Favourite/Least Favourite Things About PoE?

[Gender Nihilist]

First post! 

 

Hi, I'm new to the forums and haven't yet bought Pillars of Eternity. I'm pretty pumped about Tyranny (and, of course, love things Obsidian has been involved with like their stellar Fallout and NWN releases), so I'm definitely planning to grab this game at some point (especially as a long-time fan of Black Isle games that inspired PoE) and when I do I'd like to know some (non-spoilery) favourite/least favourite things that fans of the game are opinionated about! 

 

What do you love about the game and what would you like to see changed, what keeps you coming back for playthrough after playthrough and what starts to wear on you playthrough after playthrough, those sorta things! 

[MaxQuest]

What do you love about the game and what keeps you coming back for playthrough after playthrough

- Story

- Atmosphere

- Game opening and the way it engages you in the first 5 minutes (and tbh this is way harder task than it sounds)

- Companions humour

- Spells diversity

- Replayability

- Strategy and freedom with party composition

- Attribute system. It's not perfect, but it's new, unique and is actually quite deep. Every once in a while you can re-evaluate your own point of view on the stats spread and optimize stuff even further. And.. that's great!

 

What would you like to see changed, and what starts to wear on you playthrough after playthrough

- Some tooltips lie or are quite vague. They shouldn't.

- More transparent mechanics.

- Stealth, detection and noise system are not explained in the game at all.

- Attack system revised. The dps gain should be proportional to the numbers stated.

- Choices. I need more choices in rewards, dialogs, outcomes. For example I want:

• to stop (not destroy) the machine from the Herritage Hill and be able to inform the populace (direcly or via guards/duc) to NOT SETTLE there, until I come back to investigate it (and probably even figure out how to get it's gift without sacrificing people to Aldhelm)
• being able to send, or at least propose to Aelys to go to Caed Nua chapel
• to be able to recruit captain Emery
• the flexibility in faction reward. I need The Merciless Hand talent. But nope, I will not side with Doemenels. I would rather RP out how I've slaughtered their entire faction and that's how I've got that alias. And side with Crucible Knights. Again.

- Faster loading screens.

- More enchanting options. Also if the character is able to enchant a robe, it is not clear what prevents him from enchanting lets say a hat.

- Basic personality templates for the hired NPCs. With their own occasional jokes and dialog interjections.

- Extra 2-3 basic voice templates per gender.

- Crossroad Keep style patrolling and income.

- Maybe, just maybe, multi-classing of NWN2+Kaedrin style. Class-building was so much fun.

- Maybe, just maybe, party AI setup of DaO style. It was great in making your party feel like a well working together team.

 

P.S. Don't get me wrong, PoE is a great game. It just has room for even more improvements

* all stated above is a matter of personal opinion.

Edited May 16, 2016 by MaxQuest

[Barbedbeat]

Hello Gender Nihilist, and welcome to the forum!

I really dig your question, and I'll reply straight away.

 

Let's start by saying that, since you are a Black Isle (ah, nostalgia is grabbing me by the throat yet again) RPGs fan, you absolutely need to get your hands on PoE. I'm positive you'll enjoy quite a lot. 

 

And here are the things I personally liked the most out of Pillars of Eternity:

 

1. Companions. Let's be frank, I love them, their concept, their writing- which I think to be generally well done- and their personal motives/quests AND quirks. Following the good Black Isle tradition, they are all very far from the stale, exaggerated stereotypes one would expect to encounter in this kind of games and I was pleasantly "surprised" by this on my first playthrough. 

 

2. Combat mechanics. I like them very much, and feel like they are some of the smoothest I ever found in an isometric rpg so far. I perceive the combat system as well-attuned, granting a very good synergy between all different classes as well as making room for the player to experiment with various different strategies.

 

3. No class restriction for armours, weapons, skills and talents. During my first playthrough, this made me literally squeal with joy. You want one of your chars to become a very stealthy fighter equipped with nothing but a loincloth and an arbalest? You can. You want your priest to turn into an athletic, heavy armored, axe-wielding maniac? Do as you please. One of the reasons I come back to Pillars is for messing around with various builds and equipment combinations. 

 

4. Story. Simply put, I found it very interesting and  immersive. Moreover, I love the setting and its lore, even though some things still need to be perfected and/or defined more clearly (but I'm sure that's will be fixed in Pillar's sequel/s).

 

5. An interesting villain. 

 

 

 

Things I don't like. Or, to put it better, "let me squeeze my tiny brain to think of something i didn't like as much as everything else, ah, ok, maybe this I guess". 

