Anyone else having P:E Kickstarter Campaign withdrawal?

[Sensuki]

I dunno about you guys, but I really miss the days of the Project Eternity Kickstarter Campaign.

 

I randomly discovered the campaign viewing Kickstarter's main page on the day it was launched, it was under the "Popular in" section on the main page. I clicked the link and watched the pitch video, and you should have seen the grin on my face. I was not a member of the Obsidian forums, in fact I hadn't even played one of their games since the original Neverwinter Nights 2 back in 2007, and I had no idea that anything was coming like many of the people here.

 

Most of the online communities that I had been part of over the years had died off, but it was pretty awesome to come to the Obsidian forums Project Eternity section to speculate about the game with other fans, the forum was absolutely bustling with activity, during the KS campaign I think I had a day where I made ~100 posts.

 

It was really fun to stay up late for the next update, spread the news around, discuss game mechanics with other people here and interact with the team members who posted on the forums during that time. I'll never forget how much I looked forward to every day being able to take part in the buzz of the Kickstarter campaign of something I really cared about.

 

Since then I've gone on to join the discussions at Something Awful and RPGCodex (I tried to sign up to Neogaf too but they rejected my registration even though I used my school email). I've read through the entire 400-600 page threads and gone over all the Project Eternity updates and videos several times, trying to relive the moments of the Kickstarter.

 

But now that the excitement has settled down, I think I'm having a bit of a withdrawal. The "year of incline" hasn't started yet, and I am not really inspired to play much of anything at the moment, so I spend a lot of the free time I do have between work, university and 'other things' sitting here reading this forum, the RPGCodex and SA Project Eternity threads ... but often there's not too much happening.

 

In the meantime it's been good to see the Torment campaign be a success, but I didn't really take part in that, I hate the Uservoice forums that inXile have chosen to use for that, and I was never really as into Torment as I was BG/IWD.

 

Anyone else miss the Kickstarter days too?

Edited May 1, 2013 by Sensuki

[Malekith]

Yes, it was the best campaign ever.

[rjshae]

Yeah, the campaign was the wooing period. It ended with a bang and a honeymoon. Now we're settled into the marriage waiting for the first child to arrive.

[Spiritofpower]

Yeah, the campaign was the wooing period. It ended with a bang and a honeymoon. Now we're settled into the marriage waiting for the first child to arrive.

Basically this. All we can do right now is wait. I imagine the forums might liven up a bit once we get a playable beta demo or something, though.

 

Anyways, Sensuki, if you haven't already, you should try Mount & Blade: Warband. I recently downloaded the demo off of Steam and WOW. It is awesome.

[Few]

Same here. Although I never posted that much myself these boards felt very alive and I really enjoyed reading through everyones thoughts and ideas. I still come on here a fair amount just to see if anything new is being talked about though, and I did find out about the Divinity kickstarter on here. I'm sure when the game is released or close to release then it will liven up again. Until then i'm not really playing any games either, apart from a little EVE now and again.

[Labadal]

With the regular updates and posts by devs, I don't feel like there is a reason for me have any kind of withdrawal. I've also followed games like Torment and Original Sin. It was great to be a part of the whole thing, but that was the funding period. I'm actually more excited when we get the weekly/bi-weekly updates.

[Lephys]

I've gotta say that I also don't much care for the discussion aspect of the Uservoice page inXile is using. However, I DO like the voting capabilities. While these forums have plenty of discussion going on, we often have no idea at all what might or might not be being currently considered by Obsidian for the game.

 

I think it might be nice if they tossed us out some guided discussion topics with the updates or something, or maybe just started some official polls along with a discussion thread. *shrug*

 

There's just only so much speculation you can do before it feels like there's nothing to do but wait around because you don't even know if your speculation is useful anymore.

