Hard mode is too easy.

[Malignacious]

 

Are you sure it's on Hard? There's another thread in which people are noticing that, even though they started a game on a harder difficulty setting, their game is actually set to Easy or Normal for some reason.

 

I don't know how prevalent that is, or how easy to notice it is, either. I just figured that, if that IS going on a lot, then it would be understandable to select "Hard" at the beginning of the game, and assume the game is set to that, even if the game for some reason reset itself to an easier difficulty setting without notifying you.

 

 

Well, i checked again ingame just to be sure and the difficulty bar it's on hard.

 

I have a party of 5, 2 tanks, 2 range dps and the priest.

 

Makes sense, I plan on having party consisting of 3, it's not overly hard on normal but it is difficult if you don't pay attention all the time at the slightest detail.

 

So, you saying that the game is easy on hard doesn't make much sense since most people don't like to have big parties.

[g1mps0r]

I don't think that hardmode is too easy in every circumstance.

 

What makes it "easy" is just the expierience of players. As an example if people didn't played the older games they would prever damage instead of cc spells as catser which makes the game alone 10 times harder.(4-5 times oil makes nigh everything on hard a piece of cake)

 

Another thing is running around with 2 fighter(tank) with 3 times knockdown(6 knockdowns per battle)

 

Combine that on top with a rogue(my rogue does the single target damage of 4-5 party members) and you completly break the game. With 2 stilettos + vulnerable attacks and dual wield mastery they just shred through everything within seconds.

 

But as I said if you don't combine those 3 things or even don't use any of those it's for sure hard. For everyone who played those kind of games before it's kinda easy because rogue/wizard(cc) are just too unbalanced if skilled right like in baldurs gate/nwn.

[Lord of Riva]

I'd wager that the "too easy" crowd have extensive experience in the beta. This was also true for Baldurs Gate (and divinity: OS). In a complex game you can come up with munchkin moves that trivialize content. The only real solution is noting imbalanced things or going for the hardcore options.

 

nope didnt play the beta at all.

 

still too easy, the bounties were challenging but not more. i had to reload on of them because my tanks (pala and fighter) were in the wrong position. I never use stealth for anything except traps. (which i hate btw. because i seem to be always one skill level behind the traps)

 

its just a matter of how to play with the engagmebt system i guess. and keeping your ranged units out of harm. i swear Eder stood in a wall of fire surrounded by a whole bounty mob and didnt loose a point of endurance (i have pretty good equip on him though, endurance regen ftw)

[Matt516]

So, you saying that the game is easy on hard doesn't make much sense since most people don't like to have big parties.

 

What are you basing this off of? "Most" people who play this game were fans of the IE games in some way or another, and they are used to 6-character parties. Even people who aren't IE people aren't necessarily biased towards large or small parties..... I'm sorry - your statement makes no sense and has no backing.

[Darkpriest]

It seems fine if you go with the NPCs and RPish character (so no obvious min/max). If you are a min/max plaeyr at heart and want to run custom party, go PotD.

[Darkpriest]

 

if you find it too easy, try turning expert mode on

Expert mode doesn't really make combat harder. Maiming doesn't matter if you don't die in the first place, AoE highlights and defense tooltips are a memory, not tactical challenge, and I'm not sure about combat tooltips, but I assume they aren't terribly useful for people who know what they're doing.

 

 

I can assure you that aiming 120 degree cones or some AoE spells can be difficult if you have no range highlights, you usually end up with selection of Foe only or friendly only AoEs and single target spells, because aside of the first opening "round" it is hard to aim, unless you are door blocking

[brandysnap]

im finding it hard on just normal difficulty :/

 

[Ink Blot]

I was wondering when this thread would show up. Every game release I've seen over the past few years inevitably has this complaint.

 

 

the two most common complaints for every ie game:

 

it was too hard

 

it was too easy

 

is no way for developers to win.

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

 

Indeed, Gromnir, indeed.

[Merina]

I'm playing at normal difficulty, and I don't think it's too easy.

