Next Gen

[Falkon Swiftblade]

I believe it was during the kickstarter the devs specified this game would only be coming to the pc. During the first glimpse inside the game Josh Sawyer said it was running on a very average run of the mill pc. I've been following development for next gen games for the past few months and its pretty interesting to read several indie devs have stated it only took them 2-8 weeks to port their game to the ps4 from pc. With larger AAA teams averaging 2-3 months. Seeing as how the ps4 is a fixed architecture that has been called a high end pc by members of Ubisoft and other top developers, not to mention the built in touch pad on the controller, the fact that Unity and most if not all additional middleware tools are also supported, and the dev kits are only a tenth of the cost of last gen it sounds like a winner. Not to mention the devs have the ability to self publish in just about any way they want, it only makes sense to me they should plan for it now for an easy transition.

[AwesomeOcelot]

It's just marketing, it's not a high end PC, but it should run Project Eternity no problem, it's got the equivalent of a Radeon HD 7850, the hardware will have PC variants, the AMD CPU and GPU in the same families as PC hardware.

 

There's a difference porting games designed for PC and those designed to be multiplatform, porting the engine should be a lot more straight forward. The biggest difference is TV vs monitor, viewing distance mostly, people generally don't read a lot of blocks of text on TV, consoles games tend to zoom in, they can't have the details.

 

How well does the touchpad perform as a mouse replacement? Poorly but adequately if it's like the ones on laptops.

[Greensleeve]

I think one of the biggest hurdles for porting PE to, for example, the PS4 would be the lack of mouse and keyboard. This game is being developed with them in mind, and a console simply does not have any good alternatives for mouse and keyboard when it comes to isometric games like these. 

[bonarbill]

I think one of the biggest hurdles for porting PE to, for example, the PS4 would be the lack of mouse and keyboard. This game is being developed with them in mind, and a console simply does not have any good alternatives for mouse and keyboard when it comes to isometric games like these. 

 

The new touchpad is a nice solution.

[Tale]

It doesn't make sense that they should plan for it now, because they've specifically rejected the idea of planning this game around a controller. Or at least that's how I interpreted the statement from MCA.

[ManifestedISO]

Didn't we covered this already in this topic: http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/59945-merged-please-make-a-console-version/ ?

 

That was before we learned about the next generation of consoles, hence the title of this thread. 

 

I hope they do it. I need only the slightest of excuses to buy Project Eternity again, and a PS4 port would be a delight, I'm certain. Surely the target resolution for P:E is 1080, the same as next-gen consoles, so the TV/monitor thing makes no difference. If it isn't, no problem, I read hundreds of pages of text in Skyrim on my TV. And the PS4 touchpad is both a swipe and a button, just begging to be utilized. Truly, I hope Obsidian says nay to the PC-only high-horse.  

[alanschu]

It'd come down to "is it worth the time and effort to make the necessary changes to the interface."  A large part of that is going to have to go through any certification processes and so forth.

 

The game could sell digitally (which helps a lot), but ultimately it comes down to whether or not they WANT to port it to a console, and then whether or not they feel it's worth the effort to do so.

[Frenetic Pony]

The main thing I can see for next gen is that both Sony and MS allow self publishing.

 

Which is awesome! I can foresee PE coming to The PS4 if it's a success on the PC first. The main reason I say PS4 only is because, well it has a touchpad control in the center, and PE is really, REALLY not the type of game for a standard control pad.

 

The only technical considerations I can foresee besides easy portability to a GCN/x86 based system is running at max setting and 60fps at 1080p without a ton of trouble. Which isn't so much a consideration as a plus. Or maybe even pulling a 4k resolution at 30fps, or 60? I obviously don't know how PE is going to end up running. Point is any ports to the Xbone/PS4 will be mostly a control scheme concern so far as any really big obstacles so far as I can see.

Edited July 31, 2013 by Frenetic Pony

[alanschu]

I heard that, but I haven't heard too much more beyond that.

 

Does the self-publishing literally mean that any joe that wants to put something up for sale can, without any sort of cert process?  Or does it just mean that every console works as a devkit, so you're free to start making and testing stuff out on it if you want.

