San Bernadino shooting

[Qistina]

http://nypost.com/2015/12/13/theyre-so-nice-until-they-get-religion-and-want-to-kill-us/

 

"Studies back him up, including one recently published in Europe that found that Islam is the only religion in the world in which people become more violent the stronger they believe."

 

[Meshugger]

I'm more of the school that Islam is a magnet for the perpetually butthurt. Meaning that it has to be respected or else they will blow up, figuratively or literally.

 

I mean, those guys at San Bernadino just waited for an excuse to blow it all up.

Edited December 16, 2015 by Meshugger

[Namutree]

 

http://nypost.com/2015/12/13/theyre-so-nice-until-they-get-religion-and-want-to-kill-us/

 

"Studies back him up, including one recently published in Europe that found that Islam is the only religion in the world in which people become more violent the stronger they believe."

 

 

I don't see the connection between this quote and Star Wars. I will say though that this statement sounds absurd. Pretty much any religion makes people more violent.

 

 

[Hurlshort]

Yes, all the churches in my neighborhood are hotbeds of violence, what with their soup kitchens and clothing drives.

[Namutree]

Yes, all the churches in my neighborhood are hotbeds of violence, what with their soup kitchens and clothing drives.

Almost nobody takes religion seriously in the states, and the few who do spend more time celebrating dead soldiers and shooting up their work places than helping people.

[Hurlshort]

 

Yes, all the churches in my neighborhood are hotbeds of violence, what with their soup kitchens and clothing drives.

Almost nobody takes religion seriously in the states, and the few who do spend more time celebrating dead soldiers and shooting up their work places than helping people.

 

 

Religion really brings out the unreasonable side of you, Namutree.

[Hurlshort]

If nobody in the states takes religion seriously, why are there churches on nearly every corner?

 

Like it or not, it is simply a part of human nature.  As is violence, as is kindness.  Now most churches I know preach kindness over violence, so I'm not sure why that is such a big issue.  

[Namutree]

If nobody in the states takes religion seriously, why are there churches on nearly every corner?

Religion is very culturally relevant. 

 

 

Now most churches I know preach kindness over violence, so I'm not sure why that is such a big issue.  

 

Most churches preach what is reflected in their politics and the values that they hold. Very rarely do churches actually preach their religious doctrines and even more rarely do people acquire their values from their faith (like they are supposed to). Instead they deliberately twist the religion they supposedly have faith in to fit their world view. That is not what people who genuinely believe their religion would do; it's what liars who only pretend to believe their religion would do.

Edited December 16, 2015 by Namutree

[Wrath of Dagon]

 

http://nypost.com/2015/12/13/theyre-so-nice-until-they-get-religion-and-want-to-kill-us/

 

Another great Guandolo post, right?

 

"Evidence exists that the more religious a terrorist is, the more likely he is to be a religious terrorist".

 

Because this absolutely flies in the face of the millions of peaceful Muslims who are deeply religious and NOT violent. But they don't count, because Guandolo here is redefining "religious" to mean "willing to commit violence in the name of religion".

 

Circular logic, meet WoD. WoD, this is circular logic. What do you mean you were already acquainted?

 

It's only circular logic if you misquote it like you did. There aren't many secular Muslim terrorists.

[Volourn]

"Because this absolutely flies in the face of the millions of peaceful Muslims who are deeply religious and NOT violent. But they don't count, because Guandolo here is redefining "religious" to mean "willing to commit violence in the name of religion"."

 

They count as much as non violent Catholics or non violent Athiests. Not much. Why? By definition, non violent people are non threats so you don't have to worry about them RIGHT?

 

Are you more concenred about the Christian going door to door passing out pamphlets or the Christian that  attacks abortion clinics? No contest there right? RIGHT.

