Update #54: Art Update - Work IS in Progress!

[kenup]

Ok. I'm not going to say much about the GUI, and I know this is a WIP, but you better allow us to up-scale and resize that thing. Especially the text. I have no interest in going blind because "IGN: 2014, minimalistic and small GUIs FTW, derp!".

[ShadySands]

Let's call it a kobold

[Jotra]

I really like the UI except for one thing. Most people are right-handed and keep the mouse cursor more time on the right side of the screen than left. IMO it would be better if the combat log and character portraits/spells/etc. switched side, ie. combat log on the left side and that other stuff on the right side.

[Kutaka]

I quite like the unnamed lizardfolk, but as for the UI...I'm not liking it.

 

Obviously a lot of it is placeholder, but the artwork itself seems out of place. Wood grain background with pillars book ended by a couple statues for no reason. Wasted space that could be used for more function. In addition it has a very harsh dividing line along the top border, which is for some reason a sort of punched or bolted metal which clashes with everything else and makes the contrast in theme stand out even more. I mean you have the gorgeous background with a nice waterfall and bridge and all that, then this blatant "THIS IS A DIVIDING LINE" followed by something that was put together by a committee and lacks cohesion and singular focus.

 

What sort of baffles me is that it feels like its taking up so much space, and yet its still so cramped that I couldn't tell you what was going on. Assuming the icons under the far left portrait are buffs/debuffs; they seem far too small to be able to react to with any certainty.

 

I see some good ideas in there, but I see too many different ideas clashing and covering up each other. It needs to flow organically, as lame of a suggestion as that sounds I don't really know how to describe it any other way. Perhaps have a few people throw a design out and then pick one. Just don't pick and choose parts from each one.

 

Also, as personal preference I prefer text on the left.

[Osvir]

The UI does not look appealing. I understand the idea to make it feel infinity engine-ish, but that looks really outdated, Im not saying to make it like super modern or sth, but right now, it just looks like it was taken out of Baldurs, icewind etc ui and then without any design or work on it.

 

Im not sure if its the icon art, or the textures that is on them, but it makes it feel dated...

I can't really give you an answer on that but I relate to your post a little bit, that's kind of my first impression as well "It looks weird!". Looking at it in photoshop and going in closer in on it I feel it is very pretty and has potential to do what it is intended to do, provide party intelligence. Artistically it is very wooden, with some stone, I feel they could work more with that concept. Spell icons could have animation or be runic and integrated into the UI so that they blend very nicely together.

 

The icons are not helping as they are now. They make me relate to the older games and the older games are outdated by themselves, there's definitely relevance in the psychology of that. To be honest, due to the icons I actually thought that it was one of the IE UI's that had been copy-pasted onto the screenshot until I zoomed in on it and read some comments to realize that in fact, it was not.

 

ICONS NEEDS TO BE UPDATED <- there you go, all caps, bold and size 18

 

Another thing to take into consideration is that we've been seeing the screenshot without an UI for a very long time now, and my first impression of the UI together with the screenshot is that it makes it look squeezed together. Even when we saw the UI for the very first time, the UI mockups we saw back then looked weird. I believe there is relevance there as well to my own reaction. Relate or do not relate, up to you.

 

EDIT:

 

Stone carving (Google Search link)

Some concepts, general idea of what I'm talking about with icons:

 

 

Birds:

 

Wall:

 

Face:

 

 

 

Wood burn carving (Google Search link)

Some concepts:

 

 

Tree of Life

 

Kwaa! Eagle:

 

Mountain:

 

 

 

This one gets to stand out because I like it  (named "Peace in Many Languages")

Edited May 29, 2013 by Osvir

[EhyehAsherEhyeh]

I don't really like the UI staying too close to the old style; we missed the strong points of the old games, but that does not mean we want it all back exactly as it was. The scene looks beautiful, and what we've seen of early prototype videos promises the game in motion will look even more enchanting; why then, have a big block of static UI bar constantly taking my eyes of the spectacle and out of immersion? I'd like to see the UI more integrated into the scene I'm experiencing.

I apologize for not reading through all the preceding posts to avoid rehashing an already made point, but am writing this in a five-minute (pomodoro style) break during work.

[Ineth]

I actually really like the wood-textured UI background in the screenshot, especially the combat-feedback box at the right - it looks Infinity Engine'ish but at the same time more modern and interesting.

 

What I don't like is the left part with all the portraits and spell icons - not 100% sure why, but it feels somehow irritating. I suspect that part of the blame rests on the glaring neon-blue color of the health-bars, and the imho not-quite-fitting spell icons.