 

I had started as a wizard with no idea when to meet a first companion other than those from the tutorial-like intro. The manual could have done a better job at explaining the possibilities of how to build a party. Once I met an NPC that suggested joining me, it was another wizard. Aaaaarrrgh! Once I met a fighter NPC, I found out I can hire a mysterious nameless level 1 adventurer at an inn, and giving that a try, it means I can create the entire character myself like another PC and even choose the name. This isn't mentioned in the manual, is it? The manual only refers to the Stronghold and its hirelings. Sometime later I found out I can create also a level 2 adventurer at the same inn and more of them.

 

That made me restart as a druid and with a different story in my head. Probably too ambitious ... being more the cleric, wizard or paladin type usually. I'm not too fond of restarting so early.

 

My Baldur's Gate 1+2 and Icewind Dale 1+2 knowledge doesn't help me so far. Too much is different ... especially the feeling on the maps .. especially when encountering enemies with their red circles around them. I have trouble positioning my party. Can't even think about offensive AoE spells yet, when enemies rush towards my party. Melee, melee, melee. And the wizard's missile spell is not the good old magic missile -- not that the wizard is a damage power-house anyway. Probably his most useful spell is mirror images. Combat is very hectic, even with pause inbetween. So many details to read about how they attack me, hit me, damage me, and so on.

 

There's no long period of killing small parties of kobolds, goblins or xvarts on the way up to level 2. Much too quickly you are at level 3 without feeling stronger ... and that is because you're fighting shadows and other monsters you don't know at all. Almost every encounter gives the feeling of fighting a dragon.

 

I don't stay on the roads. I explore as much as possible. I don't mind the occasional cave bear, although I'm warned ... but with a party of four, an added barbarian, it should be doable. Typically, 1-2 out of 5 go unconscious. Same for the shadows. Not a big problem as long as I finish them off, but I need to think this through once more.

[Sensuki]

There seems to be this point during Act 1 where things just become a breeze except for the odd fight or two. Nothing can hit Eder at the moment.

[sparklecat]

Im in agreement at the moment but I'm barely entering mid-game. But so far Hard Ironman has been steamroll, basically attack moving most things besides Spirits. No real close calls besides Spirits chain confusing my PC Barb and then the party AI for some reason start auto-attacking my PC.. which is super annoying i have to say. 

 

When they're confused, sometimes their circles briefly go red and they're counted as enemies; party members who switch targets due to the death of their previous one during this will sometimes attack them.

[Lephys]

There seems to be this point during Act 1 where things just become a breeze except for the odd fight or two. Nothing can hit Eder at the moment.

Yeah, that happened to me in the last few fights. I didn't even give him Defender Mode, and he's still holding off like 4 enemies at a time while my PC Wizard and Aloth tag-team stuff from afar. MY PC Wizard actually switches to a 1-handed Rapier to help out once the enemies are thinned out a bit (that and I like using as much short-range magic as possible... just my style, 8P).

 

I think maybe a few tuning passes are in order, to make things a bit less swingy? I don't have an issue with party setup A making things easier than party setup B. But, there are some things that seem way easier even on Hard difficulty than they're meant to be. I get things being not uber-hard if you do it right, but... some stuff's been just passively unworrisome (such as 4-5 things clawing at Eder, but don't worry... he's fine for like the next 6 attacks with me not actively making him fine).

 

Really, the only thing that's been HARD hard were the first bears I fought. They pretty much laughed at Eder's armor and Deflection values. Of course, that was at Level 2. *shrug*

[Ink Blot]

Really, the only thing that's been HARD hard were the first bears I fought. They pretty much laughed at Eder's armor and Deflection values. Of course, that was at Level 2. *shrug*

 

I'm getting my ass handed to me by Shades, but everything else I've met so far has been manageable. My party's only level 3 though, so maybe that's the issue.

[Zorfab]

 

There seems to be this point during Act 1 where things just become a breeze except for the odd fight or two. Nothing can hit Eder at the moment.

Yeah, that happened to me in the last few fights. I didn't even give him Defender Mode, and he's still holding off like 4 enemies at a time while my PC Wizard and Aloth tag-team stuff from afar. MY PC Wizard actually switches to a 1-handed Rapier to help out once the enemies are thinned out a bit (that and I like using as much short-range magic as possible... just my style, 8P).