[Rostere]

Most churches preach what is reflected in their politics and the values that they hold. Very rarely do churches actually preach their religious doctrines and even more rarely do people acquire their values from their faith (like they are supposed to). Instead they deliberately twist the religion they supposedly have faith in to fit their world view. That is not what people who genuinely believe their religion would do; it's what liars who only pretend to believe their religion would do.

 

This is true both for today's Christians and today's Muslims. But of course nobody thinks themselves a liar. This is not anything which happens deliberately, as you write. People will unconsciously think better of things they have decided to embrace - compare also the mother who fails to scold her favourite child for misbehaviour. Nobody could ever rationalize believing in a religion which also does not give any support to your political views. "Yeah, I'm a complete takfiri, I know that's completely against my religion, but I think it's the right thing to do anyway". How many right-wingers think Jesus was a Socialist and vice versa? Not all religious people project all their opinions onto their religion, but many do and none that I know of rationalizes the opposite.

 

Any disagreements between Muslims and the Western world today is best thought of as being based on:

1. Real political and historical grievances.
2. Identity politics/nationalistic bull**** or similar.

Seeing how Muslims were more tolerant than Christians during certain parts of history, I think it's pretty clear that tolerance and degree of secularism are more dependent on historical circumstance than the actual tenets of the religion. Islam is harder to reform because it is more specific in its commandments, while Christianity is very, very vague because Jesus was never in any position of power where jurisprudence would have become important and his teachings were only compiled a significant time after his death. You could argue that this is a problem, but then you could look at Judaism. There we also have specific commandments regarding how to treat slaves et.c. (see here). God commands at various times rape, murder and genocide (see here for an example). The God of the Old Testament is evil to the degree of for example commanding his "chosen people" to attack and genocide the Canaanites and take their land for no reason. Yet these teaching are not at all at the centre of how modern, secular Jews behave. Why is that? If you ask a modern rabbi they will instead refer you to other teachings and later interpretations which would seem to speak against slavery and various crimes against humanity.

 

Similarly, certain commandments in the Quran might seem like intractable problems today, but rest assured you can find other passages which can be interpreted as contradicting them in certain situations. I'm sure it won't take long to find examples where the notion of papal infallibility would imply that the Catholic God is unspeakably evil, but that is all swept under the carpet today. I'm sure that Muslims can similarly ignore the parts in the Quran which are incompatible with modern civilization. It's only fair we give their particular brand of pretend beliefs time to evolve and mature (since much of the Muslim world has been the butthole of humanity the last 400 years or so, they are coming from a different point than where we are at now), and not judge them harder than our Christian progenitors of the ignorant past.

 

Good religious people are good because they have twisted their religious interpretation to something positive. Bad religious people are bad because they pick the worst from their sacred texts. All modern religions are large enough to include both good and bad interpretations. That's pretty much what there is to be said.

[Lychnidos]

It's only fair we give their particular brand of pretend beliefs time to evolve and mature (since much of the Muslim world has been the butthole of humanity the last 400 years or so, they are coming from a different point than where we are at now), and not judge them harder than our Christian progenitors of the ignorant past.

 

hahahahaha 

[Wrath of Dagon]

Apparently Canada is full of terrorists: http://observer.com/2015/12/canada-and-the-emerging-terror-threat-from-the-north/

[Volourn]

http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/furor-over-arabic-assignment-leads-virginia-school-district-to-close-friday/ar-BBnIFOu?li=AAggNb9&ocid=HPCDHP

 

 

LMAO Way too many about SJWs on the behalf of  double standard SJW Nazis. I guarantee you if this was asigment was on/about the bible they would be whining about seperation of church and state and how religion shouldn't be in schools.

 

 

I don't get why people who  go anti religion will bend over backwards for Islam.  L0L

\

\Athiests. And, Liberals. Pieces of crap.

 

So sad that technically I am an 'athiest' and used tom be a Liberal. DISGUSTING.

 

 

P.S. As for the Kanadian connection, not too surprising. People like to point out that 90% of Muslims are harmless. That is 100% true. But, nobody is worried about them.  It is the other 10% (or whatever number) that needs to be worried about.