Those icons (taken from the IE games) are probably just placeholders though, so maybe it will look better once the real icons (that will hopefully be designed specificaly for this UI) are in place, and the overall color scheme is fine-tuned.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Ineth

[WorstUsernameEver]

Few sparse thoughts: UI looks like it could be significantly improved from a usability standpoint, though I like its aesthetics. I like that everything has been kept at the bottom of the screen, though perhaps it could occupy slightly less space. The stamina/health bars stick out like sore thumbs ready to gouge my eyes out. Even if readability is a concern, please consider a solution that is more aesthetically pleasing for those.

 

Also, while I understand that you're aiming for an IE-like feel to the interface, but give us some wiggle room to take out/modify elements we don't need/want changed. Doesn't necessarily have to be as customizable as an MMO interface or even NWN2's own, rather debatable UI, but options like the ability to change the font/make the character in the chat log bigger, make the chat window bigger, etc.

 

I really have no idea what the icons near the center are meant to be. Why are they shaped like some weird Nintendo early 2000s controller? I know it's probably been borrowed directly from IWD2's interface, but it just seems bizarre and doesn't make any sense to me, whether I consider it from a usability or an aesthetic POV.

 

Finally, I don't like the lizardman concept: right now it doesn't seem to fit the aesthetics established by the rest of the concepts nor the excerpts of the bestiary shown so far. Also a suggestion that is likely to sound redundant since I'm sure the team is already aware of it: try to approach monster cultures with the same way you approached the player character races' cultures. I want to fight creatures that feel like they really exist and are grounded in the world rather than generic lizardmen tribals that the designers thought would make for a good pacing break in the middle of a drawn-out investigation quest.

 

EDIT: One thing that can't be judged by the mockup, but that I feel is going to be very important in the final game in terms of how the UI feels, is feedback. In the Infinity Engine games I always felt like the UI had some really nice feedback: chunky sound effects when you click on something (which also reinforced the texture/aesthetic choices of the UI, given you really felt you were clicking something solid) and buttons and toggles that felt like they were actually being pressed (despite just being, y'know, an alternate image that looked like it had been pressed, but whatever). I don't feel you did as good a job with that with Neverwinter Nights 2, and pretty much every single game afterwards moved away from that model, so this is the chance to do it right.

Edited May 29, 2013 by WorstUsernameEver

[Doppelschwert]

Although the UI seems nice, I think there are way to few icons for abilities, at least if the icons used here are supposed to reflect what should be accessible by icons in the real game (a button for defending, a button for every hand, a button for skills, a button for the spellbook, a button for abilities).

There would only be 6 slots left for abilities - in 2014 I don't really want to click through submenus to access my spells like in IWD because I can't even display a spell for every spell level. If you leave it like that by the time the game ships, I'll be really mad at you. That is neither accessible nor acceptable.

Sorry for the strong words, but I feel like more icons are less disturbing to the immersion than using time to switch menus during combat or accessing the spellbook in an extra window. Thats also one of the biggest flaw in the IE games, in my opinion at least - the nwn UI did much better regarding the displaying of abilities, although they weren't as nicely integrated into the visual style as they were in the IE games. But in a pinch, I'd always vote for accessibility over asthetics.

 

Apart from that, everyting is nice and looks awesome. Keep up the good work!

Edited May 29, 2013 by Doppelschwert

[SunBroSolaire]

Man, Kaz and Polina are some fantastic artists. Glad you have them on the project. 

 

The UI is pretty nice from a functional standpoint. Looks pretty similar to Icewind Dale, which is good. I think it could use even more decorative stuff. Love the statues.

[Ineth]

I really have no idea what the icons near the center are meant to be.

 

Really?

They seem pretty self-explanatory:

 

bottom-left: "compass" = open map screen

top-left: "mouse with dotted box" = select all characters

top-center: "loot bag" = open inventory screen

top-right: "quill & parchment" = open journal screen

bottom-right: "gears" = open settings screen

bottom: "watch hand" = pause/unpause

[WorstUsernameEver]

 

I really have no idea what the icons near the center are meant to be.

 

Really?

They seem pretty self-explanatory:

 

bottom-left: "compass" = open map screen

top-left: "mouse with dotted box" = select all characters

top-center: "loot bag" = open inventory screen

top-right: "quill & parchment" = open journal screen

bottom-right: "gears" = open settings screen

bottom: "watch hand" = pause/unpause

 

Icons of different sizes and shapes thrown without rhyme or reason in the middle of the UI don't read well with me. That was the point of my complaint, not the actual icons (which have been borrowed from the IE games, so I more or less learned to read those regardless of whether they're immediately understandable by a new player). Hope that makes it clearer.