 

1. Some things about how the plot is orchestrated towards the last part of the game. Mainly because it gave me the faintest feeling that there had been some more content that was somehow cut from the final game, and whose impalpable remains still lingered surreptitiously in some overheard dialogues and character reactions. BUT! 1. This is simply my own, personal, subjective opinion; 2. The latest (and definitive) game update has fixed and polished some narrative bits, and I didn't reach that part in my newest, patched playthrough yet, so I don't know whether I'd get the same felling still; 3. This didn't bother me one bit. Actually, the last act of Pillars of Eternity is one of the parts I enjoyed the most. Felt like there were some noteworthy moments, especially if you happen to have two specific companions by your side (heck yeah character development!). 

 

... And these were my two-cents. Keep us posted on your Pillars-grabbing decision!

[Ink Blot]

I'll just say this: if you like the game, you'll probably love it. This seems to be the trend, anyway.

 

I found it... okay. I like the story and the companions, but don't care a whole lot for the attribute system and I absolutely hate the engagement mechanic and found combat nothing short of tedious. So much so, in fact, that even though I got the expansions via Kickstarter rewards, I've yet to play through them. The thought of slogging through the combat makes me shudder. Although, since I've not played since patch 1.06(?), I believe, I'll just wait until the patch cycle is completely finished (I think there's one more in the works) and try to give it a go again.

[Barbedbeat]

I'll just say this: if you like the game, you'll probably love it.

Yes, that's how the vast majority of things works, I it seems. But again, one man's meat is another man's poison: I, for one, detest games that most people seem to enjoy to the fullest. Oh, well.

[Gender Nihilist]

These are some great answers so far, gives me a good feel for the game apart from videos of gameplay. While I haven't played the game, from watching a few Lets Plays of the first bit up to about Caed Nua (I stop watching as they start clearing out the place), I totally agree with MaxQuest on how the character creation and first few minutes of gameplay really draw you in, and I love the variety in race/class/culture/background being teased out in conversation in the first bit, that's a really great idea. 

 

Also pretty glad I haven't grabbed the game yet in the sense that Ink Blot and Barbedbeat touched on re: patches polishing things up (plus since I'm waiting until I can afford to grab the game and the expansion 2 parter in one go, I'll get to experience everything as an integrated experience on my first go-through, which I'm pretty excited about). 

 

And to Barbedbeat, I'm pretty broke and poor at the moment, but PoE is sort of a "next to buy" on my list of big game purchases so that's why I'm here scoping out people's perceptions and reactions to it. As with Black Isle games, I expect to be returning to PoE dozens of times, so I wanted to get a feel for the lay of the land, but I won't likely be picking it up until GOG does another sale (I keep being broker than usual when they do so, so I'm trying to squirrel away some extra for the next time a sale happens). 

Edited May 16, 2016 by Gender Nihilist

[anameforobsidian]

I liked the vast majority of the game.

-  Weapon variety is great, they could tone it down a bit and I would still be happy.

- Combat is great.  They made a new system and it feels very different from IE, but quite good.

- Enemy design is great.  Enemies feel unique and fun, especially in WM.

- Stronghold adventurers are a cool feature.

- Endless paths are a fun dungeon.

- Some companions really shine.

- Graphics are amazing and sound is solid.

- Slowmode is a solid addition to the genre.

 

Things that need work:

1. Combat needs to be more readable.  It would be nice if you could see what each status effect on each character does on the fly rather than going to the cyclopedia.  Similarly, attack speed is a mess to read.
2. Level design in non-WM areas.
3. The plot needs to more consistent and better organized around central themes.
4. Some companions are wildly variable.
5. Anything they could do to lower loading times would be nice.  Maybe loading sub-maps but making them invisible when they load area maps.
6. Modding is not great.
7. Enchanting should be rarer / harder (i.e. not something the player does).
8. AI can always use work.

[Gender Nihilist]

Looking up slow mode, I have to agree with you that it seems like an amazing thing to put into a game like this! Thanks for your thoughts anameforobsidian! 

[Odd Hermit]

Pros -

 

• Combat feels good overall - speed, animations, most of the mechanics, etc.
• Quest design is solid with reasonable number of different ways to solve many things.
• Companions fairly likeable and interesting to take along.

 

Cons -

• It's overwritten in general, with too much setting information dumped on you in dialogues.
• Lacks a certain warm fuzzy feeling that Icewind Dale and Baldur's Gate 2 had. They laid the grimdark on a little too thick including aesthetically.
• Sound design and music didn't really do it for me.

 

 

Nitpicks -

• Per Rest vs. Per Encounter was more of an arbitrary nuisance than a meaningful limitation.
• Companion builds arg. None of the Act 1 companions even have a mechanics class+background.
• Didn't really like having my attributes dictate parts of the PC's personality in dialogue, would've rather had separate combat and dialogue stats.
• Race bonuses were lackluster / poorly balanced, and race choice wasn't acknowledged enough in meaningful ways if you chose a controversial race.