 

I think maybe a few tuning passes are in order, to make things a bit less swingy? I don't have an issue with party setup A making things easier than party setup B. But, there are some things that seem way easier even on Hard difficulty than they're meant to be. I get things being not uber-hard if you do it right, but... some stuff's been just passively unworrisome (such as 4-5 things clawing at Eder, but don't worry... he's fine for like the next 6 attacks with me not actively making him fine).

 

Really, the only thing that's been HARD hard were the first bears I fought. They pretty much laughed at Eder's armor and Deflection values. Of course, that was at Level 2. *shrug*

 

Eder is amazingly good tank after a while (level 4-5). You can push his deflection close to 120 before buffs with enhanced large shield and some feats and at that point most enemies can barely touch him with most attacks. Probably could stand getting beaten alone for minutes or indefinitely if his weapon drains endurance... You can send him to room alone, pull all aggro and shoot the enemies to back with heavy ranged weapons in most encounters. That`s why no matter how sucky your party is most of the fighting becomes a breeze at that point.

[Mazisky]

I'm on act 3 now, hard mode, i did all quests (expect Caed Nua, still have to explore even the first floor) and i had some difficult in only one particular fight, while all others were incredibly easier.

 

I don't even check the loot because who cares, i can melt everything. If they won't balance it i'll be forced to restart on Path of the damned.

 

I repeat, i'm not a pro player, i'm a normal one. I think ALL enemies should be buffed in stats on hard mode. 

 

For now there are only 2 difficulties:  EASY(easy, normal, hard) and HARD (pod)

Edited March 29, 2015 by Mazisky

[Odd Hermit]

I'm perhaps a little biased but IMO the problem is the companions are so poorly built the difficulty hinges on your PC meshing well with what's there. It's my biggest issue with the game.

 

Personally, I added a custom min/max Paladin tank and a Cipher and it made everything way, way, way easier than dragging along 5 nigh-useless meat shields just for their personalities.

 

Now I just drag three along. I can 3 man most encounters with Paladin/Druid/Cipher anyway.

[sparklecat]

I'm perhaps a little biased but IMO the problem is the companions are so poorly built the difficulty hinges on your PC meshing well with what's there. It's my biggest issue with the game.

 

Personally, I added a custom min/max Paladin tank and a Cipher and it made everything way, way, way easier than dragging along 5 nigh-useless meat shields just for their personalities.

 

Now I just drag three along. I can 3 man most encounters with Paladin/Druid/Cipher anyway.

I don't think so; my high Perception and Resolve priest who hangs out on the back lines (i.e., not that optimally built) has been doing fine on hard with the nigh-useless meatshields, really.

[Odd Hermit]

I don't think so; my high Perception and Resolve priest who hangs out on the back lines (i.e., not that optimally built) has been doing fine on hard with the nigh-useless meatshields, really.

 

 

"Doing fine" is a bit meaningless. It's relative. I could drudge through the content with a full party of poorly built characters, but it's more fun, efficient, and less RNG to do it with a well built group that has competent damage dealers and tanks rather than a bunch of mediocre "balanced"/non-min/max builds that just suck at both.

[sparklecat]

By "doing fine," what I meant was that I am, if anything, finding it a bit too easy myself.

 

 

eta: Maybe I'm just naturally amazing at this game!

Edited March 30, 2015 by sparklecat

[Lephys]

I'm getting my ass handed to me by Shades, but everything else I've met so far has been manageable. My party's only level 3 though, so maybe that's the issue.

Haven't made it to shades yet. Wichts were a bit tough when there were 5-6 of them at once, unless I burned some spells just for each group (I have two Wizards at the moment, but I'm trying to be pretty conservative with spells. Maybe a little TOO conservative. I'm still feeling it out). I bumped into some skeletons, and had to "NOPE" my way on out of there. They were running 14DR, and even more against anything but crush, I think. /cower.

 

But then, I'm also only Level 3, with 3 people. JUST got my 4th party member. I was about to try and hire an adventurer, but I couldn't afford a Level-2 adventurer. T_T

[paz12]

 

 

if you find it too easy, try turning expert mode on

Expert mode doesn't really make combat harder. Maiming doesn't matter if you don't die in the first place, AoE highlights and defense tooltips are a memory, not tactical challenge, and I'm not sure about combat tooltips, but I assume they aren't terribly useful for people who know what they're doing.