[Xienzi]

If, for example, I wanted to break the game by running around with a little army similar to NWN and NWN2, would the extra characters be put in the companion slot or just not have an icon in the UI? I'm left wondering. On that note, I really do think that should be one of the cheats available. In before people yell at me for wanting to have fun.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Xienzi

[Malekith]

Love the direction the UI is going. Recent games (last ten years) have teririble UI with their MMO inspiration and minimalistic approach. I understand this is work in progress, but my only problem with the UI is the positions. I would prefer the combat-feedback box at the left sid of screen, and the portraits and abilities to the right.

Other than that, great job!

[Gyges]

UI is definitely a thing that has only gotten better with the years. I am no fan of the massive brickwalls in the older generation of games, meshing with the gameplay about as much as oil does with water. Then again, if it could be made a bit smaller it would be an acceptable compromise. Better even: customizable.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Gyges

[BruceVC]

I am impressed, but I don't tend to over-analyze things in such an early stage of development.

 

But I am still waiting for those first artistic interpretations of the much loved and ubiquitous chainmail-bikinis that we will see in PE

 

I suppose we will see them later in the updates?

[Jory]

I like the feel of the UI, it is a good default UI (left side feels a little cramped, but we're talking about an early iteration here).

 

What isn't shown here is probably the most important attribute of any good UI: the customizability.

 

Allow us to easily change pretty much anything without requiring full scale modding. Make it advanced options that are not necessarily focused on ease of use rather than customizability and put the UI options in a file that is easily shared. Same applies to keybinding options, allow us to keybind anything you can conceivably think of, possibly even modular stuff such as switching between several UIs to accomplish things that you may not have planned for. That way you can have community sites easily sharing UIs and you can just pick a popular one that you like if you don't fancy the default one. Needs of players will always be too different to have a one size fits all approach.

 

As an example of what I would like to do with the UI (just for me):

 

• I will memorize the relevant keybinds quickly and I'll probably never use the options pane after 10 minutes of gameplay, so that can go.
• The chat is of varying importance during different parts of the game. If I'm travelling, I don't want a an empty window blocking space, if I'm in combat or in a conversation and I want to find out what happened I don't want to scroll a tiny window around, so I want to be able to set keybinds that resize/reposition the chat window with just one click, so I can pause and immediately see what's happening.
• If i know keybinds for all characters I probably won't need a skill bar or only a very small one and I may not even need character portraits if I can save space that way.
• I also feel that characters don't belong at the bottom, they're a part of the UI that I pay constant attention to and thus are very different from the "on demand" buttons at the bottom, so I may put them at the top or left.

 

The rigidity of the IE game UIs was in my opinion their greatest flaw, I'm all for old school, just not there.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Jory

[Odd Hermit]

I like the UI style and the placement of the whole thing makes sense to me: I prefer having one bar at the bottom of the screen keeping the top very cinematic instead of having bars on the side. Of course personal preference comes into play, so perhaps some compartmentalization and the ability to move things around would be ideal. The portraits also need more defined borders and the statues on the sides probably take up too much excess space.

 

The location of the individual parts I'd change for more functionality, definitely not enough space to stretch a spell bar. I think a long bar at the top almost the length of the screen is ideal for such. The options, map, inventory, pause being centered I also disagree with as they're the things we're probably using keys for and don't need in a prominent place.

 

Personally I'd go with a layout something like this:

 

http://i.imgur.com/jYuYx9E.jpg

 

Obviously with more neat artistic bordering and such.

[vedomir]

Interface unsuccessful

 

Portraits group - small. affect bar - on Portraits? 

Radial menu - Would look in the left corner better

Action button -  too small

 

In BG UI better. 

 

_____________________________

Sorry for my English 

[igorina]

Thanks for the update, very interesting as always.

Now the UI. I really enjoyed this kind of UI in IWD but for this game it feels to heavy. I mean all graphics are so dynamic and fresh (but still having this old-style feeling) and this UI doesn't match here in my opinion. I like the general style of it but i think it needs more air, more space and bigger portraits.

Anyway i know that final version will be perfect

[Dianjabla]

I like the return of the aesthetic of the old UIs, it really helps set a tone. Compare DA:O with DA2 for a jarring change in that respect. I know they needed to make it better for people playing on TVs or whatever, but DA2s UI kinda felt like it belonged more in a scifi game than a fantasy one.

