know by now almost all of Bruce's arguments are as full of **** as a toilet after eating taco bell. Geez KP. What's with the personal venom? It's time for you to either grow up, or take your ball and go home. I see no need for persoal attacks here where it is easy to be a coward and hide behind the anonimity of the web. It is time to put away your childish behavior and become an adult. If that's gonna shock you then you should probably stay off the internet or unclench. "Akiva Goldsman and Alex Kurtzman run the 21st century version of MK ULTRA." - majestic "you're a damned filthy lying robot and you deserve to die and burn in hell." - Bartimaeus "Without individual thinking you can't notice the plot holes." - InsaneCommander "Just feed off the suffering of gamers." - Malcador "You are calling my taste crap." -Hurlshort "thankfully it seems like the creators like Hungary less this time around." - Sarex "Don't forget the wakame, dumbass" -Keyrock "Are you trolling or just being inadvertently nonsensical?' -Pidesco "we have already been forced to admit you are at least human" - uuuhhii "I refuse to buy from non-woke businesses" - HoonDing "feral camels are now considered a pest" - Gorth "Melkathi is known to be an overly critical grumpy person" - Melkathi "Oddly enough Sanderson was a lot more direct despite being a Mormon" - Zoraptor "I found it greatly disturbing to scroll through my cartoon's halfing selection of genitalias." - Wormerine "I love cheese despite the pain and carnage." - ShadySands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet_Sadie Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 (edited) "This particular site enticed me because of the level of intelligence of it's members." HAHAHAHAHA! "I see no need for persoal attacks here where it is easy to be a coward and hide behind the anonimity of the web. It is time to put away your childish behavior and become an adult." Cute. Admonish someone for their ';childish behaviour' and 'personal attacks' sling a few of your own. Hypocrisy has a new name and it is Notsosweet Sadie. R00fles! Welcome to the club. You have lost any respect I had for you. Sad little boy. I called no one any names nor made any personal attacks, if you actually READ what I wrote. I admonished KP to please not call people names, but the rest was all general and aimed at the sad little boys like you, evidently. Call me a Hippogriff if you must, but Hiphopcrisy is some of the best music playing Edited May 23, 2016 by Sweet_Sadie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet_Sadie Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Believing you know motivations of millions "smacks of leftism"? So marketing is leftism now? The assumption of rationality is leftism? The human nature argument is leftism?My comment should not be construed as anything other than a repudiation of Robert Kagan's eliteist snobbery in that op-ed Bruce linkedWe should know by now almost all of Bruce's arguments are as full of **** as a toilet after eating taco bell. Geez KP. What's with the personal venom? It's time for you to either grow up, or take your ball and go home. I see no need for persoal attacks here where it is easy to be a coward and hide behind the anonimity of the web. It is time to put away your childish behavior and become an adult. If that's gonna shock you then you should probably stay off the internet or unclench. Babies playing on the web won't chase me away. Doo dah, doo dah. The can cry in their beer all night long or all the live long day. -- sung to the toon of camptown racers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceVC Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 "This particular site enticed me because of the level of intelligence of it's members." HAHAHAHAHA! "I see no need for persoal attacks here where it is easy to be a coward and hide behind the anonimity of the web. It is time to put away your childish behavior and become an adult." Cute. Admonish someone for their ';childish behaviour' and 'personal attacks' sling a few of your own. Hypocrisy has a new name and it is Notsosweet Sadie. R00fles! Welcome to the club. Volo there is no need for personal attacks against any member, I have been saying that for ages You can have a debate with someone without being personal, I can promise you it can be done 1 "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meshugger Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 Is that why people like him? Because he fails at business, will bancrupt the US, is insane, likes to hang around David Duke, will authorize nuke strikes on the very country that he claims to love so much and make great again? Meshugger, I have no idea why people like him. I was merely answering a question you asked. That was what my retort was about. Your argument is missing an important part of the whole picture, namely why people are drawn to him to begin with. 1 "Some men see things as they are and say why?""I dream things that never were and say why not?"- George Bernard Shaw"Hope in reality is the worst of all evils because it prolongs the torments of man."- Friedrich Nietzsche "The amount of energy necessary to refute bull**** is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it." - Some guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet_Sadie Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Is that why people like him? Because he fails at business, will bancrupt the US, is insane, likes to hang around David Duke, will authorize nuke strikes on the very country that he claims to love so much and make great again? Meshugger, I have no idea why people like him. I was merely answering a question you asked. That was what my retort was about. Your argument is missing an important part of the whole picture, namely why people are drawn to him to begin with. I disagree Meshugger. My point wasn't why people like him, but why people should not like him. Is that argument necessarily fallacious if I don't include why people like him? I don't think so. Additionally, I would not attempt to read peoples minds to be able to tell you why they like him because that would be witchcraft and I think they still burn witches in California 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceVC Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 I also believe that he is popular because the white middle class has been slowly displaced, both culturally and politically the last twenty years and Trump just happens to be the right guy at the right time and place. The jobs of the avarage Joe is outsourced and the sudden change of demographics undermines the social cohesion and making people feel like strangers in their own communities where Trump, and Bernie to a degree, adresses that issue, of which the establishment has turned a blind eye to. There's the cultural aspect of forced diversity, third wave feminism, celebration of every other sexual orientation except normal heterosexuality, celebration of depravity and banality, celebration of victimhood and safe spaces which has simply left a cultural vacuum for people like Trump, who represents himself as positive, assertive, strongly masculine, pulling no punches and apologizes to no one. Pretty much like the video below: self-hatred and negative outlook is the current mantra and Trump is the opposition to that: There's probably more, but that's what i have been getting so far. Meshugger I meant to say you raised some good points here, I may not personally agree with them as rationale but yes I agree these are reasons some people are supporting Trump "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet_Sadie Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 "This particular site enticed me because of the level of intelligence of it's members." HAHAHAHAHA! "I see no need for persoal attacks here where it is easy to be a coward and hide behind the anonimity of the web. It is time to put away your childish behavior and become an adult." Cute. Admonish someone for their ';childish behaviour' and 'personal attacks' sling a few of your own. Hypocrisy has a new name and it is Notsosweet Sadie. R00fles! Welcome to the club. Volo there is no need for personal attacks against any member, I have been saying that for ages You can have a debate with someone without being personal, I can promise you it can be done Good point, Bruce. I apologize to anyone I may have offended with my recent posts. I apologize directly to Volo and KP if you found my posts to be childish or taken as personal attacks. I do make hypocritical statements at times. That's because I am a flawed human. Peace guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meshugger Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 Is that why people like him? Because he fails at business, will bancrupt the US, is insane, likes to hang around David Duke, will authorize nuke strikes on the very country that he claims to love so much and make great again? Meshugger, I have no idea why people like him. I was merely answering a question you asked. That was what my retort was about. Your argument is missing an important part of the whole picture, namely why people are drawn to him to begin with. I disagree Meshugger. My point wasn't why people like him, but why people should not like him. Is that argument necessarily fallacious if I don't include why people like him? I don't think so. Additionally, I would not attempt to read peoples minds to be able to tell you why they like him because that would be witchcraft and I think they still burn witches in California I didn't say that your argument was fallicious per se, i said that it was incomplete because the reasons that i stated. For example, the october revolution in Russia didn't happen because people thought that regicide was a swell idea, or that the nation needed a good Holodomor or two or that they were fond of a spiritual decline. The reasons were of course something completely different, and in order to adress them you will have to understand the underlying causes of such unrests to begin with. Otherwise we are all doomed to repeat the same mistakes again and again. "Some men see things as they are and say why?""I dream things that never were and say why not?"- George Bernard Shaw"Hope in reality is the worst of all evils because it prolongs the torments of man."- Friedrich Nietzsche "The amount of energy necessary to refute bull**** is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it." - Some guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gfted1 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Hmmm....my BS meter is pegging into the red.... "I'm your biggest fan, Ill follow you until you love me, Papa" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcador Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Hmmm....my BS meter is pegging into the red.... Does it ever leave the red here? Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gfted1 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Depends on whos posting. Something just seems very....familiar. I guess I could check IP's but why ruin the mystery for myself. Of course, maybe I'm just cray cray. "I'm your biggest fan, Ill follow you until you love me, Papa" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceVC Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Depends on whos posting. Something just seems very....familiar. I guess I could check IP's but why ruin the mustery for myself. Of course, maybe I'm just cray cray. Please check IP and post findings..I would love to see the results as I have a few theories of my own "Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss” John Milton "We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” - George Bernard Shaw "What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gfted1 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 No can do, BVC. I am not at liberty to disclose that information. "I'm your biggest fan, Ill follow you until you love me, Papa" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilloutman Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Depends on whos posting. Something just seems very....familiar. I guess I could check IP's but why ruin the mystery for myself. Of course, maybe I'm just cray cray. Am I missing something? I'm the enemy, 'cause I like to think, I like to read. I'm into freedom of speech, and freedom of choice. I'm the kinda guy that likes to sit in a greasy spoon and wonder, "Gee, should I have the T-bone steak or the jumbo rack of barbecue ribs with the side-order of gravy fries?" I want high cholesterol! I wanna eat bacon, and butter, and buckets of cheese, okay?! I wanna smoke a Cuban cigar the size of Cincinnati in the non-smoking section! I wanna run naked through the street, with green Jell-O all over my body, reading Playboy magazine. Why? Because I suddenly may feel the need to, okay, pal? I've SEEN the future. Do you know what it is? It's a 47-year-old virgin sitting around in his beige pajamas, drinking a banana-broccoli shake, singing "I'm an Oscar Meyer Wiene" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meshugger Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 Midsomer murders: WoT-edition. "Some men see things as they are and say why?""I dream things that never were and say why not?"- George Bernard Shaw"Hope in reality is the worst of all evils because it prolongs the torments of man."- Friedrich Nietzsche "The amount of energy necessary to refute bull**** is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it." - Some guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aluminiumtrioxid Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Guys, guys, guys! The ego's are starting to run a bit hot in here. Everyone please take a step back and realize you are not going to convince anyone of much of anything, because we are all just throwing our ego's around because actually changing people's minds is next to impossible, especially on the Internet Fix'd. This particular site enticed me because of the level of intelligence of it's members. Oh sweet summer child... "Lulz is not the highest aspiration of art and mankind, no matter what the Encyclopedia Dramatica says." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guard Dog Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Depends on whos posting. Something just seems very....familiar. I guess I could check IP's but why ruin the mystery for myself. Of course, maybe I'm just cray cray. You are JUST figuring this out? Jeez, another board member and I were discussing that very thing days ago by PM. We don't even have a "backstage pass" "While it is true you learn with age, the down side is what you often learn is what a damn fool you were before" Thomas Sowell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gfted1 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 You are JUST figuring this out? Jeez, another board member and I were discussing that very thing days ago by PM. We don't even have a "backstage pass" I had my suspicions almost immediately but I am willing to let it play out. "I'm your biggest fan, Ill follow you until you love me, Papa" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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