[Sensuki]

I think it might be nice if they tossed us out some guided discussion topics with the updates or something, or maybe just started some official polls along with a discussion thread. *shrug*

Why? I prefer they do what they want and don't listen to the bullsh1t that gets discussed in here. One of the things (which I believe came from a forum post) was the "Josh Sawyer on Miss and Hit" thread where someone didn't like the always hit mechanic because then if they wanted to make a dodgy character, that would not be supported by the game ... and thus a 5% total miss chance assuming even attack/defense score.

 

Another thing might have been the decision not to use timed cooldowns in the game (on anything).

 

There are probably other things too. But seriously some things just need time to sink in. I was an advocate for XP for kills, and at first was kind of disappointed that that model was going to not be used. But I figure I'll give it a chance and see how it goes.

 

With the regular updates and posts by devs, I don't feel like there is a reason for me have any kind of withdrawal. I've also followed games like Torment and Original Sin. It was great to be a part of the whole thing, but that was the funding period. I'm actually more excited when we get the weekly/bi-weekly updates.

It's not a withdrawal from information, it's a withdrawal from the buzz/activity of the Kickstarter campaign. The sense of an active online community.

Edited May 1, 2013 by Sensuki

[Lephys]

Why? I prefer they do what they want and don't listen to the bullsh1t that gets discussed in here. One of the things (which I believe came from a forum post) was the "Josh Sawyer on Miss and Hit" thread where someone didn't like the always hit mechanic because then if they wanted to make a dodgy character, that would not be supported by the game ... and thus a 5% total miss chance assuming even attack/defense score.

 

Another thing might have been the decision not to use timed cooldowns in the game (on anything).

Well, because if we're going to sit around discussing things excitedly all day, it'd be nice to know what's even feasible or isn't (according to things only Obsidian knows), or what things they're having difficulty nailing down and what they aren't.

 

Also, it's totally at their discretion that they provide us with tidbits of their current design plan so that we may provide direct feedback (like the miss thing, etc.). I'm not demanding that everything they're designing be up for discussion/feedback, directly, here, amongst us random people who aren't game developers. Plus, I HIGHLY doubt they're just scratching their heads about everything, then seeing a few posts here in a topic, then simply saying "Oh, well, I guess we should do it like that, then" and calling it a day. I'm pretty sure all they're doing is factoring in our feedback, along with all their own expertise and trial-and-error regarding the effects of mechanics, and implementations, and the overall goals of the game they've already set out to achieve.

 

So, I don't think this is a choice between "Should they provide guided feedback topics so that our feedback will be useful to them and just do whatever it is we say, or should they not provide us with such things and actually use their own brains and expertise to figure things out and make a good game?" I think they're fully capable of both gathering feedback on specific topics (for which feedback might be quite helpful to clear some design snags) AND simultaneously use their own brains and expertise on the matter.

 

The feedback is supplementary, not an override. It's also evaluated. If a bunch of people say "Hitpoints are stupid!", I have no worries that they'll remove hitpoints. I think if even one person somehow came up with a very reasonable case as for why hitpoints should be altered, they'd probably then consider it, since it's an actually a very reasonable and valuable bit of information they maybe hadn't considered yet.

 

Annnnywho. I just think it would help us be more helpful in our random, excited forum speculation and discussion. As it stands now, we mostly read about a few tidbits of "this is pretty much how things are gonna be unless we just happen to change our minds further down the design pipeline" in the updates, then start throwing out a bunch of "What ifs" across like 17 different threads.

 

That's one thing I think the Uservoice voting/suggestion system does very well, methinks. It shows, in general, what ideas are most important/favored by the player/backer-base, not so much so that the devs can just go "800 votes? Putting that in," but so they can prioritize and organize the ideas and suggestions that the backers are presenting. It organizes the feedback to a useful purpose. Also, it lets the backers know when an idea has been read or not, without having to find a developer's post in page 5 of an 11-page topic.

 

*shrug*. Just my thoughts on the matter is all.

[Sensuki]

Does anything you posted besides the first line have anything to do with what you quoted? I am not sure I see the point of the rest of it because it certainly has nothing to do with what I said.