[Pidesco]

I went and checked pictures online of PS4's touch pad, and I have to say it looks like a terrible control method for a game like PE. I wouldn't dream of using a laptop's touch pad to play a game sporting an IE style interface, and the same should apply to the PS4's touch pad.

 

Like others have said, the UI implementation problems such a port would entail, both graphical and physical, make the investment probably not worth it.

[moridin84]

Project Eternity is being created using the "Unity" game engine. It does not support the PS4 or XBOX ONE at the moment. Considering neither consoles are even released yet, I think it will be awhile before Unity supports them. 

 

By the time Unity adds support for the new consoles, Project Eternity should be at least halfway complete. At which point it will be impractical to make those changes. 

[ravenshrike]

 

I think one of the biggest hurdles for porting PE to, for example, the PS4 would be the lack of mouse and keyboard. This game is being developed with them in mind, and a console simply does not have any good alternatives for mouse and keyboard when it comes to isometric games like these. 

 

The new touchpad is a nice solution.

 

Depending on how good the touchpad is you could actually make a halfway decent port. Touchpad for inventory control and movement/attack confirmation. Left stick for fast scrolling, right for fine scrolling. Buttons for menus. Vertical d-pad for individual character selection outside of menus, horizontal d-pad to select/deselect entire party. Shoulder buttons to flip through abilities, with one on each trigger. PC would still very much be better though.

[moridin84]

 

 

I think one of the biggest hurdles for porting PE to, for example, the PS4 would be the lack of mouse and keyboard. This game is being developed with them in mind, and a console simply does not have any good alternatives for mouse and keyboard when it comes to isometric games like these. 

 

The new touchpad is a nice solution.

 

Depending on how good the touchpad is you could actually make a halfway decent port. Touchpad for inventory control and movement/attack confirmation. Left stick for fast scrolling, right for fine scrolling. Buttons for menus. Vertical d-pad for individual character selection outside of menus, horizontal d-pad to select/deselect entire party. Shoulder buttons to flip through abilities, with one on each trigger. PC would still very much be better though.

 

Using the analog controller as a replacement for a mouse? I don't think that will work well. Are there any examples of a good PC->Console port that does this?

 

I don't think there is any need to do a console port if it isn't as good as the PC version. I think main reason games are made multiplatform is to increase the audience, this is not necessary for Project Eternity because there are no publisher trying to squeeze as much money as possible from the game. 

Edited August 5, 2013 by moridin84

[ravenshrike]

 

 

 

I think one of the biggest hurdles for porting PE to, for example, the PS4 would be the lack of mouse and keyboard. This game is being developed with them in mind, and a console simply does not have any good alternatives for mouse and keyboard when it comes to isometric games like these. 

 

The new touchpad is a nice solution.

 

Depending on how good the touchpad is you could actually make a halfway decent port. Touchpad for inventory control and movement/attack confirmation. Left stick for fast scrolling, right for fine scrolling. Buttons for menus. Vertical d-pad for individual character selection outside of menus, horizontal d-pad to select/deselect entire party. Shoulder buttons to flip through abilities, with one on each trigger. PC would still very much be better though.

 

Using the analog controller as a replacement for a mouse? I don't think that will work well. Are there any examples of a good PC->Console port that does this?

 

I don't think there is any need to do a console port if it isn't as good as the PC version. I think main reason games are made multiplatform is to increase the audience, this is not necessary for Project Eternity because there are no publisher trying to squeeze as more money as possible from the game. 

 

Without the touchpad you're left with the stick buttons for selection, which is crappy at best. Not to mention to my knowledge no one has used the sticks for a difference in scroll speed. Also, I did say PC would still be better. It's just that with the touchpad you could actually make a halfway decent port now instead of the utter ****e that it would be without.

[Falkon Swiftblade]

Project Eternity is being created using the "Unity" game engine. It does not support the PS4 or XBOX ONE at the moment. Considering neither consoles are even released yet, I think it will be awhile before Unity supports them. 