 

Afterall, even in the States, the actual crime rate 9with guns or otherwise) is actually miniscule when comapred to overall population but nobody worries about non threats.

Edited December 19, 2015 by Volourn

[BruceVC]

Apparently Canada is full of terrorists: http://observer.com/2015/12/canada-and-the-emerging-terror-threat-from-the-north/

Volo....it looks like you have been cursed by Prophet Mohammed for your Islamophobia ? Do you feel guilty ...now your country is being overrun and conquered by radical Muslims

 

I warned you about this....lucky Qistina isnt here 

[BruceVC]

 

P.S. As for the Kanadian connection, not too surprising. People like to point out that 90% of Muslims are harmless. That is 100% true. But, nobody is worried about them.  It is the other 10% (or whatever number) that needs to be worried about.

 

Afterall, even in the States, the actual crime rate 9with guns or otherwise) is actually miniscule when comapred to overall population but nobody worries about non threats.

You know this is where I tell people you make irrefutable points that are logical .....you right here. Why even mention the 90% ..its always the 10 % we worry about

 

Thats something I never focus on and always say 90 % are harmless...I am going to say what you said next time on the radio 

[Hurlshort]

In what crazy world do you guys think that 10% of Muslims are extremists?  That would be a huge amount.  

[BruceVC]

In what crazy world do you guys think that 10% of Muslims are extremists?  That would be a huge amount.  

Those are the stats now ? Ask Volo its all over Canada....there information is generally accurate 

 

But Hurlshot thats only 10 %? Why is that such a concern

[ManifestedISO]

No way there are 100 million Islamic extremists. Hoping not, anyway.  

[BruceVC]

No way there are 100 million Islamic extremists. Hoping not, anyway.  

Yes my friend.....stats don't lie....this is scientific but maybe not so many .....give or take a few

 

But they are spread all over the world     

 

I hear they sending 40 k to San Diego because you guys are so friendly and welcoming 

Edited December 19, 2015 by BruceVC

[Gromnir]

10% is on the low end of many surveys, but keep in mind that extremism is not easy to define.  the reason the % is so frightening high is 'cause when respondents is asked 'bout the appropriateness o' violence 'gainst civilians or suicide bombings, or similar such examples, muslims is far more likely to respond in the affirmative than followers o' the other major religions.   is ok to use violence to prevent foreigners from burning the quran?  is ok to use violence to prevent foreigners from burning the bible?  etc.  the ordinary follower o' islam might not concede that using violence to prevent such sacrilege equates with being extremist.  the surveys/studies we has seen that show inordinate high percentages o' muslim extremism is resulting from a fundamental difference regarding the appropriateness o' violence.  

 

the thing is, am not certain how useful such studies is.  compare protestants in rhode island to muslims in syria is, perhaps, giving a distorted perspective.  might be better to compare folks with similar educational, economic and cultural backgrounds, yes?  lebanon might be an ideal location for such comparisons as ~40% o' the population is christian.  is those christian militia groups in lebanon any less tolerant o' violence than the muslims? dunno.  

 

islam is the most popular religion in a part o' the world that suffers from endemic poverty, substandard education and a rather limited appreciation o' the value o' personal freedoms.   as such, the correlation 'tween islam and extremism does not surprise us in the least.  

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Volourn]

Are people actually arguing about the stupid number? It is a number I pulled straight out of my ass to ilustrate my point. LMAO I don't know  the actual %. NOBODY does.

[BruceVC]

Are people actually arguing about the stupid number? It is a number I pulled straight out of my ass to ilustrate my point. LMAO I don't know  the actual %. NOBODY does.

Volo it is considered presumptuous to make assumptions about what other people know...how do you know NOBODY does...maybe, just maybe I do

 

 

  

[Wrath of Dagon]

I don't know, does wanting the death penalty for blasphemy and apostasy make you an extremist? http://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-overview/