 

What are you saying, that they should post threads like "What do you want to see regarding item statistics" or something like that ?

Edited May 2, 2013 by Sensuki

[Lephys]

Does anything you posted besides the first line have anything to do with what you quoted? I am not sure I see the point of the rest of it because it certainly has nothing to do with what I said.

 

What are you saying, that they should post threads like "What do you want to see regarding item statistics" or something like that ?

Ehh... I'm not trying to be pompous or anything, but I'm really not sure how it doesn't pretty much have everything to do with both what I quoted AND what I was talking about that begat your quoted response. Most specifically, it is an answer to "Why?". Do you mean you don't see the point in the rest of it because you feel I was overly elaborative, or that you, yourself, would not have typed so much? I don't understand.

 

I'm saying, quite simply, that it would be nice to know what would be useful to Obsidian for us to discuss and what wouldn't. As much fun as it is to just discuss potential mechanics and design choices whether they're even feasible or likely to be used in P:E or not.

[Sensuki]

These paragraphs here I thought were completely superfluous, because I didn't say anything on the matter.

 

 

 

Also, it's totally at their discretion that they provide us with tidbits of their current design plan so that we may provide direct feedback (like the miss thing, etc.). I'm not demanding that everything they're designing be up for discussion/feedback, directly, here, amongst us random people who aren't game developers. Plus, I HIGHLY doubt they're just scratching their heads about everything, then seeing a few posts here in a topic, then simply saying "Oh, well, I guess we should do it like that, then" and calling it a day. I'm pretty sure all they're doing is factoring in our feedback, along with all their own expertise and trial-and-error regarding the effects of mechanics, and implementations, and the overall goals of the game they've already set out to achieve.

 

So, I don't think this is a choice between "Should they provide guided feedback topics so that our feedback will be useful to them and just do whatever it is we say, or should they not provide us with such things and actually use their own brains and expertise to figure things out and make a good game?" I think they're fully capable of both gathering feedback on specific topics (for which feedback might be quite helpful to clear some design snags) AND simultaneously use their own brains and expertise on the matter.

 

The feedback is supplementary, not an override. It's also evaluated. If a bunch of people say "Hitpoints are stupid!", I have no worries that they'll remove hitpoints. I think if even one person somehow came up with a very reasonable case as for why hitpoints should be altered, they'd probably then consider it, since it's an actually a very reasonable and valuable bit of information they maybe hadn't considered yet.

 

It looks as if you're responding to my post as if I presented an opinion on the fact that changes have been made due to discussions on this forum, when all I did was highlight the fact that they had.

 

They do like to hear our thoughts and feedback in the update topics, and they specifically asked us to state what we would like to know more about in the last update. To be honest I don't think they need to guide discussion at all, they already have ideas for what they are going to do for pretty much everything in the game and as Josh said in the Armor Design update (where he has a skeleton face) they get a lot of "insight" from the forum discussions.

Right now, they have most of the systems blocked out and I am sure the narrative design is well on it's way. I'm sure most of the necessary research has been done already as it is nearing the end of the pre-production phase.

 

I thought most of Wasteland 2's polls were kind of superfluous. The one about the color saturation was a no-brainer. The logos well ... I really don't like most of the logos they have in the poll. The only good thing that came out of them was the guy who came up with a better name for the attribute system, and that wasn't even in the poll. The most important one was when Brian mentioned social features in an interview somewhere and there was a massive uproar about it - and that was a natural discussion, not a requested one.

 

I am glad Obsidian is careful about unsolicited opinions, and Josh has a good way of invoking discussion in the manner he presents the design challenges he's having.

[Osvir]

Part 1: Kickstarter

- The invitation

Part 2: Fan Response

- The shores of Dyrwood

Part 3: Development

- Keep it at 180 celsius degrees (because I don't know Fahrenheit). We can only wait and see what comes out of it. What landed on the shores of Dyrwood and what was obliterated by the Godbomb?

Jokes aside, we are at a stage of support and cheering on right now, until more information is provided (updates~ next week).