 

By the time Unity adds support for the new consoles, Project Eternity should be at least halfway complete. At which point it will be impractical to make those changes. 

 

Well Unity announced in March it was going to support PS4, and it's currently in beta from one source I've heard from. However I think it's not officially supported because the final dev kit for PS4 only came out last month and Sony is sending out kits to random studios kinda first come first serve basis. Some studios are getting the kits for free on loan right now. And like I said, every article I've read from indie to triple A studio using the kit has ported their game in weeks – a few months tops. It's not like it used to be when it took 12–18 months to port something over. Unity speeds up that process even more since it's a middleware utility. It should be very doable by this time next year. Shoot Blizzard even redid Diablo 3 ui for PS4 in only a few months, and they really like the controller. I'm not sure if or how they're using the touch pad, but really the main use of the mouse now is to select your party and click a spot, why would you need a giant mouse pad to do so for this game? I've played many games that use right analog as a mouse with no issues as well. I'm not trying to be argumentative, but at least in my mind I think it would be very doable. I've even read the Ps4 controller will work on PC's.

[Falkon Swiftblade]

 

 

 

I think one of the biggest hurdles for porting PE to, for example, the PS4 would be the lack of mouse and keyboard. This game is being developed with them in mind, and a console simply does not have any good alternatives for mouse and keyboard when it comes to isometric games like these. 

 

The new touchpad is a nice solution.

 

Depending on how good the touchpad is you could actually make a halfway decent port. Touchpad for inventory control and movement/attack confirmation. Left stick for fast scrolling, right for fine scrolling. Buttons for menus. Vertical d-pad for individual character selection outside of menus, horizontal d-pad to select/deselect entire party. Shoulder buttons to flip through abilities, with one on each trigger. PC would still very much be better though.

 

Using the analog controller as a replacement for a mouse? I don't think that will work well. Are there any examples of a good PC->Console port that does this?

 

I don't think there is any need to do a console port if it isn't as good as the PC version. I think main reason games are made multiplatform is to increase the audience, this is not necessary for Project Eternity because there are no publisher trying to squeeze as much money as possible from the game. 

 

 

I felt like Kingdoms of Amalur Reckoning handled the use of mouse and keyboard and controller very well, and felt like the controller made it even better.

[moridin84]

 

Project Eternity is being created using the "Unity" game engine. It does not support the PS4 or XBOX ONE at the moment. Considering neither consoles are even released yet, I think it will be awhile before Unity supports them. 

 

By the time Unity adds support for the new consoles, Project Eternity should be at least halfway complete. At which point it will be impractical to make those changes. 

 

Well Unity announced in March it was going to support PS4, and it's currently in beta from one source I've heard from. However I think it's not officially supported because the final dev kit for PS4 only came out last month and Sony is sending out kits to random studios kinda first come first serve basis. Some studios are getting the kits for free on loan right now. And like I said, every article I've read from indie to triple A studio using the kit has ported their game in weeks – a few months tops. It's not like it used to be when it took 12–18 months to port something over. Unity speeds up that process even more since it's a middleware utility. It should be very doable by this time next year. Shoot Blizzard even redid Diablo 3 ui for PS4 in only a few months, and they really like the controller. I'm not sure if or how they're using the touch pad, but really the main use of the mouse now is to select your party and click a spot, why would you need a giant mouse pad to do so for this game? I've played many games that use right analog as a mouse with no issues as well. I'm not trying to be argumentative, but at least in my mind I think it would be very doable. I've even read the Ps4 controller will work on PC's.

 

 

A few months? I'd rather Project Eternity was not delayed by a few months just for this.

 

Could you give an example of the games which use the analogue stick as a mouse? I don't think that Kingdoms of Amalur Reckoning is a good example, I believe the keyboard was used for movement. Diablo 3 might be a better example but I suspect they ditched the point and click interface and use the analogue stick to move the character. Which won't work with a party based RPG.

Edited August 6, 2013 by moridin84

[Falkon Swiftblade]

A few months? I'd rather Project Eternity was not delayed by a few months just for this.