Edited May 21, 2016 by Odd Hermit

[Gender Nihilist]

Thanks for the input Odd Hermit, altho I'd say your Cons sound like Nitpicks (i.e. broadly subjective feelings about very subjective things, as I know I'm going to want infodumps on a brand new setting I know next to nothing about, love grimdark aesthetics and tone and may very well enjoy the sound design and music) and your Nitpicks sound like Cons (i.e. very specific mechanical gripes which I personally, when reading them anyway, take as Cons that could have been done better) lmao

 

All of this is good to know, I appreciate all the perspectives being brought to this, and it will help me frame any questions I may have to make threads about when I do start up a game. 

[White Phoenix]

Liked:

 

• Lore 
• Story (Act 2 the most)
• White March - was great in every point! 
• Soulbound weapons
• Class system
• Real time combat (I don't have a taste for turn-based)
• Companions (Eder, Hiravias, Devil of Caroc and Durance!)
• Graphics with backgrounds
• Scripted Interactions
• No text walls in White March
• Full voiced WM part 1
• Slowmode! (It makes fight easier and readable)

Disliked:

• NPC backers
• Loading times 
• Story's potential wasted a little 
• Class and racial reactivity (too much attention for cipher)
• Same slot for necklace and cloak
• Companions not tying with story 
• White March in two parts
• Insane enemy fortitude (bugs!)
• Heavily bugged WM part 2!
• Text walls! (I like reading but it was very hard for me to concentrate)

Edited May 21, 2016 by White Phoenix

[AndreaColombo]

Liked:

 

• Graphics and sound
• Writing, with but a few spotty exceptions here and there
• Lore and world-building
• Story, despite a few hiccups here and there
• Scripted interactions
• Overall feeling in and out of combat. This game is fun.

 

Disliked:

 

• Engagement mechanic and slower recovery while moving. They make no sense.
• Scarce transparency on how mechanics work (it's really hard to calculate your DPS.)
• 2D elements capping at 1920x1080 despite the Kickstarter promise to go up to 2560x1440. I bought a 1440p screen because of it and ended up with a blurry UI (the awful bilinear scaling for 2D elements beyond 1080p doesn't help either.)
• Some of the companions' personal quests felt too short or too shallow. I wouldn't have minded more companion content.
• Companions could have shown more character, voiced their opinion louder, argue to the point of fighting over moral matters, and/or leave the party if you systematically act in contrast with their beliefs or moral tenets
• Reactivity sometimes falls short (appreciate reactivity takes lots of resources to develop and PoE only had so many to begin with.) More reactivity to your race, class, background, and choices in dialog and quest-solving would have kicked ass. Reactivity to who you travel with or associate with would be awesome as well.
• AI is pretty basic. Once you learn how it works, it's very easy to beat it. IWD2-grade AI would have been more interesting to face.
• Sharp decrease in difficulty in the second half of the game. If you're a completionist, you inevitably end up ROFLSTOMPING Acts III and IV.

Edited May 21, 2016 by AndreaColombo

[tinysalamander]

“Deaf” companions in dialogs. So, I need a Wizard for this option and I happen to have a Wizard companion, but…

[Gender Nihilist]

“Deaf” companions in dialogs. So, I need a Wizard for this option and I happen to have a Wizard companion, but…

Anything you liked? 

[tinysalamander]

“Deaf” companions in dialogs. So, I need a Wizard for this option and I happen to have a Wizard companion, but…

Anything you liked? 

 

The things the where already mentioned, so I've kinda skipped them. The story, character creation (more or less), Edér, no class restrictions (soulbound weapons notwithstanding), many spells to choose from. Hmm, WM2 sudden spoilery things too. Oh, and the fact that for once “a follower of a good healing god” is so damn interesting concept. Too bad potential of being one is never fully realised.

Edited May 21, 2016 by tinysalamander

[AndreaColombo]

Ah, yes: I forgot to mention character creation in my list of likes. I love how the absence of restrictions on items and talents enables the creation of so many different, interesting, and viable builds.

[Gender Nihilist]

Ah, yes: I forgot to mention character creation in my list of likes. I love how the absence of restrictions on items and talents enables the creation of so many different, interesting, and viable builds.

 

Yeah I gotta say I'm pretty pumped to try out a lot of different builds and party compositions! 

[Sking]

Dope;

- Ending/Story

- Od Nua

- Character Creation/Level up

- Overall game difficulty range

- Solid expansions

- Most of the side quests (love me some baby sacrifice and ghost lighthouse)

- Near perfect execution of a game that allows killing of any NPC. It is a lot harder then you'd think.