[LadyCrimson]

The "Fan response" ... omg the expression on the Obsidian stick figure is hilarious.

[IndiraLightfoot]

Withdrawal is a strong word, let's just say that a great community bustling with joy, expectations and ideas are something that I miss, but I am fairly confident much of that will come to life again when PE finally is delivered.

 

And yes, Osvir has made a master piece here! Kudos to you, Osvir! :D

 

To me, Project Eternity and Divinity: Original Sin are the games I really feel like I am expecting a child, a mix of excitement and trepidation, also the wait in itself is agonizing. Fortunately, my backlog of games are huge, and I also tend to replay all the golden oldies too. Right now I'm having fun with ToEE with Circle of Eight's mudpack, for instance.

 

P.S. Torment will surely be a fantastic treat too, but for slightly different reasons - wonderful interwoven threads of deep story telling; existential, moral and philosophical. It won't be a CRPG world with juicy character creation and talent/skill development, teeming monster compendiums and that general PnP feel of "This is a wonderful setting for a motley crew party".

[Lephys]

It looks as if you're responding to my post as if I presented an opinion on the fact that changes have been made due to discussions on this forum, when all I did was highlight the fact that they had.

My mistake...

 

I prefer they do what they want and don't listen to the bullsh1t that gets discussed in here. One of the things (which I believe came from a forum post) was the "Josh Sawyer on Miss and Hit" thread where someone didn't like the always hit mechanic because then if they wanted to make a dodgy character, that would not be supported by the game ... and thus a 5% total miss chance assuming even attack/defense score.

I very hastily assumed that stating "I prefer," followed by something you don't want to happen, followed by examples of that happening, was some form of expression of your opinion on the matter. I shall try to avoid drawing such wild conclusions in the future. Apologies.

[Sensuki]

Right, thanks for clearing that up. Sorry that is ultimate post structure failure on my behalf.

 

It does indeed seem like that's what I meant from just that little segment, but I was a verbal aggregate for no cooldowns, misses and XP for Kills 2/3 at least.

Edited May 3, 2013 by Sensuki

[Lephys]

 

No worries, Sensuki. I wasn't trying to be an arse, haha. Much of what I said was unnecessary, but I simply wasn't aware that wasn't what you were getting at, at the time.

 

It happens. 8P

[JFSOCC]

I'm still high on this site

[Inannachan]

As with Indra, I went on to support Divinity: Original Sin after Project Eternity, so I've found other things to watch over and love along side my first kickstarted project, and although I also backed Torment, it just doesn't have the same appeal as PE or D:OS does. As for the wait, I've gone back to playing some of my older games while ghosting on the forums here (I may not entirely contribute to every single discussion). Still love getting all the updates and enjoying seeing the ideas raised on the forums.

[D'rez]

I am getting impatient for the lack of the fulfilment site that supposed to be up like 5 months ago. I don't care for baby's born and other stuff. If a project manages to raise $4.000.000 they should hire someone to build that site if no one currently working for obsidian isn't able to.

[Sensuki]

I think most of us would prefer that the money goes to the game's development, not company logistics.

Edited May 7, 2013 by Sensuki

[D'rez]

I prefer trust. If they can't manage to keep the promise of a backersite, how will they ever be able to make a complex game?

[Sensuki]

Are you certain it's not coming?  Because I am certain it is, whether its next week or in July.

[D'rez]

If I promise my clients something by the end of the month, I can't afford to say it will take a few months (years?) longer. If i would do that, I won't have to work anymore, since I would not get any clients anymore.

It is not because they have our money they should not keep their promises. Sure the release of the game wil be postponed, I can really live with that (they do have a lot of extra work to do, where we (clients) asked for), and that they don't know how much later the release will be, is fine as well.

A site for people manage their pledges might be a "minor" thing compared to the game, but if they can't even deliver that as promised, I don't want to know how many years beyond 2015 we have to wait to get a game (if we get one)

 

"soon" should never be Blizzard soon.