 

Could you give an example of the games which use the analogue stick as a mouse? I don't think that Kingdoms of Amalur Reckoning is a good example, I believe the keyboard was used for movement. Diablo 3 might be a better example but I suspect they ditched the point and click interface and use the analogue stick to move the character. Which won't work with a party based RPG.

 

Don't forget Blizzard was working on unfnished hardware and software. Now that everything is finished it probably will be even faster and more optimized. Another thing is you're comparing apples and oranges. Most of this game is 2d pictures with some data base stuff. The 3d is primarily camera trickery moving the 2d animations in z space. Its not that hard to do. The stuff that's harder is balancing the game, not so much creating the ui.

 

Another game that plays well using only the small trackpad on my mac is Baldurs Gate EE. I don't really use my keyboard much at all. I foresee this to be pretty similar in that aspect, and from what I've seen the ps4 touchpad is bigger than my laptop.

Edited August 6, 2013 by Falkon Swiftblade

[Sensuki]

Shame on you console gamer.

[AwesomeOcelot]

Most of this game is 2d pictures with some data base stuff. The 3d is primarily camera trickery moving the 2d animations in z space. Its not that hard to do.

What game are you talking about? Not Project Eternity.

 

Another game that plays well using only the small trackpad on my mac is Baldurs Gate EE.

Not surprising considering EE was designed for touchscreens. Project Eternity isn't.

[moridin84]

 

A few months? I'd rather Project Eternity was not delayed by a few months just for this.

 

Could you give an example of the games which use the analogue stick as a mouse? I don't think that Kingdoms of Amalur Reckoning is a good example, I believe the keyboard was used for movement. Diablo 3 might be a better example but I suspect they ditched the point and click interface and use the analogue stick to move the character. Which won't work with a party based RPG.

 

Don't forget Blizzard was working on unfnished hardware and software. Now that everything is finished it probably will be even faster and more optimized. Another thing is you're comparing apples and oranges. Most of this game is 2d pictures with some data base stuff. The 3d is primarily camera trickery moving the 2d animations in z space. Its not that hard to do. The stuff that's harder is balancing the game, not so much creating the ui.

 

Another game that plays well using only the small trackpad on my mac is Baldurs Gate EE. I don't really use my keyboard much at all. I foresee this to be pretty similar in that aspect, and from what I've seen the ps4 touchpad is bigger than my laptop.

 

Umm, I don't think you quite understand what's involved in porting and why it's difficult. 

[Falkon Swiftblade]

 

Most of this game is 2d pictures with some data base stuff. The 3d is primarily camera trickery moving the 2d animations in z space. Its not that hard to do.

What game are you talking about? Not Project Eternity.

Another game that plays well using only the small trackpad on my mac is Baldurs Gate EE.

Not surprising considering EE was designed for touchscreens. Project Eternity isn't.

 

Surely you've seen the video with Josh, everything was in 2d. Each version of bgee was created for its own platform. The man reason I would like to have the option to come to next gen is I'm recovering from a stroke, and have really limited dexterity in my hand, so its a usability issue. Luckily these types of games are way easier to play than a fps.

[Sensuki]

If that's the issue I believe the game will be playable with 99% mouse use. Turn your mouse sensitivity up and voila, most of your problems solved (unless I'm missing something here).

[AwesomeOcelot]

Surely you've seen the video with Josh, everything was in 2d.

The environments were in 2D, the characters and some objects won't be.

[Falkon Swiftblade]

If that's the issue I believe the game will be playable with 99% mouse use. Turn your mouse sensitivity up and voila, most of your problems solved (unless I'm missing something here).

 

the issue isn't mouse use, it's keyboard use. hence why fps are so much harder to play. These games are probably the easiest to play for me next to adventure games.

 

And AwesomeOcelot I understand, but nothing 3d will make their jobs take longer than it already would for the pc version.  I kind of would like to see a test how long it takes to create something on the PS4 first, then make a PC version. I suspect the pc version would take longer because you have to factor in a thousand different video cards and operating systems, etc for compatibility.