 

That said, the mock up probably could do with some tweaks. Definitely does need more room for effect icons for characters. In ToB I had more effects than spaces for the icons in some battles. Zed's idea on fixing that seems ok. I have pleanty of horizontal room to spare and if I want to look at the pretty back ground, I hide the UI.

 

The ever popular customisation request might solve some of that, but a customisable interface is quite likely to lose the aesthetic feel pretty quickly. A right click radial menu like in ToEE done right could do the same trick in allowing you full access to a spell book etc.  It's also getting further away from the feel of the original which is one of the stated goals I personally hold dear. How far form trumps function I leave to the guys making it to decide.

 

I also like the suggestion of being able to break the game balance and have all the NPCs in the party at once - it was fun to lead a small army in NWN2. Although only for a short while. Path finding became an issue (Fight ALL the dungeon) and battles got boring after a while. Have it totally invalidate any iron man mode or whatnot, that's fair - just don't hard code the party size.

 

Anyhow, to that end and so that summonables or temporary NPCs can be accounted for, at least a scrolling list of characters or if customisable, being able to drag that element some where it will fit?

 

 

 

[Frenetic Pony]

The UI looks a bit... TOO Infinity-ish.

 

I get the stylistic yearnings for the old Infinity games, some neat wood background. But a more efficient, more OBVIOUS interface would be nicer. The Infinity Engine hotbar was just... ugh. I.E.

 

 

And most of all... it's just too big for how little it does, too old school in thought, seemingly looking much like the Icewind Dale 2 UI, a UI designed for screens at 640x480 or 800x600 if you wanted to get fancy! That thing is far too information poor for the amount of screenspace it's taking up. To give an example, I'll show the absolute best, most beautifully functional interface I've ever seen in gaming:

 

 

Just gaze upon how much information is there, in relatively just a little more screenspace, and how clear all of it is! You've got a mini map, a log, a character portrait, level and xp and xp to next level for the character. Armor, damage done, movement speed, strength, dexterity, and intelligence, AND what bonuses are being given to all of them at the moment. All of the characters abilities, with their mana costs and cooldowns and how leveled the abilities are. An entire panel of items, a space that could easily be used for character selection. Not to even mention the top bar (which is already fantastically close to a character selection bar)! And still it has room and space for some personality and nice even spacing.

 

Now that is an efficient, very well designed interface! That is something I'd love to see strived towards, that level of clearly readable information density all presented before you without a single menu or submenu or any of that to go through. In this case, yes I know about the store interface (after 250 hours I should) but that's my point! This is so efficient it can pack much the same level of complication as Project Eternity into what is basically a single, menu less screen. And while "Infinity Engine like" in some style might be a fine goal, in functionality the IE games were anything but the pictures of an efficient or even manageable UI.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Frenetic Pony

[Geckleorn]

What's that? Now isn't the end of 90th or beginning 2000th. UI is biggest, but unfriendly for user. Many wasted space. This UI is archaic and boring, but, of course, i don't want see UI in Project Eternity same as in DOTA 2.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Geckleorn

[Ganbariya]

Wow, i really love the Baldur'esque  style of the UI!

 

The earthtone colors etc. looks nice and i felt some cozy

feeling in my heart, when i saw the old BG icons ... *sniff*

 

My critique for some details would be:

- to highlight the status effects somehow with a lighter background,

t'was hard to distinguish one from the other (especially without a ongoing battle)

 

- maybe thinking about an option to customize the UI?

like nor only the size, but also maybe making a Infinity styl version

with one part x and one part on the y-axis?

 

 

But for me personally and most important was this:

Please make the Portraits go red, when the characters get hurt!

This was such a strong "input" in battles, when you hear

a "ouch" from the voice, a *clunk* from the hit and next you

see the portrait go mostly red from ONE hit!

 

it really made you panic and hit the panic (pause-) button :D

 

 

Keep up the good work guys and girls!

[VIGIL_AU]

I think the art style is absolutely fantastic. The artists you have on your team are doing any incredible job; seriously great work.

 

As for the UI I feel it's "almost, but not quite". Fallout: Tactics was (in my opinion, many will disagree) one of the best games I've ever played. The UI in Fallout: Tactics was absolutely spot on. Picture attached. It's not that dissimilar to what you've already mocked-up, but perhaps less cluttered. All the information you need is there and if you need to know more specifics it's available through tabs.

 

Again, great work. Glad I backed this project as much as I did.