- I liked the final city (Twin Elms). Don't understand why peeps hating on it.

- Music

 

'Not' so Dope;

- I'm a turn based type of guy

- Limited skills

- Chanters (lol sorry, but they are boring)

- Wish the companions were more strong willed and would tell the pc to screw off

- Stealth/Stealing 

- Bounce spells never felt 'right' to me

[AndreaColombo]

- I'm a turn based type of guy

 

Booooo!!

[ShadySands]

Dope;

- Ending/Story

- Od Nua

- Character Creation/Level up

- Overall game difficulty range

- Solid expansions

- Most of the side quests (love me some baby sacrifice and ghost lighthouse)

- Near perfect execution of a game that allows killing of any NPC. It is a lot harder then you'd think.

- I liked the final city (Twin Elms). Don't understand why peeps hating on it.

- Music

 

'Not' so Dope;

- I'm a turn based type of guy

- Limited skills

- Chanters (lol sorry, but they are boring)

- Wish the companions were more strong willed and would tell the pc to screw off

- Stealth/Stealing 

- Bounce spells never felt 'right' to me

I agree with pretty much all of this and would add that I wish ranged attacks and spells had more range and that a the camera and FoW were both a little further out

 

More of a nitpick but I'd prefer the combat to be a little more deadly... either higher damage (especially for spells (me likes em OP)) or lower health across the board

[Barbedbeat]

[

- Chanters (lol sorry, but they are boring)

Sking... *pinches bridge of nose and lets out a big, fat groan*, oh Sking. My dear, dear Sking. "Chanters are boring", you say? Well, I beg to differ. Chanters are awesome. And they are exactly like this (WARNING: swearing included)->

I can't see a single speck of boredom in a hundred-mile radius of pure, sheer epicness, my good Sir. Harrumpf. Edited May 27, 2016 by Barbedbeat

[Odd Hermit]

Chanters are boring though, and very buggy too. Probably the worst class design aside from maybe Monk, but Monks are actually fun it's just that if you want to use them right you have to pause and check on their wound situation and swift strikes duration way too often.

 

I'd say that Paladins are also boring, but that's almost standard for anything pseudo-DnD. Chanters sounded interesting but you just don't get to use their abilities enough and the increased time and phrases needed pushes you into very dull sequences repeating only the most efficient combination of the same chants -> same invocation over and over again.

[anameforobsidian]

Chanters are less active, by design.  Fighters are the same way.  And so are rangers and some paladin builds.  That's not a failure.

 

The existence of less active classes is okay in a party system, because it allows you to tune the party to the level of micro you are comfortable with.  Some people may want to play a party of pure rogues or wizards, reacting all the goddamn time, and heavily dependent on micro to keep people alive.  Some people may want one or two reactive classes (say a druid and a cleric), and the less reactive classes allow you to experience party play without constantly switching to those classes.  

 

Chanters can be played far more active than most people do.  But I think the real interesting thing about a chanter is that they expose you to the possibility of a party without a priest (or dedicated healer).  That's a huge conceptual shift.

[Elric Galad]

Chanters are boring though, and very buggy too. Probably the worst class design aside from maybe Monk, but Monks are actually fun it's just that if you want to use them right you have to pause and check on their wound situation and swift strikes duration way too often.

 

I'd say that Paladins are also boring, but that's almost standard for anything pseudo-DnD. Chanters sounded interesting but you just don't get to use their abilities enough and the increased time and phrases needed pushes you into very dull sequences repeating only the most efficient combination of the same chants -> same invocation over and over again.

Chanters are a nice class design. They surely need a bit of balancing with their chants. And probably a few class talents to get some invocations a bit faster, but that's about it. They're meant to be passive.

 

Monk are great too, even if their design is really a matter of taste. Some just don't like requiring being hurt.

 

The worst class design is currently the priest. Not by itself of course, priest are extremely strong. But there are just no good alternative to priests currently. It's less about healing than buff and immunity against affliction.

 

Add more party buff to other class and pb will be fixed. Still ok for PoE1 by the way.

Edited May 27, 2016 by Elric Galad

[TWPE]

[

- Chanters (lol sorry, but they are boring)

Sking... *pinches bridge of nose and lets out a big, fat groan*, oh Sking. My dear, dear Sking. "Chanters are boring", you say? Well, I beg to differ. Chanters are awesome. And they are exactly like this (WARNING: swearing included)->

 

I can't see a single speck of boredom in a hundred-mile radius of pure, sheer epicness, my good Sir. Harrumpf.

 

Here you are being the cool guy; making a joke. What does everyone do? Start a serious discussion on Chanters.

 

Should have linked the clip from the movie instead of just the song (that scene fits chanters perfectly).