 

 

I can assure you that aiming 120 degree cones or some AoE spells can be difficult if you have no range highlights, you usually end up with selection of Foe only or friendly only AoEs and single target spells, because aside of the first opening "round" it is hard to aim, unless you are door blocking

 

This. I am playing on normal diff. + expert. No beta experience with the game. At the start, I had some (=huge) difficulties during the first couple of hours because I had to learn AoE ranges by roasting my frontline :D When I finally found Eder + hired another PC, it became a lot easier. I was considering switching expert mode off, but then again, it's fun if you don't really know what your casters are doing. Also: dialog options.

Edited March 30, 2015 by paz12

[Jasta11]

Sagani seems like the only really poorly built character I found so far (thanks to Perception being useless for ranged characters now). The others are average, Edér is a decent tank and Kana does a good job overall I find. 

 

If someone finds the game too easy, they can always gun for the Triple Crowns (PotD, Expert, Trial of Iron) solo achievement. What's nice about PoE is that the difficulty is very scalable, from Easy which is relatively faceroll to the aforementionned achievement which is probably impossible for any but the most dedicated and skilled players.

 

For me, Hard is just right; difficult enough to keep me on my toes in a good half of the fights, but not so much that I start pulling my hair out.

[Lephys]

Yeah, as long as you read about the spells first, it's not TOO bad to figure out. You can usually kind of err on the side of caution, and (with Fan of Flames, for example) miss one out of, say, 4 foes, rather than make sure you get all the foes but hit your ally as well.

 

Also, I'm almost certain now that, if not exact, the regular-size (not giant creatures and stuff, just people) character selection circles are very close to 1 in-game meter. So, you can use that to kinda gauge distances/areas with your spells and abilities. I've had pretty good luck with effectively hitting my foes and not my friendlies.

 

As for the "some party setups make everything super easy" sentiments described in here, I don't think the enemies need to be toned UP, necessarily (although nicer AI would be welcome), as much as the player's party capabilities need to be toned DOWN. For example, Eder doesn't really NEED to be able to have 120 Deflection before even buffs, maybe. If he can have circumstantially high Deflection, then awesome. If you have to actively make that Deflection happen in the midst of battle, then that's cool. But, when passive numbers can climb so high like that, that makes things drastically easier, because a passive Deflection rating (for example) just means you have to deal with fewer hits and way less incoming damage. I think Deflection's job in the balance of things just needs to be to steer your general incoming hits into different ranges. Beyond that, it should be the job of DR, crowd control, etc, to actually make sure you aren't dying even to the higher difficulty stuff.

 

Or, to look at a simpler scenario, the fact that your tank pretty much never gets hit shouldn't really win the fight for you. And, I guess a lot of that is really the AI. Your tank isn't single-handedly taking out the enemies at that point. He's just "absorbing" all their attacks for you, because they'll pretty much just go after the first/closest thing they can.

 

Annnnywho. I think maybe the things that become super-easy on Hard are a good indication of things that could use a little tweaking. Things should be more incremental. A party of 6 LvL-2 Class X's should have roughly the same amount of difficulty handling most encounters on Hard as a party of 6 LvL-2 Class Y's. There're always going to be exceptions, because of how the different classes work and the specifics of the enemies, etc. But, it shouldn't be "With this group of only 2 people, these 5 consecutive fights were a breeze. With this other group of 5 people, these fights were all still really hard."

 

And something should only be a breeze when active effort is involved. I mean, for a pro tennis player, acing a serve is "a breeze," but it's not because his racket gives him +50 to Acing.

[Dongom]

At first I could barely do normal.

 

Now I'm breezing on hard.

 

It's all about character-build/party-build.  Two pure tanks and 4 pure ranged well behind them usually demolishes.    Ranged do nutty dmg with Chanter reload buff.

 

And then theres the 6 chanter group that laughs at PotD.

Edited March 30, 2015 by Dongom

[cycbersnaek]

I think the game is hard depending on what class you start with, I did the eothas temple with skuldr and skuldr kings (spell) with my starting character rogue, wizard npc, priest npc and chanter npc at level 3.  It was hard as hell,  (used kiting to pull single skuldr king in the last room, used door to black pathing..etc) now as soon as I recruited eder, everything is much easier now.  On Hard diff.